Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

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JD Spydo
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Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby JD Spydo » Sun May 24, 2020 1:37 pm

OK I know this subject has come up a few times but the way the knife afi culture seems to be changing in the past two years I would like to chat about it more. It hasn't been all the long ago that our good Brother "EVIL D" came out with a challenge to only EDC a serrated/Spyderedged folder rather than a plain edged folder. Well needless to say I've been watching the action on that challenge closely for quite some time. It's been quite interesting to say the least.

For one thing that think that there are more knife users taking serrated blades more seriously than they did in the past. Because I can remember a time when I did a lot of trading over at Bladeforums and a couple of other venues I've traded at you couldn't hardly get anyone interested in serrated folders.

But that has changed somewhat and occasionally I run into people that only want a Spyderedged unit. A while back I've tried to trade one of my PE TASMAN models for a serrated TASMAN not long ago and I didn't even get one person even inquiring about it :confused: . I'm about to try it again to see what happens. Because that wouldn't have been the case 5 years ago I can assure you. Do you all think we might be seeing a shift in edge preference? If so why? I'm wondering if I'm the only one that has noticed this shift in edge preference.

BornIn1500
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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby BornIn1500 » Sun May 24, 2020 1:55 pm

why not both? :D
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VooDooChild
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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby VooDooChild » Sun May 24, 2020 1:58 pm

I think you mostly saw people not wanting a pe h1 hawkbill.
sal wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:14 pm
... "The edge is a ghost"...

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Wartstein
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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Wartstein » Sun May 24, 2020 2:05 pm

I am not sure if there is a general shift towards SE... I just have a feeling that most people who give spyderedges a fair try get to really like them and rid of prejudices. The latter being mainly: Not able to do a clean cut and a pain to sharpen. Both FAR from true, as more and more people seem to realize.

I myself gladly repeat once more that since I tried the Endela SE, I would want 80 to 90 % of my Spydies to be in SE..and ffg, but other than my CE Delica they all are ffg anyway, but mainly PE. Just because they don´t come in SE (despite knives like the Manix LW both in blade shape and the BD1N steel must work great with teeth...) or I did not know how superior SE is in my use at the time I bought them..

I don´t now a lot about Spydercos history, but I have a feeling that there is a more "modern" SE pattern (Endela, Delica and Endura wharnie...) that is rather shallow and less aggressive and works better in every day tasks than the "older" more aggressive and more likely to snag pattern - ?!? This modern pattern (for me more like a "better PE")n could be a reason that more and more people get convinced of SE?!

But then... I am just seeing a bit of the "bubble" of this forum... I have a feeling, that outside of this there are still a lot prejudices concerning SE...
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Evil D » Sun May 24, 2020 3:35 pm

I haven't carried a PE blade since 2017 except for my Cruwear Shaman a few times. That's coming from a guy who was 100% against serrations when I joined this forum. I stick with my opinion that (like that older version of myself) much of the trash talkers and people who dislike them 1) don't know how to sharpen them, 2) have never used a truly sharp SE knife, and 3) have never given them a fair chance to begin with. I'm sure there are exceptions to that where people have done those things and still don't like them, but I think those people are few and the "ignorant" are many.

I've done quite a bit of preaching about the subject in the last few years, I definitely wouldn't bother if I didn't see a real world advantage. I have sprints collecting dust because I have little interest in using PE anymore...that's saying something.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby JuPaul » Sun May 24, 2020 4:08 pm

I don't know about the knife world at large, but I'm definitely more open to SE knives since joining this forum. I'm pretty sure every folding knife I owned from my late teens to my early 30s (aside from SAKs) was combo edge, though. Then the anti-CE movement got hold of me for a few years. Then it was this forum that really introduced me to the benefits of a fully serrated edge. I'm still not sure I'd want to carry one exclusively every day, but I'm totally in love with my SE pac salt, and I definitely like to have one of my SE hawkills with me in addition to a PE knife. Also I really appreciate having CE knives again (the 52100 pm2 and an s30v manix). I wish there were more exclusives and sprints in CE or SE.
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Wartstein
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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Wartstein » Sun May 24, 2020 4:28 pm

The takeaway of this thread for me so far is: Who hasn´t yet, just give SE a try and see for yourself! :)

I am almost certain: Even if one will not get convinced that in knives like the Endela SE is the definitely better choice, I hardly can imagine that one will regret having a spyderedged tool in the arsenal!

