Maxamet vs ZDP-189

[PeanutButterFan]

I am wondering how the two compare over all in performance. I know neither are very tough but have very high edge retention. With maxamet seemingly being above all other steals in edge retention, I am curious as to how zdp 189 stacks up against it. Again, not just in edge retention but the other aspects too (toughness, corrosion resistance, etc).

[Ramonade]

Good info to provide you objective comparison between both steels :

https://knifesteelnerds.com/2021/10/19/ ... esistance/

Here's some graphs that might interest you coming from that article Dr Larrin Thomas (knifesteelnerds) created :


High Alloy Tool Steel and High Speed Steel Ratings




Hope this helps. The article is really something ! Even with a limited knowledge about steel, it provides a incredible number of facts.
These numbers are something I find again in real world, even between different models (Endura 4 ZDP-189 vs Native 5 and Para 3 in Maxamet).

[PeanutButterFan]

That helps a lot, thank you!

[bearfacedkiller]

Toughness might be similar, zdp’s corrosion resistance is better and edge retention is a bit lower but still better than most steels. ZDP is a strange animal in terms of corrosion, it doesn’t readily patina but it can rust. In my experience it skips patina and goes straight to the brown stuff if deliberately neglected. Maxamet seems to patina easily. This all just my anecdotal experience. I haven’t had toughness issues with either but that is just me and how I use my knives.

The comparison that really stands out to me is zdp189 and k390. They have similar levels of edge retention but ZDP needs higher hardness (65 vs 63) to achieve this and thus lower toughness. There is also the difference between ZDP being mostly chromium carbides and K390 being heavy in vanadium. In the end K390 wins.

I still think ZDP is a super steel but it isn’t as popular as it once was. I hope it doesn’t go away but I think it will.

[Vaugith]

Only thing not mentioned so far I can add is hardness and sharpening difficulty. Spydercos zdp-189 usually clocks in at 63-65 HRC while their Maxamet is typically run at 66-68 HRC. Zdp having all chromium carbides will be more easily cut than maxamet with it's vanadium and tungsten.

[Gtscotty]

I think it would be interesting if Spyderco put more Z-Max out. It seems to offer a rather compelling balance of very nearly top end edge retention along with similar toughness to 20CV or 154CM. My Mule is not overly difficult to sharpen, and took a wicked edge.

[z1r]

I think BFK is right, that K390 will be replacing ZDP. My EDC Combo for the last year has been a ZDP DF2 and a K390 Endela. The ZDP has nary a blemish and the K390 a wee bit of patina. I have a K390 DF2, but just can't bring myself to replace the ZDP version.

The only Maxamet knife I have is Manix 2. Awesome knife, but just doesn't fill my EDC need like the Endela does. So I can't offer any useful feedback.

[JohnDoe99]

I am wondering how the two compare over all in performance. I know neither are very tough but have very high edge retention. With maxamet seemingly being above all other steals in edge retention, I am curious as to how zdp 189 stacks up against it. Again, not just in edge retention but the other aspects too (toughness, corrosion resistance, etc).

ZDP-189 will have far better corrosion resistance, it is essentially stainless, though barely. Besides that, ZDP-189 is hyper brittle, extremely hard, and takes a long time to sharpen. I'll never own a Maxamet blade but on paper it would seem to be at least as brittle as ZDP-189 and even more of a pain to sharpen. However in realistic pocket usage there is no way you will ever be able to tell the difference in "edge retention." You will never be able to carry one this week and another the next week in your pocket and be like, "yeah, the Maxamet has more edge retention." ZDP-189 is just too hard for that to happen; the margin of difference is too close. To that extent ZDP-189 is more useful because it can resist corrosion far better.

[Wartstein]

This is of course totally anecdotal and says nothing, but still "funny": Of the two pics of really broken in two Spyderco folder blades I have ever seen, one was in Maxamet (Manix), one in ZDP (I think Endura...)

[Ramonade]

I wrote a gigantic answer about my experience and all and closed the tab...

Deadboxhero/Big Brown Bear/Shawn's videos about Maxamet and ZDP-189 are really something to see if you are interested in these types of steel. https://www.youtube.com/user/shawnhouston/videos

I recommand "Maxamet is Da Bomb", "Is Maxamet too brittle?" and honestly everything ^^. On ZDP it's mostly sharpening and edge retention test but I'm sure deadboxhero will chime in if he sees this thread.

They are high hardness / high edge retention steels so of course they can be brittle, doesn't stop Maxamet from being a usable EDC steel. I found both really cool for an edge nerd like me. They behave differently. ZDP sharpens nicely (easier than S110V in my experience), deburring is a breeze.

[Wandering_About]

I haven't used any ZDP-189 knives for a while, but it was my first supersteel. Spent a good portion of last year carrying and using a Maxamet PM2. Both are quite interesting steels, and very nice if you understand a little bit about them. ZDP-189 is basically a monster made of chromium carbide. I have definitely rusted more than one ZDP-189 knife. Never tried thinning it back then, but edge performance was fine with factory edges, considering its high hardness. My first ZDP knife was a combo edge saber grind Endura that I really put through its paces, and it held up pretty well.

Maxamet has been surprisingly good to live with, considering its extreme nature. I have found it sharpens up pretty well, especially considering its crazy wear resistance. Deburring is a breeze. Holds an edge forever, which is kind of what it's supposed to do. On Larrin's charts it has considerably greater wear resistance than ZDP-189, and I can confirm that while I did dull ZDP, on Maxamet you kind of just sharpen when you feel like it instead of when you have to (unless you hit hard objects and damage the edge).

Have not broken blades in either steel, but on these high hardness, low toughness steels, I tend to be a bit more careful. Knives, for me, are cutting tools first so I maybe treat them a bit differently than others who are really beating on knives in various ways. I'd say if you're aware of the limitations of these steels, both are great steels to try.

After having played with both of them, for me, I would choose Maxamet over ZDP-189 at this point. Both are interesting steels in their own right but Maxamet has really left me impressed, more so than ZDP-189 has.

[Ramonade]

[...]
Maxamet has been surprisingly good to live with, considering its extreme nature. I have found it sharpens up pretty well, especially considering its crazy wear resistance. Deburring is a breeze. Holds an edge forever, which is kind of what it's supposed to do. On Larrin's charts it has considerably greater wear resistance than ZDP-189, and I can confirm that while I did dull ZDP, on Maxamet you kind of just sharpen when you feel like it instead of when you have to (unless you hit hard objects and damage the edge).

This ^.

After having played with both of them, for me, I would choose Maxamet over ZDP-189 at this point. Both are interesting steels in their own right but Maxamet has really left me impressed, more so than ZDP-189 has.

Totally with you on that one, I enjoy using, testing and tending to Maxamet more than ZDP-189.

ZDP-189 is a steel we can find at other places too though. I've seen some heat treat wonders around...

[dan31]

I was thinking working on my ZDP-189 Endura yesterday. A difference between the two is the option to use standard abrasives with ZDP-189. Both are high carbide content steels designed for high abrasive wear. Maxamet more of a tool steel. ZDP is really targeted to cutlery and food or softer media.