Others Spyderco Competitors

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Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby ugaarguy » Wed Jan 27, 2021 11:39 am

I sent TazKristi a PM this weekend, and she gave me the go ahead to post this. I think that some competitors models are beating Spyderco in value at, particularly at the lower price points. She's going to pass this on to the rest of the Spyderco team, so they can see what else we're buying and why.

For example, the full size Cold Steel Tuff Lite. This is a Taiwanese made knife with a 2.5", hollow ground, AUS-8, wharncliffe blade, full thickness finger choil, and it sells for $25-$30. It also has liner-less plastic handles with clip screw thread inserts, and the Tri-Ad lock; so, it's built a lot like the Native 5 lightweight. It's priced like an FRN Byrd, but made in Taiwan rather than mainland China, and has Japanese Aichi AUS-8 steel rather than Chinese 8Cr13MoV. It's not Native 5 tight, but it's well fit and finished with a very smooth opening action.

What "others" do you find compete with Spyderco knives, and why?

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby MacLaren » Wed Jan 27, 2021 12:03 pm

Very, very few after all said and done imo.
At the end of the day, I always come back to Spyderco.
That being said, imo- ZT and Benchmade come to mind as direct competition. Both ZT & Benchmade have very nice lineups comparable to Spyderco imo and they do offer some of the more popular blade steels as Spyderco. But, really Spyderco has them both beat again- my opinion.
When I consider sharpness outta the box, fit and finish and the big one.imo, variety of steel, Spyderco sits alone atop the Mountain.
I've had a few very nice middle to low high-end blades if you will, but again, at the end of the day Spyderco is the actual knife I reach for when something needs done.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby ladybug93 » Wed Jan 27, 2021 12:06 pm

the cold steel tuff lite is a wonderful value. i carried mine when i had blade length restrictions at work and it's build quality is on par with or better than any lw spyderco model, just with lower grade steel.

i also like to carry the d2 esee avispa or zancudo. i know some people complain about finish on those knives, but i've owned three and had zero issues. it's a great knife. the zancudo is more ergonomic to me than a delica for the same blade length. the avispa feels a little thin in the hand and isn't quite as comfortable as my manix, but it's still a great knife for almost $100 less.

some of the kershaw usa models are a pretty good value for being made in the us. i have the composite dividend. i'm not sure i'd call it a good value, but it was beautiful. some of their other models have 20cv and are priced much lower than spyderco knives with the same or similar steels.

i do think spyderco folders are on the top end of what i'd be willing to pay (and some far beyond that), but their fixed blades are the ones that really fail to compete for me. i'd like a knife like the enuff, but i'm never spending that much when i can buy a few moras that i never have to worry about and still have money for a date night with the wife for the same amount as the enuff. the bow river doesn't appeal to me at all and neither do any of the much more expensive models. maybe one of the salts if i had to work on the water, but i don't, so a pacific salt is perfectly fine for my needs.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby Naperville » Wed Jan 27, 2021 12:08 pm

I only own 85 knives so I feel like I do not get my hands on enough knives to say where Spyderco is winning/losing a battle for territory. I think you would have to handle and use hundreds to thousands of knives to be good at responding to this. Sal and Eric may not want to make knives to compete head to head too, they do their own thing and they are pretty good at that.

For example:

Spyderco could make more frame locks and compete with KAI, Kershaw, and ZT Knives more head to head.

Spyderco could make more tactical knives and compete with Spartan and CRK head to head.

...


If you take it down to the knife level:

Spyderco could design and manufacture the NEW XL sized Fish Hunter, and compete with Tops Pig Hunter, among others. Spyderco would have the best knife out of the competition because they would employ better steel.



A proper analysis model by model for Spyderco would take months to complete.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby ugaarguy » Wed Jan 27, 2021 1:20 pm

Naperville wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 12:08 pm
I only own 85 knives so I feel like I do not get my hands on enough knives to say where Spyderco is winning/losing a battle for territory. I think you would have to handle and use hundreds to thousands of knives to be good at responding to this. Sal and Eric may not want to make knives to compete head to head too, they do their own thing and they are pretty good at that.

