? CPM-SPY-27 ?

[gull wing]

Did not get around to getting a Para 3 LW in SPY-27, so can anyone tell me about yours.
Like, cutting cardboard, paper, wood/whittle. Nothing heavy duty, I don't do camping/hunting much anymore.

Thanks

[Deadboxhero]

I'm sure other folks will come in here and chime in, here's a thread you can read about it in the meantime.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=86859&hilit=Cpm+spy27

Did not get around to getting a Para 3 LW in SPY-27, so can anyone tell me about yours.
Like, cutting cardboard, paper, wood/whittle. Nothing heavy duty, I don't do camping/hunting much anymore.

Thanks

[elena86]

I own a Para3 and I am impressed with SPY27 to say at least. It gets a sticky sharp edge and likes the ceramic stones. Very balanced steel. Good wear resistence and more than decent toughness. Love it ! Cant't wait for a PM2 and a Millie in SPY27. Bring'em ....instant buy ! Sal did a great job in designing this steel !

[Mrj]

I use it for everything. Just a quick strop and it’s good to go

[gull wing]

Great, thanks.

[JSumm]

I am a big fan of it. Edge holds up well and sharpens nicely without a lot of fuss. Hoping to see it in more models.

[weeping minora]

Edge retention seems to be between VG-10 (of which SPY27 has been described a "Powdered" version of) and S30V. Edge aggression seems to increase as the edge wears into its "working edge", which I quite appreciate (meaning it keeps its "bite" after use). This means that the working edge feels "toothier" when compared to its cousin, VG-10; however, due to the small carbide size, SPY27 is less aggressive in cutting versus S30V. It can suffer from apex instability at lower edge angles (IME), however its toughness withstands any serious damage at such angles (no worries of chipping). The downside to this, is that the edge retention isn't within the "super steel" spectrum.

On the upside, the most mind-boggling attribute to SPY27 seems to be in regards to sharpening and edge maintenance. The sharpening response on nearly any medium is truly inspiring for those who are not experienced at sharpening, or do not care to own every abrasive available to sharpen their knives. The steel will touch up with a strop exceptionally well and will continually do so after repeated touch ups. In this regard, it is certainly a "super steel", however it does require more effort to make it so. All around, I'd classify SPY27 in the absolute "best" class of EDC pocket knife steel (if there is such).

[Urkilnmesmalls]

I second the apex instability at lower edge angles which I prefer. I don’t think it’s the steel for my uses as much as I hoped to like it. I have a para 3 lightweight in spy27 and I carry it often. I like the model enough that I use it a lot, but I think I prefer s30v for most of my uses. I actually think 14c28n is exactly what I hoped spy27 would be.

[Cl1ff]

What do you mean by “apex instability”.
Specifically interested in your individual experiences. Just out of curiosity.

[Doc Dan]

It would be interesting to find that out since there was mention of no chipping worries.

[weeping minora]

I think the devil is in the details when it comes to its sharpening responsiveness. The ability and longevity to strop the apex back to shape (I've had roughly 3 weeks of moderate use whilst maintaining the apex on a strop alone), tells the tale regarding edge instability; meaning SPY27 is very pliant at its apex. This goes for both formation and deformation.

While SPY27 seems to possess a great deal of toughness when compared to its cousin, VG-10, they both share rather low levels of yield strength (beginning points of deformation). SPY27 will flatten (not roll, literally flatten) in deformation, while VG-10 seems to (predominantly) chip. They share similar wear resistance, with both being rather low, as both will blunt rather quickly, in my use.

In thinking, SPY27 with the finer matrix structure and higher hardness should increase apex stability at low edge angles. Whilst I don't have an angle guide, I've certainly set my bevels below 15dps and have experienced the apex deform rather quickly at such angles, as I have had happen with VG-10 (albeit, again, flattening versus chipping). Bringing the angles back up to ~15dps allows the apex to withstand deformation a bit better. The overall edge longevity (and coincidentally, toughness) seems to increase when applying a more polished edge, meaning the overall amount of edge maintenance you can apply before needing a re-sharpening will increase; therefore the coarser I left my edges, the quicker I needed to actually re-sharpen. The working edge always had bite to it regardless of edge finish, even if that bite was initially polished out in sharpening, so I found low-grit finishes impeded the steel overall.

Like Urkilnmesmalls, I prefer a thinner edge geometry for my knives and SPY27 just doesn't seem to allow for that. The steel reminds me of what many folks report about LC200N, although I have no experience with LC200N to be conclusive. Undoubtedly, SPY27 is a great steel with excellent attributes that will certainly suit most knife users out there, albeit the price does feel a bit high for what you do get out of it (of course IMO/IME). It's just not the ideal steel for me and my uses.

