K390 - Manix2 or Shaman?

[silver & black]

People get too caught up in this stuff. Just use your knives and sharpen to your best ability and let your own results decide for you. This extreme level of nerdness isn't really necessary in a pocket knife! It's ok to be simple/simpfly

It seems to be thought into way too deeply sometimes instead of allowing your own experiences and personal abilities to judge for yourself. Plus, lets face it...how many people are really going to be able to tell the difference between steels that are fairly similar anyways??

[kobold]

CruWear, rex45 or 15V? I'll be honest I haven't been too impressed with K390 myself. Takes a great edge but it stains if you look at it funny.

This was my experience too, it's rusts more than anything else i have (but i'm a swamp dweller), so I am not buying more K390, just waiting for Magnamax

[salimoneus]

People get too caught up in this stuff. Just use your knives and sharpen to your best ability and let your own results decide for you. This extreme level of nerdness isn't really necessary in a pocket knife! It's ok to be simple/simpfly

It seems to be thought into way too deeply sometimes instead of allowing your own experiences and personal abilities to judge for yourself. Plus, lets face it...how many people are really going to be able to tell the difference between steels that are fairly similar anyways??

People get too caught up in what? You mean customers having great experiences with a particular steel (K390) and wanting to see it paired with some of the harder use Spyderco models like a Shaman or Manix2?

Sorry but I'm just not seeing your point. There is no such thing as "simplify" with Spyderco, considering how many combinations of steel/models have been released. So basically you have no valid point whatsoever.

Spyderco is obviously on board with K390, otherwise they wouldn't have converted the ENTIRE FRN line (Delica, Endura, Police, etc...) over to K390. So it's pretty clear they hold this steel in high esteem.

So why not do your customers a solid and release some of the favorite harder use models with that same exact steel, which would seem to excel amazingly well in those formats? To me it seems like a no brainer.

[silver & black]

People get too caught up in this stuff. Just use your knives and sharpen to your best ability and let your own results decide for you. This extreme level of nerdness isn't really necessary in a pocket knife! It's ok to be simple/simpfly

It seems to be thought into way too deeply sometimes instead of allowing your own experiences and personal abilities to judge for yourself. Plus, lets face it...how many people are really going to be able to tell the difference between steels that are fairly similar anyways??

People get too caught up in what? You mean customers having great experiences with a particular steel (K390) and wanting to see it paired with some of the harder use Spyderco models like a Shaman or Manix2?

Sorry but I'm just not seeing your point. There is no such thing as "simplify" with Spyderco, considering how many combinations of steel/models have been released. So basically you have no valid point whatsoever.

Spyderco is obviously on board with K390, otherwise they wouldn't have converted the ENTIRE FRN line (Delica, Endura, Police, etc...) over to K390. So it's pretty clear they hold this steel in high esteem.

So why not do your customers a solid and release some of the favorite harder use models with that same exact steel, which would seem to excel amazingly well in those formats? To me it seems like a no brainer.

[TkoK83Spy]

People get too caught up in this stuff. Just use your knives and sharpen to your best ability and let your own results decide for you. This extreme level of nerdness isn't really necessary in a pocket knife! It's ok to be simple/simpfly

It seems to be thought into way too deeply sometimes instead of allowing your own experiences and personal abilities to judge for yourself. Plus, lets face it...how many people are really going to be able to tell the difference between steels that are fairly similar anyways??

People get too caught up in what? You mean customers having great experiences with a particular steel (K390) and wanting to see it paired with some of the harder use Spyderco models like a Shaman or Manix2?

Sorry but I'm just not seeing your point. There is no such thing as "simplify" with Spyderco, considering how many combinations of steel/models have been released. So basically you have no valid point whatsoever.

Spyderco is obviously on board with K390, otherwise they wouldn't have converted the ENTIRE FRN line (Delica, Endura, Police, etc...) over to K390. So it's pretty clear they hold this steel in high esteem.

So why not do your customers a solid and release some of the favorite harder use models with that same exact steel, which would seem to excel amazingly well in those formats? To me it seems like a no brainer.

Sheeesh, this guy coming in hot...

