Favorite movie fight scenes

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twinboysdad
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#641

Post by twinboysdad »

What a story…thanks for sharing
James Y
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#642

Post by James Y »

“His Kicks Broke The Ribs Of Many Actors.” (John Liu)

Article and video below

I’m mainly posting this as an interesting example of how much inconsistent, sometimes questionable, and outright false information is out there about some martial artists, either of their own creation, or through incorrect assumptions by others. John Liu just happened to have been a kung fu movie star. This could have easily been posted in the “Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread.”

As mentioned in this micro-documentary, information about John Liu’s life is often contradictory. And there are also some flat-out falsehoods I’ve heard, NOT all coming from John Liu himself. The late Jeet Kune Do teacher and actor, John Ladalski, who had worked in one of John Liu’s films, had called John Liu “a man of many stories.”

Some “Kung Fu Cinema Experts” have stated that John Liu was born in South Korea (false). Others state Taiwan (possibly). What I’ve always heard and even seen John Liu himself claim was that he was born in Hawaii in 1944 (most likely). According to him, his father was Chinese and his mother was Japanese. But I’ve seen fellow old-school kicker Tan Tao-Liang, who taught John Liu his flexibility and kicking, state in Mandarin language during an interview, that Liu’s mom was of Shandong (a province in northeastern China) descent. Liu has also stated that his dad was a rocket scientist for NASA, which helped Liu get American citizenship. Hadn’t he already had that from being born in Hawaii? Also, NASA hadn’t started until 1958, supposedly after his parents were divorced and he and his mom were supposedly living in Okinawa. I think John Liu got his timelines wrong. He also claimed that his uncle was a Shaolin monk who began teaching him kung fu when he was a child in Hawaii. I don’t know about the “Shaolin monk” claim.

I DO NOT believe that John Liu earned a 3rd-degree black belt in Karate in Okinawa as a 14 year old kid. AFAIK, there were no junior black belts in the 1950s; and certainly not to 3rd degree, especially somewhere like Okinawa.

I DO NOT believe John Liu’s claim that Bruce Lee had asked him to be in Game of Death, or that Bruce Lee had even known about him.

We do know that John Liu met and even sparred with Chuck Norris in Paris, France in 1976, supposedly during a “battle of past champions.” It could also have been a simple sparring match during a seminar. Supposedly, the winner was decided by who got the biggest applause, and so John Liu won. Reportedly, he easily anticipated and countered Chuck Norris’s attacks, but since he’d actually been living and teaching in Paris, it’s possible that John Liu got a little hometown favoritism. Below is an article about the event with a publicity still and a magazine cover shot, from a (Greek?) martial arts publication:

 https://nasosmartialarts.blogspot.com/2 ... orris.html

It is true that sometime during the 1960s, John Liu and his mom left Okinawa and ended up living in Taiwan, and there his mom made him study Tae Kwon Do from Tan Tao-Liang to keep him out of trouble, due to bad influences; he had to cook and clean for Master Tan, which is odd, because John Liu is about 3 years older than Tan.

While in Taiwan, John Liu had challenged Zhang Kezhi (the same Master Zhang I mentioned sparring with in the “Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread”). Zhang was too quick and ended it with a single hard kick to John Liu’s torso. After which, John Liu reportedly followed Master Zhang around for a time, referring to him as “Big Brother.”

John Liu was very famous in Taiwan, where most of his movies were made, as well as in European martial arts circles of the time. Another falsehood (spread by others about him) is that John Liu is half-French. Wrong. He had moved to France in the early-to-mid 1970s because that’s where his wife at the time was from, but he wasn’t French, except for his citizenship.

https://youtu.be/M6Kmg9hNKac

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#643

Post by James Y »

Kuro-Obi (Black Belt; 2007, Japan). Director: Shunichi Nagasaki. Martial arts choreographer: Fuyuhiko Nishi. Action coordinator: Akihiro Noguchi.

Full movie. Japanese language, with English Subtitles.

I already posted a fight or two from this movie earlier in the thread, but decided that since, IMO, this is the best movie about Japanese Karate ever made, it deserves to be presented in its entirety.

