Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Fri Dec 09, 2022 6:29 pm

Joe Lewis: "What Bruce Lee Taught Me"

There are many people who think that Bruce Lee was only a movie actor. There are even some ignorant people who say that Bruce Lee was a 'martial arts fraud'.

Joe Lewis, undoubtedly one of the greatest fighters of all time (many refer to him as THE greatest Karate fighter of all time), clearly learned a lot, and was influenced in a lot of ways, from the time he spent training with Bruce Lee. And all that occurred during the time that Joe Lewis was already a Karate champion.

https://youtu.be/YxmMQtTqcOQ

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby Naperville » Fri Dec 09, 2022 7:34 pm

James, I follow the posts in this thread. I check to see if it's updated every day. I don't say anything so that I don't slow it down.

If I feel a bit better physically in 2023, I may buy a heavy bag and drop 20 tennis balls from the rafters in the basement to practice striking and escrima/arnis. First I have to be able to take care of the property I am living in, and if I can do that with no issues, then I can find the time to "play."
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:24 pm

Naperville wrote:
Fri Dec 09, 2022 7:34 pm
James, I follow the posts in this thread. I check to see if it's updated every day. I don't say anything so that I don't slow it down.

If I feel a bit better physically in 2023, I may buy a heavy bag and drop 20 tennis balls from the rafters in the basement to practice striking and escrima/arnis. First I have to be able to take care of the property I am living in, and if I can do that with no issues, then I can find the time to "play."

Naperville, I'm hoping you're feeling better in 2023.

You're welcome to share your thoughts and/or experiences here whenever you want.

Jim
Last edited by James Y on Sat Dec 10, 2022 8:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:48 pm

The Joe Lewis Story

(Video below)

For some reason, I've been on a Joe Lewis kick lately. This is a good video, but there are a couple points made in the video that I'd like to address.

I partly disagree with John Corcoran about Joe Lewis and American kickboxing's influence on modern MMA. It's Muay Thai, not American kickboxing, along with modified boxing, that makes up the orthodox stand-up fighting in modern MMA. Joe Lewis DID pioneer American-style kickboxing/full-contact Karate in 1970, but it's different from Muay Thai, which is clearly the dominant stand-up striking/kickboxing method in MMA. And Muay Thai has a long history that predates American kickboxing; however, Muay Thai, first brought to the US in 1968, didn't really gain notoriety in the States until around the mid-1970s, when a group of pro Muay Thai fighters from Thailand came to challenge American martial artists.

As far as Joe Lewis' arrogance in his younger years: Almost EVERY SINGLE martial artist I've ever met, worked with, trained with, or studied under was, or came across as, arrogant, to some degree or other. Maybe not Bill Wallace and a few others, but the vast majority, especially the fighters. Not necessarily arrogant towards me personally, but in their general demeanor.

As far as Joe Lewis' failed career as an actor, I have a few observations. In his prime, Joe Lewis had the classic looks of a Hollywood star. He was a Karate and kickboxing champion. But he wasn't a good ACTOR. He also lacked the type of charisma and screen presence that radiates off the screen and makes people want to watch. Some people have an "it factor," but most people don't. You can take all the acting classes you want, but if you don't have "it," you don't have "it."

Joe was a fighting prodigy, and highly intelligent and communicative on the subjects of fighting and the martial arts; but as an actor, he was a piece of wood onscreen. And as effective a fighter as he was in real life, his martial arts/fighting skills did not translate well to the silver screen. That's not "throwing shade," that's just a fact. Joe Lewis was one of my very few martial arts heroes, BUT I could see that from the very first time I saw him onscreen in Jaguar Lives (1979). We need to be honest about it; otherwise, what’s the point of saying anything? Classic looks, great physique, and great fighting skill in real life do not necessarily mean you're cut out to be a movie star. Long gone are the days when being a martial artist or fighting champion by itself meant a potential path into the movies.

