Lil Para

[bearfacedkiller]

When in Boston or Salem I carry whatever I want. Shaman today. I’m just a casual visitor who can just be discreet.

I did leave my ccw back in my home state which is in New England’s better half. Southern New England is a police state and they don’t play games.

We need to keep in mind that folks who work in Boston or Salem need a legal knife for work carry. For many being discreet may not be enough and might not be worth the risk.

[gull wing]

I like smaller knives, not on that platform.
Smaller knives, in my opinion, should be slim.

[Mushroom]

Fellow Bostonian saying yes, I’d be interested. The Lil’ Native scratches this itch pretty well for me, but I would put my money down to get that pointier blade shape in a 2.5” package.

Good to hear! Lil Native is one of my favorites too but I think a pointier option could be nice.

The only constant in the knife world is change. I would buy a Lil Para.

Very true!

I'd buy one. I'd hope it'd come in at 60mm to hit another place's limit I go to, but even at 2.5" I'd get one.

That might be smaller than I'd want to see but if that's what it took to make it happen, I'd support it.

I would not want anything smaller than the P3, but I suspect a sizable number of people would like a larger Military (The General?) than what’s available now.

Except for some exceptions, my signature sums up my response.

LOL I actually did think of that line in your sig while writing this post. It's all good though and to a certain extent I actually agree.

Mush, as a new zealot/er, convert into the Lil Native tribe myself, I think this is a novel idea. Though I would suggest following the back contour of the PM2 scale rather than the inward curving bottom/rear handle part of the Para3.

I can play around with different combinations but my Photoshop skills aren't quite what they used to be so this was primarily a concept to display the size in relation to the others models. I would expect Spyderco to work their own magic on a genuine "Lil Para." IF it ever happened.

I'm a sucker for small-ish knives, so yes, I would buy one.

Same here! I love the sense novelty they have. Especially Spyderco's because they're the perfect combination of novelty and performance.

We need that. I would buy several.
Besides, it will give more options to those who live in areas with blade limits.

I agree!!

Have you tried the Comp Lock Lil Native?

It seems like it might fit your desire for a 2.5" comp lock, and the ergonomics are somewhat similar.

It's one of my favorites! I actually had some skepticism about the Lil Para because I thought it might be too much of a competitor to the Lil Native. Honestly, I would hate to see the Lil Native phased out in favor of a Lil Para.

The lil native is my lil para.
Hope the will bring a lightweight variant.

It's too much of a tank and the ergos are a bit off to me.

For small knives the Dragonfly is hard to beat.

Right now the Lil Native is my Lil Para as well. I was hoping the Native and Para series were different enough to justify having them both.

In my opinion the Para 3 is already to small for the typical "Para" features. They work for Millie and PM2, but less so for the Para 3. Especially the thick bladestock and the ergos. The "front and rear" guard that make the PM2 handle "hand hugging" for most hand sizes, restrict the grip area on the Para 3 too much, when not using the choil.

Now in a "Lil Para" this issue would probably occur even IF using the choil. The knife could not offer any good four finger grip.
If the handle was shaped like on the Sage or Chaparral though (make the downside of the handle the longest part, and not the upside, and make it flat at the downside, without that "hook" at the end): That could work fine! Just like it does on the Chap.

And: The thick stock would hinder slicing performance more than on the Para 3, cause on a Lil Para less tapering would be going on.

That being said: Cool mock up! A "Lil Para" would certainly LOOK cool and BE cool as a "Baby-baby-version" of the iconic PM2!

All good points Warststein. Whether or not it would support a four finger grip, I think Spyderco could make it very ergonomic for it's size. Also, cool factor is enough for me.

Meh, not a big fan of the Para3. Not sure I would like an even more scaled down version.

I’m in the Boston area this weekend visiting family on the north shore. Salem has a 2.5 inch limit too. Im taking my son in to the aquarium tomorrow.

I’m not here enough to buy a dedicated knife though. Stupid laws.

They're very stupid laws!