The main Karateka featured are all genuine Karate experts; at least the first two are established Karate Sensei in real life. They are:

Akihito Yagi (7th dan, Meibukan Goju-ryu Karate)

Tatsuya Naka (7th dan, Shotokan Karate)

Yuji Suzuki (1st dan, Kyokushin Karate).

In this post, I am not highlighting the locations of the fight scenes.

https://youtu.be/w61nT38_M_g

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#644

Post by James Y »

“He Laid Five Security Guards On The Floor” (Dorian Tan, AKA Tan Tao-Liang)

Tan Tao-Liang (AKA Dorian Tan; AKA Delon Tan) was one of the best kickers in classic martial arts cinema, along with Hwang Jang-Lee, John Liu, Casanova Wong, Kwon Yung-Moon, and Kim Won-Jin. Of the lot, Tan Tao-Liang’s kicking form was probably the most picture-perfect; stills of his kicks from his movies could have been used in old-school Tae Kwon Do instructional books. He was also the man who taught fellow kung fu movie actor John Liu his flexibility and kicking skills. Other famous students of his included Jonathan Ke Quan (Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom; The Goonies, etc.), Shannon Lee (the daughter of Bruce Lee), Hong Kong actor Yuen Biao, among others.

Tan Tao-Liang was a Shandong Chinese who grew up in South Korea, where he trained in Tae Kwon Do, and he later relocated to Taiwan. During his time as an actor, the majority of his movies were filmed in Taiwan.

During the 1980s, after he retired from films, he moved to Los Angeles and opened a large and successful Tae Kwon Do academy in Monterey Park, which he operated for many years. I saw him in person at a large tournament in San Francisco in 1993, where several of his students, including his son, were competing, and they were very good. Sometime in the late ‘90s or early 2000s, he moved back to Taiwan.

The story in the video of his beating up five “security guards” in Taiwan is highly misleading. The real story is that in 2006, Tan Tao-Liang was with his son at a restaurant in either Taiwan or Hong Kong, and got drunk and was acting belligerent. Tan ended up beating on five restaurant staff, sending some to the hospital, and he got arrested for it. Five restaurant staff most likely meant some waiters, a bus boy and a manager, which is a far cry from “five security guards.” This video was originally put out by a Russian(?) woman, and her English subtitles, including some of her incorrect wording, were later dubbed over into English. I wish she had gotten her facts straight about the incident. She made him out to be the hero of the story, which he wasn’t. Then again, I suppose that saying he beat up five restaurant workers wouldn’t have sounded so heroic.

https://youtu.be/yPL0KijKP2E

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#645

Post by James Y »

Death Duel of Kung Fu (1979, Hong Kong; filmed entirely in South Korea). Director: William Chang Chi. Action directors: Chin Yuet-Sang & Meng Hoi.

Cast: Wong Tao, John Liu (AKA Liu Chung-Liang), Han Ying, Kim Jeong-Cha, Chan Yiu-Lam, Chung Fat, Lee King-Chu, Wu Chia-Hsiang, Peter Chan Lung, Chang Kung, Jang Bo-Yeong, etc.


Full movie. I posted some scenes from this movie much earlier in the thread, but have decided to post it in its entirety for anyone who might be interested. The reason I’m able to post this here now is because a scene (at approximately 19:47), where the female character (played by Kim Jeong-Cha) bears her breasts, has been deleted. IMO, this was Wong Tao’s best movie. It was also one of John Liu’s two best movies (IMO), along with The Invincible Armour. And it was the best movie for Han Ying (AKA Eagle Han), who played the arch-villain.

The main characters were played by a mix of actors of Chinese and Korean descent; arch-villain Han Ying and Kim Jeong-Cha, the actress who played the Japanese girl (the only female in the entire movie) were both Korean. Most of the extras were played by Koreans. IRL, John Liu was born in Hawaii and claims a mix of Chinese and Japanese descent, although he’s often listed as “Taiwanese,” because he lived in Taiwan for many years, and made most of his movies there. I only mention this because this movie was a unique contrast between the setting/time period and the actual film location, hairstyles, etc., that I’ll mention later.