In the acting world, there are many people who might be considered "butt-ugly" in terms of their physical appearance, and they have no good physique or fighting skills; but their charisma and acting ability are such that your eyes and your attention are naturally drawn to them when they're onscreen. That's because they're REAL actors, who are as great at their craft of acting as Joe Lewis was at his craft of fighting and martial arts.

https://youtu.be/SWEzIRlD5Po

Jim

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Wed Dec 14, 2022 4:54 pm

Chuck Norris vs Joe Lewis (1967)

(Video below)

The footage is old and of poor quality, but as good as you're going to find of this. Chuck is in all-white, and Joe is wearing the black gi pants.

They faced each other 4 times in Karate competition. Chuck won 3 out of 4, with Joe winning their last encounter.

However, Joe Lewis was feared by many competitors; Chuck was highly respected, but wasn't really feared. I have no doubt that in a full-contact match, Joe would have handled Chuck. Joe later pioneered and became a full-contact kickboxing champion; Chuck never fought full-contact. Chuck Norris was a Karate tournament point fighter, and retired from competition as a point fighter. Chuck was one of the top 3 US Karate fighters (alongside Joe Lewis and Mike Stone), and during the rough-and-tumble "blood and guts" era of American Karate competition (the 1960s into the very early '70s). But it was still not the same as professional (or even amateur) full-contact fighting.

That's OK, though. While the match may not look impressive to young people now, Chuck could have easily handled the vast majority of his critics of today, if they were to go back in a time machine to face him back then in a real fight. For the most part, the way that Karate was trained back in the 1960s, throughout the '70s, and into the early '80s, was a lot tougher and more hard-core than it is today. Dojos of today would lose students, and/or get sued for the way many schools trained students back then. And just because someone isn't a professional full-contact fighter or MMA fighter doesn't mean they can't more than handle themselves in real fights. I've known several former point fighters who can go for real, outside of playing "tournament tag."

IMO, it was actually better that Joe Lewis turned down Bruce Lee's offer to play Colt in Way of the Dragon. Although Joe was a great real fighter, he wouldn't have looked as good on film as Norris (whom Bruce called when Lewis turned the role down) did. Chuck's style of fighting combinations and movement translated better to fight choreography for the silver screen. In his fighting days, Joe Lewis had a very highly-developed but limited repertoire of techniques. And Chuck was probably more accommodating and easier to work with than Joe would have been.

https://youtu.be/JCXdAn5h_O0

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Thu Dec 15, 2022 7:09 pm

Dan Inosanto & Dan Lee (2-Man Set from Ed Parker's Kenpo Karate)

Very rare footage. I remember practicing this 2-man set (form) back in my Kenpo Karate days.

https://youtu.be/ebk8fshOkV8

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby Naperville » Thu Dec 15, 2022 8:57 pm

I thought that I would mention Kali Center. He has a ton of FREE videos on Odysee and YouTube, and an online school that has a small fee. I am a member of the online school. Not doing anything physical here just yet, but I watch intently. If I can buy a couple of bags and feel OK, I'll get back to training.

YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/@kalicenter/videos

Odysee
https://odysee.com/@KaliCenter:6?view=content

School
https://www.kalicenter.com/

Most recent video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz67s2nxOec
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:07 pm

Naperville wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 8:57 pm
I thought that I would mention Kali Center. He has a ton of FREE videos on Odysee and YouTube, and an online school that has a small fee. I am a member of the online school. Not doing anything physical here just yet, but I watch intently. If I can buy a couple of bags and feel OK, I'll get back to training.

YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/@kalicenter/videos

Odysee
https://odysee.com/@KaliCenter:6?view=content

School
https://www.kalicenter.com/

Most recent video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz67s2nxOec

Thanks a lot for posting those, Naperville!

Jim

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Fri Dec 16, 2022 3:23 pm

Ed Parker on The Lucy Show (1963), and on The Courtship of Eddie's Father

(Video below)

I never was a fan of Lucille Ball or her show(s), but I found this interesting and amusing, for its historical context. At that time, Karate was still considered a 'mysterious, exotic, deadly' art; even Judo was still sort of mysterious to many Americans. This presentation probably fit perfectly with the general American public's notions of Karate and Judo at the time.