I feel like a hump that size on a handle that short would make it almost impossible to get a good grip on it…. So I can’t say I think this is a “good” idea. That said, “good” is subjective. If you’ve considered the ergos and you’re still confident this knife would make you happy, I hope you get it and it’s everything you’re dreaming of!

They offer other knives in this size range with humps, so I have faith that Spyderco could design a Lil Para to be an ergonomic knife. Though I do understand your point. I will admit that I did not consider the ergonomics of the concept I created, it was done more to show size.

Conveniently enough, the Lil Native is pretty much the knife of my dreams. I'm just too obsessed with Spyderco to stop there.

This is ridiculous. "Massa say we can't has no scary sharp things."...

Carry what you want, where you want. Don't bend the knee to these idiotic restrictions.

I agree, the laws are completely ridiculous. In college a roommate of mine had one of his knives confiscated one night while we were walking back to our apartment. He was never able to get it back.

Now, I work in Boston and regularly carry knives that exceed the 2.5" limit.

I love the Millie family, mostly for the straight spine strong and pointy blade and the unsurpassed action of the PM2 & Para 3. I understand the desire to have a legal version for your area. I don't know if a Lil Para would have the same magic, even if it'd work smoothly. There's a minimum size required, and from my point of view the Para 3 is serving this perfectly.

I carry Spydies that I'm not supposed to all the time. No thrill no fun.

All good, I'd love to see if Spyderco could work some magic and make it work.

I also carry whatever I want. Within reason of course and always out of sight.
A Lil Para is not for me mainly because I am happy with my small EDC knives (Chap, DF2) and because it would sport - I assume - a comp lock.
All I really want is a mid-sized Native.

I work in Boston and carry pretty much anything I'm in the mood for but I find that the 2.5" limit is often a good excuse for something new.

I’d be very interested if it had better edge length-to-handle ratio than the Lil’Native

I hadn't considered this and now wondering if it would. I'll try to measure them when I get a chance.

[Mushroom]

I think for the Para series the P3 is about as small as I'd like to go. If you shorten that tall blade any more it seems like it'll almost be as tall as it is long. As much as I like the Lil' Native I don't carry mine very much (although that could change). So I don't think I want another Lil'. I have no issue with others wanting a Lil Para though

That's fair and I understand your point. It does start to look a little ch... funny the shorter it gets.

When in Boston or Salem I carry whatever I want. Shaman today. I’m just a casual visitor who can just be discreet.

I did leave my ccw back in my home state which is in New England’s better half. Southern New England is a police state and they don’t play games.

We need to keep in mind that folks who work in Boston or Salem need a legal knife for work carry. For many being discreet may not be enough and might not be worth the risk.

I work in a contractors warehouse in Boston and I will often carry knives that exceed 2.5". I do it on the assumption that I could actually use my job as an excuse or "reason" for carrying a knife that size. I'm fortunate that I've never had to test that assumption. Though like you said, the police don't play games and I've seen them confiscate knives for exceeding 2.5".

I like smaller knives, not on that platform.
Smaller knives, in my opinion, should be slim.

That's a very fair point.

[FK]

No thanks, blade would be too thick for lock design.

Regards,
FK

[Buddafucco]

It seems to me like the PM2 and the Para3 are good sellers so a smaller Para4 would probably be taken into consideration if they haven't already. They could call it the Swat!
With all the spyder venom coursing through my veins, I don't think I'd be able to not buy one!

[Accutron]

I hate the idea, but it should be called the Para Legal.

[Hullk]

I hate the idea, but it should be called the Para Legal.

What about the Para Trooper?

[kennethsime]

I would probably buy one, but probably just one.

To make it more practical, I think Eric needs to take his cues from the Dragonfly or similar.

• It should be a Lightweight first, the weigh of the G-10 and liners is already kind of silly on the Para 3, it'd be even more so here.
• The pronounced hump and large 14mm round hole seem a bit ridiculous on a knife this short - the big thing you get from that is leverage when opening, and you need a lot less of that with a knife so short.
• The blade stock needs to be thinned to 3mm, or even 2.5mm.
• I'd like the handle to lose the pinky bump, to accomodate larger hands like mine.

