I'm Thinking Stretch in Super Blue - Good Choice??

[dubya3]

My NIB Super Blue Stretch arrived today, ordered it on Tuesday so I'm pretty happy with how fast it arrived but I think I may have gotten one of the not so good pieces from this run. The pivot came extremely tight but still has a little side to side play, it's so tight that I can't flick it open like all my other spydies including my Manbug. The centering is off a tad but that doesn't bother me much, what I dislike is the tang/pivot area of the blade rubs the scales on both sides of the blade so much that there are light marks there and it's a VERY gritty action. I think 100% of the problem is coming from the scales rubbing against the pivot area of the blade but neither my Manbug or Endura have that issue and they're FRN scales too. I loosened up the pivot to make the blade easier to flick open but then it has so much blade play I can't leave it like that. Is this fairly normal for this model or did I get a "monday knife"?

I'm curious but it's non of my business where you bought it. Sounds pretty bad but being brand new it may just be one of the worst ones and a good cleaning and a little break-in may take care of it. The rubbing of the scales sounds strange. Does the scale material extend beyond the inside of the liners? There should be a washer between the blade and each liner so that TINY gap should prevent the tang from touching the scales. It's possible someone forgot to put one or both washers in the knife at the factory.

Based on your description (and why I asked where you bought it) you may be able to just swap it out right away for another one. Most reliable re-sellers (cutlery shoppe for example) will swap them within 30 days as long as you haven't done anything to it. Don't sharpen it or anything. I'd get with the seller and see about your options. But, it's possible what seems like a big problem may be easily corrected. The thing is there may not be many of these SB stretch sprints left. Good luck.

Jack

Thanks Jack, it looks like the washers are intact but it's hard to tell without disassembly. The bedded liners and inside edge of the scales are not flush which looks normal but I'm not sure to be honest. At this point I think I'll call the place I bought it, soonerstate, tomorrow and see if they will exchange it but who knows how that'll go. I bought a CruWear Manix from them last week and it's 100% perfect in every way and better than expected so I was pretty disappointed to see the issues with the SB Stretch I received today. I'm far from an expert but it almost seems to need another (or A washer) on each side to gap the scales a teeny bit but that wouldn't fix the super tight pivot and blade play issue I don't think.


ETA: I played with it a bit and the washers are there and tweaking the screws tightness helps a bit so I'm going to play with it a bit and see if it loosens up on its own before calling the store.

[jackknifeh]

My NIB Super Blue Stretch arrived today, ordered it on Tuesday so I'm pretty happy with how fast it arrived but I think I may have gotten one of the not so good pieces from this run. The pivot came extremely tight but still has a little side to side play, it's so tight that I can't flick it open like all my other spydies including my Manbug. The centering is off a tad but that doesn't bother me much, what I dislike is the tang/pivot area of the blade rubs the scales on both sides of the blade so much that there are light marks there and it's a VERY gritty action. I think 100% of the problem is coming from the scales rubbing against the pivot area of the blade but neither my Manbug or Endura have that issue and they're FRN scales too. I loosened up the pivot to make the blade easier to flick open but then it has so much blade play I can't leave it like that. Is this fairly normal for this model or did I get a "monday knife"?

I'm curious but it's non of my business where you bought it. Sounds pretty bad but being brand new it may just be one of the worst ones and a good cleaning and a little break-in may take care of it. The rubbing of the scales sounds strange. Does the scale material extend beyond the inside of the liners? There should be a washer between the blade and each liner so that TINY gap should prevent the tang from touching the scales. It's possible someone forgot to put one or both washers in the knife at the factory.

Based on your description (and why I asked where you bought it) you may be able to just swap it out right away for another one. Most reliable re-sellers (cutlery shoppe for example) will swap them within 30 days as long as you haven't done anything to it. Don't sharpen it or anything. I'd get with the seller and see about your options. But, it's possible what seems like a big problem may be easily corrected. The thing is there may not be many of these SB stretch sprints left. Good luck.

Jack

Thanks Jack, it looks like the washers are intact but it's hard to tell without disassembly. The bedded liners and inside edge of the scales are not flush which looks normal but I'm not sure to be honest. At this point I think I'll call the place I bought it, soonerstate, tomorrow and see if they will exchange it but who knows how that'll go. I bought a CruWear Manix from them last week and it's 100% perfect in every way and better than expected so I was pretty disappointed to see the issues with the SB Stretch I received today. I'm far from an expert but it almost seems to need another (or A washer) on each side to gap the scales a teeny bit but that wouldn't fix the super tight pivot and blade play issue I don't think.


