Who´d like to teach (me/us) proper English?!

[Wartstein]

The only time I get to use English as a language is in this forum.

I never actually talk in English (except perhaps for shortly explaining to some tourists how to get to Mozarts` birthplace or some sound of susic locations in the city of Salzburg... :rolleyes: ) and so I never, ever get corrected or can see the reaction of Native Speakers to what I say.

I figure it is the same for quite some more non-native-speakers in English here, and so I thought a thread where one can ask questions about proper grammar, use of words and so on would be nice.
Whoever of you native speakers cares to reply and explain (Doc, I think you even are an English teacher?!) please do so!
First question in the next post... :)

[Wartstein]

- "What" vs "Which"

Like in "What Spyderco is on your pocket today" vs. "which Spyderco is on your pocket today"

- When to use one or the other term?
- Or are they totally interchangeable?

[Wartstein]

"Either" vs "too" vs "also"

Like in: "I own an Endura too"; "I own an Endura either" "I also own an Endura" "I own an Endura also"

- When/how to use which term?

[ChrisinHove]

- "What" vs "Which"

Like in "What Spyderco is on your pocket today" vs. "which Spyderco is on your pocket today"

- When to use one or the other term?
- Or are they totally interchangeable?

This is pretty nuanced stuff, and either is perfectly understandable.

To me, *What* Spyderco? implies a choice of any Spyderco.

Whereas, *Which* Spyderco? more implies a choice from a known range of options. I know you have an Endura and a Stretch, but which one?

[Wartstein]

- "What" vs "Which"

This is pretty nuanced stuff, and either is perfectly understandable.

To me, *What* Spyderco? implies a choice of any Spyderco.

Whereas, *Which* Spyderco? more implies a choice from a known range of options. I know you have an Endura and a Stretch, but which one?

Thanks! Perfect while (or actually BECAUSE) simple explanation! :)
Are you perhaps even a teacher??

[ChrisinHove]

"Either" vs "too" vs "also"

Like in: "I own an Endura too"; "I own an Endura either" "I also own an Endura" "I own an Endura also"

- When/how to use which term?

‘I own an Endura too’ is a little ambiguous as it could mean either ‘I own an Endura like you do’, or, ‘I also own an Endura (as well as a Delica)’. This is a much less formal, even slightly childish, expression. Which of the two options do you mean?

Similarly, ‘I also own an Endura’ could mean either option, is less informal, but also ambiguous unless in a clear context.

‘I own an Endura either’, doesn’t work on it’s own. ‘Either’ implies an ‘either this or that’ situation.

‘I own an Endura also’ is OK, understandable but similarly ambiguous, and a little awkward.

[ChrisinHove]

- "What" vs "Which"

This is pretty nuanced stuff, and either is perfectly understandable.

To me, *What* Spyderco? implies a choice of any Spyderco.

Whereas, *Which* Spyderco? more implies a choice from a known range of options. I know you have an Endura and a Stretch, but which one?

Thanks! Perfect while (or actually BECAUSE) simple explanation! :)
Are you perhaps even a teacher??

No, not good enough for that! :) I write moderately technical reports for non-technical people.

Using a lot of editing :D

[Wartstein]

"Either" vs "too" vs "also"

Like in: "I own an Endura too"; "I own an Endura either" "I also own an Endura" "I own an Endura also"

- When/how to use which term?

‘I own an Endura too’ is a little ambiguous as it could mean either ‘I own an Endura like you do’, or, ‘I also own an Endura (as well as a Delica)’. This is a much less formal, even slightly childish, expression. Which of the two options do you mean?

Similarly, ‘I also own an Endura’ could mean either option, is less informal, but also ambiguous unless in a clear context.

‘I own an Endura either’, doesn’t work on it’s own. ‘Either’ implies an ‘either this or that’ situation.

‘I own an Endura also’ is OK, understandable but similarly ambiguous, and a little awkward.

Thanks heaps! :)

Follow up questions, should you or anyone find time somewhen:

- So IS there actually a way to be "UN-ambigous" with just ONE of these terms (or another one)
So CAN you say, using just one word for it, either "I own an Endura like you do" or I also own an Endura as well as a Delica" ot does one always add that clarification when using "too" or "also" - or does it matter WHERE in a sentence the terms are placed?!

- So something like the following does not work in English:
A: "I have and Endura"
B: " I have one either" (like in "like you I have an Endura")

[Wartstein]

- "What" vs "Which"

Like in "What Spyderco is on your pocket today" vs. "which Spyderco is on your pocket today"

- When to use one or the other term?
- Or are they totally interchangeable?

This is pretty nuanced stuff, and either is perfectly understandable.

To me, *What* Spyderco? implies a choice of any Spyderco.

Whereas, *Which* Spyderco? more implies a choice from a known range of options. I know you have an Endura and a Stretch, but which one?