Ed Parker was the Father of American Kenpo Karate, and was one of the first to open a Karate dojo in the Mainland United States (in 1954). I believe the first Mainland US Karate dojo was opened by Robert Trias in 1946.

Ed Parker passed away fairly young in 1990, at the age of 59. The same age I am right now.

In terms of Kenpo, Ed Parker was my great grand teacher; he taught Brian Adams, who taught my Kenpo teacher, Parker Linekin. I haven't practiced Kenpo since the early '80s, but even recently I was still listed by Master Linekin as one of his black belts.

I saw Ed Parker in person a few times in the early '80s at his annual tournament, Ed Parker's Long Beach Internationals. The same tournament where, in 1964, Bruce Lee was 'discovered' by an audience member, Jay Sebring (a hairdresser to the stars, who was later murdered by the Manson Family alongside Sharon Tate in 1969), who brought Bruce Lee to the attention of Hollywood.

I've always respected, and still respect Kenpo to this day, although I've never felt the Kenpo self-defense technique sequences were very practical. There are many Kenpo stylists who are excellent fighters, but we never actually sparred using those sequences, most of which depended on the 'attacker' standing stationary, and were too complicated to work in real life (IMO). I'm sure there are Kenpoists who have used some of them for real, but I couldn't have, even though I had a Kenpo black belt. In our Kenpo school, we sparred with a combination of kickboxing (with takedowns, groin kicks/groin slaps, leg kicking, etc.).

The Chinese Kung Fu systems I later learned were MUCH more natural and easy to apply in sparring, as well as for real, than the Kenpo self-defense sequences. I'll share some of my thoughts on Kenpo in another post.

https://youtu.be/1Q9dnEGmpMk

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby Naperville » Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:45 pm

James,

After watching the Ed Parker video of course I laughed, but the ladies truly captured the shock and awe that students have when a technique works. They were set up for a perfect circumstance so as not to fail, but I remember those initial feelings of shock and awe. I think that is what keeps us coming back for additional instruction.

People who do card tricks or magic master sleight of hand. Martial artists master the control and manipulation of an opponents body mass.

I wish that I was 18 again!
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Sat Dec 17, 2022 4:34 pm

Naperville wrote:
Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:45 pm
James,

After watching the Ed Parker video of course I laughed, but the ladies truly captured the shock and awe that students have when a technique works. They were set up for a perfect circumstance so as not to fail, but I remember those initial feelings of shock and awe. I think that is what keeps us coming back for additional instruction.

People who do card tricks or magic master sleight of hand. Martial artists master the control and manipulation of an opponents body mass.

I wish that I was 18 again!

The first time a martial arts skill worked for me in a real fight was after my dad taught me a Judo throw for the first time, because some kid had been bullying me at school for years. That was the summer right after I turned 10. That bully ended up not being around (his family had moved before the next school year), but another kid who started bullying me paid the price. I threw him perfectly, and he was out cold for about a minute. I don't know how, but that throw was perfect. It was the very first time I ever attempted a martial arts technique, or even fought back at anyone, at all. I couldn't have recreated how perfectly and easily it worked if I'd wanted to.

Jim

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Sun Dec 18, 2022 4:53 pm

Jackie Chan Beats Bruce Lee? (Michael Jai White)

(Video below)

I remember the video from years ago, where MJW claimed he could beat Bruce Lee, and that even Jackie Chan would have beaten Bruce Lee. I used to have a lot of respect for MJW as a martial artist, but after I saw that video a few years back, my level of respect for him dropped.

These types of claims are STUPID. There is no way anyone's ever going to know, because Bruce Lee is dead; and if he were still alive today, he would be 82 years old. So what was the purpose for MJW to say that? Of course, to build HIMSELF up. And what better way than to say, " I could have beaten Bruce Lee"?

MJW is also super-fixated on size. That also reeks of desperation and insecurity. Size does matter, but it isn't everything. I myself have beaten physically larger (but same weight category) men in competition. And I've beaten bigger, heavier men in real fights. I've also been outclassed by men my own size or smaller.