Really, I did not expect at all to like SE when I got my Endela. It was more like: "Well, give it a try and then sell it again". But then I was just blown away in actual use, totally unexpected...
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby ladybug93 » Sun May 24, 2020 5:08 pm

each has its place. i think se gets a bad rep for the reasons david mentioned above, because of some popular tabletop reviewers, and because they want pristine cuts to show off how sharp their blades are instead of just cutting what needs cut. there isn’t much i need to use a pocketknife for that has to be cut cleanly. on the contrary, if i need a to use a pocketknife, it probably doesn’t need to be a clean cut and likely needs to be cut in a hurry. se make more sense if you really think about it and give it a shot. same for tactical fixed blades. give me pe for a fixed blade woods knife all day, but everything else is more efficient in se, specifically spyderedge.
personally, i prefer the look of pe and i don’t really like the chisel grind. however, most of our knives aren’t meant to just sit and be pretty. they are tools. se makes a knife feel more like a tool. and, if you learn how to sharpen serrations, they are much more effective than internet haters that have turned the community against them think they are.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby JD Spydo » Sun May 24, 2020 7:30 pm

VooDooChild wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 1:58 pm
I think you mostly saw people not wanting a pe h1 hawkbill.
And that very well could be true and I've thought about that. However there was a time especially in 2005 to 2010 range it seemed like everyone wanted plain edged Spyders period. But in the past 2 to 3 years I've noticed that far more users are inclined to use Spyderedged units. More so than I've seen in the past.

I also think that the Salt Series might have played a role in the shift of edge preferences.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby ladybug93 » Sun May 24, 2020 7:34 pm

JD Spydo wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 7:30 pm
VooDooChild wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 1:58 pm
I think you mostly saw people not wanting a pe h1 hawkbill.
And that very well could be true and I've thought about that. However there was a time especially in 2005 to 2010 range it seemed like everyone wanted plain edged Spyders period. But in the past 2 to 3 years I've noticed that far more users are inclined to use Spyderedged units. More so than I've seen in the past.

I also think that the Salt Series might have played a role in the shift of edge preferences.
it did for me. i was firmly in the serrations are dumb camp for years. i came back to spyderco for the pacific salt and chose se because i was buying the knife to carry in the ocean in case of emergencies. se really made sense to me for water use. since getting it and using it, i’m liking it more and more.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby JD Spydo » Sun May 24, 2020 7:34 pm

JuPaul wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 4:08 pm
I don't know about the knife world at large, but I'm definitely more open to SE knives since joining this forum. I'm pretty sure every folding knife I owned from my late teens to my early 30s (aside from SAKs) was combo edge, though. Then the anti-CE movement got hold of me for a few years. Then it was this forum that really introduced me to the benefits of a fully serrated edge. I'm still not sure I'd want to carry one exclusively every day, but I'm totally in love with my SE pac salt, and I definitely like to have one of my SE hawkills with me in addition to a PE knife. Also I really appreciate having CE knives again (the 52100 pm2 and an s30v manix). I wish there were more exclusives and sprints in CE or SE.
You bring up a good point Jupaul because I remember a time and it wasn't that long ago that combo edges were considered trash more or less. And a lot of hard core afis really looked down on them too. But even that has changed somewhat lately.
I think that David's challenge was timely and it at least got people here on the forum to re-thinking their selections of EDC folders. I'm now also seeing increased interest in serrated fixed blades as well. There was a time you couldn't get anyone interested in those. I got my two TEMPERANCE 1 SE models for a song back in 2005-06 time slot. I bet you couldn't touch a serrated TeMP 1 now for under $150 or so. That is if you could even find one.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby James Y » Sun May 24, 2020 8:14 pm

I haven’t had any hangups around serrated edges since 1998, when I got my first Endura, which happened to be CE. I even went through a period of years where the only Spyderco’s I carried were full SE (SS Police, Delica 4, Salts, etc.). Now it depends on what I feel like carrying on a given day. Or whatever I think I might need it for. So I don’t know which, PE or SE, is ideal, cause it depends.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Naperville » Sun May 24, 2020 8:48 pm

I like them both!

PE - Province in 4V

SE - Jumpmaster 2 in H1
Last edited by Naperville on Sun May 24, 2020 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Spyderco Collection: Military (S110V), Bob Lum Darn Dao(CPM-154), Yojimbo 2 (1 in S30V & 2 in 20CV), Sustain(20CV), Native 5(Maxamet), Jumpmaster 2(H1), Province(4V). SHORT LIST: CF Shaman(S90V), Native Chief, Street Bowie(4V at 60+ HRC), Nightstick, Yojumbo.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby dan31 » Sun May 24, 2020 9:23 pm

If you had to make one cut to save a life it would be SE 100%. This is a fun hobby and I think the whole sharpening scene and special stones/strops plays to the plain edge crowd. I carry a plain edge to just whittle wood while my son plays outside. When I head out I carry a SE Endela or SE lil native. I’m considering a Sae dragonfly salt?