Next follow up question :o :

- If I refer to "any Spyderco" , but specifically as the "group of all Spydercos" or to indirectly to one Spyderco with particular properties in that group, I´d still rather use "which" than "what", right?

- Example:
A: "I know you´re totally into folders. So can you tell me WHICH Spyderco is the largest?" - Here it actually IS about a choice of any Spyderco, but I am referring to "any Spyderco" perhaps a bit differently than in "What Spyderco is in your pocket today?"

[ThomC]

"Either" vs "too" vs "also"

Like in: "I own an Endura too"; "I own an Endura either" "I also own an Endura" "I own an Endura also"

- When/how to use which term?

‘I own an Endura too’ is a little ambiguous as it could mean either ‘I own an Endura like you do’, or, ‘I also own an Endura (as well as a Delica)’. This is a much less formal, even slightly childish, expression. Which of the two options do you mean?

Similarly, ‘I also own an Endura’ could mean either option, is less informal, but also ambiguous unless in a clear context.

‘I own an Endura either’, doesn’t work on it’s own. ‘Either’ implies an ‘either this or that’ situation.

‘I own an Endura also’ is OK, understandable but similarly ambiguous, and a little awkward.

Thanks heaps! :)

Follow up questions, should you or anyone find time somewhen:

- So IS there actually a way to be "UN-ambigous" with just ONE of these terms (or another one)
So CAN you say, using just one word for it, either "I own an Endura like you do" or I also own an Endura as well as a Delica" ot does one always add that clarification when using "too" or "also" - or does it matter WHERE in a sentence the terms are placed?!

- So something like the following does not work in English:
A: "I have and Endura"
B: " I have one either" (like in "like you I have an Endura")

I am neither an English native nor a teacher, but I think I'm well versed enough in the language to chime in here.

The simplest thing is using "as well". The thing with too is it's very situational : it can be used to shorten an answer, reciprocate a feeling, an opinion, add substance to a sentence without having to repeat what you've been told or have said already.

As to "either", it is used to indicate a shared sentiment but after a negative, usually. I.e. "I don't like the Star Wars sequels" - "I don't either".
"Either" and "neither" are appropriate adverbs here but depend on your use of the negative; "Neither do I" being the sister answer.

Its primary meaning is in a context of choice or to distinguish two possibilites; i.e. "you can have either coffee or tea as a hot beverage".

[Wartstein]

"Either" vs "too" vs "also"

I am neither an English native nor a teacher, but I think I'm well versed enough in the language to chime in here.

The simplest thing is using "as well". The thing with too is it's very situational : it can be used to shorten an answer, reciprocate a feeling, an opinion, add substance to a sentence without having to repeat what you've been told or have said already.

As to "either", it is used to indicate a shared sentiment but after a negative, usually. I.e. "I don't like the Star Wars sequels" - "I don't either".
"Either" and "neither" are appropriate adverbs here but depend on your use of the negative; "Neither do I" being the sister answer.

Its primary meaning is in a context of choice or to distinguish two possibilites; i.e. "you can have either coffee or tea as a hot beverage".

Thanks!! Very well explained!

One follow up question:
- You say "either" can be used to "indicate a shared sentiment".
- DOES it have to be a "sentiment" in a narrower sense of the word? So it can´t be used like in my example for just owning a similar item (without involving any sentiment):

Example:
A: "I have an Endura" B: "I have one either"
Or A:"I never held a Sage" B: "Me neither"... ?

[James Y]

I am neither an English native nor a teacher, but I think I'm well versed enough in the language to chime in here.

The simplest thing is using "as well". The thing with too is it's very situational : it can be used to shorten an answer, reciprocate a feeling, an opinion, add substance to a sentence without having to repeat what you've been told or have said already.

As to "either", it is used to indicate a shared sentiment but after a negative, usually. I.e. "I don't like the Star Wars sequels" - "I don't either".
"Either" and "neither" are appropriate adverbs here but depend on your use of the negative; "Neither do I" being the sister answer.

Its primary meaning is in a context of choice or to distinguish two possibilites; i.e. "you can have either coffee or tea as a hot beverage".

Thanks!! Very well explained!

One follow up question:
- You say "either" can be used to "indicate a shared sentiment".
- DOES it have to be a "sentiment" in a narrower sense of the word? So it can´t be used like in my example for just owning a similar item (without involving any sentiment):

Example:
A: "I have an Endura" B: "I have one either"
Or A:"I never held a Sage" B: "Me neither"... ?

A: “I have an Endura.” B: I have one, too.” Or “I also have an Endura.” Or “Me too.” Or “So do I.”

These are only some examples.

A: I’ve never held a Sage.” B: Neither have I.” Or “Me neither.”

These are only some examples.

Jim

[Naperville]

I am not an English teacher. The best book on the subject that I know of is, "The Little Brown Handbook."

https://www.amazon.com/Little-Brown-Han ... 9729&psc=1

[TomAiello]

Great thread!