I was referring to folks being caught up in the chemistry/composition of the steels and minuscule differences between steels that are fairly similar.

It seems like Spyderco has chosen K390 for their Seki models, and 15V for the Golden models (besides the BBS PM2 and Para 3) I'm sure there's a reason behind that. They didn't get this far on luck. I know the reasons have been discussed before and Sal has chimed in himself. Probably tough to search for, but it's in here somewhere.

I'm sure they could slap a K390 engraving on a non stonewashed 15V blade and you would never know the difference...but what do I know, I'm already making non valid points whatsoever!

[salimoneus]

I'm sure they could slap a K390 engraving on a non stonewashed 15V blade and you would never know the difference

So you're saying that the actual users of Spyderco products are too stupid to even know the difference if they simply stamped the blade with a different steel marker?

*Edited - TazKristi

[salimoneus]

It seems like Spyderco has chosen K390 for their Seki models, and 15V for the Golden models (besides the BBS PM2 and Para 3) I'm sure there's a reason behind that. They didn't get this far on luck. I know the reasons have been discussed before and Sal has chimed in himself. Probably tough to search for, but it's in here somewhere.

Additionally, the fact that you simply lump K390 in the same category as 15V shows completely your ignorance as to steel composition and what each is best suited for. Honestly you would be better served by just closing your mouth hole and listening a bit more.

[Steeltoez83]

The lil Temperance 3 has k390. Tank of a knife imo. (I have the vg10 version).

[vivi]

People get too caught up in this stuff. Just use your knives and sharpen to your best ability and let your own results decide for you. This extreme level of nerdness isn't really necessary in a pocket knife! It's ok to be simple/simpfly

It seems to be thought into way too deeply sometimes instead of allowing your own experiences and personal abilities to judge for yourself. Plus, lets face it...how many people are really going to be able to tell the difference between steels that are fairly similar anyways??

Well said.

[vivi]

Where are either of these? I mean there's a bazillion other variations of almost every model, and that's great, but it seems like this steel specifically is such a good fit for either of these models.

Those two are supposedly the more "harder use" model folders in the lineup, so does that not beg for a K390 pairing? What am I missing here...

Why does K390 = hard use in your eyes?

Wouldn't a cheap, tough steel be ideal for that role? That's what I'd want for a hard use folder.

[TkoK83Spy]

It seems like Spyderco has chosen K390 for their Seki models, and 15V for the Golden models (besides the BBS PM2 and Para 3) I'm sure there's a reason behind that. They didn't get this far on luck. I know the reasons have been discussed before and Sal has chimed in himself. Probably tough to search for, but it's in here somewhere.

Additionally, the fact that you simply lump K390 in the same category as 15V shows completely your ignorance as to steel composition and what each is best suited for. Honestly you would be better served by just closing your mouth hole and listening a bit more.

You take knife steels a bit too seriously...settle down sweetheart.

[Red Leader]

I'll never miss the opportunity to highlight 3V as the perfect steel, if we are talking about a 'hard use' folder lol

K390 may have better toughness in the contexts of steels with high wear resistance, but it still sort of lies on the spectrum opposite to a lot of tougher steels like Z-Tuff, 3V, 8670, 14C28N, and others. I like them all! Can we all get along?

Regarding hard use, there is some context to that as well. I used my Spydies for slicing and cutting, and I use my Cold Steels for hard use.

[M_J87]

K390 may have better toughness in the contexts of steels with high wear resistance, but it still sort of lies on the spectrum opposite to a lot of tougher steels like Z-Tuff, 3V, 8670, 14C28N, and others.

I think there's some misconception about how tough K390 is. Yes, comparative to other high hardness tool steels it's tougher, but like you I still wouldn't consider it necessarily as a "tough" steel. Of course, I can only speak based on the numbers supplied because truth be told I can't tell the difference between most steels in practical use.

[M_J87]

Additionally, the fact that you simply lump K390 in the same category as 15V shows completely your ignorance as to steel composition and what each is best suited for.

I'd think even the most educated metallurgist would categorize 15V and K390 together. High hardness tool steels with decent toughness comparative to wear resistance. They're a lot more alike than they aren't.