Set in China’s Fukien (AKA Fujian) Province, but filmed in South Korea, Death Duel of Kung Fu is a very simple story set in approximately 1661, during the early Qing (Ching, or Manchu) Dynasty. Wong Tao’s character is a Ming patriot attempting to deliver the head of a field marshal he assassinated to General Zheng Chenggong (AKA Koxinga, a real-life historical figure) in Taiwan. Han Ying is appointed by the Manchu government to stop him, and John Liu is a spy whose position appears to be ambiguous. Based on the concept in the Secret Rivals movies (the first of which also starred Wong Tao and John Liu), the two main protagonists/rivals are a “Southern Fist” (southern-style hand specialist, played by Wong Tao) and a “Northern Leg” (northern-style kicking specialist, played by John Liu); and a seemingly unbeatable arch-villain, who possesses both superior hand and kicking skills, and who can defeat either fighter in a one-on-one fight.

The fight choreography in this movie is heavily stylized, including some meaningless acrobatics by the lead characters (which were actually stunt doubled by choreographers Chin Yuet-Sang and Meng Hoi) put into the middle of fights. The reason was to show the complexity of movements clearly for the camera, and to highlight the characters’ athleticism. It wasn’t meant to be realistic, and it requires a suspension of disbelief, like ANY martial arts or action movie. Equally unrealistic are the late-1970s hairstyles of Wong Tao, John Liu, and Chan Yiu-Lam, who played the “Captain of the Guard.” Note: Chan Yiu-Lam was 007 Roger Moore’s opponent in the karate school scene in The Man With The Golden Gun. Fans of old-school kung fu movies should have no problem suspending their disbelief, and will probably enjoy the movie.

This movie has very few main characters, but they still made it work. The stunt actors who played the two swordsmen with the ‘70s hairstyles (Chung Fat and Lee King-Chu), who attack Wong Tao in a field early in the movie, also played “The Royal Guards” during the rest of the movie. Chung Fat was an acrobatic stuntman in countless kung fu films, but was probably best known to filmgoers in the West as the guard who got squeezed to death by muscleman Bolo Yeung in Enter the Dragon.

The soundtrack was “borrowed” from two Clint Eastwood films: Hang ‘Em High, and The Gauntlet. However, in many ways, the music tracks work for dramatic effect much better in this movie than they did in the movies they were made for.

https://youtu.be/xM7B8pq_Sn0

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#646

Post by James Y »

Scary Movie 3 (2003, USA). Director: David Zucker.

Charlie Sheen vs Michael Jackson (Edward Moss):

https://youtu.be/zAeofWDUArU

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#647

Post by Co Pilot »

I apologize if any of these have been listed before, I'vr been keeping up wiyh this thread but don'y know if I've read every page.
1. Die Hard (the first one). The fight between Bruce Willis and Alexander Godunuv (a ballet dancer I believe!) is almost never commented on in my experience, probably because it's over shadowed by the other stunts in the movie. It is, unusually for Hollywood, pretty brutal,realistic, and doesn't seem to have alot of fancy martial art moves.Except for the way it ends it looks a lot closer to real fights I've seen and been in then most of fight scenes in movies.

2. The Bourne series. Each one has a kind of "center piece fight" in addition to the other fights throughout. The "center piece fight" in each one is outstanding. Jeff Imada, a Filipino ma/JKD (and who knows what else) practioner and long time well known, in Hollywood, is the fight coordinator/choreographer listed on the last two. Damon Caro is listed as such for the first one, which has some fights which seem to have been sped up or shot in a manner that makes it difficult to even tell what is happening. But the "center piece fight" in Bourne Paris apartment is very well done.

3. The Last Of The Mohicans. Directed by Michael Mann. All the fights in the movie. Perhaps not accurate, I don't have any idea how Native Americans fought then. Especially an imaginary tribe. Mann is known as a stickler for accuracy and putting his actors through training for their roles, usually firearms and tactics training for his other films. For this the lead Daniel Day Lewis went to train with some primitive survival instructors for several weeks. There are some excellent videos about it on utube. Don't know if they taught him or coordinated the fights.