Would a prime MJW have beaten a prime Bruce Lee in an octagon? Possibly. We won't ever know that, either, because MJW was a Karate tournament point fighter back in the '80s. So he never fought in pro MMA, either. In a street fight, I would bet on Bruce Lee over MJW, hands down. But again, that is conjecture on my part, exactly what MJW is doing regarding himself and Bruce Lee and claiming to be fact.

Not that I'm a Bruce Lee worshipper. Bruce Lee was one of the few martial artists I've always admired, but I'm not one of those who thinks he was the best fighter, or unbeatable.

MJW clearly has a very high, possibly even overinflated, opinion of himself. You can actually see it in his face and in his body language. Which is actually a character trait shared by MANY martial artists. The main reason why I do NOT admire many martial artists, and why, with rare exceptions, I never discuss martial arts with anyone outside of this thread.

As 'Viking Samurai' points out, MJW has also claimed that he can take Steven Seagal. In spite of the fact that MJW is much smaller and shorter than Seagal. MJW is so fixated on size advantage for the bigger man, even if it's by a mere 10 or 20 pounds. Yet he moves the goalposts for himself with respect to Seagal. Now, I'm NO FAN of Steven Seagal as a human being or as a martial artist. But I agree with Viking Samurai that Seagal would probably beat MJW in a street fight that doesn't require physical conditioning.

From MJW's attitude, he doesn't seem overly street savvy as far as street fighting is concerned. Because if he was, he would understand the rule of Don't Underestimate Anyone. Some of the most dangerous men you will encounter outside of a ring or competition floor are average to small-sized. Because perhaps partly due to their size 'disadvantage', many of the ones with actual street fighting experience will take things farther and dirtier than most people are expecting.

One certain truth is that 50 years after his death, people the world over are still admiring and talking about Bruce Lee. And that nowhere near the same number of people will be discussing or will even remember MJW 50 years after he's gone.

Even Joe Lewis, who was known as being very arrogant in his prime, had developed some degree of humbleness in his later years. MJW is no spring chicken; he's almost the same age I am. Maybe it's time to grow up and out of these childish fantasy fight comparisons that will never happen.

https://youtu.be/IsAqBTU0OWU

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby Naperville » Sun Dec 18, 2022 5:34 pm

I started in Judo at 9. I am not sure when I first knew of or saw Bruce Lee in a video clip. I saw my first Bruce Lee movie when I was around 16 or 18 in Chicago(I think) at the Ramova Movie Theater in the 70's. I even bought my first set of oak octagon chucks!

http://cinematreasures.org/theaters/1499

Bruce Lee is special to me because he brought martial arts to me, and I wanted to be like Bruce Lee. I wanted to do martial arts MORE after seeing Bruce Lee doing martial arts!

Bruce Lee is special to the 8 billion people in the world because he was a very well trained martial artist, made some of the best martial arts movies and now everyone knows about martial arts. I had been in Judo before I knew of Bruce Lee, but after Bruce Lee, I had someone that I could look up to other than my Judo instructor. Bruce Lee was cocky, sure of himself, and a brilliant actor.

I have no idea who would beat who in any fight, but it's really irrelevant. There was only one Bruce Lee, and only one guy, Bruce Lee, who made martial arts a real thing to the masses. Thank God there was a Bruce Lee!

Now look at martial arts! There is a dojo in every town with 50,000 people in the US almost.
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Sun Dec 18, 2022 10:14 pm

Naperville wrote:
Sun Dec 18, 2022 5:34 pm
I started in Judo at 9. I am not sure when I first knew of or saw Bruce Lee in a video clip. I saw my first Bruce Lee movie when I was around 16 or 18 in Chicago(I think) at the Ramova Movie Theater in the 70's. I even bought my first set of oak octagon chucks!

http://cinematreasures.org/theaters/1499

Bruce Lee is special to me because he brought martial arts to me, and I wanted to be like Bruce Lee. I wanted to do martial arts MORE after seeing Bruce Lee doing martial arts!