[salimoneus]

K390 may have better toughness in the contexts of steels with high wear resistance, but it still sort of lies on the spectrum opposite to a lot of tougher steels like Z-Tuff, 3V, 8670, 14C28N, and others.

I think there's some misconception about how tough K390 is. Yes, comparative to other high hardness tool steels it's tougher, but like you I still wouldn't consider it necessarily as a "tough" steel. Of course, I can only speak based on the numbers supplied because truth be told I can't tell the difference between most steels in practical use.

Never said K390 was the toughest steel out there, I just think it's a better fit for the Shaman or Manix2 than many of the steels we see those models usually released with, including 15V, 20CV, 204P, S90V, XHP, the list goes on. Many are more brittle and emphasize stainless properties over toughness, edge retention, edge stability, and are in general less well balanced overall as K390 in my opinion.

[Red Leader]

K390 may have better toughness in the contexts of steels with high wear resistance, but it still sort of lies on the spectrum opposite to a lot of tougher steels like Z-Tuff, 3V, 8670, 14C28N, and others.

I think there's some misconception about how tough K390 is. Yes, comparative to other high hardness tool steels it's tougher, but like you I still wouldn't consider it necessarily as a "tough" steel. Of course, I can only speak based on the numbers supplied because truth be told I can't tell the difference between most steels in practical use.

Never said K390 was the toughest steel out there, I just think it's a better fit for the Shaman or Manix2 than many of the steels we see those models usually released with, including 15V, 20CV, 204P, S90V, XHP, the list goes on. Many are more brittle and emphasize stainless properties over toughness, edge retention, edge stability, and are in general less well balanced overall as K390 in my opinion.

I love K390 and I directionally agree, and yet comparatively a Cold Steel in AUS10A or 8CR vs a K390 blade with large hole in it are orders of magnitude different in the hard use category. Because the Cold Steel option is widely available and cost effective, it is an easy choice. I'm reminded of Sal's comment 'all good, just different' and that can certainly apply here. I wouldn't be opposed to any Golden K390 as a production option; actually I would love it. But I wouldn't beat on it, and would still worry about it being dropped off a ladder onto a concrete floor, even if it was a Shaman.

[salimoneus]

I love K390 and I directionally agree, and yet comparatively a Cold Steel in AUS10A or 8CR vs a K390 blade with large hole in it are orders of magnitude different in the hard use category. Because the Cold Steel option is widely available and cost effective, it is an easy choice. I'm reminded of Sal's comment 'all good, just different' and that can certainly apply here. I wouldn't be opposed to any Golden K390 as a production option; actually I would love it. But I wouldn't beat on it, and would still worry about it being dropped off a ladder onto a concrete floor, even if it was a Shaman.

A Cold Steel what model though? I'm specifically referring to not "hard use" but more realistically "harder use" folders, that are currently a part of the Spydeco lineup. Which at the forefront includes both Shaman and Manix2. If I was intending Cold Steel to consider something else for their models, I would have posted in their forums, but that is not the case here.

I am an admitted Spyderco fanboy and believe they try to satisfy their customers in the realm of "folding knives" more than anyone else. So that is why I am strongly suggesting either a Shaman and/or Manix2 in K390.

Not terribly difficult to understand the desire, many others have supported such an offering. Thanks for your thoughts.

[vivi]

I love K390 and I directionally agree, and yet comparatively a Cold Steel in AUS10A or 8CR vs a K390 blade with large hole in it are orders of magnitude different in the hard use category. Because the Cold Steel option is widely available and cost effective, it is an easy choice. I'm reminded of Sal's comment 'all good, just different' and that can certainly apply here. I wouldn't be opposed to any Golden K390 as a production option; actually I would love it. But I wouldn't beat on it, and would still worry about it being dropped off a ladder onto a concrete floor, even if it was a Shaman.

A Cold Steel what model though? I'm specifically referring to not "hard use" but more realistically "harder use" folders, that are currently a part of the Spydeco lineup. Which at the forefront includes both Shaman and Manix2. If I was intending Cold Steel to consider something else for their models, I would have posted in their forums, but that is not the case here.

