Why are so many people concerned with perfect blade centering?

[Salty Dog]

A few reasons Steiny, a nicely centred blade shows good craftsmanship, QC and quality, and shows the company isn't happy sending out off centred blades to their paying customers, its basic respect for the customer, pride in a companies product imo.
A knifes a fairly simple thing, getting a entered blade shouldn't be a big issue, especially when we are paying hundreds for a knife.
I got a uncentered tenacious SE, I finally found out why after using a metal ruler on the blade, that it was at least 2mm-3mm off centre because it was bent to the left.
It annoyed me a bit and ive been trying to bend it back to no avail, maybe its bent back 1mm so its a bit better.
I realise its Chinese made though, so my expectations were a little lower.
No biggie.
The better a reputation a company has and the more they charge, I more I expect which is fair enough..
My expectations are much higher for Spyderco than they are for Gerber, for example.
Not bagging Gerber, I own two strong-arms, great knives but my expectations for their products are lower than they are for somebody like Spyderco or Benchmade.

Off centred blades just look bad, its annoying that a object of such beauty and symmetry can have an off centred blade, just gets on my OCD :)

[Evil D]

Has anyone here ever bought any production knife from any manufacturer that was 100% perfect? Or anything else for that matter, gun, boots, etc. etc. that was 100% perfect?

Close enough that I didn't notice, which for me may as well be 100%. Most of them are actually, and the ones I've had that were off center are usually adjustable if you know what you're doing. I've never returned a knife for this sort of issue, actually only ever sent one knife to Golden and it was a Stretch with severe up and down play and was deemed defective.

[TKCSA]

My brain says it matters not and that knives are tools, but my heart keeps shouting: "but you like precisely made things that fit together precisely".

[blues]

If I weren't interested in the precision of the build nor the aesthetics, I'd just use a box opener or a cheap production knife for most all of my tasks. They're easy to keep sharp and they're disposable.

A certain price point implies a certain level of quality in both the materials and the build. IMHO.

[JRinFL]

People want it because it is form of order in a chaotic world. I have stopped overthinking it as long as it is not egregious.

[Abyss_Fish]

Depends on the knife, If it's full flat ground in the way spydercos usually are or if the sabre grind ends before contact with the handle, then slight off center-itude is usually fine since there's very little chance of blade rubbing. But if the grind is close enough to the handle when closed it can be real trouble.

There's definitely some mild snobbery going around though. There's a time and place for beauty, I mean 90% of my knives are customized and I WAY love fancy shamcy kitchen knives, but I'm not gonna buy that 500 dollar kitchen knife unless it's >0.010 behind the edge, ya know? In the end knives are tools and form follows function, always.

You want MORE than 0.010” behind the edge? Or was that a typo?

Open side faces the larger number, that’s correct. Less than.

[James Y]

For the same reasons I ‘feel up’ bags of snack foods at the store, and pick one that seems ‘heavier’ or ‘fuller’ to me. Or check the ground turkey meat for the package that appears to have a bit more, at the best color. Or checking the surfaces of fruits for breaks or cuts. Or when I buy canned foods, I check the can for dents, or for dirt/dust on the lid. Etc., etc. Simply put, I want to have the best example of something I can get for the money, whether it’s nonsensical or there really is a difference. It has to do with my mild but very real OCD.

My first really expensive knife was a Benchmade AFCK back in 1998. The blade ended up being badly off-centered, and it couldn’t be adjusted out. It also looked to me like the blade was either warped, or had been ground that way. It rubbed the liner badly when opening. The blade was impossible to sharpen, and felt like trying to sharpen window glass. I finally contacted the company and sent it in. After my knife was sent, I called Benchmade’s warranty department, and the guy said that yes, the knife was really defective, and they sent me a brand new one that was fine, and which served me well.

When I was a kid back in the ‘70s, I owned some slipjoint pocketknives that had liner rub and lazy action (mushy ‘walk & talk’), and put up with it, though even then it bugged me. Nowadays, when I order a knife, I always do it over the phone, and have a short, pre-written list of things to check for. Blade centering is only one. Using this ordering method, I’ve never gotten a lemon so far.

Jim

[steelcity16]

I'm pretty OCD when it comes to design aspects on knives, but for some reason blade centering doesn't even enter my mind. I don't think I've ever really looked at the centering on my drawer full of users. If I noticed it was way off it would probably bother me, but I honestly don't even check when I get a new knife.

