Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

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blues
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby blues » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:13 am

By the way, since the Shaman has already been produced with two of the steels tested in this video by Michael Christy, it might be useful and thought provoking to revisit his take on the differences in toughness observed in a short test conducted on blades with 4V, M4 and S90V:

https://youtu.be/GgDOgLjSfD8

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Cycletroll » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:29 am

sal wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:11 pm
Ever feel like you can't come out on top no matter what you do?

sal
Sal,
IMHO, you and Spyderco ARE on top! Great company, great people, great products!
Thank you!!!

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Fynnister » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:51 am

Evil D wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:23 am
This thread is getting dangerously close to forcing me to post pics of my cat and or dog. Don't tempt me.
Would honestly be refreshing at this point :D

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HammerHill
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby HammerHill » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:08 am

Another Micarta Shaman? What a gift!

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sal
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby sal » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:49 am

Hi 2bits,

Welcome to our forum.

sal

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Hank Scorpio
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Hank Scorpio » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:34 am

sal wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:11 pm
Ever feel like you can't come out on top no matter what you do?

sal
I dunno Sal, I think from a Utilitarianism point of view, you’ve come out way on top. John Stuart Mill would nod his head in approval. ;)
Currently enjoying the most pocket time:
:spyder: Caribbean SE Leaf, Crucarta Shaman, McBee :spyder:

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby ZrowsN1s » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:46 am

GiftedMisfit wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:38 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:04 am
sal wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:11 pm
Ever feel like you can't come out on top no matter what you do?

sal

Sal, just wanted to quickly state:
Though I personally most likely even won´t try and purchase one of the Micarta Shamans (but be happy when I finally get a "basic" G10/S30V one), what you and Spyderco do in planning to release this new Micarta-vesion really has increased my appreciation for Spyderco yet even more.

Look how many of my fellow forum-members are excited and glad! :)
Warstein I just wanted to say a couple things, first the g10/s30v one is pretty awesome, hope you can get one sometime. Reading alot of your posts, I think you would like and appreciate it. Second - you're a pretty constant reminder of the positivity that lives here on these forums.

Fresh air.

On topic. I'm happy with the blacked out Shaman I've had to purchase twice because of someone's sticky fingers
I have 4 Shamans now. Fancy Shamans, tough Shamans, amazing Shamans. I have Zero plans of getting rid of my base model S30V Black G-10 model. An absolute solid work knife.

I love exotic steels and chasing rarities, but anyone sleeping on the base model Shaman is really missing out.
Carrying 3 knives is perfectly normal :D
-Matt

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Hatchet 7419 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:09 pm

Just added a pops custom bronze deep carry clip and it looks great just have to figure out how to upload pictures .

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sal
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby sal » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:15 pm

Hi Blues,

Thanx for posting Michael Christy's video. Good stuff.

sal

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blues
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby blues » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:24 pm

sal wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:15 pm
Hi Blues,

Thanx for posting Michael Christy's video. Good stuff.

sal
You're welcome, Sal. Helps put things in perspective from an everyday usage perspective...and points out why one of your favorites, S90V, is no hothouse flower when it comes to performing under less than ideal circumstances.

(My very first custom knife, a Model 4 made for me by the late, great Kit Carson, was built with a CPM-420V (S90V) blade. And I carry a neck knife built and gifted to me by Darrel Ralph with S90V blade daily. The CF/Ti Military in S90V has been a frequent companion since picking one up last week.)

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby wrdwrght » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:44 pm

JuPaul wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:05 pm
Rutger wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 1:08 pm
Slash wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 12:43 pm
Joey wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 12:24 pm


I’m no expert, and haven’t looked much into this, but I’m pretty sure “Cruwear” and “CPM-Cruwear” are two different steels.
So, you think the spyderco used cruwear and not cpm cruwear for the mule?
yes, mule is not cpm.
As was explained to me: the mule was ingot Cruwear. CPM Cruwear is chemically the same steel, but goes through the cpm (crucible's particle metallurgy) process, which improves its performance significantly. PD1 goes through essentially the same process (Carpenter has a different name for it - micro melt??) so it has very similar performance to CPM Cruwear. So look at the PD1 mule to get an idea of performance for CPM Cruwear.
I’m actually excited at the prospect of a PD1 Shaman in an extra-large sprint.

Then—apart from me and everyone else getting one at MAP—Pete (of Cedric & Ada) can test the Cruwear and PD1 Shamans side by side.

Given similar chemistries, and assuming similar heat-treats, I’m betting their edge-retention will have about the same excellence, and that it will be more like the PD1 Mule than the poorer (re-heat-treated ingot) Cruwear Mule in Pete’s Mule test.

In other words, anyone missing out on the Cruwear Shaman should not expect they’re getting just table scraps if a CruPD1 Shaman materializes.
Marc <— a mere data-point

INBOUND: 83mm “Mini” Manix. ON RADAR: Maxamet PM2; Lil’ Native slipjoint; Siren. IN DREAMS: V4E Military2 stop-lock; 4V Native Chief; Slysz Swayback; C27 serrated Jess Horn; Vanax Massad Ayoob (SE) sprint; LC200N Breeden Captain (recurve SE) sprint.

