Roger on that! Treat those trainers with the same respect as live blades; lest you ingrain bad handling habits. I count the number of times I 'cut' myself, just to keep myself honest. slowly and surely my skills are increasing and my simulated self-mutilation is lower.
Seth
Feed your trainers flesh and not your live blades.
Gads..
OK look NEVER..NO NEVER open it on your leg..
Don't do it with a trainer..it builds bad,very bad habits..
You have to treat your trainer like a guide. a guide to what a lIVE BLADE WILL AND CAN do,,
'its tomake sure you NEVER do something unacceptable with a live blade...
as well as alllow one to train knife counter knife safely..
to train MBC-GUNTING safely..
Thats why there are RED training guns..to make sure you don't blow yourself off.
thats why there are BLUE working tools, to see the effect of flasback and wax bullets etc..BUT they are NOT TRAINERS.. nor is the CRMIPT
DO NOT EVER OPEN THE GUNTING ON YOUR LEG..
bio mechanically you run out of arm / shoulder movement long before you can stop or recover the motion of cutting.."BAM" you be cut!
Kin-Op..Kinetic opening is blazingly fast..too fast to react to..
Don't do it...
"BAM its a disaster!"...
DO NOT OPEN A GUNTING ON YOUR OWN LEG....
I cannot do it..NO ONE CAN..at least not without cutting themselves....
How many times MUST I say this?
I'm not joking or fooling around as many of you have felt...
PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS!!!!!
OK look NEVER..NO NEVER open it on your leg..
Don't do it with a trainer..it builds bad,very bad habits..
You have to treat your trainer like a guide. a guide to what a lIVE BLADE WILL AND CAN do,,
'its tomake sure you NEVER do something unacceptable with a live blade...
as well as alllow one to train knife counter knife safely..
to train MBC-GUNTING safely..
Thats why there are RED training guns..to make sure you don't blow yourself off.
thats why there are BLUE working tools, to see the effect of flasback and wax bullets etc..BUT they are NOT TRAINERS.. nor is the CRMIPT
DO NOT EVER OPEN THE GUNTING ON YOUR LEG..
bio mechanically you run out of arm / shoulder movement long before you can stop or recover the motion of cutting.."BAM" you be cut!
Kin-Op..Kinetic opening is blazingly fast..too fast to react to..
Don't do it...
"BAM its a disaster!"...
DO NOT OPEN A GUNTING ON YOUR OWN LEG....
I cannot do it..NO ONE CAN..at least not without cutting themselves....
How many times MUST I say this?
I'm not joking or fooling around as many of you have felt...
PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS!!!!!
-
vampyrewolf
- Member
- Posts: 7486
- Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:33 am
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada
I know of one person who did it, Frank from Cutting Edge... he even showed me the 4" gash in his pants. He didn't get skin, and was lucky. It could have been interesting. He told me it was "playing" with the trainer...
We all start with 10 fingers. Those with Spydies have 9 to spare, Still need a thumb. Good thing I still have 8 to spare...
We all start with 10 fingers. Those with Spydies have 9 to spare, Still need a thumb. Good thing I still have 8 to spare...
VampyreWolf..Frank must have wanted to use a trainer..thought he was using a trainer, wished he'd been fooling around with the trainer Drone cause there's no way to cut ones self or pants with the DRONE....
BUT the GUNTING itself with its wickedly sharp blade..well it cuts pants, pants n legs..pants, legs n bone...
Mary is the very first to cut her pants without cutting herleg..just lucky I guess..
Many have seriously sliced themselves...
Rule #1: Steel cuts flesh
Rule#2: you can't change rule #1
Rule#3: unless you got on a blue suit with a big red S on it..rules #1 & #2 ALWAYS apply!
Amended Rule #4: you cannot open a GUNTING on your own leg......
BUT the GUNTING itself with its wickedly sharp blade..well it cuts pants, pants n legs..pants, legs n bone...
Mary is the very first to cut her pants without cutting herleg..just lucky I guess..
Many have seriously sliced themselves...
Rule #1: Steel cuts flesh
Rule#2: you can't change rule #1
Rule#3: unless you got on a blue suit with a big red S on it..rules #1 & #2 ALWAYS apply!
Amended Rule #4: you cannot open a GUNTING on your own leg......
Yeah I agree with the "you need a trainer story", but ****, its expensive to purchase a live blade, trainer and then the tapes.
The blades go for R1350.00 down here in SA, for me to fork out R2700.00 + tapes is kinda pushing it a tad far, Im not complaining, I know Spyderco blades are of the highest quality and are worth every cent, but I was hoping there would have been cheaper trainers, Id be willing to take pretty much anything, Im sure alot of people can afford to purchase the live blade or the trainer, but not both.