[TenGrainBread]

Those who have worked in manufacturing know that tolerances are applied to all dimensions on an engineering print. It's bad engineering to apply super precise tolerances to every dimension of every part. You are adding unnecessary cost, cycle time, and QC fallout by requiring super tight tolerances where it does not matter functionally. The best engineers have a good eye for what is a critical dimension and what is not. The critical dimensions get the tightest tolerances. Good engineering is providing the loosest tolerance as possible to non-critical dimensions to lower the manufacturing cost of the product. To me that's why a slightly off-center blade doesn't indicate a risk of lack of quality in other areas of the knife. And that's why you shouldn't assume it "got past QC". QC inspection is usually on a small sample of all the products, first of all, and second of all they probably are inspecting to a tolerance and not checking for perfect centering.

Now, it's perfectly reasonable for a dimension to be labeled critical because of aesthetics. If the business decides a certain feature is important to the end user aesthetically, they will work that into the product requirements so the designer knows to tighten the tolerance. This happens all the time. However, I don't think blade centering is one of those things with Spyderco. Maybe with a super expensive CNC small batch knife.

[PStone]

Serious question:
If the blade is off center when closed, wouldn’t that mean it is when open too? Just not as noticeable?

Also, I find that sometimes it’s the handle that’s warped a bit, or an uneven profile grind causing the blade to appear off center. I personally am not bothered by uncentered blades unless they rub.

[vivi]

I'm not thrilled if it's not centered, but as long as it's not rubbing on the liner/scale, I can live with it. I've been able to tinker with most to get them centered, but I have a few that are slightly off. No biggie in my book.

I am with you on this, not a huge deal as long as it’s not rubbing.

Yep. Comparing it to a terribly aligned steering wheel is blowing things out of proportion. One is unnoticeable in use, while the other makes a dramatic difference every single use. Apples to steaks, lol.

As long as it isn't rubbing the liner or causing other issues, I don't care if a blade is perfectly centered or off a bit. If its real bad I would send it back, but even among seconds I've yet to encounter one that bad.

I think a large part of it is the pocket jewerly crowd. Not all mind you. But the people more concerned with drop shut action, m a c h i n e d features, sleekness, bearings, flipper action, rarity, value of the materials, color coordinating after market hardware and clips, etc. are the people I see most bothered by this.

The people concerned with BTE thickness, overall geometry, carbides % and type, ergonomics in a variety of grips etc. seem less concerned.

Not saying either group is right or wrong or better or worse, this is simply what I've observed. Some people are more concerned with how their knives look, some are more concerned with how they function.

I notice more of the latter group here, which is why I'm active, vs more of the former on /r/knife_swap and /r/knifeclub, which is why I post maybe a handful of times a year. I obviously relate to one group much more.

[Explorador]

I got my first Spyderco only a few months ago and my second less than a week ago, so I can clearly recall those magical first moments and impressions with the knives.

As I was discovering the knife, most features triggered rational thoughts, like the length of the blade, the caracteristics of the particular steel, how grippy are the scales, how comfortable or not is feels in the pocket, the blade geometry and the weight of the folder, just as examples. But on both knives, when I noticed the perfect centering of the blade, I felt more a relief in my stomach and the only two words that came to my mind were : „Glück gehabt“, which is an expression that I don‘t really know to translate correctly, but I is a relief feeling, not a thought.

Maybe, down the road, after having received many more Spydies, like most of you here, the emotional energy will cool down and I see the knife more with my brain than with my heart, and will not feel this kind of inexplicable joy any more, just brain analysis.

But to be honest, I hope to never lose the capability of instant happiness about something or somebody in my life. Spontaneous joy beyond rational PLUS rational satisfaction with the product can potentiate each other.

At least that is my personal experience.

[kennethsime]

Frankly, I've never cared about blade centering, we're in agreement about that Warstein.

I understand if you're a collector, and you're going to keep them in the safe for 20+ years. I also understand if the knives are mostly jewelry, or if you're buying $400+ knives, even users. But at my price point (anything under $200 or so) I'm looking for a knife that looks good, feels good, and cuts good. I've never had a Spyderco with a blade so off-center that it affected the actions at all, though I think my first PM2 was consistently off a bit. I imagine if it bothers you enough, you could just swap it out with another example if your dealer is good.

Where does the concern come from? Like others have mentioned in the thread, I think a remarkable number of inexperienced knife users have started Youtube channels where they offer "First Impressions" videos of knives and other EDC gear. Sometimes they'll actually put the knife to work, other times they just give it a few over-exaggerated flicks while reading off a spec sheet. Since they don't have anything useful to talk about, and they need to add a couple of minutes for the ad revenue, they focus on minor details like "blade centering."

