Anyone know why the A.T.R. was discontinued?

[Laphroaig9]

Anyone know why the A.T.R. was discontinued?

Such a cool looking knife...and looks great for stabbing defense!

[Coastal]

I have one of the all-stainless ones. It has the sweetest action of any folder I've used, even after some pretty bad mistreatment. A really solid piece. It has the worst clip of any folder I've ever used as well. Any other clip would have been better.

I don't know why it was discontinued, but I figure most potential buyers were put off by its weird appearance, and thus it sold poorly.

[Evil D]

I'll guess and say too similar to a Para 2 but not built quite as good (Japan vs Golden). The blade shape is probably hit and miss as is the Cobra Hood, though I would love to see more models with the hood. Overall the handle fits me better than a Para 2 and I like the hood, if it were made in Golden and offered in as many steels as the Para 2 I'd likely buy it over the Para 2.

Ultimately the answer is more likely to be about cost and poor sales though, but then the ATR 2 did cost $60 more than a Para 2 which is basically the Spyderco flagship model so it was a hard sell.

[Cl1ff]

I’m not sure why it was discontinued, but I think I actually prefer the ATR design to the PM2, so I would be interested in any future versions.

One thing I was thinking is that the ATR has those holes in the handle to reduce weight, but I don’t think many people like what that does visually.

While I think the ATR is a more balanced design than the standard PM2, in profile, I’m also not really fond of its aesthetic. The only model I like with handle holes that I also like is the Watu.

A way to reduce the weight without the holes is by going the linerless route. For example, a construction like the BD1N/Aluminum PM2s or LW Para 3.

I think Aluminum would fit the ATR better, personally.

Anyway, it’s definitely a model I have thought a bit about and want to try. It’s looks like a really good Spyderco design.

[araneae]

Sales is usually the answer.

[Manixguy@1994]

I have the SS and the G10 , I like the lock better on the SS model but the clip was and still is a bit of a pain . You definitely won’t lose the SS once in pocket! G10 and SS open smooth as glass for me . About ounce difference between the two . Love the Cobra hood , nice wearing gloves .

[WRB]

Looks like another really good knife with a price that didn't quite line up. That doesn't usually go well for a production knife.

[sal]

We made a number of variations. The Titan integral Compression lock was the most expensive and the most popular. The scales were outsourced locally and the outsource went out of business due to a death in the family. We tried to make other variations, but they were not as much in demand.

sal

[clovisc]

The ATR 2 in G10 always feels fabulously grippy in the hand, even when indexing into an alternate grip.

[sal]

Talkin' Story;

Some history. When I first designed the original ATR, (At The Ready), which actually took quite a while to refine, my plan was to present it to Glock to be used as their official Glock knife.

Probably more "hope" than actual. I was really all about myself and thought it was a great design. I figured that Glock would jump on the opportunity. Reality put my ego back in line. Although I tried many ways to try to present the knife to Glock, every path was a dead end. Crushed, I decided to offer the knife as just another Spyderco model. I was complimented on the design from some of the custom makers for which I had much respect, which restored my ego somewhat. It was just about that time that Glock came out with their "official" Glock knife. It was a fixed blade that did nothing for me, but it is it what it is.

Funny thing about design; Something that probably most designers feel at one time or another. One works on a design, refining over and over, for sometimes years. When one feels the design is complete, they give themselves a rating on how well they like their piece and how well they think it will be received. Then reality rears it's ugly head and puts the designer in their place.

Some of my designs, like the Polestar and Alcyone, which I had great hopes for, actually never moved the needle. The ATR was one of those. One of my designs that Peter, Roque and I refined for years making many prototypes before completion, was the Native Shaman. We were very proud of our achievement.

We thought it was a heavy duty hard use model, like the ATR, that was ready for anything. But the design received very little attention. We entered the design in the Blade Magazine "Knife of the Year" contest and few noticed it. Even my own staff was lukewarm about it. The model was introduced in G-10 and S30V and again, not much.

Later, the Shaman was re-introduced in Micarta and Cruwear and rang the bell. Subsequent "Exclusives" had good response and the follow up models using the Shaman pattern have yet to hit the market. The lighter performance version ("Edgerati" (TM), the Choil-less version, and the FRN version are still in-the-works, but we really won't know how you (the market) will respond until they've been out for a while. "Persistence is King", and we will continue to try.

There have been many examples that fell into the above categories of hit and miss, which has taught me, as a designer, to be humble and patient. Something I would venture to say most designers have experienced.

sal

[R100]

Talkin' Story;

Some history. When I first designed the original ATR, (At The Ready), which actually took quite a while to refine, my plan was to present it to Glock to be used as their official Glock knife.

Probably more "hope" than actual. I was really all about myself and thought it was a great design. I figured that Glock would jump on the opportunity. Reality put my ego back in line. Although I tried many ways to try to present the knife to Glock, every path was a dead end. Crushed, I decided to offer the knife as just another Spyderco model. I was complimented on the design from some of the custom makers for which I had much respect, which restored my ego somewhat. It was just about that time that Glock came out with their "official" Glock knife. It was a fixed blade that did nothing for me, but it is it what it is.