Ive ordered the numbered collectors piece (live) since until I can fork out cash for the trainer Ill have to put my faith in my Civie/Matriarch should I need anything.
Hope to be able to get a trainer sometime soon.
Seeya guys
MaNcEr
It's Time To Kick @$$ 'N Chew Bubble Gum
The blades go for R1350.00 down here in SA, for me to fork out R2700.00 + tapes is kinda pushing it a tad far, Im not complaining, I know Spyderco blades are of the highest quality and are worth every cent, but I was hoping there would have been cheaper trainers, Id be willing to take pretty much anything, Im sure alot of people can afford to purchase the live blade or the trainer, but not both.
Ive ordered the numbered collectors piece (live) since until I can fork out cash for the trainer Ill have to put my faith in my Civie/Matriarch should I need anything.
Hope to be able to get a trainer sometime soon.
Seeya guys
MaNcEr
It's Time To Kick @$$ 'N Chew Bubble Gum
Well I guess like most people you need to be educated...and thats my job..to TEACH..If you're buying a knife to use as a matter seperator, nothing else, no education is necessary..
If you intend to play with it..use it for selfdefense, knife counter knife,anything else but rudimentary cutting or utility work..well a trainer is more important than the live blade..
knife counter knife DEMANDS the use of a trainer DRONE..
Of course who uses a live blade on their own body? thats very poor common sense. (Sorry Glenn..but now you know that as we practice we do in real time!! I really sincerely hope your leg heals as it was BEFORE you cut it!)
Glenn wa @ my seminar AFTER he cut himself..
How could one make a trainer CHEAPER???.. when it gets abused n used much more than a real live bladed knife? A trainer see duty all the time..it opens zillions of times more than a live blade..
its lock really gets rocked..its blade banged on and dragged across things...
A live blade ONLY opens when its needed..a trainer opens all the time to engrain the muscle memory needed for the FEW live blade openings..
so a functional trainer is needed..
a strong functional trainer..
gee the GUNTING for example has an IDENTICAL trainer DRONE..steel, G10, liners etc...so it feels, indexes and responds the same as the live Blade.
I don't do counter for counter drills with a live blade..But I do them all the time with the Trainer Drone...
and with a GUNTING I do Kin-Op openings with the DRONE version all the time.."BAM"
I put DRONE steel to flesh all the time..( his or hers NOT mine) and thats OK..it has no cutting edge..
I learn about cutting and putting steel to flesh...and I learn NOT to put the steel of the Trainer DRONE on me so in stressful situations, or in any attempt to use Live steel I NEVER make a unacceptable decision such as live steel onto MY OWN BODY..
I use steel.my students use steel..we all know that a trainer is the way to go..even before getting the live blade..
hmm it makes a great less than lethal impact tool as well..many LEO-police magazines have stated that very point!
thats the same reality the LEO ,military and Anti Terrorist community is seeing as I teach them the reality of steel..Trainers are a must..No live blade till one is used to using the DRONE...
PRICE??? give me a break..Buying two Spydies..a set..DRONE & GUNTING is still less than bying one custom folding tactical knife and the currecnt run of SPYDIES is as hand made as some of the "handmmade customs"..they're as close to a custom as one can get..
How much is your life worth?
How much is the training to insure you survive edged tool usage worth?
Mike Janich & I represent years of knife training..Sal Glesser & Spyderco represent years of knife usage & design & manufacturing..
How much is that knowledge and experience worth?...
its in the tools you buy...
I guess its all a matter of priorities..
By the way this applies to all MBC knives..
want to learn REAL CHINOOK usage? better get the tapes, the DRONE is coming..and go train with James Keating in the USA @ a RIDDLE cause I guarentee hes not going to be in South Africa anytime soon..
Hmm want to see what MAS had in mind with his Ayoob Tacical folder?Better get the tapes, DRONE and a quick trip to LFI- Lethal Force Institute in New Hampshire...
Trainers are IT!
Edited by - BRAM on 6/12/2001 9:45:05 AM
If you intend to play with it..use it for selfdefense, knife counter knife,anything else but rudimentary cutting or utility work..well a trainer is more important than the live blade..
knife counter knife DEMANDS the use of a trainer DRONE..
Of course who uses a live blade on their own body? thats very poor common sense. (Sorry Glenn..but now you know that as we practice we do in real time!! I really sincerely hope your leg heals as it was BEFORE you cut it!)
