Military 2 Discussion (Merged)

[Midnightrider]

This one also cuts the monster box better than the 15V did, but still not as well as my Chief or Bodacious.

Was there a "best box cutting knife" thread?

I meant to ask about that. I have cut up probably a thousand boxes in the past years and I don't know of a silver bullet.

[Evil D]

This one also cuts the monster box better than the 15V did, but still not as well as my Chief or Bodacious.

Was there a "best box cutting knife" thread?

I meant to ask about that. I have cut up probably a thousand boxes in the past years and I don't know of a silver bullet.

Not that I'm aware of, but it's a pretty easy topic to speculate about. There is a thread about behind the bevel thicknesses which combined with blade stock thickness can give us a pretty good idea of what to expect. Basically, geometry is what allows a blade to cut, and the thinner you made the wedge shape of a blade the easier it'll go through rigid material. Even the actual edge of a knife is just making that part of the wedge as thin as possible.

[Midnightrider]

This one also cuts the monster box better than the 15V did, but still not as well as my Chief or Bodacious.

Was there a "best box cutting knife" thread?

I meant to ask about that. I have cut up probably a thousand boxes in the past years and I don't know of a silver bullet.

Not that I'm aware of, but it's a pretty easy topic to speculate about. There is a thread about behind the bevel thicknesses which combined with blade stock thickness can give us a pretty good idea of what to expect. Basically, geometry is what allows a blade to cut, and the thinner you made the wedge shape of a blade the easier it'll go through rigid material. Even the actual edge of a knife is just making that part of the wedge as thin as possible.

Thanks, this kinda turned on a light bulb for me. At the same time, the steel or whatever material the blade is made out of has to be x-much harder than the material being cut. And the thin as possible is a balance between stiffness and skinny.

Does this mean that some steels are better or worse, and could somebody like Sal produce the optimal mother of all box cutting knives?

I guess I have more questions than before :D

[Brock O Lee]

...the optimal mother of all box cutting knives...

My favourite Spyderco box cutters, by a long shot, are the Seki K390 wharncliffe's (Endela or Delica). I formed that conclusion after 2 years of constant use on cardboard. You could probably also count the Endura wharncliffe in that camp. That steel and blade shape combo, with a suitable low angle edge, is superb on cardboard. Try one!

[Midnightrider]

...the optimal mother of all box cutting knives...

My favourite Spyderco box cutters, by a long shot, are the Seki K390 wharncliffe's (Endela or Delica). I formed that conclusion after 2 years of constant use on cardboard. You could probably also count the Endura wharncliffe in that camp. That steel and blade shape combo, with a suitable low angle edge, is superb on cardboard. Try one!

The knives I cut the most boxes with are just the ones I carry all the time which is a Military in S110V and a P4 K390. I'm unlikely to buy anything but Militarys but if I can grab an Endura in an interesting steel for an ok price I might go for it.

[skybladefromthe]

I just received my Crucarta Military2 and it has the exact same centering issue you described. I've seen this is not unique to this model. This is the first Spyderco I've had that I couldn't adjust it to a satisfactory tolerance.
The decision has to be made whether to live with it or go ahead and flip it.

I don't post much here (usually on Reddit/BF), but I figured I would share my experience with the latest drop as this thread is more active.

I got my Crucarta Military 2 in on Saturday, and it was a little rough out of the box. The lock bar is noticeably more stiff than on any PM2 I own or have owned before, the centering was very off towards the show side scale, one of the clip screws was stripped and free spinning, and the action was not smooth. The electrical fire smell is also a bit odd and is not something I've experienced before, having owned a Crucarta Shaman.

I took it apart and found the same laser cutting remnant/burr on the pivot hole as noted earlier. It popped off after I hit it with a diamond file. I have adjusted the action the best I can and loctited the screws down, but the pivot tightness keeps loosening as I break the knife in so I'll probably need to redo this again. I cannot fix the centering with the usual body screws/paper wedge trick, as the blade will wander back in a short time.