4. Rapid Fire. I'm pretty sure this was mentioned previously. Jeff Imada was once again the fight coordinato/coreographer. And again the fights are excellent. Brandon Lee is incredible to watch as his "fight body language" is like watching his dad. I believe Brandon was training with FMA/JKD practioners including Danny Inosanto and his academy either for the film or before.Danny Inosanto was of course a friend and training partner of Bruce Lee's. I tend to think of these fights as the ones Bruce would have eventually done. They really showcase the JKD idea. And not flashy Kung Fu. Watch for the many low line kicks, kuch more street real than any flashy above the waist kicks.

4. The Blade movies. All the fights. Including the last movie which wasn't as good as the first two. Why are the third films always the worst? This, The Matrix, The Godfather.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#648

Post by Co Pilot »

Forgot Lethal Weapon, again the first one. The rest are garbage and not just the fights, they just devolved into cartoons. I remember reading a GQ article about the film which said that Mel Gibson trained for three months prior to the film in Brazilizn jiu jitsu with the Gracie's, capoeira (spelling?), and a very unusual martial art called jail house rock. Yes the last one is or was real.Invented by a martial artist who went to prison and had to come up with a way to fight in confined spaces, so a lot of elbows,knees and head butts, the last of which are seen throughout the movie. And are arguably effective irl, if done correctly. Probably one of the only films to show the use of them so prominently and often. This art is showcased in the scene where Mel Gibson bursts through the door into the room where Danny Glover is being tortured and goes through several men very quickly. An excellent scene overshadowed by the final fight between Gibson and Gary Busey.
The final fight between Gibson and Busey was also excellent and features elements of all three arts. Alledgedly choreogrphed by Rorion Gracie, at least in part. And he also alledgedly doubled Gibson in the fight for several scenes where they are back lit and obviously being doubled.
A side story, the Gracies were just starting their challenge to fight anyone and not be defeated, yes this is pretty much how MMA started, and their academy's phone number was in the article! As a young man with some MA training I called them to find out about this unbeatable art. I spoke to Rorion himself about the art and the possibility of them starting a school in NYC where I lived. He was extremely nice and spent quite awhile on the phone with me. This was in 1986 way before they became famous.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#649

Post by James Y »

Thanks for posting these, Co Pilot!

Dan Inosanto was a student of Bruce Lee, but he was also the man who taught Bruce the nunchaku.

It's a shame that Brandon Lee never lived to reach his full potential as an actor. I think he would have been a better dramatic actor than a screen fighter. He showed some of the same onscreen mannerisms of his father, but had nowhere near Bruce's martial arts or screen fighting talent.

Jim
Last edited by James Y on Wed Dec 08, 2021 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#650

Post by Co Pilot »

You're very welcome James, thanks for starting an interesting and entertaining thread. Any thoughts on those scenes?
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#651

Post by Co Pilot »

James I was aware he taught him the nunchaku, and I would guess some FMA? So I guess that makes them each others students? Though from everything I know Dan Inosanto Is way to modest to phrase it that way and I don't think he ever has. The imbodiment of humble, considering himself an ongoing student. Considering his mastery of many arts I find that very impressive and inspirational.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#652

Post by James Y »

You're welcome, too. Glad you are enjoying the thread! I just added a bit of a comment on Rapid Fire/ Brandon Lee in my last post.

I've actually seen all of those movies, and liked most but the last Bourne movie, which I think sucked.

I really liked the first Blade movie, but the sequels were way inferior tithe first one.

The Last of the Mohicans was very good, though I only saw it once, back in the 90s.

Lethal Weapon was good, and I remembered those scenes. I only saw that once, too, when it was released. I later learned of Rorion Gracie's involvement. I first heard about the Gracies in a martial arts magazine in the late 80s, a few years before they started the first UFC, which, IIRC, was actually called The Ultimate Challenge.

