Mule Team 20 (CTS B70P), my first Mule

[jackknifeh]

Well dang. A bit of the wood chipped off the top/front of the handle at the thumb ramp. You can see it partially in the picture in the post above. Here are pics of how it is now. If I do flatten the ramp some this will make it easier though. I'll make the other side look like this side. Maybe I should not leave tiny areas of wood this thin in the future. Especially where I'll be applying a lot of force.

Here is the back side. See how sharp the wood point is at the top of the handle? The front side was just like this. See the change below. Not sure why this picture came out turned 90 degrees. :confused: I used my phone camera. :confused: :confused: :)


Here is what the front side looks like now.


The camera is very unforgiving. :) I see in the pics I need to clean up excess glue or polyurethane in front of the wood. You can see it on the knife but it's not nearly as noticable to my naked, blind eyes. :)

[Nate]

Thanks for sharing your perspective on sharpening. Holding a consistent angle is probably my biggest challenge aside from just being patient with the process in general. I'm pretty good now with apexing an existing bevel, but whenever I am doing heavier grinding or reprofiling I tend to get frustrated and just ramp up the speed and force. This is generally effective in terms of material removal and increased cutting ability, but the whole transition from the primary to the edge ends up heavily convexed/faceted. I don't mind this a bit on my beaters and heavy users, but I am hesitant to give this treatment to nicer sprints, etc... I know I will keep progressing with practice, but right now I probably only spend an hour or two a week on knife projects.

Sorry about the chip on your new scales. Looks like it won't be much of an issue though if you can just match the other side.

[jackknifeh]

The kydex sheath making stuff came in the mail yesterday. What I bought was:

1. Kydex sheath kit. It came with a sq. ft. of kydex, 10 rivets, one belt loop and a ball chain.
2. Foam. Bought one piece and cut it in half.
3. Rivet hand setter. Using this you set the rivets using a hammer by hand.

I watched a couple of videos then made my first sheath. In this picture I had heated and formed it twice. The first time the knife was not centered well between the rivets. Also, the knife wiggled a little when in the sheath. There was plenty of pressure to keep the knife in the sheath. I tried to shake it enough to make the knife fall out but it stayed in. It isn't finished yet as far as forming the edges or anything. Do that later. Here it is.



As usual though I got in a hurry and set myself back a couple of days. I'm using polyurethane to seal the handle and it takes that stuff a long time to dry completely. The directions say 24 hours but I think it's more like 48 or 72 for a full cure. I wasn't real happy with my first coats so I had sanded it and re-applied the polyurethane. Then I smashed the kydex around it before I let it dry completely. That ruined the poly. So, I sanded it again and now the first coat is drying for the second time. Tonight will be 24 hours so I'll sand it and apply a second coat. If I like that 24 hours later I'll wait 2 more days and probably form the kydex again. Also, I'm thinking I didn't heat the kydex quite enough. I used a toaster oven. I put the sheath in it and then turned it on. No pre-heating. I left it in there for 10 minutes. Next time I'll let it go 13-15 minites but I'll be watching it. I have a heat gun but I CAN'T FIND IT! :mad: Maybe the kydex wasn't soft enough to form a tighter fit. That may be why the knife wiggled inside the sheath.

I didn't expect this sheath to come out perfect being my first one. I'm planning on making another soon. I have enough kydex but I'll need more rivets. On this sheath I'll say the rivets look terrible but they work. I think you need practice using the hand rivet smashing tool. Smashing them evenly is the problem I had. A press would probably do a better job the first time but right now I'm not going to get one. On the next sheath I'll use the belt loop that came with the kit.

If there are any kydex guys out there I'd appreciate any advice you have. Thanks.


Jack

[jackknifeh]

Oops! I hit the quote button instead of the edit button when adding the "PS" at the bottom. That created two posts. Sorry.

The kydex sheath making stuff came in the mail yesterday. What I bought was:

1. Kydex sheath kit. It came with a sq. ft. of kydex, 10 rivets, one belt loop and a ball chain.
2. Foam. Bought one piece and cut it in half.
3. Rivet hand setter. Using this you set the rivets using a hammer by hand.

I watched a couple of videos then made my first sheath. In this picture I had heated and formed it twice. The first time the knife was not centered well between the rivets. Also, the knife wiggled a little when in the sheath. There was plenty of pressure to keep the knife in the sheath. I tried to shake it enough to make the knife fall out but it stayed in. It isn't finished yet as far as forming the edges or anything. Do that later. Here it is.