Bruce Lee is special to the 8 billion people in the world because he was a very well trained martial artist, made some of the best martial arts movies and now everyone knows about martial arts. I had been in Judo before I knew of Bruce Lee, but after Bruce Lee, I had someone that I could look up to other than my Judo instructor. Bruce Lee was cocky, sure of himself, and a brilliant actor.

I have no idea who would beat who in any fight, but it's really irrelevant. There was only one Bruce Lee, and only one guy, Bruce Lee, who made martial arts a real thing to the masses. Thank God there was a Bruce Lee!

Now look at martial arts! There is a dojo in every town with 50,000 people in the US almost.



Thanks for sharing. Yes, Bruce Lee is a household name. Even people who don't know anything about martial arts, or have never seen his movies, have at least heard of him.

I did Judo and had been in Karate for a few years before I actually saw a Bruce Lee movie. I probably shouldn't have said I always admired Bruce Lee. He really wasn't my inspiration for taking up martial arts. I'd seen him as Kato in The Green Hornet on TV at age 3 or 4, which hadn't left an impression at that age. And I'd been aware of his movies in the early '70s, because a black kid at elementary school was always raving about "Ooooh, did you see Bruce Lee? Bruce Lee! He bad! He bad!", while he mimed doing spin kicks at the air for all to see.

I actually saw a Bruce Lee movie for the first time at age 16, in 1979; six years after he died. But I'd started reading about him in the martial arts magazines about a year earlier. It was actually a screening of Enter the Dragon at San Diego Comic Con. I was impressed with his screen presence, and his speed and technique. But I think I've always been more interested in his studies and views of the martial arts than I was in his movies.

BTW, my favorite Bruce Lee movie is Way of the Dragon. It's way more fun, and IMO, the fights are better than in his other films.

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby Naperville » Sun Dec 18, 2022 10:42 pm

James Y wrote:
Sun Dec 18, 2022 10:14 pm
I did Judo and had been in Karate for a few years before I actually saw a Bruce Lee movie. I probably shouldn't have said I always admired Bruce Lee. He really wasn't my inspiration for taking up martial arts. I'd seen him as Kato in The Green Hornet on TV at age 3 or 4, which hadn't left an impression at that age. And I'd been aware of his movies in the early '70s, because a black kid at elementary school was always raving about "Ooooh, did you see Bruce Lee? Bruce Lee! He bad! He bad!", while he mimed doing spin kicks at the air for all to see.

I actually saw a Bruce Lee movie for the first time at age 16, in 1979; six years after he died. But I'd started reading about him in the martial arts magazines about a year earlier. It was actually a screening of Enter the Dragon at San Diego Comic Con. I was impressed with his screen presence, and his speed and technique. But I think I've always been more interested in his studies and views of the martial arts than I was in his movies.

BTW, my favorite Bruce Lee movie is Way of the Dragon. It's way more fun, and IMO, the fights are better than in his other films.

Jim
I like Way of the Dragon too.

You know I remember seeing him as Kato in the early 60's too, but it just didn't click with me at the time. Sure, I thought all the hand to hand combat was cool, but I did not put it all together until I started Judo. I did not know the difference between a street fight, a boxing match on TV, or martial arts until I was 9.

I did not start buying martial arts magazines until my instructors were in them or on the cover. If I was instructed by X in a school with regular attendance or a seminar then I tried to learn about the art and people behind it, if it was an excellent school/instructor. I bought the magazines/books then. I cannot train with these folks forever so the best thing to do is to support their place in history.

