PM2 tip strength

[OnEdge]

Greetings, this has been simmering in my thoughts lately. Maybe one for Sal. My understanding for the, Endura, Endela and Delica models the tip drops to enhance tip strength. Why haven’t the PM2 and PM3 followed suit. I was thinking of doing it myself but can’t see purposely altering it unless the tip were to break. Thank you in advance, Troy

[CDEP]

PM2 & PARA3 have much thicker blade stock (0.145) than the Delica (0.098) and Endura/Endela (0.118).

[James Y]

Some members have reported breaking the tips off of their PM2's blades. It hasn't happened to either of my two PM2's (yet), but I can certainly see the possibility if I'm not being fully mindful in certain circumstances. The thicker blade stock of the PM2 and Para3 wouldn't make a difference, because the blades still taper down to fine tips, especially on the PM2.

Many people like and prefer pointer tips without the slightly dropped point. I like both.

Jim

[Pacu0420]

Different blade shapes for different tasks. The PM2 is certainly not a blade to use as a pry bar or screw driver.

[OnEdge]

All good input. My thoughts were if it is a enhancement for one, wouldn’t it apply to another.

[bearfacedkiller]

It’s just preference. Spyderco changed the Seki knives due to complaints. I put a tip back on them myself. If you want to round the tip off on a Para2 all it takes is a piece of sandpaper and a little effort.

It’s worth noting that when we got a Straight Spined Stretch and a StetchXL they did not come with rounded tips like the other Seki knives. The Endela which was also a newer Seki knife did.

[Danke]

Everything can be a prybar if you're brave enough.

[phaust]

You just need the right PM2. Here's the tip of the Emerson opener edition

[SpyderEdgeForever]

You just need the right PM2. Here's the tip of the Emerson opener edition

I love that. Thank you.

I am definitely in the thick blade stock camp, but, I also see the definite value and uses in pointier tips.

If one does not try to use it as a prybar they should be fine?

[phaust]

You just need the right PM2. Here's the tip of the Emerson opener edition

I love that. Thank you.

I am definitely in the thick blade stock camp, but, I also see the definite value and uses in pointier tips.

If one does not try to use it as a prybar they should be fine?

Yep and the extra thick tip makes dummies like me feel like they do stuff they shouldn't with it

[Wartstein]

Greetings, this has been simmering in my thoughts lately. Maybe one for Sal. My understanding for the, Endura, Endela and Delica models the tip drops to enhance tip strength. Why haven’t the PM2 and PM3 followed suit. I was thinking of doing it myself but can’t see purposely altering it unless the tip were to break. Thank you in advance, Troy

I actually really like the "drop" on the Endura,Endela, Delica tip. Perhaps even more so the even more pronounced ones on the "Salt" versions (Pac Salt, Salt 2). I always found those tips to be fine enough for any task I personally use them for, and the "reinforcement" inspires more confidence in harder tasks (admittedly I don´t know how much difference it really makes).

If a majority of consumers was into modding their knives, I´d think the "drop" should be the default way to go:
One can always make such a tip pointier WITHOUT loosing cutting edge length, while vice versa giving a pointier tip that "drop" will inevitably result in an at least a tad shorter edge.
But as it is (most customers won´t or can´t mod their blades) I fully get why Spyderco goes with pointier tips in the first place on many models.

[jwbnyc]

Hey Gernot!

[Michal O]

Here is my comparison pic done a while ago. PM2 is in the middle with purple G10.


Guy who sold it to me, has his own cruwear PM2, once dropped it on concrete, only small part of the bevel on tip broke off, maybe 0,3 mm.

Massad Ayoob next to PM2 is the tank compared to most of my knife collection. Absolute beast.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

Greetings, this has been simmering in my thoughts lately. Maybe one for Sal. My understanding for the, Endura, Endela and Delica models the tip drops to enhance tip strength. Why haven’t the PM2 and PM3 followed suit. I was thinking of doing it myself but can’t see purposely altering it unless the tip were to break. Thank you in advance, Troy

I actually really like the "drop" on the Endura,Endela, Delica tip. Perhaps even more so the even more pronounced ones on the "Salt" versions (Pac Salt, Salt 2). I always found those tips to be fine enough for any task I personally use them for, and the "reinforcement" inspires more confidence in harder tasks (admittedly I don´t know how much difference it really makes).