The pocket clip screws/threads are perplexing, as the threading on one of the pocket clips screws was totally wrecked out of the box (popped out when I went to change the clip to tip-up, as it wasn't held in by anything other than friction, and the threads are just completely gone). Even with the other two clip screws, neither want to go cleanly into the threaded holes in the liners, and none of the screws seem quite long enough to make it to the inner liner surface. I've never seen these issues before with a Spyderco. Eventually I subbed in a clip screw from a Manix 2, so now I've got a T8 along with two T6s holding my clip on.

Not off to a great start, but I'm hoping I can eventually get it into a better state. I'm kinda irked with myself for messing with it when I should have just returned it for a replacement.

[WilliamMunny]

I just received my Crucarta Military2 and it has the exact same centering issue you described. I've seen this is not unique to this model. This is the first Spyderco I've had that I couldn't adjust it to a satisfactory tolerance.
The decision has to be made whether to live with it or go ahead and flip it.

I don't post much here (usually on Reddit/BF), but I figured I would share my experience with the latest drop as this thread is more active.

I got my Crucarta Military 2 in on Saturday, and it was a little rough out of the box. The lock bar is noticeably more stiff than on any PM2 I own or have owned before, the centering was very off towards the show side scale, one of the clip screws was stripped and free spinning, and the action was not smooth. The electrical fire smell is also a bit odd and is not something I've experienced before, having owned a Crucarta Shaman.

I took it apart and found the same laser cutting remnant/burr on the pivot hole as noted earlier. It popped off after I hit it with a diamond file. I have adjusted the action the best I can and loctited the screws down, but the pivot tightness keeps loosening as I break the knife in so I'll probably need to redo this again. I cannot fix the centering with the usual body screws/paper wedge trick, as the blade will wander back in a short time.

The pocket clip screws/threads are perplexing, as the threading on one of the pocket clips screws was totally wrecked out of the box (popped out when I went to change the clip to tip-up, as it wasn't held in by anything other than friction, and the threads are just completely gone). Even with the other two clip screws, neither want to go cleanly into the threaded holes in the liners, and none of the screws seem quite long enough to make it to the inner liner surface. I've never seen these issues before with a Spyderco. Eventually I subbed in a clip screw from a Manix 2, so now I've got a T8 along with two T6s holding my clip on.

Not off to a great start, but I'm hoping I can eventually get it into a better state. I'm kinda irked with myself for messing with it when I should have just returned it for a replacement.

For what it's worth my Crucarta PM2 is one of the best knives I own in terms of centering, action and general fit and finish. I would have thought the Military 2 would be similar.

[skybladefromthe]

I bet most are just fine. Probably a very small percentage that had blade a centering issue. And it's not scraping on the side.

For what it's worth my Crucarta PM2 is one of the best knives I own in terms of centering, action and general fit and finish. I would have thought the Military 2 would be similar.

[Evil D]

I bet most are just fine. Probably a very small percentage that had blade a centering issue. And it's not scraping on the side.

For what it's worth my Crucarta PM2 is one of the best knives I own in terms of centering, action and general fit and finish. I would have thought the Military 2 would be similar.

It might just be the pic but it kinda looks like the lanyard tube isn't seated all the way into the liner on the bottom of your pic, if that's true then it's definitely all out of parallel and that'll throw the blade centering off.

[skybladefromthe]

It might just be the pic but it kinda looks like the lanyard tube isn't seated all the way into the liner on the bottom of your pic, if that's true then it's definitely all out of parallel and that'll throw the blade centering off.

I'm going to check that out! Thanks. I'll let you know how it turns out.

[skybladefromthe]

I think the lanyard was a bit off. However still not centered but I think it helped a tiny bit. Thanks for the suggestion.

It might just be the pic but it kinda looks like the lanyard tube isn't seated all the way into the liner on the bottom of your pic, if that's true then it's definitely all out of parallel and that'll throw the blade centering off.

[Red Leader]

I think the lanyard was a bit off. However still not centered but I think it helped a tiny bit. Thanks for the suggestion.

It might just be the pic but it kinda looks like the lanyard tube isn't seated all the way into the liner on the bottom of your pic, if that's true then it's definitely all out of parallel and that'll throw the blade centering off.

I had heard a quote on this forum that was something to the tune of 'blade centering is more scale centering than anything else'...and it may ring true in your case.