- You say "either" can be used to "indicate a shared sentiment".
- DOES it have to be a "sentiment" in a narrower sense of the word? So it can´t be used like in my example for just owning a similar item (without involving any sentiment):

Example:
A: "I have an Endura" B: "I have one either"
Or A:"I never held a Sage" B: "Me neither"... ?

"I have an Endura, too" or "I have an Endura also" or "I have an Endura as well"

'I have one either' doesn't work. Oddly 'I don't have one either' does work to imply a lack of the thing.

The thing about a sentence that short is that the underlying nuances depend on context. In the 'I have an Endura tooo/also/as well' example' you could be saying that you have an Endura in addition to another knife, or that you have an Endura in addition to your Glock 19, or that you have an Endura just like the person you are talking to.

My Italian is probably about on a level with your English, and the difficulty I encounter is that expressing simple concepts is easy, but understanding higher level nuances is very complex. For example, 'I have an Endura also' does have a slightly different nuance from 'I have an Endura too'. The first is more likely to mean that you have one and so does the person you are talking to, and the second is more likely to mean that you have one in addition to another knife. But that's not an absolute rule--just a '60% of the time' kind of thing.

Even more confusing, those nuanced meanings vary greatly with dialect, so the 60% that I expect in Idaho might be different from the general guideline in Mississippi, New South Wales, or Herefordshire. I expect that as an Austrian, you're familiar with this kind of thing though. I have a friend who grew up in Hamburg and now lives in Munich and often remarks on the 'Bavarian' spoken there. He says it's almost as bad as traveling from Georgia to California (he works in tech and used to split his work week between Atlanta and San Francisco).

I have another friend who is South African and teaches English in the UK, and he's constantly moaning about how poor the English spoken in England is, when compared to the 'textbook' grammar.

[RustyIron]

I don't have an Endura.

To be able to speak well and to be able to describe the rules that govern proper grammar are entirely different. During casual conversation, many Americans use improper grammar. Sometimes the non-standard usage is common in their regional dialect, sometimes they are using the grammar rules common to their native language, and sometimes their usage is lack of education. Regardless, polite people overlook these errors. I enjoy learning things, but traditional study of language is boring. I've found a podcast by Grammar Girl to be both educational and entertaining. You might want to try her podcasts.

I'm no expert, but I'll try to lend guidance.

What vs Which
Both are interrogative pronouns--words that take the place of a person, place, or thing that is not defined. Generally, you'll use "what" when speaking of something with many possibilities. Generally, you'll use "which" when the number of possiblities is smaller. For instance, if I know you have a lot of knives, I might ask, "What knife are you carrying today?" If I know you have four Spydercos, I might ask, "Which knife are you carrying today?" Of course it's much more complicated than that, but that rule will help you in most situations.

More important than silly grammar rules, when speaking to Americans, use your accent. Ladies will think your sexy, and children will think you're a rocket scientist.

[JuPaul]

I love word nerd threads! Wartstein, you got some excellent answers here already. As others have said, these are very nuanced questions, and many native speakers get them wrong. In most cases, you would be understood clearly using any of the examples you listed. The one exception might be using too/also/as well vs. using either/neither:

Too/also/as well would be used in a positive sentence.
Ex. I DO have a Spyderco, too.
Ex. I DO have a Spyderco as well.

Either/neither would be used with a negative.
Ex. He does not have a Spyderco. I do NOT have a Spyderco, either.
Ex. He does NOT have a Spyderco. Neither do I.

[TkoK83Spy]

As long as you don't say "loosing" when you're trying to say "losing" ...then you're okay with me! My #1 all time grammar pet peeve!

[Wartstein]

Folks, great replies. Very helpful and really well put, so that I can really understand the nuanced differences. :)
But for me this is not only educational, but also entertaining! Thanks for that too!

[Wartstein]

I love word nerd threads! Wartstein, you got some excellent answers here already. ......

Yep, "word nerd discussions" are fun! :)

What I personally like the most: The Austrian dialect is actually a form of German, and related to "high" German perhaps a bit like an US dialect to oxford English (just a guess)
But there are quite a few words in our dialect for which there are just no real equivalents in high German.
You now, like one word in our dialect that describes something perfectly well, but in "high" German you would need like three whole sentences to do so (not much sense in listing examples on this particular forum, but should a German native speaker read this: "Gschaftig"or "Grantler" would be examples for what I mean)

[Wartstein]

Another one I struggle with: "This" vs "that" and to what degree the terms are interchangeable...

Some examples:

- A.: "Sal, my new Endura came with a comp. lock. Can you explain this/that?"

- A.: "Sal, my new Endura came with a comp.lock!
Sal: "This/that is weird"

- A.:"I think I am going to fell a tree with my Endura"
B.: "Cool, I actually want to try this/that too!"