If a majority of consumers was into modding their knives, I´d think the "drop" should be the default way to go:
One can always make such a tip pointier WITHOUT loosing cutting edge length, while vice versa giving a pointier tip that "drop" will inevitably result in an at least a tad shorter edge.
But as it is (most customers won´t or can´t mod their blades) I fully get why Spyderco goes with pointier tips in the first place on many models.

Wartstein my friend it is so great to see you on here!
That is a great point. I have a PM 2 and I am scared to use it because I don't want the point broken. I carry my Foliage Green Endura 4.
It cuts bread and sausage and breaks down cardboard and is a great pocket comfort.

[OnEdge]

Okay, no pun intended. My point of my post was at some point tip breakage was prevalent enough on the Endura and Delica models that a change was made for the positive IMO. I have read several threads about tip breakage on the PM2-PM3 series. Would this not be a good modification to make for these as well. Sal, Eric, what say you?

[vivi]

I'd hope for the opposite myself. Never had an issue with the tip of my old first run PM2 or any of my Military folders over the past couple decades. I always grind my Pacific salt tips down to resemble the Endura 3.

Haven't even had an issue with the tip of my Catcherman used as a utility EDC knife, even using it to puncture cans.

[RustyIron]

I know people get tired of listening to me when I say this, but it IS just a simple math problem. As the dimensions of the tip approach zero, so does the strength. And as the dimension of the tip approaches zero, the pressure it exerts approaches infinity. You don't need to be Richard Feynman to figure out what happens when you have infinite pressure at a single point. I think you get a black hole or something.

If people find breakage to be a problem, they can always sharpen their edges to be blunter, and they can drop down the tip as is done on the Endura. It takes minutes.

On the other hand, if Spyderco was to start churning out blunt blades, it would take a LOT of work to make them pointy and slicey. Personally, I'm a fan of pointy and slicey.

[Scandi Grind]

Okay, no pun intended. My point of my post was at some point tip breakage was prevalent enough on the Endura and Delica models that a change was made for the positive IMO. I have read several threads about tip breakage on the PM2-PM3 series. Would this not be a good modification to make for these as well. Sal, Eric, what say you?

It isn't really about better or worse. Something thin and pointy will cut better, something stout and round is more durable. I can hear Sal right now saying, "All good, just different."

For me a knife is a cutting/slicing tool. I use knives for knife like functions, so a stouter tip is rarely going to be of any benefit. Some people work under harsher circumstances, are less careful, or need more versatility, so a stronger tip is preferred. There is no right answer, it depends on your use, which is why variety is nice.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

Along with the utility it is cosmetic and psychological for me.
To me thick = survive the apocalypse tool and thin= snap and break.

I feel a thicker blade is me getting more material for the cost.

[Wartstein]

Wartstein my friend it is so great to see you on here!
That is a great point. I have a PM 2 and I am scared to use it because I don't want the point broken. I carry my Foliage Green Endura 4.
It cuts bread and sausage and breaks down cardboard and is a great pocket comfort.

Hi SEF, thanks!

As far as I recall the foliage green Endura has a sabre grind, right? To be honest: The tips on those sabre grind Enduras and Delicas are actually way TOO stout and "blunt" for my liking for any remotely regular EDC scenario.
I do like to use my combo edge sabre grind Delica though in the super rare occasions where the tip could hit hard stuff/ metal AND I have to work so quickly that I absolutely can´t be a bit careful concerning the tip.
If a sabre grind Endura or Delica was my main EDC though, I´d definitely mod that (sabre grind) tip to be a lot pointier.

And again: I have no idea if an ffg Endura tip actually IS stronger than a PM2 tip. Sure, the former has that "drop", but on the other hand the PM2 blade starts out from thicker stock and has less blade length for tapering, so this should lead to a stronger tip when looking at the spines of the blades.

In my case it´s really just that I never felt like I´d need a tip even pointier than an ffg Endura tip with its "drop" and so I appreciate the bit of added strength the "drop" just has to give it by geometry. Perhaps it´s just more of a "psychological" thing though.