Paramilitary refinement - Need input.

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jon shannow
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#61

Post by jon shannow »

Vincent wrote:well theres a reason the majority of knife companies choose to use Torx. Im not sure the flat head would really go over well. Thogh I am a fan of the one sided torx like on the Military.

i agree and would hate to see a flat head on it would make me think twice about geting one
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Mr Blonde
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#62

Post by Mr Blonde »

sal wrote: 1. I believe a 4way clip will be a necessary improvement.
2. We'll be doing somethng with the "sharp" corner at the back of the spine in the closed position.
That's pretty much everything that's needed in my opinion. Maybe you could find a way to make it slimmer and lighter?

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Ted
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#63

Post by Ted »

My 'beef' with the paramilitary was that the compression lock liner didn't retain the knife well when closed.
Oh, and 4-way clip would be nice.
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Bodieism
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#64

Post by Bodieism »

STR wrote:I like the knife but can't say I'm fond of the nested compression lock though. I'd much prefer a lock back option
Same here. My first vote would to change the lock to a lockback. However, if that wouldn't be considered then a close second choice would be the ball bearing lock. Any other lock and it would probably sway me from buying it (unless some sort of new lock were to be put on it). I'd like to hear some teaser info about the stop lock :D
-- Bodie

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speyederlover
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#65

Post by speyederlover »

One thing I forgot to write earlier. The blade play was a problem mine had and seemed common from what I seen others post. I just can't stand any blade play. It was one reason I sold mine. Please make the blade play go away.
Fred Sanford
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#66

Post by Fred Sanford »

Bodieism wrote:Same here. My first vote would to change the lock to a lockback. However, if that wouldn't be considered then a close second choice would be the ball bearing lock. Any other lock and it would probably sway me from buying it (unless some sort of new lock were to be put on it). I'd like to hear some teaser info about the stop lock :D

Am I mistaken in thinking that the lockback would be weaker than the compression lock?

Seems like it would be which is why I would like to keep the compression lock. ;)
"I'm calling YOU ugly, I could push your face in some dough and make gorilla cookies." - Fred Sanford
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#67

Post by TheKnifeCollector »

PS: besides the other changes I mentioned, I would like to see it as a tip up carry.
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Bodieism
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#68

Post by Bodieism »

[quote="David Lowry"]Am I mistaken in thinking that the lockback would be weaker than the compression lock?

Seems like it would be which is why I would like to keep the compression lock. ]

Depends. The Mini Manix lock is stronger than the Para-Military's. I think it would all come down to how it was designed. When lockbacks are done right they are extremely strong. I think something else usually breaks on the them before the lockback fails. I'm also in favor of the BB lock which seems to be extremely strong also. Isn't the Dodo's lock also stronger than the Para-Military's?
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lerman
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#69

Post by lerman »

1. I believe a 4way clip will be a necessary improvement.
2. We'll be doing somethng with the "sharp" corner at the back of the spine in the closed position.

+ OD green' it'll look good but it's not a must have.
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peacefuljeffrey
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#70

Post by peacefuljeffrey »

Piet.S wrote:Changing the lock to a backlock would be inbreeding. There is allready the Manix-80mm. It's the diversity that keeps the pack healthy.
I'm right handed but find the Para very easy to operate with left as well.
In another thread, Sal said they have a ball-holder that will work in all models. I think you're right about a backlock in a Para being a step back toward other models (and needless). It seems like a natural that the ParaMilitary would get a BBLock. I am hoping hoping hoping. I'd drop another hundred bucks for one. I just started carrrying my ParaMilitary yesterday after keeping it safe in the box for like a year or more.

I want to start using the heck out of these, but I want a backup, and I might as well wait for a BBLock version, yes?

-Jeffrey
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peacefuljeffrey
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#71

Post by peacefuljeffrey »

Django wrote:In my opinion the G-10 should definitely stay black. I would like to see a lower-riding clip, doesn't have to make the knife invisible, but at least lower riding than the current one. Also, smooth out the sharp tang, hide it in the handle, whatever.

The clip and sharp tang have been the two reasons I have not yet purchased a Para.


-Django :spyder:

I started carrying my ParaMilitary only yesterday, mostly because of this thread. Of course, I keep manipulating (fondling?) it all day and night now, and considering all these floating suggestions for changing the knife, trying to decide what I agree/disagree with, and what I would like to see changed, and what I fear to see changed.

As far as the clip, I agree, the knife could stand to ride lower in the pocket. That would be if I were to carry it in the rear pocket. In part because of how high it rides, I plan to carry it in the front pocket. The end of the clip should be rounded just a bit, though

As far as the angular corner of the tang that sticks out when closed, I guess I agree that it should be redone to hide, but at the same time, I actually kind of like it!. It's something that feels kinda raw, tough, mechanical to sort of fiddle with, with your thumb. My thumb actually likes it. :D

-Jeffrey
"Within this frame an ocean swells -- behind the smile -- I know it well..."
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Bodieism
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#72

Post by Bodieism »

peacefuljeffrey wrote:I think you're right about a backlock in a Para being a step back toward other models (and needless). It seems like a natural that the ParaMilitary would get a BBLock. I am hoping hoping hoping. I'd drop another hundred bucks for one.
There are a lot of choices for lockback models while there aren't many for ball bearing lock models so it does seem that the better choice would be for the BB lock. It wouldn't hurt my feelings none to see them use a BB lock instead of a lockback though :D I think a BB lock on the Para-Military would be a great improvement. So I'm hoping with you to :D
-- Bodie

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J.B
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#73

Post by J.B »

Please don´t forget the Paramili was designed to be the ultimate mid size survival folder, sturdy and still lightweight. The robust compression lock that consists only of the locking liner and it´s open frame construction allow for cleaning in the field if it comes to dust, dirt and mud.