In H.S. and college I was an avid reader/buyer of firearm, mercenary and military magazines. Soldier of Fortune was read at all hours 24x7x365 as I dreamed of combat. I signed up for a 6yr stint in the USMC in 86 and they bounced me on my ship date for the heart murmur due to it being a time of peace. Dreams die hard. Had to immediately throw down and go to college. Drs would not even recommend me going back to hard core lifting, martial arts, or my job for a decade, construction. Had to scrap everything that I had been involved in at that point of my life and start all over at 25.
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:53 am

Naperville wrote:
Sun Dec 18, 2022 10:42 pm
James Y wrote:
Sun Dec 18, 2022 10:14 pm
I did Judo and had been in Karate for a few years before I actually saw a Bruce Lee movie. I probably shouldn't have said I always admired Bruce Lee. He really wasn't my inspiration for taking up martial arts. I'd seen him as Kato in The Green Hornet on TV at age 3 or 4, which hadn't left an impression at that age. And I'd been aware of his movies in the early '70s, because a black kid at elementary school was always raving about "Ooooh, did you see Bruce Lee? Bruce Lee! He bad! He bad!", while he mimed doing spin kicks at the air for all to see.

I actually saw a Bruce Lee movie for the first time at age 16, in 1979; six years after he died. But I'd started reading about him in the martial arts magazines about a year earlier. It was actually a screening of Enter the Dragon at San Diego Comic Con. I was impressed with his screen presence, and his speed and technique. But I think I've always been more interested in his studies and views of the martial arts than I was in his movies.

BTW, my favorite Bruce Lee movie is Way of the Dragon. It's way more fun, and IMO, the fights are better than in his other films.

Jim
I like Way of the Dragon too.

You know I remember seeing him as Kato in the early 60's too, but it just didn't click with me at the time. Sure, I thought all the hand to hand combat was cool, but I did not put it all together until I started Judo. I did not know the difference between a street fight, a boxing match on TV, or martial arts until I was 9.

I did not start buying martial arts magazines until my instructors were in them or on the cover. If I was instructed by X in a school with regular attendance or a seminar then I tried to learn about the art and people behind it, if it was an excellent school/instructor. I bought the magazines/books then. I cannot train with these folks forever so the best thing to do is to support their place in history.

In H.S. and college I was an avid reader/buyer of firearm, mercenary and military magazines. Soldier of Fortune was read at all hours 24x7x365 as I dreamed of combat. I signed up for a 6yr stint in the USMC in 86 and they bounced me on my ship date for the heart murmur due to it being a time of peace. Dreams die hard. Had to immediately throw down and go to college. Drs would not even recommend me going back to hard core lifting, martial arts, or my job for a decade, construction. Had to scrap everything that I had been involved in at that point of my life and start all over at 25.

Sorry to hear about all the curves life has thrown at you. I hope your condition is able to improve to the point where you can do the things you love doing again. And most of all, to feel a lot better.

I actually bought my first Black Belt Magazine because my Kenpo teacher, Parker Linekin, was featured in an article. Early 1978, IIRC. I discovered the article by chance; AFAIK, he never mentioned that he was in a magazine to anybody, and for some reason I picked up that issue out of curiosity in a bookstore I used to frequent. Synchronicity?

When I saw Kato in The Green Hornet, it left no impression on me at all. My only impression of the show was that I thought it was similar to the Batman show, but not as colorful, nor as funny. The "Kung Fu" and the fighting didn't even register with me. I was too young. The only martial art I was aware of until age 8 was Judo, because when I was around 3, my older brother had to take Judo for awhile, and because some relatives also did it.

The first time I ever heard of Karate was seeing a board and brick breaking demo on TV (Wide World of Sports??) when I was 8. I wasn't too impressed. Then for a few years, I thought Karate was only chopping.

In hindsight, the demo on TV was probably done by Koreans, or by Japanese Kyokushin guys. Those were the ones who had the biggest fetish for breaking demos; most Japanese Karate styles like Shotokan, Shito-Ryo, etc., rarely if ever demonstrated breaking bricks and boards. I remember it was several rows of Asian men in gis and black belts, with the bricks or boards near the ground. One guy jumped up into the air and chopped down at the boards, which they replayed in slow motion. I thought Judo was better, because you get to throw people around, instead of breaking inanimate objects. Well, that was my first impression of Karate.

🙂

The first I heard of Kung Fu was people talking about the TV show, and I thought it was the character's (Caine's) name. Then people said it was a Chinese style of Karate called "Kung Fu Karate," which I thought was something made up for TV. And David Carradine's weak fighting only reinforced that impression for me. I hadn't known about anything other than Judo and Japanese Karate.