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#653

Post by James Y »

Co Pilot wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 3:02 pm
James I was aware he taught him the nunchaku, and I would guess some FMA? So I guess that makes them each others students? Though from everything I know Dan Inosanto Is way to modest to phrase it that way and I don't think he ever has. The imbodiment of humble, considering himself an ongoing student. Considering his mastery of many arts I find that very impressive and inspirational.

Yes, Dan Inosanto is both impressive and inspirational! I saw him in person in 1982 at UC Irvine, where he and a few other famous martial artists were giving week-long seminars. He was teaching FMA, but I was training "full-contact Karate" (kickboxing) at the time under Bill "Superfoot" Wallace. Mr. Inosanto gave an empty-hands and weapons demo during one of the nightly demos the various teachers gave for all participants, and his skill was remarkable. And he was humble, almost to the point of being self-effacing, yet was still fully self-confident.

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#654

Post by Naperville »

James Y wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 2:49 pm
Thanks for posting these, Co Pilot!

Dan Inosanto was a student of Bruce Lee, but he was also the man who taught Bruce the nunchaku.

It's a shame that Brandon Lee never lived to reach his full potential as an actor. I think he would have been a better dramatic actor than a screen fighter. He showed some of the same onscreen mannerisms of his father, but had nowhere near Bruce's martial arts or screen fighting talent.

Jim
I was just rereading some of the posts.

Dan Inosanto may have also taught Bruce Lee the arts of Escrima and Arnis....double sticks, double knives.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

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Post by Naperville »

James Y wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 3:13 pm
Co Pilot wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 3:02 pm
James I was aware he taught him the nunchaku, and I would guess some FMA? So I guess that makes them each others students? Though from everything I know Dan Inosanto Is way to modest to phrase it that way and I don't think he ever has. The imbodiment of humble, considering himself an ongoing student. Considering his mastery of many arts I find that very impressive and inspirational.

Yes, Dan Inosanto is both impressive and inspirational! I saw him in person in 1982 at UC Irvine, where he and a few other famous martial artists were giving week-long seminars. He was teaching FMA, but I was training "full-contact Karate" (kickboxing) at the time under Bill "Superfoot" Wallace. Mr. Inosanto gave an empty-hands and weapons demo during one of the nightly demos the various teachers gave for all participants, and his skill was remarkable. And he was humble, almost to the point of being self-effacing, yet was still fully self-confident.

Jim
I did not meet Dan Inosanto until around 2002 in an FMA seminar in Stockton, CA that Bahala Na was holding for the area.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#656

Post by Co Pilot »

James, you are right about the suckatude of the sequels mentioned, but the fight scenes were still very good, especially the last Bourne thanks to Jeff Imada. And also Matt Damon who I understand trained extremely hard for all movies. That's why it was so hard to get him back for the 4th, Jason Bourne, he said many times he couldn't do it and was too old. He managed to get in great shape, but if that's the "last" one you mean, yeah it REALLY sucked.

Last Of The Mohicans is definitely worth a rewatch, fantastic movie all around. The cinematograhy, sound and music alone are outstanding. Especially the music used for the fight scenes, really gets your blood going.

Lethal Weapon is probably worth a rewatch to, good movie, good fights. Sadly they totally gave up on that in the neverending sequels. Looked like Gibson didn't train at all and the movies just got sillier.

I never had the pleasure of meeting Guro Inosanto, but have heard those things about him and seen it in videos of him.
I trained in Pekiti Tirsia Kali under Tuhon Bill Mgrath and met and got to train under Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje,an extroidnary gentleman and very lethal. Deceptively so thanks to his age at the time and stature.

Thanks for the responses to you and Naperville, have enjoyed both of your prior comments and learned much from them.
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#657

Post by James Y »

Co Pilot wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 4:09 pm
James, you are right about the suckatude of the sequels mentioned, but the fight scenes were still very good, especially the last Bourne thanks to Jeff Imada. And also Matt Damon who I understand trained extremely hard for all movies. That's why it was so hard to get him back for the 4th, Jason Bourne, he said many times he couldn't do it and was too old. He managed to get in great shape, but if that's the "last" one you mean, yeah it REALLY sucked.