For example:

Spyderco could make more frame locks and compete with KAI, Kershaw, and ZT Knives more head to head.

Spyderco could make more tactical knives and compete with Spartan and CRK head to head.

...


If you take it down to the knife level:

Spyderco could design and manufacture the NEW XL sized Fish Hunter, and compete with Tops Pig Hunter, among others. Spyderco would have the best knife out of the competition because they would employ better steel.



A proper analysis model by model for Spyderco would take months to complete.
I'm not asking what Spyderco could make, nor for analysis of every Spyderco model. I'm just curious as to what competitors are making that does compete with Spyderco, and why other folks here think that knife / those knives compete. If you don't think it's worth your time, you don't have to participate, and you have to make any further negative posts either.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby vivi » Wed Jan 27, 2021 1:43 pm

Fixed blades are often tough for me to justify from Spyderco, because a lot of other makers present such a good value.

For example, Landi:

https://www.collectorknives.net/product ... i-cutlery/

Those are the prices from a retailer for his knives that are handmade in USA, heat treated very well and generally to a higher rc than most companies, and come complete with well fitted kydex. I find it difficult to justify a VG10/FRN Enuff if a Landi in A2/micarta is half the price. Additionally I can email him directly and get even lower prices.

I also recently purchased some Cold Steel fixed blades. SK5, molded on rubberized handles, made in Taiwan with kydex style sheaths with great retention. I bought two SRK-C's, two SRK's and a Recon Tanto for less than a Spyderco Sustain, Bradley Bowie, Zoomer or Serrata would cost by itself.

I can appreciate that the fixed blades I listed have attributes which increases manufacturing costs, like high end steels, 3D sculpted handles etc., but at the end of the day a $40 taiwan made fixed blade is easier for me to say yes to than a $200-400 taiwan made fixed blade.

I tend to use my fixed blades for carving wood, batoning, light chopping, processing food and small game etc. Most of those things don't require the edge holding of steels like S90V and 20CV. I'm perfectly happy with steels like O1, A2 and 1095 with a good heat treat for smaller fixed blades. They work great for me. They take screaming sharp edges with ease and hold up to my use.

This is the case for chef knives too. The murray carter collabs are gorgeous but my 12 year old Victorinox 10" chef knife is a fantastic knife for the $30 I paid for it. Its difficult enough keeping other people in my kitchen from using that (whether at home or professionally), couldn't imagine trying to keep tabs on a $400 chef knife unless I lived alone and didn't take it to work.

That being said I still buy Spyderco fixed blades if I like the design enough (Street Beat) or it offers something unique (Swick 6 / Aqua Salt / Waterway)

I love Spyderco for constantly pushing the envelope in regards to steels etc., but there is always going to be a market for 440C or similar FRN scaled knives under $50.
Last edited by vivi on Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby VooDooChild » Wed Jan 27, 2021 2:01 pm

I am pretty die hard spyderco.

As far as your example goes I will say this. I have a cold steel tuff lite and I love it as a cheap awesome bomb proof knife. With that said, its ergos have got nothing on the choil grip of the native 5. If they made a native 5 wharncliffe it would blow the tuff lite out of the water. The tuff lites steel isnt that good, I would rather have vg10, or insert steel here. And finally I dont think the triad lock is as great as everyone else says it is. I will take a Golden made mid backlock every single time.
The tuff lite absolutely wins in price though.

I buy spyderco for the integrity and good business practices. Thats why I will contunue to support them.

I am paying for research and development, good ergos, proper heat treats, cqi, new steels, rust proof steels, a real warranty, etc...

With that said there are a lot of great other options out there. Its hard to beat a cheap mora. Its hard to beat a great USA made fixed blade like a bark river.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby vivi » Wed Jan 27, 2021 2:30 pm

Tri-ad lock is awesome. Its basically a stronger lockback with zero play.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby TomAiello » Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:14 pm

Hogue.