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby JuPaul » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:53 pm

wrdwrght wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:44 pm
JuPaul wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:05 pm
Rutger wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 1:08 pm
Slash wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 12:43 pm


So, you think the spyderco used cruwear and not cpm cruwear for the mule?
yes, mule is not cpm.
As was explained to me: the mule was ingot Cruwear. CPM Cruwear is chemically the same steel, but goes through the cpm (crucible's particle metallurgy) process, which improves its performance significantly. PD1 goes through essentially the same process (Carpenter has a different name for it - micro melt??) so it has very similar performance to CPM Cruwear. So look at the PD1 mule to get an idea of performance for CPM Cruwear.
I’m actually excited at the prospect of a PD1 Shaman in an extra-large sprint.

Then—apart from me and everyone else getting one at MAP—Pete (of Cedric & Ada) can test the Cruwear and PD1 Shamans side by side.

Given similar chemistries, and assuming similar heat-treats, I’m betting their edge-retention will have about the same excellence, and that it will be more like the PD1 Mule than the poorer (re-heat-treated ingot) Cruwear Mule in Pete’s Mule test.

In other words, anyone missing out on the Cruwear Shaman should not expect they’re getting just table scraps if a CruPD1 Shaman materializes.
Absolutely. Based on what I've read here and other places, no one should be disappointed by a pd-1 shaman - for all intents and purposes, it'd be the same knife as the cruwear version. Different in name only, really. If I hadn't been lucky enough to grab one from this sprint, I'd be just as excited for a micarta pd-1 sprint.
Be excellent to each other. - Bill S. Preston, Esq.

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby steelcity16 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:10 pm

JuPaul wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:53 pm

Absolutely. Based on what I've read here and other places, no one should be disappointed by a pd-1 shaman - for all intents and purposes, it'd be the same knife as the cruwear version. Different in name only, really. If I hadn't been lucky enough to grab one from this sprint, I'd be just as excited for a micarta pd-1 sprint.

Yep, I would expect the performance to be imperceptible to someone just using their knives in normal day to day use. I'm sure some youtubers will run head to head tests and declare one superior over the other, but there are not enough data points and too many variables for take these tests with anything more than a grain of salt. I plan on buying a PD-1 though as a backup for my Cruwear version, and I don't expect to be able to tell the difference in use of one vs the other. I'll buy an OD Green Cruwear Shaman as well just to have. And a Denim Micarta 4V, and a Black or Burgundy Micarta with 3V. Keep em coming in these tough steels!
:spyder: CRU-CARTA THEM ALL! :spyder:

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Sharp Guy » Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:56 pm

Has it ever been confirmed that this one will actually use PD-1? I know Sal said that they would use a "complementary" steel but has he actually said it's PD-1? I guessed PD-1 early on but that was just a guess. Anything else is just speculating. Seems to be a lot of that going on.
Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most!

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Larry_Mott » Sun Nov 10, 2019 3:02 pm

This place is 'Chinese whispers' live :p
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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby wrdwrght » Sun Nov 10, 2019 3:30 pm

Sharp Guy wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:56 pm
Has it ever been confirmed that this one will actually use PD-1? I know Sal said that they would use a "complementary" steel but has he actually said it's PD-1? I guessed PD-1 early on but that was just a guess. Anything else is just speculating. Seems to be a lot of that going on.
Sal has said they have acquired no materials for this run. He can’t really promise what is coming until it’s in hand. So, yes, only speculation here.
Marc <— a mere data-point

INBOUND: 83mm “Mini” Manix. ON RADAR: Maxamet PM2; Lil’ Native slipjoint; Siren. IN DREAMS: V4E Military2 stop-lock; 4V Native Chief; Slysz Swayback; C27 serrated Jess Horn; Vanax Massad Ayoob (SE) sprint; LC200N Breeden Captain (recurve SE) sprint.

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby Tucson Tom » Sun Nov 10, 2019 4:14 pm

steelcity16 wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:10 pm
JuPaul wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:53 pm

Absolutely. Based on what I've read here and other places, no one should be disappointed by a pd-1 shaman - for all intents and purposes, it'd be the same knife as the cruwear version. Different in name only, really. If I hadn't been lucky enough to grab one from this sprint, I'd be just as excited for a micarta pd-1 sprint.

Yep, I would expect the performance to be imperceptible to someone just using their knives in normal day to day use.
It could even be better -- didn't the test numbers indicate as much in the video that was posted? Or maybe you can conclude there is that much variance in the test results. Or maybe it is all about the heat treat (maybe Carpenter has a different regime for PD1).. Who can say?

Whatever the case, unless you are just hung up on having it labelled "Cruwear" you shouldn't be disappointed. If I was offered the choice between Cruwear and PD1, I would pick PD1 -- just because it is more "exotic". But that is just me.

On the other hand we don't know for sure if PD1 is going to be the choice for the next run. It seems likely from what Sal said, but that was just a hint.

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby BLM » Sun Nov 10, 2019 4:42 pm

Whatever it comes out to be I will buy it and as far as that goes I will try and buy any variation that comes out it is my favorite Spyderco

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby GarageBoy » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:35 pm

In summary people don't want what they need, they want the object that reflects their perceived needs. People thought the base shaman was average (s30v is probably fine in most applications) - but the cru-carta is basically the Wrangler unlimited - people like the idea that their jeep has locking diffs and all the off roading goodies - the base model doesn't give Same with the Cru wear and micarta combo

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Re: Micarta Shaman 2nd Sprint Run

Postby blues » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:42 pm

^^^^^Give that man a cigar!


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