Tasman Salt Corrosion Test

[smcfalls13]

Strange about the G1 and 420...when I used to nightdive, ANY knife I carried would spot rust by the time I got back on shore after a few hours of being in the water.

I'm pretty sure I'm lacking enough Salt in the water to be comparable to the Pacific ocean, still need the hyrdrometer, and I may check with a pet store and see how much I need to duplicate a salt water environment.

[eljay]

I just poked around online and one brand of synthetic sea salt was 1.5 pounds of salt to make 5 gallons of salt water. You usually have to stir it quite a bit to get it all mixed in.

[smcfalls13]

I just poked around online and one brand of synthetic sea salt was 1.5 pounds of salt to make 5 gallons of salt water. You usually have to stir it quite a bit to get it all mixed in.

Yeah...I definitely don't have enough then

Need to take a field trip to the pet store...

[Simple Man]

Just an observation, only knuts (myself included) would have a three page thread on watching metal rust. And we're excited about it to boot!! :D :D

I love it, carry on. :p

[BlackNinja]

Just got to reading this thread today, myself. Thanks for sharing the exp. Scott! I'll be looking forward to seeing the results.
Simpleman, LOL :D , that's funny!

[smcfalls13]

Well, the OCD Chemistry student lurking inside me decided this experiment wasn't representative enough, nor was the setup controlled enough.

I'm ending this experiment prematurely, while I set up a newer, better, more controlled experiment.

I've ordered barstock of 440C, 154CM, ATS-34, D2, 01, 1084, 1095, and 5160. Should be here later this week.

I've also ordered a Benchmade H20 Rescue Hook, which features the X-15 blade steel.

I'm going to try to find some small pieces of A-2, M-2, L-6, S30V, and S60V. I'd love to get some AUS-6,8,10, and VG-10 bar stock, non heat treated, but being Japanese steel, I don't think I'll be able to get it in small amounts(anyone have any supplier who would be willing to sell it in small amounts, let me know)

Heat treat plays too much of a part in corrosion resistance, so I wanted non heat treated steel for the primary experiment. I will also pick up the proper supplies for a true saltwater environment, and the steel will only be partially submerged. I'd like to find a way to agitate the water consistently. Standing water doesn't provide much oxygen.

The primary experiment will be to determine the corrosion resistance of the primary stainless and tool steels used in cutlery.

The secondary experiment will be test H-1 vs. X-15 (I still need a Boker example of it, most likely the Helios, it's the cheapest, got to save a little for it first.

Any other recommendations while I'm getting the setup ready in a more scientific way? My original experiment was flawed, and halfa$$ed, so I'd like to do it right this time.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[zenheretic]

:eek: :eek: My word, pulling out all the stops on that one! :eek: :eek: :cool:

[butch]

I've ordered barstock of 440C, 154CM, ATS-34, D2, 01, 1084, 1095, and 5160. Should be here later this week.



Heat treat plays too much of a part in corrosion resistance, so I wanted non heat treated steel for the primary experiment. I will also pick up the proper supplies for a true saltwater environment, and the steel will only be partially submerged. I'd like to find a way to agitate the water consistently. Standing water doesn't provide much oxygen.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

well i do think you should have all heat treated steel
i for one dont have any knives or any other tools that are annealed :eek:
and what size barstock i have some 3v and cpm154 scraps i could get to you
butch

[spd9075]

Wow...you're not holding anything back on this one, are you! I really look forward to following along with this one.

I'm sure you have been following MacTech's test....What do you think of testing each bar one at a time or in different containers...to avoid any possible contanimation?

[smcfalls13]

Wow...you're not holding anything back on this one, are you! I really look forward to following along with this one.

I'm sure you have been following MacTech's test....What do you think of testing each bar one at a time or in different containers...to avoid any possible contanimation?

I'm going back and forth with various ideas. I'd like to stay away from multiple containers, for fear of having inconsistent salinity. Too much variation would compromise the results.

Ideally, I'd like to remove each bar as soon as it shows signs of rust, to prevent contaminating the rest of the experiment.

The bars are only going to be partially submerged, and I'd like to find some way to keep the water agitated and volatile, so there is more oxygen reach the submerged steel.

