Police XL Talk

[Dodge]

Wouldn’t mind a police salt….

[vivi]

Wouldn’t mind a police salt….

If both the Police and Military get the salt treatment close to the same time I wouldn't know what to think. When I got my first Pacific Salt and Police around 2008 that was a dream combo of mine.

[SaltyCaribbeanDfly]

Well tracking says I’m supposed to be getting my first P4 tomorrow (PD#1) and I’ve heard it’s a big boi but sometimes bigger is better and biggest is best so I’d be game for a C.O.D.

I like my PD1 version quite a bit. The coating is better than what Spyderco typically uses on japanese knives, and the steel sharpens up very easily.

Cool, that’s good to know

[sal]

Well, I received the first drawing for the Police with a 5.0" blade length. So I want to continue this conversation. I know drawings always look larger than a real model, but this thing is a sword. Overall length in almost 12". I guess I'm trying to decide; 1) if we want to make one, and 2) do we want to modify the design? It's currently a mid back-lock.

sal

[James Y]

Wow. I'm not usually into 5" blades on folders (I do own one 5" and one 6"-bladed folder, each from different companies), but I might make an exception someday if there was a 5"-bladed Poluce XL, especially if the tip sits down far enough into the handle when closed, and if the clip's landing spot is on a flat logo area (if the scales are FRN).

Jim

[sal]

Thanx much for all of the comments so far. Some thoughts to share;

Nick, I like your C.O.P. name.

Jeb,

I don't think we can use REX-121 in this length. that's why we couldn't make a Mule Team out of it. Longer blades in 121 tend to warp. Also, There isn't any room for a lanyard hole. The Police designs have always been about us wrapping a handle around the blade, just enough to cover it. We tried a lanyard hole years ago and placement was a nightmare and I didn't want to enlarge the handle to fit a lanyard hole.

Some thoughts on other comments; I don't think I would be interested in a Tanto tip, but if we were to make it and it were to be popular, Eric might be talked into a Tanto tip? That might require a handle mod> I like Tanto tips on my Wakizashi and Katana blades.

I would probably prefer to use liners, skeletonized. This would keep the knife thinner which is one of the real features of the Police family. Easy to carry for a large folder.

I would prefer a 14mm opening hole. It's a full flat as drawn, might be able to run a thin swedge on the spine to reduce friction in "through cuts" and reduce weight, also for appearance.

If we wee to do a Salt, I would prefer FRN and no liners, maybe a fully serrated H2? But the tooling is really costly so we'd have to be sure of a market.

I probably wouldn't put an Emerson opener on it. That would require a different grind for strength.

It would certainly fit the Novelty category.

sal

[sal]

What I would buy is a stretched Bodacious. Add an inch to closed length to match the Police 4, and you'd have 4 1/2" of sharpened edge. And I think the design would not suffer at all from the additional length.

The Spyderco knife I own that I think that would actually strongly benefit from being longer is the Lil Temperance 3. I'm pretty sure if it was an inch longer, it would be a more generally useful knife. That wide, short, thick blade, with necessarily strongly curved sharpened edge, would be transformed, and the handle would be a little less crowded for those with wide hands. The grip shape is already really good.

Hi Derangedhermit.

The Bodacious is still pretty new to get into larger variations. I'll need a couple of years with the model in the field and variations in use before I were to consider a larger one.

We do have a design for a Lil' temperance in a 3.5" blade. We just haven't made a concept model yet. Maybe I'll make one?

sal

[xceptnl]

This thread slipped under my radar as well, but it's been enjoyable to catch up. Some terrific ideas but they are making me question what I enjoy about my 4" folders (P3/P4s, Millie 1/2s & Chief).

• I miss the swedge

• I don't miss the Boye dent as much as I thought i would

• Linerless G10 sounds cool but what i have always loved about the Police was it's thin width in pocket

• Wish we could see a P3 revival in K390

• The C.O.P. is just perfect

• Can we get this monster with teeth?

Subscribed!

[p_atrick]

We do have a design for a Lil' temperance in a 3.5" blade. We just haven't made a concept model yet. Maybe I'll make one?