When cutting gets serious it’s SE all the way from my experience in the service.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby PeaceInOurTime » Sun May 24, 2020 9:32 pm

It has been nearly six months since I started using only SE. Apart from whittling and woodcraft, SE is my new preference. After this year, I'm sure I'll be excited to use PE again just for variety, but SE has really shown to be a better performer in my usage. And someday I'll get around to making a cutting video of my wharncliffe Endura (for whoever enjoys my poorly made videos). :)
+ I'm currently participating in a serrated edge only challenge for 2020: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=85560
+ "Wouldn't it be tight if everyone was chill to each other?" -Gryzzl (Parks and Recreation)

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Waco » Sun May 24, 2020 9:40 pm

My multitool has a nice serrated blade in case I need to cut rope or some other fibrous material. I'd rather have a PE for my main knife. For a while, I carried a SE Ladybug in addition to a PE Endura, and never used it.

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Wartstein » Sun May 24, 2020 11:54 pm

Waco wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 9:40 pm
My multitool has a nice serrated blade in case I need to cut rope or some other fibrous material. I'd rather have a PE for my main knife. For a while, I carried a SE Ladybug in addition to a PE Endura, and never used it.

I noticed, that you got to know Spydercos SE on that ladybug, but generally and for all who might not have that experience:

There are very different forms and patterns of SE even within Spydcercos lineup, and in my experience SE blades on most multitools might work just fine, but can´t compare to a true "spyderedge" at all! The latter is a lot more refined and a lot more capable imho
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Wartstein
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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Wartstein » Mon May 25, 2020 12:00 am

PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 9:32 pm
It has been nearly six months since I started using only SE. Apart from whittling and woodcraft, SE is my new preference. After this year, I'm sure I'll be excited to use PE again just for variety, but SE has really shown to be a better performer in my usage. And someday I'll get around to making a cutting video of my wharncliffe Endura (for whoever enjoys my poorly made videos). :)

I am really not so sure about the "SE is not for whittling and woodcraft"-thing anymore, in fact I begin to prefer SE (SPYDERCOS SE!) in that type of tasks too...

Where a Spyderedge clearly does better a lot than a plain edge is making feathersticks: This gets mentioned very seldom, but in fact it is amazing how well this works!
Also when whittling wood, like making a pointy stick or a nodge SE works faster and better, as long as you don´t do TOO fine work (like carving a little figurine or something, here PE is better)

That might all be partly due to the chisel grind though and not necessarely only the serrartions themselves
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby Wartstein » Mon May 25, 2020 12:03 am

ladybug93 wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 5:08 pm
each has its place. i think se gets a bad rep for the reasons david mentioned above, because of some popular tabletop reviewers, and because they want pristine cuts to show off how sharp their blades are instead of just cutting what needs cut. there isn’t much i need to use a pocketknife for that has to be cut cleanly. on the contrary, if i need a to use a pocketknife, it probably doesn’t need to be a clean cut and likely needs to be cut in a hurry. se make more sense if you really think about it and give it a shot. same for tactical fixed blades. give me pe for a fixed blade woods knife all day, but everything else is more efficient in se, specifically spyderedge.
personally, i prefer the look of pe and i don’t really like the chisel grind. however, most of our knives aren’t meant to just sit and be pretty. they are tools. se makes a knife feel more like a tool. and, if you learn how to sharpen serrations, they are much more effective than internet haters that have turned the community against them think they are.
But Spydercos SE actually CAN do real "pristine cuts" (or maybe I don´t understand fully what is meant by "pristine" exactly), especially when it comes to slicing paper or cardboard (and that´s what "tabletop reviewers" do all the time, if they show knives in use at all... :rolleyes: )
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Most Ideal PE Or Spyderedge

Postby ladybug93 » Mon May 25, 2020 12:26 am

Wartstein wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 12:03 am
ladybug93 wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 5:08 pm
each has its place. i think se gets a bad rep for the reasons david mentioned above, because of some popular tabletop reviewers, and because they want pristine cuts to show off how sharp their blades are instead of just cutting what needs cut. there isn’t much i need to use a pocketknife for that has to be cut cleanly. on the contrary, if i need a to use a pocketknife, it probably doesn’t need to be a clean cut and likely needs to be cut in a hurry. se make more sense if you really think about it and give it a shot. same for tactical fixed blades. give me pe for a fixed blade woods knife all day, but everything else is more efficient in se, specifically spyderedge.
personally, i prefer the look of pe and i don’t really like the chisel grind. however, most of our knives aren’t meant to just sit and be pretty. they are tools. se makes a knife feel more like a tool. and, if you learn how to sharpen serrations, they are much more effective than internet haters that have turned the community against them think they are.
But Spydercos SE actually CAN do real "pristine cuts" (or maybe I don´t understand fully what is meant by "pristine" exactly), especially when it comes to slicing paper or cardboard (and that´s what "tabletop reviewers" do all the time, if they show knives in use at all... :rolleyes: )
i know they can, but if you don’t know what you’re doing, or the knife isn’t as sharp as it could be, you get a lot of snagging and that makes it hard to show off how sharp your knife is.


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