Spyderco liner locks

[cabfrank]

Totally agree. Those tests are more for talk than function.

[Coastal]

I'm comfortable manipulating any of the locks Spyderco offers, but liner locks and frame locks are my favorites. That doesn't mean all my favorite knives have those locks, just that those are my favorite to use because the movements are very natural to me. (Not to fidget with, but just to open and close the knife.)

It would never occur to me to choose one Spyderco knife over another because I was worried about lock strength. All of them are strong enough for my uses.

As several have said, the Military Model has an awesome liner lock, the best I've used. I just picked up my 6th Military Model in the seconds sale for $79, a crazy bargain. Spyderco budget models also have excellent liner locks. If you want to try a big, robust, inexpensive folder with a dynamite liner lock, the Resilience is the ticket!

[DSH007]

I understand the trepidation if your only experience with the liner locks is from "gas station knives".. some of those are downright sketchy. That said, any reputable knife company is going to be able to put out a perfectly safe, effective liner lock. Spyderco is a very reputable company. I have always been very confident in the reliability of Spyderco's liner (and frame) locks. I know in my head that I should prefer other lock-types for being "stronger," or "finger safe," but I'd be lying if I said some of my favorite knife models (Spyderco & other reputable brands) weren't liner locks..

[grasshopper]

FWIW—I’ve been using Spyderco frame lock for over 20 years with
No failures. Medium usage,no abuse.On My large Wegner the lock
Travels all the way over. It’s a bit concerning.

BTW- the 1st Gayle Bradley has a liner lock on steroids.It’s a lot
Thicker than any other liner lock I’ve seen

[Ferruginous]

I trust my Spyderco Military more than 99% of the titanium frame locks out there. The Ti framelock is only as strong as its thinnest section - most of them are extremely thin, and titanium is nowhere near as strong as steel given the same thickness.

I have 3 Military models now, but I've owned 20 or so over the years. Every one of them opened with a satisfying "thunk!".

I wouldn't want a liner lock on every knife design, but it works on the Military because of other design aspects like the choil (which allows you to disengage the lock and let it swing down onto your finger because it is the choil that lands on your index finger and not the edge) and the general shape of the handle. I like that I can hold the knife in a sabre grip (with my thumb up against the back of the blade before the Spyderhole) and push hard through a cut without disengaging the lock. I wouldn't try that with the Military 2, where my thumb would be on the edge of the compression lock, and any twisting could disengage it.

[Danke]

Rock Lobster, one of my favorites, and it's liner lock.

[Danke]

I trust my Spyderco Military more than 99% of the titanium frame locks out there. The Ti framelock is only as strong as its thinnest section - most of them are extremely thin, and titanium is nowhere near as strong as steel given the same thickness.

I have 3 Military models now, but I've owned 20 or so over the years. Every one of them opened with a satisfying "thunk!".

I wouldn't want a liner lock on every knife design, but it works on the Military because of other design aspects like the choil (which allows you to disengage the lock and let it swing down onto your finger because it is the choil that lands on your index finger and not the edge) and the general shape of the handle. I like that I can hold the knife in a sabre grip (with my thumb up against the back of the blade before the Spyderhole) and push hard through a cut without disengaging the lock. I wouldn't try that with the Military 2, where my thumb would be on the edge of the compression lock, and any twisting could disengage it.

You may be thinking of something else. Titanium has a higher strength per unit mass than steel.

Now if we're talking price, that's a real world area where steel beats Ti by a long way.

[Ferruginous]

I trust my Spyderco Military more than 99% of the titanium frame locks out there. The Ti framelock is only as strong as its thinnest section - most of them are extremely thin, and titanium is nowhere near as strong as steel given the same thickness.

I have 3 Military models now, but I've owned 20 or so over the years. Every one of them opened with a satisfying "thunk!".

I wouldn't want a liner lock on every knife design, but it works on the Military because of other design aspects like the choil (which allows you to disengage the lock and let it swing down onto your finger because it is the choil that lands on your index finger and not the edge) and the general shape of the handle. I like that I can hold the knife in a sabre grip (with my thumb up against the back of the blade before the Spyderhole) and push hard through a cut without disengaging the lock. I wouldn't try that with the Military 2, where my thumb would be on the edge of the compression lock, and any twisting could disengage it.

You may be thinking of something else. Titanium has a higher strength per unit mass than steel.

Now if we're talking price, that's a real world area where steel beats Ti by a long way.

1 lb of titanium is stronger than 1lb of steel, but that pound of titanium will be much larger than the pound of steel. Titanium has better strength-to-weight, but steel has higher yield strength.

A Ti framelock whose thinnest portion is the same thickness as a steel liner lock will have a much weaker lockbar than properly heat treated steel liner lock. I can easily "tune" (bend) Ti framelocks by overbending them in one direction or the other in my bare hands, I doubt I could do so, without a vise and channel-locks, to a properly made liner lock.

[BLUETYPEII]

I have a couple of Spyderco liner lock knives but I definitely don’t prefer that style of lock and I definitely don’t like frame locks. I do think Spyderco makes a good liner lock though. The two examples that I have from Spyderco are the Euro Edge and the Pattada. The Patata locks up very solid. The Euro Edge though… wow that thing locks up like a bank vault.