[spd9075]

Yeah..I figured it would be a pain with that many bars....way too many factors involved with such a controlled group. Keeping everything chemically balanced and as realistic as possible will be challenging enough with one tank. Although, I would remove them just as corrosion appears and call it done. Hey..if you'd like, I don't mind donating some funds to help out. PM me if interested. :D

[Devils_Advocate]

Sending our knives into harms way! OHH the Humanity! I pray for their safe return.

Anyway...I want to see how that H-1 holds up. Put it to the test. Is it really rust "PROOF"...we shall see...

After you've destroyed them, if there's anything you don't want, send them to me!

(can you blame me for trying?)

Cheers,

D.A.

[Zwaplat]

Yes, H-1 cannot rust in salt water. It's been explained many times. There's no need of this kind of test...people are just cocking about :D .

[MacTech]

Yes, H-1 cannot rust in salt water. It's been explained many times. There's no need of this kind of test...people are just cocking about :D .

Actually, in my case, it was a combination of deep-seated cynicysm (i automatically distrust any advertising claims), and plain old scientific curiosity, so a grandiose claim such as "will not rust under any conditions" strikes me as dubious at best, and must therefore be tested and verified as true

i basically tried to engineer the cruelest test i could think of, salt spray, and my Pacific came through with flying colors, so i had proved to myself that H-1 steel *IS* truly rustproof, this is one of the exceptionaly rare cases where a grandiose claim is actually true

for me, no, it wasn't "cocking about", i wanted to disprove the "will not rust" claim, but i was unable to do so

[sal]

Hi Scott, for those steels that are heat treated, heat treating is an absolute must. Steels like 440C do not do their job of creating corrosion resistance if they are not heat treated.

sal

[Zwaplat]

Alright, my apologies, MacTech. Didn't want to offend you.
It's just the point, once I found out what H-1 is, and after I heard the chemical explanation, I believed the "will not rust" claim.
And "under any circumstance" are big words. I'd say, under any normal extreme condition. ie nothing like pure H2SO4 or something like that.

[smcfalls13]

Hi Scott, for those steels that are heat treated, heat treating is an absolute must. Steels like 440C do not do their job of creating corrosion resistance if they are not heat treated.

sal

Good to know :cool:

[MacTech]

[quote="Zwaplat"]Alright, my apologies, MacTech. Didn't want to offend you. ]
Don't worry, no offense taken...

claiming something "will not rust" is kinda' like labeling a button "Please *do not* press this button", we all know what will invariably happen....



...a sign will light up saying "Please do not press this button again!"

[smcfalls13]

Well, I "officially" ended the experiment, but I figured I'd let the knives sit, just to see exactly how bad they get. Some surprises, and some expected results.

Gin-1 rusted a lot, more than I expected, and it was UGLY rust, that kind that looks like it'll bite you if you try to remove it. You can actually see it in these pictures, and given the fact that my camera doesn't do closeups, this should speak for itself.



Leatherman had much the same result, but the corrosion was only present on the tools themselves, not the handle. Still not sure what steel is used, but needless to says, it's got ugly rust like Gin-1





H-1 refused to rust(shocker :eek: ) I did manage to get some discoloration, but nothing that even remotely resembles rust. The only thing Salt water did to the Tasman was remove all the oil in the pivot. This thing needs lubrication BADLY, it barely opens.





The biggest shock though, is how well 1095 stood up to the test. Yes it was the first to rust, but it's the kind of rust that's very easily removed. It was superficial, and mostly just spotting and discoloration, primarily at the edge, guard, and anywhere there was a deep scratch in the blade. Very little pitting.





This "officially" concludes the test. The next one is coming up. Still waiting on supplies. I'll keep you all posted.

[MacTech]

[Spock]Fascinating![/Spock]

i know you said the Harpy was broken, but i really felt bad for it

interesting that 1095 Carbon steel held up as well as it did

from out two combined tests i think we can draw the following conclusions;

H-1 will not rust under normal severe conditions (salt spray or submersion in salt water)
420J2 may suck as a bladesteel (crappy edge retention), but it has impressive corrosion resistance
1095 will only suffer cosmetic surface rust (i need to find a cheap 1095 blade to do my salt *spray* test on)
the Leatherman Micra doesn't need to be babied to avoid rust on the handles

and finally, we both have too much time on our hands

as far as your digicam goes, does it have a "Macro" setting (typically an icon of a flower), try that setting, should improve the picture quality