Glenn wa @ my seminar AFTER he cut himself..
How could one make a trainer CHEAPER???.. when it gets abused n used much more than a real live bladed knife? A trainer see duty all the time..it opens zillions of times more than a live blade..
its lock really gets rocked..its blade banged on and dragged across things...
A live blade ONLY opens when its needed..a trainer opens all the time to engrain the muscle memory needed for the FEW live blade openings..
so a functional trainer is needed..
a strong functional trainer..
gee the GUNTING for example has an IDENTICAL trainer DRONE..steel, G10, liners etc...so it feels, indexes and responds the same as the live Blade.
I don't do counter for counter drills with a live blade..But I do them all the time with the Trainer Drone...
and with a GUNTING I do Kin-Op openings with the DRONE version all the time.."BAM"
I put DRONE steel to flesh all the time..( his or hers NOT mine) and thats OK..it has no cutting edge..
I learn about cutting and putting steel to flesh...and I learn NOT to put the steel of the Trainer DRONE on me so in stressful situations, or in any attempt to use Live steel I NEVER make a unacceptable decision such as live steel onto MY OWN BODY..
I use steel.my students use steel..we all know that a trainer is the way to go..even before getting the live blade..
hmm it makes a great less than lethal impact tool as well..many LEO-police magazines have stated that very point!
thats the same reality the LEO ,military and Anti Terrorist community is seeing as I teach them the reality of steel..Trainers are a must..No live blade till one is used to using the DRONE...
PRICE??? give me a break..Buying two Spydies..a set..DRONE & GUNTING is still less than bying one custom folding tactical knife and the currecnt run of SPYDIES is as hand made as some of the "handmmade customs"..they're as close to a custom as one can get..
How much is your life worth?
How much is the training to insure you survive edged tool usage worth?
Mike Janich & I represent years of knife training..Sal Glesser & Spyderco represent years of knife usage & design & manufacturing..
How much is that knowledge and experience worth?...
its in the tools you buy...
I guess its all a matter of priorities..
By the way this applies to all MBC knives..
want to learn REAL CHINOOK usage? better get the tapes, the DRONE is coming..and go train with James Keating in the USA @ a RIDDLE cause I guarentee hes not going to be in South Africa anytime soon..
Hmm want to see what MAS had in mind with his Ayoob Tacical folder?Better get the tapes, DRONE and a quick trip to LFI- Lethal Force Institute in New Hampshire...
Trainers are IT!
Edited by - BRAM on 6/12/2001 9:45:05 AM
I've learn to trust the compression lock because I've experienced how the trainer holds up under full force hard-surface impacts.
This would not have possible if the training drone was not constucted to the same standards as the live Gunting.
Training knives are like practice ammo; you'll expend thousands of practice rounds for every 'combat' round you'll fire.
Seth
This would not have possible if the training drone was not constucted to the same standards as the live Gunting.
Training knives are like practice ammo; you'll expend thousands of practice rounds for every 'combat' round you'll fire.
Seth
Hi Bram, I can fully understand the reason for having a trainer of the exact materials and quality as the live blade, my comments where not aimed at you or spyderco in a way to make you think I was saying you ripping me off, not at all.
Its just that to get the whole package is extremely expensive and very hard to afford, Ive seen trainers (aluminum, wood...) on the web for a very good price but sense did kick in, my supplier is keeping the collectors piece trainer for me until I can afford to splash out the 1350 bucks for it.
With currency the way it is, its hard to afford quality items in this cr@phole South Africa, next month the blades will be even more expensive, not your fault at all ofcause.
It just gets frustrating after a while working yar*****off to afford things like this and only slipping back further and further as what you earn becomes less and less.
Sorry to give you all my woes, but I just want to state my reasoning behind the post.
Many thanx for the reply and kickass blades.
Seeya l8tr
MaNcEr
It's Time To Kick @$$ 'N Chew Bubble Gum
Its just that to get the whole package is extremely expensive and very hard to afford, Ive seen trainers (aluminum, wood...) on the web for a very good price but sense did kick in, my supplier is keeping the collectors piece trainer for me until I can afford to splash out the 1350 bucks for it.
With currency the way it is, its hard to afford quality items in this cr@phole South Africa, next month the blades will be even more expensive, not your fault at all ofcause.
It just gets frustrating after a while working yar*****off to afford things like this and only slipping back further and further as what you earn becomes less and less.
Sorry to give you all my woes, but I just want to state my reasoning behind the post.
Many thanx for the reply and kickass blades.
Seeya l8tr
MaNcEr
It's Time To Kick @$$ 'N Chew Bubble Gum