I cannot see how one will manage that with the delicate springs and the other parts on the inside of the BB lock. Nevertheless I like the BB lock for use in rather clean environments.

A backlock would be more simple and better cleanable as a BB lock but it would not be as simple as a compression lock, it is no open frame construction and it requires steel liners and other parts that would add quite some weight to the folder.

If it comes to surviving please keep it robust, lightweight, simple and cleanable.

Best wishes,
JB
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sal
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#74

Post by sal »

I guess I should point out that if the lock release sticks out through the scale (so it can be released), it really makes it difficult to have a highly effective tip down clip. The clip hinders access to the lock release. 4 way clips generally require a lock release that is on top or bottom of the scale.

The key work being "highly effective".

a thought to share.

sal
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peacefuljeffrey
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#75

Post by peacefuljeffrey »

STR wrote:I know of two guys that lost their Para Military knives to LEOs by being told they were illegal blades lengths so there are a couple of guys besides me out there wishing for this also.
While doing so might be justified, to make this kind of thing more difficult to justify happening, it sounds to me more like these were greedy, corrupt cops who used a b.s. excuse to take someone's $100+ cool pocket knife. :mad:


Just how far over 3" is the PM's blade? Enough for a cop to make a good-faith argument that it must be confiscated? I bet there was no charge; I bet there was no report (containing mention of the knife, anyway); I bet the knife is now EDC'd by the cop.


-Jeffrey
"Within this frame an ocean swells -- behind the smile -- I know it well..."
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peacefuljeffrey
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#76

Post by peacefuljeffrey »

Mr Blonde wrote:That's pretty much everything that's needed in my opinion. Maybe you could find a way to make it slimmer and lighter?

Wouter

What?! I think that one of the attributes of the ParaMilitary is the size and feel of the handle. Making it slimmer would make it less hand-filling, and that would detract from what the knife is.

I have no problem with what it weighs. I suspect that strength, rigidity, toughness would have to be sacrificed in any move to decrease the ParaMilitary's weight.

-Jeffrey
"Within this frame an ocean swells -- behind the smile -- I know it well..."
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txtroublemaker
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#77

Post by txtroublemaker »

TK wrote:I don't think that a 4-way clip is a necessary improvement, because this can cause some serious safety problems. Since the Comp Lock is some kind of Liner Lock, a tip-up carry option is somewhat like a live gun in a childs hand :eek: . It's a matter of time when the sharp blade of the tip-up carried knife opens accidentialy in the pocket and causes some serious injury. If more carry options are wanted, than only tip-down left/right.
I have to disagree with this statement, I have some real world experience with this "live gun in a child’s hand" set up that you speak of. I had my Para converted to left hand tip up carry a little over a month ago and I can't imagine my knife opening accidentally in my pocket. The only way I could see this happening is if the pivot was ridiculously loose. I carry my Para in my front left pocket, which is where I also carry my money clip. My hand goes in and out of that pocket several times a day, and I have never worried about the knife opening up accidentally. Had I not had this conversion done, this knife would never see pocket time. From a lefty's perspective, it's very refreshing to have a Sal address one of our biggest complaints about one of Spyderco's best knives. Thanks again Sal, I look forward to the revamped
Para!!!
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gull wing
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#78

Post by gull wing »

I convereted my Para to tip up. I take it with me in in hard work conditions there has never been an unwanted opening.
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MojoMC
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#79

Post by MojoMC »

I had a Paramilitary, but I sold it. The reasons:

- only Tip-Down. Why? Tip-Up is safe (and IMHO better, too) - unless you don't know how to build a knife. But I wouldn't worry about that. The extra holes for ambidextrous carry would be annoying if the handle would be made of metal or stag - but it's black G10. You can hardly see these extra holes...

- the total opposite of a low-riding-clip, very annoying.

- blade:handle ratio. It's even worse than an SBMF, and at least that's a **** good handle.
Increasing the blade would be a solution (why not buying a military? because of the ridiculously oversized handle), but decreasing the length of the handle (including moving the pivot to the end of the handle) while keeping the length of the edge under 3" would be suitable for many situations.

So, my next Paramilitary needs:
- possibility of Tip-Up
- a low-riding clip (perhaps even a wire-clip?)
- a shorter handle (better than more blade)

It would be nice if it had:
- nice steel (like ZDP-189?)
- not only black G-10, but other colors too
- not the pointy tang
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peacefuljeffrey
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#80

Post by peacefuljeffrey »

Ugh, please no wire clip. Not on a hard-use knife.

CPM S30V is not "nice steel"?? :confused:


-Jeffrey
"Within this frame an ocean swells -- behind the smile -- I know it well..."
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