ETA: I played with it a bit and the washers are there and tweaking the screws tightness helps a bit so I'm going to play with it a bit and see if it loosens up on its own before calling the store.

Don't know if this is the best way but to thoroughly clean a folder without disassemble I usually loosen the pivot screw enough to allow water/soap to get between the tang/washers/liners. Then I dribble dish soap into the pivot and work the blade back and forth several times. Then I rinse thoroughly with warm water until I know all the soap is rinsed out. By then any dirt that would cause a gritty feeling or sound should be gone also. Then I dry it including using a hair dryer to get all the moisture out of the pivot and inside the knife handle. Blowing moisture out with air is great if you have canned air or an air compressor. I don't have either. Then I lube a little and work the blade back and forth. Then I tighten the pivot screw to my liking and work the blade some more. If that doesn't solve any dirt or gritty or scraping issue I'd at least consider returning it for a replacement. But, it could still work itself into an extremely smooth folder in a week or two. :confused: :)

I looked at mine and the inside or each liner and the inside of the FRN scales is even (to the naked eye). Of course my eyes are half blind. :) On the side of the tang where it says "Japan" I do see where it looks like the scale material rubs it. Not scratches. More like a very light rub from a softer material like FRN. So my scale on that side seems to touch the tang but there aren't any problems.


Jack

[The Deacon]

My NIB Super Blue Stretch arrived today, ordered it on Tuesday so I'm pretty happy with how fast it arrived but I think I may have gotten one of the not so good pieces from this run. The pivot came extremely tight but still has a little side to side play, it's so tight that I can't flick it open like all my other spydies including my Manbug. The centering is off a tad but that doesn't bother me much, what I dislike is the tang/pivot area of the blade rubs the scales on both sides of the blade so much that there are light marks there and it's a VERY gritty action. I think 100% of the problem is coming from the scales rubbing against the pivot area of the blade but neither my Manbug or Endura have that issue and they're FRN scales too. I loosened up the pivot to make the blade easier to flick open but then it has so much blade play I can't leave it like that. Is this fairly normal for this model or did I get a "monday knife"?

They may not all be like yours, but I just checked and while mine has no side to side play whatsoever, the scales do appear to rub against the blade. On my other 6 FRN Stretches there is a hair's breadth of daylight between the FRN scales and the blade on both sides ahead of the pivot when the knife is open and I can slide a piece of cash register tape into those gaps. On the SB on, I cannot see any daylight on either side when the knife is open. There do appear to be washers, since I can slide that same register paper between the blade tang and liners with the blade closed. I'm inclined to think the liners might be a bit thinner and thus not flush with the surface of the FRN.

[Knutty]

They always have side-to-side play, even a tiny amount, unless you tighten the pivot with a pneumatic lug wrench. Disengage the lock when checking.

Finally got around to stripping the paint off my clip. It looked terrible until I polished it with some 3000 grit, but now it looks great.

[jackknifeh]

They always have side-to-side play, even a tiny amount, unless you tighten the pivot with a pneumatic lug wrench. Disengage the lock when checking.

Finally got around to stripping the paint off my clip. It looked terrible until I polished it with some 3000 grit, but now it looks great.

My Stretch nor any other Spyderco I've had has had side to side blade play that couldn't be adjusted out. They can of course if you have it adjusted for a SUPER loose pivot. But, 99% of the time I have gotten mine to be without any blade play at all and still very easy to open or flick open. I have had a couple that to absolutely eliminate blade play AND for that knife to easily be flicked open I needed to use Nano-oil instead of Quick Release, 3 in one or any other lube. There are several others that are really great that I haven't tried and we've discussed them before. But, it seems that Nano-oil performs better with the pressure is greater. Therefore, when I had a knife I COULDN'T get the blade play out of without it being VERY tight I used Nano-oil and then the lubricant seemed effective enough so I could tighten the pivot enough to eliminate blade play and still be able to easily open and flick the blades open. But lubes are a different story. Everyone seems to have issues that bug them. Some HATE a blade that isn't centered when the knife is closed. For me, it's blade play. I can't say that every folder in the world won't develop blade play when used hard enough with enough side force. That's the nature of a pivot and the reason I stopped calling any folder a hard use knife. I say hard use folder when talking about a Manix2 or a Bradley Folder or Techno, etc. But, no folder is as "hard use" as a good quality fixed blade. I think that's obvious of course and also another subject.