As usual though I got in a hurry and set myself back a couple of days. I'm using polyurethane to seal the handle and it takes that stuff a long time to dry completely. The directions say 24 hours but I think it's more like 48 or 72 for a full cure. I wasn't real happy with my first coats so I had sanded it and re-applied the polyurethane. Then I smashed the kydex around it before I let it dry completely. That ruined the poly. So, I sanded it again and now the first coat is drying for the second time. Tonight will be 24 hours so I'll sand it and apply a second coat. If I like that 24 hours later I'll wait 2 more days and probably form the kydex again. Also, I'm thinking I didn't heat the kydex quite enough. I used a toaster oven. I put the sheath in it and then turned it on. No pre-heating. I left it in there for 10 minutes. Next time I'll let it go 13-15 minites but I'll be watching it. I have a heat gun but I CAN'T FIND IT! :mad: Maybe the kydex wasn't soft enough to form a tighter fit. That may be why the knife wiggled inside the sheath.

I didn't expect this sheath to come out perfect being my first one. I'm planning on making another soon. I have enough kydex but I'll need more rivets. On this sheath I'll say the rivets look terrible but they work. I think you need practice using the hand rivet smashing tool. Smashing them evenly is the problem I had. A press would probably do a better job the first time but right now I'm not going to get one. On the next sheath I'll use the belt loop that came with the kit.

If there are any kydex guys out there I'd appreciate any advice you have. Thanks.


Jack

PS
For a press I used plywood only. I glued two pieces each of 1/2" plywood together for a top and bottom. Then I used 4 clamps to hold it all together. I'm going to make a nicer one pretty soon. It will have hinges like the real presses. I've seen a couple of home made ones on youtube. One thing I'm not sure about is how much distance does there need to be between the top and bottom (with foam) on the hinged side? Once the press is made I won't be able to change the pressure at the back of the press because that side will have the hinges. I guess I need to make it really tight when I cut the wood to create a thickness. Right now, just using a top and bottom that aren't attached I can smash it as much as I want all the way around. Maybe the knife wiggled because I didn't tighten the clamps enough??? :confused:

[jackknifeh]

Finally, here is the finished first sheath. It works perfectly. But, there are a couple of things I don't like and can do differently on the next one. I mean now that I'm an expert. :rolleyes:

The eyelets are way too far away from the edge of the knife so the sheath is wider than necessary.


Damage to the finish resulted because at first the sides of the kydex were together. You can see it on the lower part of the front of the handle. To fix this it will take about 3 days. I'll need to sand the handle smooth again and re-apply a couple of coats of polyurethane. The final coat will require 2 days to cure before I use the knife. So, I'm going to go ahead and use it.


At first I tried widening the opening with my Dremel. After this idea failed miserably I re-heated the kydex and put a small wooden wedge in the lower part of the opening to allow the front of the handle to go in without hitting the kydex.


After I got the eyelets in the kydex I re-heated the sheath 4 times to finally get it how it is now. I started with the no eyelets at the opening but to get a snug fit I ended up putting those two at the opening.

Now that I have a working sheath I can start carrying and using the Mule. Yea. :D

Jack

[jackknifeh]

At first I thought the thumb ramp was a little uncomfortable when putting the pad of my thumb on it. When I started using it I found out I did think it was a little to pointy.

Here is it originally. Some of my pictures from the phone camera get turned sideways by the time I get them in the forum. It happens on photobucket for some reason. So when looking at this picture everyone turn your monitor on it's side. :)


Using a Dremel I ground it down some. Still a nice usable thumb ramp but more comfortable when using more force when cutting. Sorry about the blurry picture. My camera must have the shakes. :rolleyes: :)




Before I did this the grip was very comfortable with the tip of my thumb right behind the ramp or with the pad of my thumb past the ramp on the flat part of the spine. But when the pad of my thumb was right where it curved it was uncomfortable when using a lot of pressure. It is much better now. I hesitate before making any change to a knife that is permanent. Making scales is one thing because I can always put the original one back if I want. You can't put the steel you grind away back. So, I'm glad I'm happy with this change.

Jack

[sbaker345]

The mules are meant to be ground on and beat up if you ask me

[jackknifeh]

The mules are meant to be ground on and beat up if you ask me

ABSOLUTELY! This knife just screams USE ME! ABUSE ME!!! :) It's a comfortable knife to hold. Just the right size IMO for a great work knife. I used polyurethane on the handle because I figured what is used on hard wood floors should be tough enough. Can't say I've really put this steel to the edge retenion test yet but from a little cutting of cardboard it kept the hair whittling edge very well. This knife won't be babied at all. Being (feeling :) ) 200 years old I don't really work hard anymore but I'm going to use this knife when I do.