😄

Little did I know that one day I would study both Karate and Kung Fu systems extensively.

Edit to add:

I actually first heard of Karate around age 6 or 7, because of the Hai Karate men's cologne commercials that used to air on TV. But the first real demo I ever saw was that TV breaking demo. The Karate chops I'd seen on the Jonny Quest cartoon hadn't even registered with me until much later.

Jim

James Y
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Mon Dec 19, 2022 3:31 pm

Jim "Ronin" Harrison Biography

How did I forget to mention Jim Harrison among my long-time (and few) martial arts idols?

https://youtu.be/QXkbpbA7I_E

Jim

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Naperville
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby Naperville » Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:47 pm

Jim,

Japanese Kyokushin! Pretty neat art huh? When I was in my 30's I thought that it would be neat to go live in Japan and study that.

I suppose if we are going to go back in time as the other thread inquires, I might be found in a dojo in Japan studying Judo or Kyokushin. Two really great arts.
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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:54 am

Naperville wrote:
Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:47 pm
Jim,

Japanese Kyokushin! Pretty neat art huh? When I was in my 30's I thought that it would be neat to go live in Japan and study that.

I suppose if we are going to go back in time as the other thread inquires, I might be found in a dojo in Japan studying Judo or Kyokushin. Two really great arts.

Not a bad choice of arts at all, if one were to do that.

Jim

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Re: Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

Postby James Y » Tue Dec 20, 2022 4:58 pm

American Kenpo Karate - Fastest Hands

(2 videos below)

The most notable characteristic of Kenpo Karate is its high-speed combinations. As long as they are done with at least some 'whole body power' behind them, it is a great physical attribute to have.

Some of the problems I always had with the Kenpo self-defense combinations are:

* The training partner steps in and attacks in an unrealistic manner and with unrealistic positioning, then stands stationary while you do these complex series of combinations.

* Raw speed is completely different when striking air, and when actually striking a solid target (i.e., another human being). If the first blow is intending to cause damage, it will strike with intent and penetration; the weapon (say an edge-of-hand chop to the neck) will expend its energy into the target. This takes a split second, up to .5 second. Therefore, you cannot flow into the next strike without this split-second to .5 second pause. Making actual contact with real intent reduces raw speed. Even Bruce Lee could not have moved at the same legendary speed he did in his demos if he were making full-contact with an actual object.

If all you care is about flowing uninterrupted into the next strike, that first blow will either tap or graze the opponent (if your strike lands at all). It's very possible the entire combination will fall short of landing if you're only used to drilling them for speed a few inches from someone's face/neck/body.

* If the opponent doesn't stand still for you (in real life, nobody will stand still, whether they're attacking you, or if you're striking them), any prolonged, complicated, pre-set combination won't work. One must take into account the opponent's action and reaction.

* Many (not all!) Kenpo practitioners do their strikes using only ‘arm power’, without any rooting, torquing, whole-body force behind them.

* In actual self-defense, simplicity is king, regardless of which 'style' or 'system' you practice. Under the sudden stress of a real situation, fine motor skills go out the window in favor of gross motor movements. IMO, the most realistic pre-set striking combinations for real (outside of training and sport fighting) consist of up to 2 moves; 3 moves at most. And they must take into account that both you and the opponent will be in motion, so you must have the flexibility to alter it with the situation.

Unless, of course, if you're striking pre-emptively; in which case, the best option is one single, sneaky, highly-developed, and fully-committed strike (say, to the opponent's neck or jawline). If he blocks or avoids it, then you must flow into your next option. It depends on what the reaction is. Or else you could end up tapping him and flowing into the rest of some complex combination where the next move or strike is completely inappropriate relative to his reaction and positioning.

https://youtu.be/hfxhPyWhLtk

Dave Hebler, Bodyguard to Elvis Presley:

BTW, I always hated that song, ' Kung Fu Fighting'.

https://youtu.be/szM92dl6T5k

Jim


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