[Airlsee]

I would probably buy one, but probably just one.

To make it more practical, I think Eric needs to take his cues from the Dragonfly or similar.

• It should be a Lightweight first, the weigh of the G-10 and liners is already kind of silly on the Para 3, it'd be even more so here.
• The pronounced hump and large 14mm round hole seem a bit ridiculous on a knife this short - the big thing you get from that is leverage when opening, and you need a lot less of that with a knife so short.
• The blade stock needs to be thinned to 3mm, or even 2.5mm.
• I'd like the handle to lose the pinky bump, to accomodate larger hands like mine.

I agree with most of this post and that's why I don't think the design is a good idea.

Unless you are going to give it a 2mm blade (doesn't fit the line) and in LW FRN, then the Lil' Native is the Lil' Para.

[Wartstein]

..

[Wartstein]

I agree with most of this post and that's why I don't think the design is a good idea.

Unless you are going to give it a 2mm blade (doesn't fit the line) and in LW FRN, then the Lil' Native is the Lil' Para.

This shows perfectly what I meant in my previous post:

The PM2 / Millie "front guard AND rear guard ("pinky bump" as kenneth called it)" is well suited for those two models.
"Brackets" the hand into place when not using the choil, and even on the PM2 still offers enough grip area for most hand sizes.

Already on the Para 3 though, as cool as it is in its way, this is actually a design that makes for not so good ergos (except one has really small hands or always uses the choil). The "front and rear" guard does NOT leave enough space behind the choil for a good four finger grip.
It might look cool to transfer this design feature from the PM2 to the Para 3, but as far as I see it Sal and Eric normally design SMALL-knife-handles like on the Lil Native in the pic above or on the Chap, the Native 5, the Sage... make the downside of the handle the longest part of it, and make it flat (no "rear guard") in order to make room for four fingers, which is a very sensible approach.
For me the Para 3 performancewise suffers from the PM2 features "handle style" and "thick blade stock".

Now on an even SMALLER version of the Para 3 this would not excactly get better...the overall handle length would be long enough for a four finger grip when one finger is in the choil (like on the Chap). But the DESIGN of that handle (shortened grip area) would kill this...

[Matus]

Here comes another smart-bottom which his idea ...

I think that a Petit Para could be a cute little knife, but it should, IMO, loose some of the design features of its larger siblings to make it more useable. First of all no 50/50 choil, but rather something like we see on a Kapara, so that the knife has still a usable edge length. Also the spydiehole would need to be considerably smaller than on the P3 as the blade would be too tall for the length and hard to make pointy (which I think it should be). The handle design would then only roughly follow the idea of PM2 (the handle needs to end similar to Urban or Chapparal) - and not scaled to absolute minimum as I think it should allow a full 4 finger grip. This means the knife would have probably a bit suboptimal handle/blade ratio, but on the other hand it would allow for a proper grip and doing some actual cutting, which would be one of my main goals if I was working on such a design (which clearly I will be not).

... the more I consider this, the more I am coming to a knife more similar to Petit Sage 5 rather than Petit Para, hmmm ...

Just my 2 cents ...

[kodai78]

Not interested. The mock up looks awkward to my eyes, and I don’t think a 3 fingered grip is so great. On really small knives a slip joint combined with a slim blade is adequate. Like the Honey bee. A Micro Para would have too thick a blade stock, assuming it was in line with other Para designs.

[Matus]

... am I the only one who can not see any mock up? There appears to be one 'broken image' in the first post ...

[Araignee]

To add to my previous post, another improvement that the Lil' Para should have is : a longer finger choil edge.

Compare the one on the Paramilitary 2 vs the one on the Para 3. The former is longer, which helps fit the finger better.

So basically the finger choil edge on the Lil' Para should be as long as the one on the Paramilitary 2.

[Paraguy]

meh... Id be cool but lil native.