I don't think Benchmade can really compete with Spyderco, but Hogue is everything Benchmade _should_ be. It's like BM with better steel and lower prices.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby ugaarguy » Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:59 pm

TomAiello wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:14 pm
Hogue.

I don't think Benchmade can really compete with Spyderco, but Hogue is everything Benchmade _should_ be. It's like BM with better steel and lower prices.
Benchmade upgraded the Griptilian to S30V. A full size Grip has a slightly longer blade than a Manix 2. Manix 2 LW with BD1N is $105 MAP. Plastic handle Grip with S30V is $110.50, MAP prices for both. But the G10 / 20CV Griptilian at $187 is $41 more than the G10 / M390 Manix 2 Sprint. And the Manix 2 G10 / S110V at $182 is also nearly $36 more than the M390 sprint ($146), and only $5 less than the 20CV Grip. Then the Hogue / Ritter RSK modified Grip design is right in the middle at $160. The pricing on the variants of those three competitors is all over the place.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby JD Spydo » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:33 pm

I've enjoyed this thread so far. There's been some great points brought out. It goes without saying that Spyderco is my favorite brand of knife. And to be honest they were not the very first premium knife I ever bought. I had purchased probably at least 12 to 14 Benchmade models before I ever bought my first Spyder in 1995.

With that said there are still other knife companies that I patronize. But for far different reasons than what I buy Spyderco knives for. On a lower price end I've always found Victorinox, Swiss made knives great for no more money than you spend on them. Not nearly the overall quality of a Spyderco but I do have a few Victorinox knives that I use frequently. And I really like their Multitools as well. Some of the other companies I still like are Cold Steel, Boker, Buck, Ka-Bar, Ontario along with a few of the German culinary knives that I've been very lucky to find at my local thrift store in the past 2 years. They include Zwilling J.A. Henckels, Messmeister, Wustoff and Weidmannsheil.

But most of my heavy users and main EDC users are all Spyderco. I respect most of the high quality knife producers and always keep my eye out for anything in the magazines>> I subscribe to 3 of them and try to keep up with the overall cutlery market. But the Great Spyder Factory is where I look first when shopping for something I need in the line of cutlery and sharpening gear.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby Naperville » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:40 pm

ugaarguy wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 1:20 pm
I'm not asking what Spyderco could make, nor for analysis of every Spyderco model. I'm just curious as to what competitors are making that does compete with Spyderco, and why other folks here think that knife / those knives compete. If you don't think it's worth your time, you don't have to participate, and you have to make any further negative posts either.
OOPS, I forgot to use a smiley! That my friend was NOT a negative post.

:)
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby yablanowitz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 5:42 pm

I've been considering how to reply to this thread. The wisest course would doubtless be to forget it and move on, but that's not really my style.

I should start by saying I own a truely ludicrous number of knives. I'm a packrat and I've been accumulating knives since the mid 1960s. I have literally hundreds, possibly a couple of thousand. A few hundred of them are Spyderco, and almost as many are Victorinox. It would be even worse if I didn't give some away once it a while.

If I have learned one thing over the years, it is that price tags are the most common and least useful yardstick for comparing knives. If Spyderco falls short in any market, it would be the low price mass market. I would just as soon see them stay out of that one. It didn't work out all that well for Gerber.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby JRinFL » Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:34 am

At first I thought I had an easy answer, but on further thought it is far more complicated to answer in a useful manner. Going to have to think longer on this.

I do agree with Vivi on fixed blade knives. Spyderco fixed blades are expensive for what you actually get and really only compete on the higher end. I do acknowledge that fixed blades are not their primary focus.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby MacLaren » Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:51 am

I understand the talk about the Spyderco fixed blades.
But, the Province is really exceptional
There's many A2 blades out there that cost more than $280 - namely Bark River.
But, the Province w/ 7" of CPM-4V, you'll never find one like it for the money. At least I haven't.
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby justjohn » Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:01 am

What, Spyderco has competitors? :eek: Not in my world. Spyderco equals quality, value, innovation, fantastic people, sincere customer interaction, exceptional discounts (OPFOCUS), and, probably the best attribute to me; integrity! :D
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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby ladybug93 » Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:48 am

vivi wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 2:30 pm
Tri-ad lock is awesome. Its basically a stronger lockback with zero play.
i have to agree with you on this one. i don't really care for spyderco's backlocks even though i have more of them than any others because i like salts. i'd much rather have a triad lock in general though. very solid lockup and feel.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby TomAiello » Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:59 am

ugaarguy wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:59 pm
TomAiello wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:14 pm
Hogue.