What I consider blade play is when you push on the side of a blade there is a gap between the blade tang and washer or liner somewhere around the pivot pin. There is no blade play when you push on one side and there is constant contact between the tang and the entire washer. On a really loose pivot you can even hear the blade bouncing back and forth as you shake it. Some folders I've checked for blade play still seem to have a little "give" at the pivot that I don't consider blade play. Picture a ream of printer paper. Hold one end of the paper stack with a lot of pressure and bend the paper back and forth. The paper will slide against each other when you hold one end tight and the other end is flopping around but there still can be contact along the entire area of the paper. You are supposed to do this to paper before loading it in your printer to prevent the sheets from sticking together and being pulled into the printer two sheets (or more) at a time. Anyway, I hope that made sense.

But, IMO, if a SB Stretch or any other Spyderco can't be adjusted to eliminate all blade play (as I define it) there's something wrong with the knife. Not trying to be disagreeable. Whew, my hands are tired. I haven't been on the forum much lately and my rambling typing has been much less and my fingers are out of shape. :)

Jack

[Knutty]

What I consider blade play is when you push on the side of a blade there is a gap between the blade tang and washer or liner somewhere around the pivot pin.

That seems to be the whole thing. By "blade play", I'm speaking in terms only of feel. I open the blade fully, disengage the lock, grab the tip, and relatively forcefully move it side-to-side. If I detect any movement before a hard stop, that's blade play. I guess we all have our ways to determine whether things are "as they should be" before and after adjustments and/or purchases. :)

[Hopsbreath]

Had some issues with my SB Stretch when it was new too. Scales rubbed the tang, blade wasn't centered, and I could NOT sharpen it on a water stone to save my life! Finally took a good look at it one day and noticed the blade was slightly bent to the side where it was closest to the scale when closed. Very carefully, I bent it back toward the other way when open with my bare hands until the centering was better. I've since tried this with some VG10 folders and could not get them to budge so at least in my experience it seems that the clad knives are just that much softer. Anyway, the knife looked better and I could suddenly get it razor sharp on my stone! I don't use it "hard" after all that out of concern it'll bend the blade again, but as a dedicated slicer it's been killer. Scales still rub, but it's added a smooth look instead of just scratches after over a year of use. Also, the action loosened up with time and it's now my easiest knife to "flick". Give it a little time to grow on you, I almost sold mine initially but am really glad I kept it. Easily one of my three favorite spydies.

[dubya3]

First of all, thanks for the input from the last few posters. After thinking about it for awhile I decided it's "only" a $110 knife, took it apart and slowly and very carefully, filed the scales on the very front and front-bottom where they were rubbing the tang. I thought that was for sure the issue but it didn't seem to help at all. I'm not sure if the cladding plays a role in how tight the pivot has to be or if it's just the design of the knife but it seems like there is absolutely no sweet spot, at least not in my copy. I'll just keep playing with it and hope it loosens up!

[dubya3]

First of all, thanks for the input from the last few posters. After thinking about it for awhile I decided it's "only" a $110 knife, took it apart and slowly and very carefully, filed the scales on the very front and front-bottom where they were rubbing the tang. I thought that was for sure the issue but it didn't seem to help at all. I'm not sure if the cladding plays a role in how tight the pivot has to be or if it's just the design of the knife but it seems like there is absolutely no sweet spot, at least not in my copy. I'll just keep playing with it and hope it loosens up!

ETA: Well its going back to spyderco and I'll be dumping money into it..apparently I deformed the plastic stud that mates with the liner on the back spacer and it will not fit together correctly now. Should have returned it when I had the chance. Lesson learned.

[TheFactor]

Scored one today from my local knife shop and love it . Very surprised they were still around so guess I got lucky .

[TheFactor]

Also on a side note hope you get yours squared away . Mine seems pretty good out of the box as far as centering and lockup . It's a little tight but can open it with a little wrist flick . I never normally adjust mine if at all until after I break them in .