Last Of The Mohicans is definitely worth a rewatch, fantastic movie all around. The cinematograhy, sound and music alone are outstanding. Especially the music used for the fight scenes, really gets your blood going.

Lethal Weapon is probably worth a rewatch to, good movie, good fights. Sadly they totally gave up on that in the neverending sequels. Looked like Gibson didn't train at all and the movies just got sillier.

I never had the pleasure of meeting Guro Inosanto, but have heard those things about him and seen it in videos of him.
I trained in Pekiti Tirsia Kali under Tuhon Bill Mgrath and met and got to train under Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje,an extroidnary gentleman and very lethal. Deceptively so thanks to his age at the time and stature.

Thanks for the responses to you and Naperville, have enjoyed both of your prior comments and learned much from them.

Thank you for your comments, and yes, I meant the last Bourne movie a few years ago. It was terrible! Sometimes (most of the time?) it’s better if a movie is a one-off, IMO. Just like the ‘Taken’ movies. There are VERY FEW movie sequels that are anywhere near as good as the original.

I wish I had studied FMA. The only FMA I ever sampled was a bit of modern Arnis at a seminar taught by Remy Presas in 1981 or early 1982. At the time, I hadn’t appreciated it as much, and I was more into kickboxing at the time.

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#658

Post by Co Pilot »

James, especially the third ones! In movies third time is not the charm. Seems guarenteed.

As far as FMA, never to late and all that. In Ca. you have perhaps the largest number of schools, including the Inosanto Academy, don't know if that's near you. I think you'd really like it. A lot of it seems to translate to other arts and they're not so rigid in their teaching methods. Quite the opposite in my experience. As I was told in Pikiti they go for a kind of imersion method to open your mind, if that makes sense.
It's also a very complete art, including many weapons, empty hand, kicks(all low line and a lot like Thai kick boxing), and even grappling which most people don't even realize is in FMA.

And of course it is very street relevant if that matters.

Nick
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#659

Post by James Y »

Co Pilot wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 6:47 pm
James, especially the third ones! In movies third time is not the charm. Seems guarenteed.

As far as FMA, never to late and all that. In Ca. you have perhaps the largest number of schools, including the Inosanto Academy, don't know if that's near you. I think you'd really like it. A lot of it seems to translate to other arts and they're not so rigid in their teaching methods. Quite the opposite in my experience. As I was told in Pikiti they go for a kind of imersion method to open your mind, if that makes sense.
It's also a very complete art, including many weapons, empty hand, kicks(all low line and a lot like Thai kick boxing), and even grappling which most people don't even realize is in FMA.

And of course it is very street relevant if that matters.

Nick

Thanks, Nick.

Although I do greatly admire and respect the FMA, as far as actually learning or incorporating a new system, at this point in my life, I have enough. It’s just one of the few things I wish I’d done when younger. The last “new” art I took up was BJJ, which I discontinued in 2009. Now I still do my martial arts training, based around my Choy Lee Fut system, which is very practical if taught right, but I’ve had to make adjustments around a chronic injury. My training has worked in real SD situations, but now my main focus is looking at what I’ve done over the decades and tweaking and individualizing everything even more, to make it even more efficient for myself (meaning the way that works best for me may not work as well for someone else).

BTW, when my Choy Lee Fut Sifu still lived in L.A. back in the ‘70s, he and Dan Inosanto knew each other.

Also back in the ‘70s, my Kenpo teacher also trained and taught FMA, as well as boxing, Kung Fu, Jujutsu, etc. and he incorporated everything during sparring, and was highly effective with it. He was MMA before “MMA” was appropriated to mean only the sport of MMA. But I wasn’t interested in the FMA aspect as a separate art at the time. Yes indeed, there is a lot of FMA in CA.

This all would probably be better discussed in the Martial Arts Experiences thread, but it’s all good.

Much appreciate your comments.

Jim
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Re: Favorite movie fight scenes

#660

Post by Co Pilot »

James, yes I was thinking I had derailed into the Martial Arts Experiences thread! Sorry. Maybe see you over there,
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