I don't think Benchmade can really compete with Spyderco, but Hogue is everything Benchmade _should_ be. It's like BM with better steel and lower prices.
Benchmade upgraded the Griptilian to S30V. A full size Grip has a slightly longer blade than a Manix 2. Manix 2 LW with BD1N is $105 MAP. Plastic handle Grip with S30V is $110.50, MAP prices for both. But the G10 / 20CV Griptilian at $187 is $41 more than the G10 / M390 Manix 2 Sprint. And the Manix 2 G10 / S110V at $182 is also nearly $36 more than the M390 sprint ($146), and only $5 less than the 20CV Grip. Then the Hogue / Ritter RSK modified Grip design is right in the middle at $160. The pricing on the variants of those three competitors is all over the place.

For me the upgrade from BM's s30v to Hogue's 20cv is significant. Comparing the Bugout to the Deka (I do own both of them), for example, I have trouble seeing anything in favor of buying the Bugout.

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby benben » Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:22 pm

Like many here, I’m strictly a diehard Spyderco fan! My only non Spyderco knife is a ZT 0562, and it’s awesome, everything about it is just right and I really like it a lot.

This 0562 just sorta happened, almost by accident. I’m glad I own it, obviously Zero Tolerance makes excellent USA built knives, but I’ve never looked at or considered buying another one!?

I’ve looked at Chris Reeve knives, handled 4 or 5 of them, super impressed! If they had a thumb hole I’d probably already own one or two of them!

MacLaren here had me on Medford research mission for a couple of weeks, his pics of his Medford’s wowed me everyday, but there’s so many Spyderco’s still on my “must purchase next” list that I could buy easily two, probably three Spyderco’s for the price of one Medford!

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Re: Others Spyderco Competitors

Postby TkoK83Spy » Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:54 pm

benben wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:22 pm
I’ve looked at Chris Reeve knives, handled 4 or 5 of them, super impressed! If they had a thumb hole I’d probably already own one or two of them!

MacLaren here had me on Medford research mission for a couple of weeks, his pics of his Medford’s wowed me everyday, but there’s so many Spyderco’s still on my “must purchase next” list that I could buy easily two, probably three Spyderco’s for the price of one Medford!
As someone that recently jumped on a CRK, I have to say...Nothing against Spyderco, but if given the opportunity at another CRK, Medford, Shiro, etc if one really appealed to me...it would be a no brainer, easy decision to hold off on a couple Spyderco's for ONE knife of the quality of those brands. Now, it's easy to say for me at this point in my collection as I feel very good about what I personally have in Spyderco knives and don't really care for another one of the many models I already have a few variations of. A different steel, or different color G10 doesn't matter these days. Too many similarities to what I've already got, nothing that's going to blow my mind when opening the box. I think THAT'S where dabbling into a higher end knife makes it worth it compared to another 3 similar Spyderco knives that I likely already have. Something that really excites you once you get it in hand.

That's clearly just my thoughts, but I have no regrets on pulling the trigger on the Sebenza and love having something that doesn't just blend in with the rest of my collection. A different color G10 or FRN just doesn't excite me anymore if I've already got the model :confused: That's the ONE thing I would love to see from Spyderco, granted easier said than done...but I'd love some different handle scale materials and options besides the very common G10 or FRN in 55 different colors. It's still the same knife and am realizing I don't need a rainbow's worth of just one model.
Last edited by TkoK83Spy on Thu Jan 28, 2021 1:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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