[dreadpirate]

This is all interesting; my SB Stretch was perfect right out of the box.

[dubya3]

Also on a side note hope you get yours squared away . Mine seems pretty good out of the box as far as centering and lockup . It's a little tight but can open it with a little wrist flick . I never normally adjust mine if at all until after I break them in .

Most of my knives are good to go out of the box as well but this one was very disappointing. I don't like the plastic stud on the back spacer so before I send it in I'm going to see if my buddy can make me a stainless backspacer obviously with a metal stud. I wonder how larger washers would act in my copy as well, maybe the size a Griptilian uses since they're a little thicker and larger in diameter it may be enough to aleivate the pivot tightness issues but I doubt it. All in all I was going to keep this one in nice condition but now I'll fix it and have a great user (I'll probably use it for opening up deer this fall and get a good patina on the blade!) or just sell the blade and take my loss, it might cost more to have Spyderco fix it then I want to spend on it.

[jackknifeh]

Also on a side note hope you get yours squared away . Mine seems pretty good out of the box as far as centering and lockup . It's a little tight but can open it with a little wrist flick . I never normally adjust mine if at all until after I break them in .

Most of my knives are good to go out of the box as well but this one was very disappointing. I don't like the plastic stud on the back spacer so before I send it in I'm going to see if my buddy can make me a stainless backspacer obviously with a metal stud. I wonder how larger washers would act in my copy as well, maybe the size a Griptilian uses since they're a little thicker and larger in diameter it may be enough to aleivate the pivot tightness issues but I doubt it. All in all I was going to keep this one in nice condition but now I'll fix it and have a great user (I'll probably use it for opening up deer this fall and get a good patina on the blade!) or just sell the blade and take my loss, it might cost more to have Spyderco fix it then I want to spend on it.

Please keep us posted on the outcome. I'm pretty sure Spyderco will make you happy. They usually do in my experience.

I don't like the plastic backspacer either. When the backspacers are steel you can reassemble the knife from the bench up. Meaning you can lay the liner in the scale, put the backspacer in place, add the lock spring, lockbar, pivot pin, pivot washer, blade (WITH THE LOCK IN PLACE AND WORKING), then add the other washer, liner and scale. This is the easiest way to reassemble a back lock knife I know of. BUT, with the plastic washer the force of the lock spring wants to move the backspacer and the plastic isn't strong enough. So, to reassemble mine I have to treat it like a solid handle knife like a FRN Dragonfly2. I reassemble everything leaving out the pivot pin, washers and blade. Then I PRESS THE LOCKBAR enough to insert the pin just enough to lay the first washer over it. Then I put the blade tang in there and push the pivot pin up enough to go just past the side of the tang. They I insert the second washer over the pin. Then you can push the pin all the way in and through the liner. All this inserting washers and blade tang inside the pivot end of a folder that is already assembled is a bit tedious. But, you can get pretty fast at it. Anyway, this is the only way I could see to save the backspacer when reassembling one of the SB Stretches. I would LOVE a metal one. If your buddy gets one made he may be able to sell a few to SB Stretch users. I wondered how to make a backspacer myself. I mean I have a Dremel. I should be able to make anything. :) I figured for the little thing on the plastic backspacer that fits inside a hole in the liners could be replaced with a small metal pin inserted through a hole in the metal back spacer. That should work. To make a backspacer with the little thing would be much harder I think and require more specialized tools. Maybe, I don't really know. I think I'm pictureing the problem you had correctly. Let me know if I'm wrong about that. Good luck.

Jack

[TheFactor]

Well after a few 100 times of my traditional day of watching some UFC and flicking open and closing my Stretch for some break in :)I decided to adjust the pivot . Added just a touch of loctite and adjusted the pivot so when releasing the lockbar the blade would fall with just a little flick . The knife feels even better now being very smooth and finger flicks much easier also . Very impressed with this Stretch .
I think you'll be very happy with yours once you get everything worked out .

[The Deacon]

I don't like the plastic stud on the back spacer so before I send it in I'm going to see if my buddy can make me a stainless backspacer obviously with a metal stud.

FWIW, the studs aren't really necessary with a steel backspacer. There aren't any on the Stretch versions (CF and GF) that have metal backspacers. The FRN backspacers on the FRN Stretch, Delica 4, and Endura 4 need the studs to keep the spring holder portion from flexing and not providing proper tension for the lock spring. The steel ones are rigid enough not to do that.