One cool thing about the Mule's is every single one of them will be unique. By putting a different handle on them they will all have a little bit different grip and can look completely different. In addition to a unique handle I now have a sharpening notch and a less round thumb ramp. That only leaves one thing that proves unconditionally that this is my knife. That is it needs to bite me. Not to worry, already been there. :) Since I got this one I'm considering getting more. Even another of this blade steel would be nice after I get a better idea of how I like it. I already emailed Spyderco and they have plenty left right now. I've already been thinking of getting one and putting a handle on it for my son for Christmas. By then I will also have enough (hopefully) practice making kydex sheaths to make something a little unique. Kydex comes in lots of colors. I wonder if you can tool it? Maybe get some small letters in a hard material to use when forming the sheath to the knife. We'll see. For me this is one of those times I wish I had gotten one or more mules since I found out about Spyderco. I remember seeing a knife from time to time with the hole in the blade but never heard the word "Spyderco" until a few years ago. Been living under a rock I guess. :)

Jack

[jackknifeh]

Yesterday I built a small gate with a 2x4 frame. I wanted to remove half the thickness from the side of each board end so the thickness of the gate would be 1.5" even where the boards attach. I didn't want to use 45 degree cuts at the corners. To do this I use a circular saw and set the depth to .75" and make a cut 3.5" from each end. Then I make several more cuts between that cut and the end of the board. Then the pieces which are about 1/4" thick break off easily. This does leave lots of wood there that needs to be removed to provide a smooth surface. In the past I have always used a wood chisel to shave the excess wood off. This time I used the Mule instead. Actually, I started using a chisel and as always I wished I had a wider chisel. My widest one is 1" wide. Then I thought I'd try the mule since I had it on me. It started out very sharp. Easily slicing into the edge of phone book paper. It would easily shave arm hair in one pass. I didn't try it but I'm sure the edge would whittle hair. It's important I think to have an idea of how sharp it was to begin with to get an idea of the edge retention. The very sharp edges are more fragile than an edge that isn't as sharp. I think of it as a shaving edge compared to a good, sharp working edge. Anyway, I had made the cuts with a circular saw then cut the remaining wood off of 8 ends of the 2x4s. The first thing I liked was I could remove the excess wood much faster just because of the larger cutting edge of the knife compared to the 1” wide chisel. This easily sped the up the job of shaving the excess wood by 50% or so I think. The last board was as easy to work on with the Mule as the first. The knife was still cutting great. When I came in the house I sliced some phone book paper and found the edge had lost no sharpness that I could determine using the "slicing phone book paper" test. Testing sharpness loss this way is really only of use to the person doing the testing. I know how the cutting feels and I can't convey this "feeling" to anyone else. I don't have any means to test how much pressure is needed to make a cut nor how much of the edge was used during the cutting or anything like that. What I found was I'm extremely happy with the edge retention of the B70P. However, I have never done this type of job with any other knife or blade steel. This is the first time I've done it using anything other than a chisel. I also don't really know how hard pressure treated boards from Lowe's is on an edge. Wood, as a rule I don't think is extra hard on a knife edge. Not like cardboard or things that may have all sorts of materials in them. But I think I could have made several more gates without worrying about the mule loosing enough sharpness to make it difficult to cut with.

This was not a huge amount of cutting but it was enough to have dulled a lot of knives I've used in my life. I am still thinking about getting another one since there will only be this run of the mule's. Unless Spyderco uses it in a regular production model.

Compared to the factory edge I had lowered the edge angle a lot and used fine grit stones to finish sharpening the knife. I don't know which stone I used last on the knife but it was something like an 8k Shapton glass or the Spyderco UF. I mention this because even a knife with a super sharp edge apex would not be the best tool for the work I described if the edge angle was between 30 and 40 degrees inclusive. Also, a smooth edge (not toothy) would be better for shaving wood.

I am wondering how other knives or blade steels would do on the same type of work.

[jackknifeh]

I finally got a kydex sheath made that I'm about as happy with as I'll get anytime soon. Still some problems with my eyelet setting but other than that I like this neck sheath.





It goes in and out of the sheath at about the perfect amount of force required. One sheath I made was so hard to pull out it was horrible. You can heat it up again though and re-smash it. Anyway, this one works good and looks ok. Well, it looks ok until you turn it over.

I have two eyelet setters you use with a hammer. The smaller one is for 3/16" and the other is 1/4" diameter eyelets. You drill the appropriate size hole, insert the eyelet and I then rest it on the round die and using the long piece I tap the eyelets hoping to curl the bottom outward and up so it looks like the top side. Here are the tools.


As you can see I don't have this task mastered at all. They do hold very well but I'm missing something in the technique. Actually on my first order I ordered eyelets that were too long. This time I ordered the ones the correct length for two sheets of .060" thick kydex. So having the wrong size was my first problem. The last eyelet I hammered was done without any kydex. I just put it on the die and tapping lightly it seemed to curve the bottom more evenly. Maybe I've been hitting it too hard. I don't know. But I like the size and shape of this sheath and it holds the knife great.




This is a great knife and I'm loving using it. Before posting this I read a review by Kevin Estela that Kristi put up. He did a great job of testing (using) the knife for all sorts of tasks and did a great job of telling his results and opinions. I suggest you check it out if you are even considering this knife. His word is worth a lot more than mine because of his experience.

Jack
PS
Here is the link to Kristi's thread.
http://www.spyderco.com/forumII/viewtop ... =2&t=68547" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;