I am an admitted Spyderco fanboy and believe they try to satisfy their customers in the realm of "folding knives" more than anyone else. So that is why I am strongly suggesting either a Shaman and/or Manix2 in K390.

Not terribly difficult to understand the desire, many others have supported such an offering. Thanks for your thoughts.

Cold Steel makes a lot of good hard use folders at a price where you won't think twice about pushing them. The 4 Max Scout is $42 right now, Recon Folders can be had under a hundred, Voyagers sell for as low as $30 new, etc.

Their heat treat on AUS10 is nice.

Spyderco does a lot other things better, but for a low cost hard use beater, it's tough to beat something like the models I mentioned.

I used to try to fill every slot with Spyderco designs, but I've come to realize different brands for different roles is a much wiser approach. Play to each companies strengths instead of trying to put a square peg in a round role.

For example: Leatherman makes a good full featured multi tool, Victorinox makes good slim every day carry multi tools, Cold Steel does hard use well, Spyderco makes very refined edge retention monsters and rust proof folders better than anyone else, ESEE has a great warranty for people that like to do silly things with their knives, Tramontina is tough to beat for a dirt cheap machete that's actually decent, Kiwi sells kitchen knives with killer geometry for pocket change, etc.

I'll always be loyal to the brand, but I've had a lot better results playing the field than trying to make a Spyderco work for every role there is.

[salimoneus]

I love K390 and I directionally agree, and yet comparatively a Cold Steel in AUS10A or 8CR vs a K390 blade with large hole in it are orders of magnitude different in the hard use category. Because the Cold Steel option is widely available and cost effective, it is an easy choice. I'm reminded of Sal's comment 'all good, just different' and that can certainly apply here. I wouldn't be opposed to any Golden K390 as a production option; actually I would love it. But I wouldn't beat on it, and would still worry about it being dropped off a ladder onto a concrete floor, even if it was a Shaman.

A Cold Steel what model though? I'm specifically referring to not "hard use" but more realistically "harder use" folders, that are currently a part of the Spydeco lineup. Which at the forefront includes both Shaman and Manix2. If I was intending Cold Steel to consider something else for their models, I would have posted in their forums, but that is not the case here.

I am an admitted Spyderco fanboy and believe they try to satisfy their customers in the realm of "folding knives" more than anyone else. So that is why I am strongly suggesting either a Shaman and/or Manix2 in K390.

Not terribly difficult to understand the desire, many others have supported such an offering. Thanks for your thoughts.

Cold Steel makes a lot of good hard use folders at a price where you won't think twice about pushing them. The 4 Max Scout is $42 right now, Recon Folders can be had under a hundred, Voyagers sell for as low as $30 new, etc.

Their heat treat on AUS10 is nice.

Spyderco does a lot other things better, but for a low cost hard use beater, it's tough to beat something like the models I mentioned.

I used to try to fill every slot with Spyderco designs, but I've come to realize different brands for different roles is a much wiser approach. Play to each companies strengths instead of trying to put a square peg in a round role.

For example: Leatherman makes a good full featured multi tool, Victorinox makes good slim every day carry multi tools, Cold Steel does hard use well, Spyderco makes very refined edge retention monsters and rust proof folders better than anyone else, ESEE has a great warranty for people that like to do silly things with their knives, Tramontina is tough to beat for a dirt cheap machete that's actually decent, Kiwi sells kitchen knives with killer geometry for pocket change, etc.

I'll always be loyal to the brand, but I've had a lot better results playing the field than trying to make a Spyderco work for every role there is.

I don't disagree that there aren't other models from other brands that may fill this particular gap, but of course everyone has their preference as to their favorite ergos and many other details when comparing brand to brand.

Regardless if you disagree or not, I will still stand by my request for either a Manix2 or Shaman in K390. I don't care if you think it's irrelevant or not, or if you think it is a completely useless configuration. I will continue to insist that many actual loyal Spyderco customers would appreciate and even purchase the offering. In fact I bet it would sell out faster than many other recent sprint/limited offerings. I think you underestimate the support that properly done Spyderco K390 has.