[dubya3]

JackKnifeH, that's exactly what I was trying to explain. That was the first backlock knife I've taken apart and the first FRN Spydie as well. It's 100% my fault for ruining the backspacer stud but I really think these would benefit greatly from a metal one in future models.

Deacon, that makes perfect sense about not needing the stud on a metal spacer since it doesn't flex like FRN does under the spring tension. My buddy has made a few random pieces of metal for me and works in his family owned machine shop so he might be able to make me a copy of the original out of stainless. Even if he could get the shape done I should be able to use my drill press, polishing wheels and Dremel to fit it to my knife properly. If he's not able to, I'll just send it to Spyderco, maybe they'll be able to adjust the blade play/pivot tightness a bit too then. I'll post an update when I figure out which route works out and possibly get a handful of the metal backspacers made.

Cory

[jackknifeh]

JackKnifeH, that's exactly what I was trying to explain. That was the first backlock knife I've taken apart and the first FRN Spydie as well. It's 100% my fault for ruining the backspacer stud but I really think these would benefit greatly from a metal one in future models.

Deacon, that makes perfect sense about not needing the stud on a metal spacer since it doesn't flex like FRN does under the spring tension. My buddy has made a few random pieces of metal for me and works in his family owned machine shop so he might be able to make me a copy of the original out of stainless. Even if he could get the shape done I should be able to use my drill press, polishing wheels and Dremel to fit it to my knife properly. If he's not able to, I'll just send it to Spyderco, maybe they'll be able to adjust the blade play/pivot tightness a bit too then. I'll post an update when I figure out which route works out and possibly get a handful of the metal backspacers made.

Cory

Deacon's right. I hadn't thought about that. I have also made handles for my FRN Dfly2's. I'm remembering now I have to epoxy the backspacer to one side scale first. Then the bottom of the backspacer will be strong enough to get the knife working without the other scale. There are no screws to hold the backspacer in place on FRN D'fly's. I had to do that to get the grove lined up right to apply the proper amount of pressure from the spring on the bottom of the lockbar. I screwed up several backspacers until I got it figured out how to do it. Anyway, I did have a thought about your FRN backspacer. Sand the little nipples down flat and drill a hole in it and try a small pin through the hole with it inside the holes in the liners the nipples go in. I don't know how big the holes are but maybe you could order some pin material straight razor makers use for the razors. It's pretty small in diameter. But, you've already ruined the warranty so maybe if the pin material is too thick you can drill the holes in the liners a tiny bit. But, (I'm typing what I'm thinking as I think it :) ) if the hole you drill in the backspacer is too big the material will probably break from the pressure of the lock spring. OR, maybe you can rig the pin material to support the spring. That's what you need. A metal stud to support the bottom of the lock spring instead of the bottom of the FRN backspacer. There would be no pressure at all on the back spacer bottom. Does that make sense? Do you think it would work? It seems like it might but I'm not going to take my Stretch apart to get a better look at it. Right now I'm going from memory and at my age that can be dangerous. :)

Jack

[jackknifeh]

Oops. I don't remember how to delete this post. I duplicated it or quoted myself or something.

JackKnifeH, that's exactly what I was trying to explain. That was the first backlock knife I've taken apart and the first FRN Spydie as well. It's 100% my fault for ruining the backspacer stud but I really think these would benefit greatly from a metal one in future models.

Deacon, that makes perfect sense about not needing the stud on a metal spacer since it doesn't flex like FRN does under the spring tension. My buddy has made a few random pieces of metal for me and works in his family owned machine shop so he might be able to make me a copy of the original out of stainless. Even if he could get the shape done I should be able to use my drill press, polishing wheels and Dremel to fit it to my knife properly. If he's not able to, I'll just send it to Spyderco, maybe they'll be able to adjust the blade play/pivot tightness a bit too then. I'll post an update when I figure out which route works out and possibly get a handful of the metal backspacers made.