Sorry (not sorry) to high jack this thread, but holy moly a 3.5 LT is music to my ears.

[vivi]

Well, I received the first drawing for the Police with a 5.0" blade length. So I want to continue this conversation. I know drawings always look larger than a real model, but this thing is a sword. Overall length in almost 12". I guess I'm trying to decide; 1) if we want to make one, and 2) do we want to modify the design? It's currently a mid back-lock.

sal

I don't expect the market for such a knife to be very big, but I know I'd personally buy a few.

This would be a tough call for me if I were in your shoes.

Obviously something like a Para 3 will sell more, but there could be untapped market potential.

The 4.5"+ folder market is dominated by a single company. They do certain things well, but general innovation, high performance steels and superior cutting geometey typically are not their strong suits.

So I think there is room for a new market player in this category.

[vivi]

Thanx much for all of the comments so far. Some thoughts to share;

Nick, I like your C.O.P. name.

Jeb,

I don't think we can use REX-121 in this length. that's why we couldn't make a Mule Team out of it. Longer blades in 121 tend to warp. Also, There isn't any room for a lanyard hole. The Police designs have always been about us wrapping a handle around the blade, just enough to cover it. We tried a lanyard hole years ago and placement was a nightmare and I didn't want to enlarge the handle to fit a lanyard hole.

Some thoughts on other comments; I don't think I would be interested in a Tanto tip, but if we were to make it and it were to be popular, Eric might be talked into a Tanto tip? That might require a handle mod> I like Tanto tips on my Wakizashi and Katana blades.

I would probably prefer to use liners, skeletonized. This would keep the knife thinner which is one of the real features of the Police family. Easy to carry for a large folder.

I would prefer a 14mm opening hole. It's a full flat as drawn, might be able to run a thin swedge on the spine to reduce friction in "through cuts" and reduce weight, also for appearance.

If we wee to do a Salt, I would prefer FRN and no liners, maybe a fully serrated H2? But the tooling is really costly so we'd have to be sure of a market.

I probably wouldn't put an Emerson opener on it. That would require a different grind for strength.

It would certainly fit the Novelty category.

sal

I'm fine with no lanyard hole personally. To me that's a plus.

I think the steel should be balanced, economical and tough. I think this will be a niche product so going all out with materials that will guarantee a $300+ price tag may not be the best route. But, on the other hand, I think K390 gave the Police 4 a level of hype the Police 3 never got online.

I think liners make sense if thinness is a primary goal. Personally I like a fatter handle during use, but I have to admit the Police carries exceptionally well due to how thin it is. I could go either way on this point.

One thing I do have some mild concerns about is the Police 4 lightweights internal pin to reinforce the lock bar spring makes it a bit more cumbersome to re-assemble, and I could see that being even more of an issue with such long liners.

Bigger opening holes are better IMO. One of the things I like best about gen 4 Police folders VS older models is the larger opening hole.

If a salt version were in mind from the start, maybe linerless would be better. Long, linerless handles can be made stiff enough if they're thick. The gen 2 japanese voyagers with traditional mid lock backs are one example. Linerless models from 4" to 6" blades that had no handle issues I'm aware of. But going this route would make it difficult to make the design as thin as you want I would guess.

[sal]

I'm a little younger than you, but not much. Things in life sure do change, and at least sometimes they can be very unpredictable - I went to the hospital about 6 months ago with back pain, and a couple days later had quadruple bypass surgery on my heart. I have finally recovered, but it was slow at first.

I was recently reflecting on much less important changes, like my knife preferences, and other things too.

Keep up the good work, and take care!

Gene

Hi Gene,

Glad you are recovering. Life is a long and winding road for sure. And I'm learning as I get older and look back over the chapters and scenes of my life, I remember the good times, the bad times, and the foolish and stupid times.

I had an event last year that made me change some of my values and priorities. Take care of your self and keep your edges sharp.

sal
====================================================================================

"We are tiny drops of life stuck on the side of a round rock whirling through space".