If you are willing to take the knife apart, it may be worthwhile to pull the blade and lay it on a flat surface, and flip flop sides to see if the blade has a slight warp in it, or if it truly is in the scales.

I have seen metal liners not exactly flat from the factory, and also, if one factors in the tension of the lock bar, it moves the liner quite a bit, which also means if you tweak it a little, you can also influence where those scales will end up when the knife is closed quite a bit as well. Given that they have been having problems w/ the linerless micarta Natives, it is no doubt a material that does not impart rigidity in the same way that a metal or G10 scale might. This is also true of FRN scales.

I'm betting you could get it either a lot closer or near perfect. But it would likely require going a little deeper.

[Evil D]

Just look at this. Ain't it beautiful?



(I know it looks like I'm about to cut my index finger but it's just the angle of the pic, it's actually pretty far from the edge, it's more "behind" the edge in this pic)

This grip isn't as comfortable for me on the Military 1, the finger choil on the 2 is far more comfortable for me in this grip. That's not to say the 1 is uncomfortable, just that for me the 2 feels way better, more like it was designed with a grip like this in mind. If I'm going to have a finger choil then I want the whole design to work well like this, otherwise I'll stick with designs like the Bodacious that give me this grip without a choil.

But also the way the thumb ramp fits just right along the bottom of my thumb is so nice. Most thumb ramps end up somewhere in the middle and I end up with my thumb positioned awkwardly on top of the ramp somewhere but this is just right. It might even be a nice place to put some jimping.

As much as I've gotta away from wanting 50/50 finger choils and thumb ramps, this design gets it so right it actually makes me dislike other choil/ramp designs even more for not being as good

[skybladefromthe]

Hi
I have had it apart twice so another won't hurt. I'll check for irregularities. In this case I have noticed that adjusting the main pivot screws, or any of the other screws for that matter, doesn't make any difference to how the blade centers. You just get what you get.
I'm learning a lot from the members. I'll post a follow up to what I find.
Thank you!
-skybladefromthe

I think the lanyard was a bit off. However still not centered but I think it helped a tiny bit. Thanks for the suggestion.

It might just be the pic but it kinda looks like the lanyard tube isn't seated all the way into the liner on the bottom of your pic, if that's true then it's definitely all out of parallel and that'll throw the blade centering off.

I had heard a quote on this forum that was something to the tune of 'blade centering is more scale centering than anything else'...and it may ring true in your case.

If you are willing to take the knife apart, it may be worthwhile to pull the blade and lay it on a flat surface, and flip flop sides to see if the blade has a slight warp in it, or if it truly is in the scales.

I have seen metal liners not exactly flat from the factory, and also, if one factors in the tension of the lock bar, it moves the liner quite a bit, which also means if you tweak it a little, you can also influence where those scales will end up when the knife is closed quite a bit as well. Given that they have been having problems w/ the linerless micarta Natives, it is no doubt a material that does not impart rigidity in the same way that a metal or G10 scale might. This is also true of FRN scales.

I'm betting you could get it either a lot closer or near perfect. But it would likely require going a little deeper.

[Evil D]

Hi
I have had it apart twice so another won't hurt. I'll check for irregularities. In this case I have noticed that adjusting the main pivot screws, or any of the other screws for that matter, doesn't make any difference to how the blade centers. You just get what you get.
I'm learning a lot from the members. I'll post a follow up to what I find.
Thank you!
-skybladefromthe

I only have one knife in my collection that I can't center, and the construction of that knife makes it pretty much impossible (Rock Lobster).

I loosen all of the screws around the whole knife (clip screws too because they're holding the scale in place against the liner). You don't want to remove them just loosen them.

Then depending on what side your blade is off center, hold the knife (while closed) in your hand and literally bend it like you're trying to break a stick in two. If you watch you'll see that the blade moves left or right depending on which way to bend the handle. You need to bend it so that it pushes the blade in the opposite direction of where it's off center, and then start snugging down screws at the same time. It helps if you have 3 hands lol.

Some people try to wedge folded up paper between the blade and inside scale and that might help but what's happening when you bend the knife is you're shifting all of the parts around in/out of parallel with each other, and you need to bend it so that it's straight and then snug the screws down.