If you want to talk about the safety of Spyderco‘s liner locks… from what I’ve seen in testing from Blade HQ The blade and or the handle will break before the lock ever gives out enough for the blade to fall on your fingers. As is the case with about any other lock Spyderco makes as well. This is one of the reasons I like Spyderco. Quality.

Check out these Spyderco lock tests in action : https://youtu.be/4KmHfbG7z7g

https://youtu.be/ERxHUXAFVs4

Oh and if the first video is an indication of lock strength/ quality. Spyderco has this making knives thing dialed in.

[Sharp Guy]

....Check out these Spyderco lock tests in action : https://youtu.be/4KmHfbG7z7g

https://youtu.be/ERxHUXAFVs4

Oh and if the first video is an indication of lock strength/ quality. Spyderco has this making knives thing dialed in.

Just FYI, those were both posted on the first page of this thread. As I mentioned previously, I don't really understand the relevance of these tests since you're putting pressure on the blade in the opposite direction when cutting something. I guess it's relevant if you get the blade stuck in the object your cutting and you're trying to pull it out. That doesn't happen to me very often and when it does I use caution regardless

[zuludelta]

The liner lock & frame lock aren't my favourites (I prefer a Compression Lock, Mid-backlock, or CBBL), but lock-type is probably a lower priority consideration for me when deciding on whether or not to buy a Spyderco, compared to, say, overall design/ergonomics or materials. I currently own 3 Spyderco liner lock knives (Gayle Bradley 2, Tenacious, Persistence) & used to own another 4 (Polestar, Alcyone, Cat, Byrd Knives Crow) & I've never had any issues with the locks failing while using them at work (where I will regularly torque on my knife when working the blade under very tight pallet straps)

[JSumm]

I wonder if a lot of concern for liner locks and frame locks for that matter are based on some of the poor quality knives that have those locks that have been in the market for years. I have handled other people's knives with those locks, and I can see the reason not to like them. Spyderco's liner locks are fantastic. And frame locks from reputable makers can also be fantastic. Very easy closing method that as you get used to it leads to a natural closing motion as you are placing the knife back in your pocket.

[yablanowitz]

I freely admit I'm a geezer. I grew up using traditional non-locking folders. I firmly believe that locks on folding knives merely allow you to develop poor knife handling skills which will one day result in much worse injury when the lock finally fails to protect you from your own stupidity. If you NEED a lock, a FOLDING knife is the wrong tool for the job.

With that said, get out your loupe and take a good look at the lockface on the blade tang of a Spyderco liner lock. That is a very precise and somewhat tricky bit of machining.

Sal has said before that they can make any of their locks as strong as they want, it is just a matter of engineering. They break knives all the time in developement, they have a special machine to do so far more precisely and repeatably than any YouTuber. If they have released it, it is strong and reliable.

I've carried liner lock Militaries for many years and used them ungently. I've seen people cringe at some of the things I've done with them. The lock has never been an issue for me. I've never managed to cut myself closing one, either.

[Blaine in the Rock]

I freely admit I'm a geezer. I grew up using traditional non-locking folders. I firmly believe that locks on folding knives merely allow you to develop poor knife handling skills which will one day result in much worse injury when the lock finally fails to protect you from your own stupidity. If you NEED a lock, a FOLDING knife is the wrong tool for the job.

Sage advice. Never thought about it that way. Thank you

[aicolainen]

Some cheapo knives out there that have liner locks so bad I wouldnt trust them to lock open strong enough to whittle a match stick. Because of this I have developed a deep distrust for liner locks and by proxy frame locks. I have never handled a spyderco liner lock or even seen one, but I feel like my trust in spyderco could exceed my distrust of frame and liner locks. Can anyone substantiate that? How strong are spyderco liner locks?

And yes I know hard stabbing with a folder is a stupid idea with any folder but there are times when it must be done in an emergency as we all know

I think the issue here is cheapo knives and not the lock itself. It just doesn't make logical sense that serious companies like Spyderco and Benchmade would risk their reputation putting out folding knives with subpar locks. And the Military model would probably have been the pinnacle of risk in that regard. A high profile knife design intended for military use, and what Sal is said to trust his own son with specifically in that role. That's a lot at stake if he didn't ultimately have confidence in the liner lock.

Maybe it's just because folding knives doesn't have a strong cultural foothold here that such cheapo liner locks seems to be hard to come by, but I've never owned a liner lock that I didn't trust for typical folding knife tasks. And that's even though I've spent most of my life knowing nothing of folding knives, just buying whatever looked useful from my local sports-/outdoor-/hunting stores. To this day I've only seen such knives on youtube, as demosnstrated by nick shabazz.

One thing is for sure though, there are a lot of myths in the knife community, that are quite convincingly spread around as common knowledge and often accepted as fact by those less experienced. And so it goes.
I have nothing against liner locks, I've just come to prefer locks/knives with a self closing bias. Counting in Leathermans with liner lock blades, which I used faithfully for many many years before I got interested in dedicated folding knives, it probably still ranks as my all time most carried lock type - and I haven't had one bad incident.