Funny thing about design; Something that probably most designers feel at one time or another. One works on a design, refining over and over, for sometimes years. When one feels the design is complete, they give themselves a rating on how well they like their piece and how well they think it will be received. Then reality rears it's ugly head and puts the designer in their place.

Some of my designs, like the Polestar and Alcyone, which I had great hopes for, actually never moved the needle. The ATR was one of those. One of my designs that Peter, Roque and I refined for years making many prototypes before completion, was the Native Shaman. We were very proud of our achievement.

We thought it was a heavy duty hard use model, like the ATR, that was ready for anything. But the design received very little attention. We entered the design in the Blade Magazine "Knife of the Year" contest and few noticed it. Even my own staff was lukewarm about it. The model was introduced in G-10 and S30V and again, not much.

Later, the Shaman was re-introduced in Micarta and Cruwear and rang the bell. Subsequent "Exclusives" had good response and the follow up models using the Shaman pattern have yet to hit the market. The lighter performance version ("Edgerati" (TM), the Choil-less version, and the FRN version are still in-the-works, but we really won't know how you (the market) will respond until they've been out for a while. "Persistence is King", and we will continue to try.

There have been many examples that fell into the above categories of hit and miss, which has taught me, as a designer, to be humble and patient. Something I would venture to say most designers have experience.

sal

That's a fascinating insight into the knife design world. I have had similar experiences in my own very different field. I think a few good blows to the ego are probably a healthy thing though!

Another of your designs that you have spoken of putting years of refinement into without commensurate reward is the Lil' Temperance 3. I love my G10 version and have used it extensively in the bush. The ergonomics and robust build really work for me. I now have the latest frn version in SE and I am about to take it out into the field to try. It feels like a really evolved knife with the thick grippy handle able to put amazing power into the blade. I have reprofiled it on the 15° slots on the Sharpmaker and it is just an astounding "matter separator". I don't know if it is a comfort but your special designs do have a place in the hearts of knife afis even when they don't break through in the general market.

Dan

[Coastal]

...the follow up models using the Shaman pattern have yet to hit the market. The lighter performance version ("Edgerati" (TM), the Choil-less version, and the FRN version are still in-the-works, but we really won't know how you (the market) will respond until they've been out for a while.
sal

Well I can tell you how my portion of the market will respond: HOORAY! This is just what I'm waiting for! Edgerati... wow.

[Bemo]

I very much appreciate the story. There's a book out based on Stoic philosophy called The Ego is the Enemy. I also believe you need to create to just create and not be attached to the outcome. How many artists don't get their due until decades later. That being said, I would love to see a re-boot of this design and would commit to buying one.

[Cl1ff]

Thank you for the backstory!

I’ve ended up becoming interested enough in knife design that it’s lead to quite a number of sketches laying around.
It takes a lot of time to get a single sketched idea looking like a properly designed/planned knife. That’s just on paper too.

Knowing and somewhat understanding what goes into one design, as well as every other design, really makes a Spyderco catalogue look quite impressive.

[Traditional.Sharpening]

Looks like another really good knife with a price that didn't quite line up. That doesn't usually go well for a production knife.

Actually if I were to try and put my finger on why it may have missed I'd say it's more likely the giant holes in the handle. It reminds me of something I've seen in the past on very inexpensive folders and it just doesn't sit well with me. I can't help but wonder if the scales looked just like what everyone seems accustomed to from Spyderco if they would sell better.

Seems you have to follow the 'formula' of what your brand has become known for and if you deviate too far then it's not received well. Makes sense on the Shaman, not at all what Spyderco is known for building super hard use blades. The success of the Cruwear Shaman may have had more to do with the trending nature of 'Cruwear' more than anything else.

[Manixguy@1994]

Custom makers used the holes to lighten and for balance . Basically there was a trickle down effect to production knives . Buck even had a 110 model with that type of handle . ATR and the ATR2 may not be for everyone but I appreciate mine . Nice Sal explores different styles and designs . MG2

[JD Spydo]

I never could fully understand why the Titanium ATR didn't sell better than it did. Of all the great Spyderco knives I've traded very few of them do I miss as much as I do my pair of Ti ATR models ( PE & SE).

If I had to take a wide guess I would say that "Sales" usually dictate a Spyderco model's destiny more than anything else. And the Ti ATR was quite pricey in it's days. But it was a super awesome folder that I wish they would consider doing a Sprint Run at some point.

[sal]

Hi JD,

The Ti version sold well. It was the other versions that didn't.

sal

[JD Spydo]

Hi JD,

The Ti version sold well. It was the other versions that didn't.

sal

Well that's most interesting to know Mr. Glesser. I would have guessed the complete opposite. Also it took me about 6 months to locate my first PE Titanium version to buy when I got my first unit. Also finding the serrated Titanium version seemed to be more difficult to find than the plain edge did. .

I do also remember that at one time the materials were hard to get for the Titanium version and that supposedly hindered the manufacture from what I was told at the time? But it was most definitely one of the more intriguing models in the early 2000s era.