I usually try to bend/press the knife into my thigh and use my other hand to shut down the screws. I'd start with the body screws and then work around to the pivot screws. On a Military I can do this one handed because the handle is so long, just hold it like this and you can squeeze it and you'll see the blade move side to side, then hit the screws with your other hand.





I'm one of the last people you'll hear complaining about blade centering because this has only ever not worked on that one Rock Lobster, and that knife has almost no gap between the blade and liners so it almost doesn't move when I try this method. But I do this all the time with a lot of knives and it works.

[skybladefromthe]

Hi
It's being stubborn but seems like loosening the clip screws made a big difference. At least it's centered before tightening everything. And I could feel the blade moving during tightening of the pivots.
Also there was a slight bend in one of the liners. I tried to correct it.
So I'll try again a little later because I have to run.
I appreciate the detailed help on this. I think I'll at least be able to get it to an acceptable degree of centering now. And the action feels better than ever if I don't get it to tight. Man this one is like walking a tightrope compared to others in my collection.
Many thanks!
skybladefromthe
Oh, and I can't help thinking back to my Jade Milli that was perfect out of the box!

Hi
I have had it apart twice so another won't hurt. I'll check for irregularities. In this case I have noticed that adjusting the main pivot screws, or any of the other screws for that matter, doesn't make any difference to how the blade centers. You just get what you get.
I'm learning a lot from the members. I'll post a follow up to what I find.
Thank you!
-skybladefromthe

I only have one knife in my collection that I can't center, and the construction of that knife makes it pretty much impossible (Rock Lobster).

I loosen all of the screws around the whole knife (clip screws too because they're holding the scale in place against the liner). You don't want to remove them just loosen them.

Then depending on what side your blade is off center, hold the knife (while closed) in your hand and literally bend it like you're trying to break a stick in two. If you watch you'll see that the blade moves left or right depending on which way to bend the handle. You need to bend it so that it pushes the blade in the opposite direction of where it's off center, and then start snugging down screws at the same time. It helps if you have 3 hands lol.

Some people try to wedge folded up paper between the blade and inside scale and that might help but what's happening when you bend the knife is you're shifting all of the parts around in/out of parallel with each other, and you need to bend it so that it's straight and then snug the screws down.

I usually try to bend/press the knife into my thigh and use my other hand to shut down the screws. I'd start with the body screws and then work around to the pivot screws. On a Military I can do this one handed because the handle is so long, just hold it like this and you can squeeze it and you'll see the blade move side to side, then hit the screws with your other hand.





I'm one of the last people you'll hear complaining about blade centering because this has only ever not worked on that one Rock Lobster, and that knife has almost no gap between the blade and liners so it almost doesn't move when I try this method. But I do this all the time with a lot of knives and it works.

[Evil D]

Hi
It's being stubborn but seems like loosening the clip screws made a big difference. At least it's centered before tightening everything. And I could feel the blade moving during tightening of the pivots.
Also there was a slight bend in one of the liners. I tried to correct it.
So I'll try again a little later because I have to run.
I appreciate the detailed help on this. I think I'll at least be able to get it to an acceptable degree of centering now. And the action feels better than ever if I don't get it to tight. Man this one is like walking a tightrope compared to others in my collection.
Many thanks!
skybladefromthe
Oh, and I can't help thinking back to my Jade Milli that was perfect out of the box!

Hi
I have had it apart twice so another won't hurt. I'll check for irregularities. In this case I have noticed that adjusting the main pivot screws, or any of the other screws for that matter, doesn't make any difference to how the blade centers. You just get what you get.
I'm learning a lot from the members. I'll post a follow up to what I find.
Thank you!
-skybladefromthe

I only have one knife in my collection that I can't center, and the construction of that knife makes it pretty much impossible (Rock Lobster).

I loosen all of the screws around the whole knife (clip screws too because they're holding the scale in place against the liner). You don't want to remove them just loosen them.