A lot of new knife buyers, unfortunately, look up to these guys on YouTube, and get most of their information from them. After all, if @overkilltacticalsurvivalist2372!# said it was "good to go," then it must be, right? Then I can feel validated in my pocket jewelry purchase, and can tell all my friends that I spent 3x the amount of money on my pocket knife than they did. Isn't that why we're all here? :rolleyes:

[DSH007]

I think that people on the internet are generally a little bit more neurotic about it than the average knife user.. I've seen people post "omg look how off-center my blade is" crying posts on the social media and the blade will be a literal hair's width closer to one scale than the other. I concede that centering should be generally good, but that level of nitpickery is bordering on mental illness haha. Personally, I like my knives as close to center as possible, but I don't consider centeredness to be nearly as important as a smooth action, solid lock-up, and lack of blade play. So long as those are good, I can live with "a hair off" center..

[Senfkarte]

I think it has become important for so many people, because you can very easily check if the blade is centered or not. Just look at the knife, and you actually see it with our own eyes. That's very handy if you make a video on YouTube. And to be honest a centered blade looks better than something of centered. So a centered blade feels more like high quality.

I personally don't look for a perfectly centered blade, just for a not completely of centered. That's mostly enough for me, especially on a user. I maybe have one or two safe queens where I really look for a centered blade but on most of my knives a blade somewhere in the middle is sufficient, nonetheless important.
A knife, even a folding knife, is not a mechanically complex tool. So above a certain price (around 50€) I expect a relatively centered blade. The higher the price the higher the expectations for sure. How can I trust the lock or the pivot if it's not even possible to get the blade centered?
Besides the grind on the blade, the fit and finish, the ergos, the (hopefully non-existent) lock play and the factory sharpness, the centering is a part of the first impression I make, when I handle a new knife for the first time. The first impression is somewhat important, so there is a lot to lose by not centering the blade (at least in some way) factory wise.

[Evil D]

You pay to have your kitchen floor tiled and this is what you get. It doesn't effect performance one bit and it's purely cosmetic. Are you ok with this or would you complain?

[vivi]

I'd laugh at the mis-aligned tile, it'd be a fun conversation piece. That cracked tile next to it, however....

[ChrisinHove]

Those who have worked in manufacturing know that tolerances are applied to all dimensions on an engineering print. It's bad engineering to apply super precise tolerances to every dimension of every part. You are adding unnecessary cost, cycle time, and QC fallout by requiring super tight tolerances where it does not matter functionally. The best engineers have a good eye for what is a critical dimension and what is not. The critical dimensions get the tightest tolerances. Good engineering is providing the loosest tolerance as possible to non-critical dimensions to lower the manufacturing cost of the product. To me that's why a slightly off-center blade doesn't indicate a risk of lack of quality in other areas of the knife. And that's why you shouldn't assume it "got past QC". QC inspection is usually on a small sample of all the products, first of all, and second of all they probably are inspecting to a tolerance and not checking for perfect centering.

Now, it's perfectly reasonable for a dimension to be labeled critical because of aesthetics. If the business decides a certain feature is important to the end user aesthetically, they will work that into the product requirements so the designer knows to tighten the tolerance. This happens all the time. However, I don't think blade centering is one of those things with Spyderco. Maybe with a super expensive CNC small batch knife.

That’s an interesting post, thank you. In my industry (construction) and experience, however, any poor workmanship you can see is usually just the thin end of the wedge. It also has to be said that “within manufacturers tolerances” seems to be a phrase more associated with batting away a warranty claim nowadays rather than an expression of extremely high workmanship or design.

That’s what I like about Spyderco knives; the precision with which many are made allows you to tinker and tune to a better action than out of the box, and without needing watchmaker skills.

I also think that most of us will have different expectations between Seki & Taichung, for example. I don’t think I have ever even looked at centering on my most used, UKPK, Maniago & Seki knives, nor have I ever tinkered with them.

[Holland]

You pay to have your kitchen floor tiled and this is what you get. It doesn't effect performance one bit and it's purely cosmetic. Are you ok with this or would you complain?

Blade entering doesn't concern me, unless the blade is touching a scale when closed.

The tile photo made me laugh more than I should have. I think I would probably leave it :D

[ChrisinHove]

I'd laugh at the mis-aligned tile, it'd be a fun conversation piece. That cracked tile next to it, however....

... whereas I would be curious about the pattern of the cracking across the tiling and the condition of the screed or slab beneath it!