[Red Leader]

I love K390 and I directionally agree, and yet comparatively a Cold Steel in AUS10A or 8CR vs a K390 blade with large hole in it are orders of magnitude different in the hard use category. Because the Cold Steel option is widely available and cost effective, it is an easy choice. I'm reminded of Sal's comment 'all good, just different' and that can certainly apply here. I wouldn't be opposed to any Golden K390 as a production option; actually I would love it. But I wouldn't beat on it, and would still worry about it being dropped off a ladder onto a concrete floor, even if it was a Shaman.

A Cold Steel what model though? I'm specifically referring to not "hard use" but more realistically "harder use" folders, that are currently a part of the Spydeco lineup. Which at the forefront includes both Shaman and Manix2. If I was intending Cold Steel to consider something else for their models, I would have posted in their forums, but that is not the case here.

I am an admitted Spyderco fanboy and believe they try to satisfy their customers in the realm of "folding knives" more than anyone else. So that is why I am strongly suggesting either a Shaman and/or Manix2 in K390.

Not terribly difficult to understand the desire, many others have supported such an offering. Thanks for your thoughts.

Cold Steel makes a lot of good hard use folders at a price where you won't think twice about pushing them. The 4 Max Scout is $42 right now, Recon Folders can be had under a hundred, Voyagers sell for as low as $30 new, etc.

Their heat treat on AUS10 is nice.

Spyderco does a lot other things better, but for a low cost hard use beater, it's tough to beat something like the models I mentioned.

I used to try to fill every slot with Spyderco designs, but I've come to realize different brands for different roles is a much wiser approach. Play to each companies strengths instead of trying to put a square peg in a round role.

For example: Leatherman makes a good full featured multi tool, Victorinox makes good slim every day carry multi tools, Cold Steel does hard use well, Spyderco makes very refined edge retention monsters and rust proof folders better than anyone else, ESEE has a great warranty for people that like to do silly things with their knives, Tramontina is tough to beat for a dirt cheap machete that's actually decent, Kiwi sells kitchen knives with killer geometry for pocket change, etc.

I'll always be loyal to the brand, but I've had a lot better results playing the field than trying to make a Spyderco work for every role there is.

I don't disagree that there aren't other models from other brands that may fill this particular gap, but of course everyone has their preference as to their favorite ergos and many other details when comparing brand to brand.

Regardless if you disagree or not, I will still stand by my request for either a Manix2 or Shaman in K390. I don't care if you think it's irrelevant or not, or if you think it is a completely useless configuration. I will continue to insist that many actual loyal Spyderco customers would appreciate and even purchase the offering. In fact I bet it would sell out faster than many other recent sprint/limited offerings. I think you underestimate the support that properly done Spyderco K390 has.

It's funny that we completely agree on this topic, but for completely different reasons. I would absolutely LOVE to see K390 in a Manix 2 or Shaman...or Bodacious, or PM2 (non-exclusive, maybe LW), Native 5, etc. That would be such a killer addition to the Golden lineup. If you research my history, you will find posts from me advocating for the addition of this steel to the Golden knives. My favorites are the knives from Golden, and K390 is one of my favorite steels, so it would be an awesome match.

I suppose our reasons differ. I don't consider the Manix 2 a hard use knife. Especially if it were in K390. What is the charpy on K390? 8ft lbs? Maybe 9? Look at the 90 deg plunge grind and see how it enters straight up through the giant hole in the blade - you have multiple stress risers all coming together. I'm not trying to dog on the design, it's quite brilliant and I have 3 of them and would absolutely add a K390, but my standards for 'hard use' or even 'harder use' are extremely high and none of Spyderco's current offerings meet that standard so I don't try to make them fit. To me these are slicers and that is where they excel. I have a Manix 2 in my pocket right now. Anyone can feel free to call twisting and lateral pressure abuse, I'm fine with that. And...there are some folders that can stand up to that abuse far better because that is what they were built to handle.

'All good...just different'

Harder use options would probably be something like the Code 4, the Recon 1, the Engage, the American Lawman, the AK47 to name a few that are a little more EDC friendly.