Then depending on what side your blade is off center, hold the knife (while closed) in your hand and literally bend it like you're trying to break a stick in two. If you watch you'll see that the blade moves left or right depending on which way to bend the handle. You need to bend it so that it pushes the blade in the opposite direction of where it's off center, and then start snugging down screws at the same time. It helps if you have 3 hands lol.

Some people try to wedge folded up paper between the blade and inside scale and that might help but what's happening when you bend the knife is you're shifting all of the parts around in/out of parallel with each other, and you need to bend it so that it's straight and then snug the screws down.

I usually try to bend/press the knife into my thigh and use my other hand to shut down the screws. I'd start with the body screws and then work around to the pivot screws. On a Military I can do this one handed because the handle is so long, just hold it like this and you can squeeze it and you'll see the blade move side to side, then hit the screws with your other hand.





I'm one of the last people you'll hear complaining about blade centering because this has only ever not worked on that one Rock Lobster, and that knife has almost no gap between the blade and liners so it almost doesn't move when I try this method. But I do this all the time with a lot of knives and it works.

If it's really being stubborn then flex it so that it's actually off center towards the other side and then tighten the screws.

Another guy in the Facebook group just suggested taking the knife apart and actually bending the scale just slightly in this same manner. I've never done that but I'm going to try it with my Rock Lobster and see if it helps. I'd be really careful with this though.

[James Y]

Do these centering issues happen more on folders with longer blades? It seems to be the case.

Jim

[8th_Note]

Hi
It's being stubborn but seems like loosening the clip screws made a big difference. At least it's centered before tightening everything. And I could feel the blade moving during tightening of the pivots.
Also there was a slight bend in one of the liners. I tried to correct it.
So I'll try again a little later because I have to run.
I appreciate the detailed help on this. I think I'll at least be able to get it to an acceptable degree of centering now. And the action feels better than ever if I don't get it to tight. Man this one is like walking a tightrope compared to others in my collection.
Many thanks!
skybladefromthe
Oh, and I can't help thinking back to my Jade Milli that was perfect out of the box!

Hi
I have had it apart twice so another won't hurt. I'll check for irregularities. In this case I have noticed that adjusting the main pivot screws, or any of the other screws for that matter, doesn't make any difference to how the blade centers. You just get what you get.
I'm learning a lot from the members. I'll post a follow up to what I find.
Thank you!
-skybladefromthe

I only have one knife in my collection that I can't center, and the construction of that knife makes it pretty much impossible (Rock Lobster).

I loosen all of the screws around the whole knife (clip screws too because they're holding the scale in place against the liner). You don't want to remove them just loosen them.

Then depending on what side your blade is off center, hold the knife (while closed) in your hand and literally bend it like you're trying to break a stick in two. If you watch you'll see that the blade moves left or right depending on which way to bend the handle. You need to bend it so that it pushes the blade in the opposite direction of where it's off center, and then start snugging down screws at the same time. It helps if you have 3 hands lol.

Some people try to wedge folded up paper between the blade and inside scale and that might help but what's happening when you bend the knife is you're shifting all of the parts around in/out of parallel with each other, and you need to bend it so that it's straight and then snug the screws down.

I usually try to bend/press the knife into my thigh and use my other hand to shut down the screws. I'd start with the body screws and then work around to the pivot screws. On a Military I can do this one handed because the handle is so long, just hold it like this and you can squeeze it and you'll see the blade move side to side, then hit the screws with your other hand.





I'm one of the last people you'll hear complaining about blade centering because this has only ever not worked on that one Rock Lobster, and that knife has almost no gap between the blade and liners so it almost doesn't move when I try this method. But I do this all the time with a lot of knives and it works.

I have a 15V Mili 2 that was off center in a way that was almost identical to yours (blade almost touching the handle). I took it apart and removed the liners. The show-side liner was slightly torqued. You couldn't tell until you removed it from the handle. But I straightened it out the best I could and reassemble it. Now, it's not perfectly centered, but it's close enough.



As a side note, when I disassembled the 15V Mili 2, the lanyard tube pretty much just fell right out. That was a nice change from the typical experience of fighting with it to get the liners out

[Evil D]

Do these centering issues happen more on folders with longer blades? It seems to be the case.

Jim

It's at least more obvious the longer the blade is.