Cory

Deacon's right. I hadn't thought about that. I have also made handles for my FRN Dfly2's. I'm remembering now I have to epoxy the backspacer to one side scale first. Then the bottom of the backspacer will be strong enough to get the knife working without the other scale. There are no screws to hold the backspacer in place on FRN D'fly's. I had to do that to get the grove lined up right to apply the proper amount of pressure from the spring on the bottom of the lockbar. I screwed up several backspacers until I got it figured out how to do it. Anyway, I did have a thought about your FRN backspacer. Sand the little nipples down flat and drill a hole in it and try a small pin through the hole with it inside the holes in the liners the nipples go in. I don't know how big the holes are but maybe you could order some pin material straight razor makers use for the razors. It's pretty small in diameter. But, you've already ruined the warranty so maybe if the pin material is too thick you can drill the holes in the liners a tiny bit. But, (I'm typing what I'm thinking as I think it :) ) if the hole you drill in the backspacer is too big the material will probably break from the pressure of the lock spring. OR, maybe you can rig the pin material to support the spring. That's what you need. A metal stud to support the bottom of the lock spring instead of the bottom of the FRN backspacer. There would be no pressure at all on the back spacer bottom. Does that make sense? Do you think it would work? It seems like it might but I'm not going to take my Stretch apart to get a better look at it. Right now I'm going from memory and at my age that can be dangerous. :)

Jack

[dubya3]

JackKnifeH, that's exactly what I was trying to explain. That was the first backlock knife I've taken apart and the first FRN Spydie as well. It's 100% my fault for ruining the backspacer stud but I really think these would benefit greatly from a metal one in future models.

Deacon, that makes perfect sense about not needing the stud on a metal spacer since it doesn't flex like FRN does under the spring tension. My buddy has made a few random pieces of metal for me and works in his family owned machine shop so he might be able to make me a copy of the original out of stainless. Even if he could get the shape done I should be able to use my drill press, polishing wheels and Dremel to fit it to my knife properly. If he's not able to, I'll just send it to Spyderco, maybe they'll be able to adjust the blade play/pivot tightness a bit too then. I'll post an update when I figure out which route works out and possibly get a handful of the metal backspacers made.

Cory

Deacon's right. I hadn't thought about that. I have also made handles for my FRN Dfly2's. I'm remembering now I have to epoxy the backspacer to one side scale first. Then the bottom of the backspacer will be strong enough to get the knife working without the other scale. There are no screws to hold the backspacer in place on FRN D'fly's. I had to do that to get the grove lined up right to apply the proper amount of pressure from the spring on the bottom of the lockbar. I screwed up several backspacers until I got it figured out how to do it. Anyway, I did have a thought about your FRN backspacer. Sand the little nipples down flat and drill a hole in it and try a small pin through the hole with it inside the holes in the liners the nipples go in. I don't know how big the holes are but maybe you could order some pin material straight razor makers use for the razors. It's pretty small in diameter. But, you've already ruined the warranty so maybe if the pin material is too thick you can drill the holes in the liners a tiny bit. But, (I'm typing what I'm thinking as I think it :) ) if the hole you drill in the backspacer is too big the material will probably break from the pressure of the lock spring. OR, maybe you can rig the pin material to support the spring. That's what you need. A metal stud to support the bottom of the lock spring instead of the bottom of the FRN backspacer. There would be no pressure at all on the back spacer bottom. Does that make sense? Do you think it would work? It seems like it might but I'm not going to take my Stretch apart to get a better look at it. Right now I'm going from memory and at my age that can be dangerous. :)

Jack

Thanks Jack. Since I already ruined the stud I filed it down smooth and had the same thought race through my head, drill a hole and make a pin. I was thinking of using a portion of one of my taps since I have quite a few in similar sizes to what I need. Good news is I talked to my buddy and either this coming or following weekend he said we can go to the shop and see what we can whip up so I'm pretty excited about that. If all goes well I think the stainless backspacer we'll attempt to make will look much better assuming I can match the polish of the lockbar and theoretically I think it should be a stronger lock with more longetivety (or would it make the lock too stiff?).
I'm following your ideas but I'm not sure I'd want to drill the liners, that seems to be asking for more trouble! The best scenario would be to make a stainless spacer. Then, drill a hole in the frn spacer and use a makeshift pin and my last option would be to simply send it in to Spyderco. I'm sure I'm not the first that will attempt a stainless spacer replacement in a FRN Spydie so maybe I'll get lucky and that someone will stumble upon this thread :)

Thanks for the help and input guys

Cory