[cabfrank]

A Lil Temp with 3.5 inch blade, or slightly longer would be grail-like. SE and VG-10 would be great, Salty maybe even better. I love the current one though, and will continue to.
A five inch blade twelve inch Police would be niche for sure. Some would love it, but it surely wouldn't sell enough to justify FRN molds.
These are just opinions, of course.

[vivi]

Maybe we should start a thread for the moderately sized temp?

that snippet caught my attention too.

I was a huge fan of the OG Lil Temp despite being much smaller than I prefer to carry. Tank of a knife for the size.

Been back and forth over ordering one of the Lil Temp 3 Lightweights while they're on sale for $100. I'd definitely enjoy experiencing the changes made to the design, but I'm afraid it may sit in my knife drawer after the newness wears off.

3.5" blade would make me much more inclined to reach for the knife over a Military or Police.

[TomH]

I hope the 5 inch Police gets produced....and that the steel is VG10.

[Wartstein]

Well, I received the first drawing for the Police with a 5.0" blade length. So I want to continue this conversation. I know drawings always look larger than a real model, but this thing is a sword. Overall length in almost 12". I guess I'm trying to decide; 1) if we want to make one, and 2) do we want to modify the design? It's currently a mid back-lock.
...

If that means you´re thinking about another locktype for a larger Police: I personally would really wish that it keeps the backlock! (Probably also the best option if the handle should still remain thin, something that is a goal with the Police as you say in another post...?)

[Bill1170]

I also like Nick’s “Chief of Police” name. Since a 5” blade would be great for food, stainless steel would be my preference. Keeping it slim, with skeletonized liners for stiffness and to anchor clip screws, makes sense. It seems that this model would be lower volume, so G-10 or carbon fiber are more likely than FRN due to the high cost of mold tooling.

I like a slim blade, not over 4mm, and less if possible. As for the lock, mid-back lock is logical, matches other Police models. CBBL would require too much height for the slim Police shape, wouldn’t it? Compression lock is another possibility. I like a swedge on the spine. As Sal mentioned, those reduce friction on through cuts. They also add comfort in pocket.

[Wartstein]

I like a slim blade, not over 4mm, and less if possible. As for the lock, mid-back lock is logical, matches other Police models. CBBL would require too much height for the slim Police shape, wouldn’t it? Compression lock is another possibility. I like a swedge on the spine. As Sal mentioned, those reduce friction on through cuts. They also add comfort in pocket.

Agreed on the slim blade.

Not on the comp.lock though...

- Imo a comp.lock designwise is great and clearly better than a backlock if one wants to implement a really tall blade into a comparably not-tall handle.
- When it comes to keep the handle thin though a backlock is the better choice just by design, ain´t it?

Also a the comp.lock cutout could mess with the great Seki FRN (G10) handle ergos and imo a backlock is better in operation with gloves or generally in harsher conditions.

[aicolainen]

We tried a lanyard hole years ago and placement was a nightmare and I didn't want to enlarge the handle to fit a lanyard hole.

I'd gladly sacrifice a lanyard hole on almost any knife for smaller handle, better clip placement and potentially allowing the tip to sit deeper into the handle when closed. And especially on a knife of this size.
My only use cases for lanyard holes are on very small knives like Man-/Ladybug, to fish them up from my watch pocket or on the (ever more) rare occasion that I need to perform work at height and securing all my tools with lanyards is required. I don't need all my knife to conform to work at height requirements and I already have enough knives with lanyard holes to last me several lifetimes of said work :)

I would probably prefer to use liners, skeletonized. This would keep the knife thinner which is one of the real features of the Police family. Easy to carry for a large folder.

Even as an avid proponent of linerless knives, I support this design choice. As with lanyard holes, not all knives have to tick every box, and I think this one might benefit more from a slim carry profile than being linerless.

[p_atrick]

There’s been some talk about what happens when you extend the handles (flex), but what about extending the blade? What are we laymen missing when a blade gets that long? Lock rock on mid back locks has been discussed several times. Would this be worse with such a long blade?