I still own (or have until recently owned) liner locks from Spyderco, WE, Leatherman, Benchmade/HK and Giant Mouse, and they have all been dependable and confidence inspiring.

I recently flipped my first and only Military (SNK 4V) before I had a chance to use it, but at least I got to see it and hold it in person. It left enough of an impression to know I will get another version at some point. While my preference could change when/if I get first hand experience with the MM2, my preference still leans toward the OG as of now (despite, or maybe even somewhat because of the liner lock).

Edit to add: titanium frame locks seems to have a better reputation, probably because cost of the raw material keeps most of the less serious manufacturers from entering the game. Personally I trust them just as much as liner locks, but they generally don't appeal very much to me. With the market being saturated by overbuilt titanium frame lock flippers for a number of years, only to be replaced by the Chinese manufacturers flooding the market with new, uninspiring designs every week, the concept didn't age well with me. And as Tony Sculimbrene once wrote; titanium frame locks often feel like unfinished liner locks in actual use.

[Danke]

I trust my Spyderco Military more than 99% of the titanium frame locks out there. The Ti framelock is only as strong as its thinnest section - most of them are extremely thin, and titanium is nowhere near as strong as steel given the same thickness.

I have 3 Military models now, but I've owned 20 or so over the years. Every one of them opened with a satisfying "thunk!".

I wouldn't want a liner lock on every knife design, but it works on the Military because of other design aspects like the choil (which allows you to disengage the lock and let it swing down onto your finger because it is the choil that lands on your index finger and not the edge) and the general shape of the handle. I like that I can hold the knife in a sabre grip (with my thumb up against the back of the blade before the Spyderhole) and push hard through a cut without disengaging the lock. I wouldn't try that with the Military 2, where my thumb would be on the edge of the compression lock, and any twisting could disengage it.

You may be thinking of something else. Titanium has a higher strength per unit mass than steel.

Now if we're talking price, that's a real world area where steel beats Ti by a long way.

1 lb of titanium is stronger than 1lb of steel, but that pound of titanium will be much larger than the pound of steel. Titanium has better strength-to-weight, but steel has higher yield strength.

A Ti framelock whose thinnest portion is the same thickness as a steel liner lock will have a much weaker lockbar than properly heat treated steel liner lock. I can easily "tune" (bend) Ti framelocks by overbending them in one direction or the other in my bare hands, I doubt I could do so, without a vise and channel-locks, to a properly made liner lock.

Strength to weight is what matters in the real world. Ti has a greater strength to weight than steel.

Ti also has better fatigue resistance so a part you're bending or flexing repeatedly (like a liner/frame lock) will resist failure longer.

[aicolainen]

I freely admit I'm a geezer. I grew up using traditional non-locking folders. I firmly believe that locks on folding knives merely allow you to develop poor knife handling skills which will one day result in much worse injury when the lock finally fails to protect you from your own stupidity. If you NEED a lock, a FOLDING knife is the wrong tool for the job.

While there is certainly some truth to that, I don't share your belief/conclusion.
Whit any safety implementation you run the risk that some people rely on those measures and stop thinking for themselves. That's no reason to assume no one can make rational assessments and think for themselves, or that there isn't a net benefit to most safety implements that has stuck around.
A good lock, my liner locks included, quite handily extends the window of tasks I feel can be safely performed with a folding knife beyond what I'd deem safe to carry out with a slip joint/dual detent/friction folder, and before I need to move to a fixed blade.

[bgcameron]

Still, this test IS flawed indeed when it comes to the backlock:
The wire noose is actually blocking the lockbar from moving, so the lock could not open / fail, but the blade had to break. Not a real test for LOCK strength...

If you look carefully, the cable is placed just behind the lock pivot so it can't be holding down the lock bar. On the Delica, there is very little material between the blade's lock cutout and the pivot compared to the lock bar, so it would make sense that this area would fail first.

[dull&blunt]

Lock tests are important to a point. Check out the issues people have had with the Volsteed Racoon (button lock version). It literally couldn’t pass a light spin wack test. Or dare I mention the Mini Adamas on the Spyderco forums? Lol

Now attaching hundreds of pounds to a knife to test the lock? Maybe? That’s starting to get more extreme

As I recall, Andrew Demko did some interesting lock tests when he was at Cold Steel. They feature some Spyderco and are on YouTube.

[Wartstein]

Still, this test IS flawed indeed when it comes to the backlock:
The wire noose is actually blocking the lockbar from moving, so the lock could not open / fail, but the blade had to break. Not a real test for LOCK strength...

If you look carefully, the cable is placed just behind the lock pivot so it can't be holding down the lock bar. On the Delica, there is very little material between the blade's lock cutout and the pivot compared to the lock bar, so it would make sense that this area would fail first.

That´s a good observation and now I seem to recall that someone pointed this out to me already in an earlier discussion about that test.
I´ll have to rewatch the vid, but of course I trust you and am sure already that you are right!

/ Generally, and again, these lock strength tests do nothing for me when it comes to any lock on any Spyderco knife I´ve ever used.
All way strong enough.