[Urkilnmesmalls]

I think the devil is in the details when it comes to its sharpening responsiveness. The ability and longevity to strop the apex back to shape (I've had roughly 3 weeks of moderate use whilst maintaining the apex on a strop alone), tells the tale regarding edge instability; meaning SPY27 is very pliant at its apex. This goes for both formation and deformation.

While SPY27 seems to possess a great deal of toughness when compared to its cousin, VG-10, they both share rather low levels of yield strength (beginning points of deformation). SPY27 will flatten (not roll, literally flatten) in deformation, while VG-10 seems to (predominantly) chip. They share similar wear resistance, with both being rather low, as both will blunt rather quickly, in my use.

In thinking, SPY27 with the finer matrix structure and higher hardness should increase apex stability at low edge angles. Whilst I don't have an angle guide, I've certainly set my bevels below 15dps and have experienced the apex deform rather quickly at such angles, as I have had happen with VG-10 (albeit, again, flattening versus chipping). Bringing the angles back up to ~15dps allows the apex to withstand deformation a bit better. The overall edge longevity (and coincidentally, toughness) seems to increase when applying a more polished edge, meaning the overall amount of edge maintenance you can apply before needing a re-sharpening will increase; therefore the coarser I left my edges, the quicker I needed to actually re-sharpen. The working edge always had bite to it regardless of edge finish, even if that bite was initially polished out in sharpening, so I found low-grit finishes impeded the steel overall.

Like Urkilnmesmalls, I prefer a thinner edge geometry for my knives and SPY27 just doesn't seem to allow for that. The steel reminds me of what many folks report about LC200N, although I have no experience with LC200N to be conclusive. Undoubtedly, SPY27 is a great steel with excellent attributes that will certainly suit most knife users out there, albeit the price does feel a bit high for what you do get out of it (of course IMO/IME). It's just not the ideal steel for me and my uses.

I honestly couldn’t say it better than that. I’m going to put a 17 degree per side microbevel on mine today and see how it holds up doing some laminate flooring. I know by the end of the day it will be a butter knife most likely. Only ZDP-189 has survived a day of that type of work and not been flat spotted along the edge for me.

[Urkilnmesmalls]

17 degree per side mirror polished edge is set. I will report back when I’m done with the work I have planned today or tomorrow. It’s a very nice edge even though on mine the bevels are uneven. Whittles hair and shaves very smooth.

[Urkilnmesmalls]

Well I put in a good deal of work with the Para3 today. The 17dps edge actually held up very well. I cut quite a bit of the edges of some super tough waterproof laminate flooring off so it fit flush against the walls. The edge had a couple flat spots near the tip. The strop wouldn’t quite take them out but 12 passes per side on the 800 grit venev and a few swipes on the strop and it was like nothing happened. The same tasks at 15 degrees per side required a full sharpening and had several flat spots. I’m kinda blown away what a difference 2 degrees per side can make. Honestly I could have just stropped it and probably not noticed the little flat spots at the tip in actual use but I wanted to see what it took to get back to perfect. I kinda have to eat my words here. If you can live with a slightly thicker edge angle this Spy27 is good to go. It’s definitely going to get more carry now

[chronovore]

17 degree per side mirror polished edge is set. I will report back when I’m done with the work I have planned today or tomorrow. It’s a very nice edge even though on mine the bevels are uneven. Whittles hair and shaves very smooth.

Thanks for doing this. I still haven't tried either SPY-27 or S45VN so I'm a little behind the times. This is the kind of stuff I like to hear about when thinking about a new steel.

The comparisons here with VG-10 are interesting. I'll be keeping an eye on the thread.

[Bolster]

Well I put in a good deal of work with the Para3 today. The 17dps edge actually held up very well. I cut quite a bit of the edges of some super tough waterproof laminate flooring off so it fit flush against the walls. The edge had a couple flat spots near the tip. The strop wouldn’t quite take them out but 12 passes per side on the 800 grit venev and a few swipes on the strop and it was like nothing happened. The same tasks at 15 degrees per side required a full sharpening and had several flat spots. I’m kinda blown away what a difference 2 degrees per side can make. Honestly I could have just stropped it and probably not noticed the little flat spots at the tip in actual use but I wanted to see what it took to get back to perfect. I kinda have to eat my words here. If you can live with a slightly thicker edge angle this Spy27 is good to go. It’s definitely going to get more carry now

Very interesting, thanks for the report Urk.

[Cl1ff]

Always enjoy learning how others learn, so yeah, thanks for taking the time to share!

[Urkilnmesmalls]

I enjoy hearing accounts of actual use, I figured it was time to contribute a bit. It was a good excuse to break out a the para 3 which I really like. I haven’t been carrying it because I just wasn’t that impressed with the steel, so thanks for this thread.