9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

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shunsui
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#41

Post by shunsui »

Here's a little something you can do with an aftermarket barrel and a stronger spring.

https://youtu.be/zbg6Ll85l8k

And if that's not enough...

https://youtu.be/AhGM0hhsGEg
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#42

Post by Evil D »

Extra330SC wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 12:07 pm

This is mostly for entertainment value...but how about pig heads? :eek:
This reminds me of an incident when I was a teen, one of my neighbors' sons was graduating and they were having a hog roast and decided to go with a live hog.

Now, this is fairly out in the country where most families hunt deer and such. So processing an animal isn't rocket science, but apparently killing it was too much for these people. The first suggestion was to wench him up and slit his throat. Nobody had the balls for that so the dad decided to shoot the hog in the head...with a .22 pistol. Pigs are pretty well known for having very thick skulls, so of course the bullet bounced right off and wounded him but not enough to kill him. Eventually someone came over and shot him in the heart with a rifle of I don't know what caliber probably a 30.06, but the whole ordeal was a mess.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#43

Post by Doc Dan »

Evil D wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 pm
Extra330SC wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 12:07 pm

This is mostly for entertainment value...but how about pig heads? :eek:
This reminds me of an incident when I was a teen, one of my neighbors' sons was graduating and they were having a hog roast and decided to go with a live hog.

Now, this is fairly out in the country where most families hunt deer and such. So processing an animal isn't rocket science, but apparently killing it was too much for these people. The first suggestion was to wench him up and slit his throat. Nobody had the balls for that so the dad decided to shoot the hog in the head...with a .22 pistol. Pigs are pretty well known for having very thick skulls, so of course the bullet bounced right off and wounded him but not enough to kill him. Eventually someone came over and shot him in the heart with a rifle of I don't know what caliber probably a 30.06, but the whole ordeal was a mess.
You mean COUNTRY people acted like this? All of the people that lived in the country when I was growing up would never have had an issue with this. Now, this new generation is something else, again. They do not have to survive, just sit around and talk in a made up country accent, and pretend to be country. Even "Country" Music is not good anymore. It is pop music with a twang and most of it is pretty poor. It used to be that Country Music was about stuff that mattered to people, talking about troubles, affairs, love, marriage, death, sorrow, etc. Now it is about who is the toughest in a bar fight, love songs with no content or feeling, and just plainly pitiful.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#44

Post by Evil D »

Doc Dan wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:39 pm
Evil D wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 pm
Extra330SC wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 12:07 pm

This is mostly for entertainment value...but how about pig heads? :eek:
This reminds me of an incident when I was a teen, one of my neighbors' sons was graduating and they were having a hog roast and decided to go with a live hog.

Now, this is fairly out in the country where most families hunt deer and such. So processing an animal isn't rocket science, but apparently killing it was too much for these people. The first suggestion was to wench him up and slit his throat. Nobody had the balls for that so the dad decided to shoot the hog in the head...with a .22 pistol. Pigs are pretty well known for having very thick skulls, so of course the bullet bounced right off and wounded him but not enough to kill him. Eventually someone came over and shot him in the heart with a rifle of I don't know what caliber probably a 30.06, but the whole ordeal was a mess.
You mean COUNTRY people acted like this? All of the people that lived in the country when I was growing up would never have had an issue with this. Now, this new generation is something else, again. They do not have to survive, just sit around and talk in a made up country accent, and pretend to be country. Even "Country" Music is not good anymore. It is pop music with a twang and most of it is pretty poor. It used to be that Country Music was about stuff that mattered to people, talking about troubles, affairs, love, marriage, death, sorrow, etc. Now it is about who is the toughest in a bar fight, love songs with no content or feeling, and just plainly pitiful.

I read that post again, and just wanted to make sure it was clear that when I said "dad" I was talking about the neighbor dad, not my own lol.

But yeah these people should have known better. Several people even told him you can't shoot a pig in the head, it would take a powerful rifle at close range to get through but he insisted that a .22 at point blank range would do it. He's really lucky it didn't come back and hit him.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#45

Post by Doc Dan »

Evil D wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:29 am
Doc Dan wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:39 pm
Evil D wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 pm
Extra330SC wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 12:07 pm

This is mostly for entertainment value...but how about pig heads? :eek:
This reminds me of an incident when I was a teen, one of my neighbors' sons was graduating and they were having a hog roast and decided to go with a live hog.

Now, this is fairly out in the country where most families hunt deer and such. So processing an animal isn't rocket science, but apparently killing it was too much for these people. The first suggestion was to wench him up and slit his throat. Nobody had the balls for that so the dad decided to shoot the hog in the head...with a .22 pistol. Pigs are pretty well known for having very thick skulls, so of course the bullet bounced right off and wounded him but not enough to kill him. Eventually someone came over and shot him in the heart with a rifle of I don't know what caliber probably a 30.06, but the whole ordeal was a mess.
You mean COUNTRY people acted like this? All of the people that lived in the country when I was growing up would never have had an issue with this. Now, this new generation is something else, again. They do not have to survive, just sit around and talk in a made up country accent, and pretend to be country. Even "Country" Music is not good anymore. It is pop music with a twang and most of it is pretty poor. It used to be that Country Music was about stuff that mattered to people, talking about troubles, affairs, love, marriage, death, sorrow, etc. Now it is about who is the toughest in a bar fight, love songs with no content or feeling, and just plainly pitiful.

I read that post again, and just wanted to make sure it was clear that when I said "dad" I was talking about the neighbor dad, not my own lol.

But yeah these people should have known better. Several people even told him you can't shoot a pig in the head, it would take a powerful rifle at close range to get through but he insisted that a .22 at point blank range would do it. He's really lucky it didn't come back and hit him.
I will say that there is not much better eating than a pig slow roasted over a slow smokey fire. It makes my mouth water just to think of it.

I've known of big hogs that shrugged off .45's and even .44 mags. They can be tough critters, though I have seen them put down with a .22 LR with a shot to the right place (and not head on).
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#46

Post by Evil D »

Doc Dan wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:39 am

I will say that there is not much better eating than a pig slow roasted over a slow smokey fire. It makes my mouth water just to think of it.

I've known of big hogs that shrugged off .45's and even .44 mags. They can be tough critters, though I have seen them put down with a .22 LR with a shot to the right place (and not head on).

I'm all about a nice big ribeye steak but a hog roast done right is magical.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#47

Post by Doc Dan »

Evil D wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 7:26 am
Doc Dan wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:39 am

I will say that there is not much better eating than a pig slow roasted over a slow smokey fire. It makes my mouth water just to think of it.

I've known of big hogs that shrugged off .45's and even .44 mags. They can be tough critters, though I have seen them put down with a .22 LR with a shot to the right place (and not head on).

I'm all about a nice big ribeye steak but a hog roast done right is magical.
Ribeye, beef, if it is American beef, is the best there is. I love American beef. I have eaten beef from around the world and nothing is as good as American beef. I have friends from other countries that hate beef...that is, except when they come to America and the first stop is to buy a good steak.

I have never tried to shoot a bovine with a handgun. I wonder how that would turn out? They are rather big. Once, my cousin and I were hunting rabbits out in the cow pasture and came upon a dead cow all swollen with gas as it had been dead for some time. My cousin walked near it and I could not resist popping that swollen cow with my shotgun. HaHaha! It stank to high heaven! It smelled so bad it was all over his clothes. I had to run fast to keep from getting clobbered! Hahaha!
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#48

Post by MichaelScott »

Long ago when we raised our own meat, we would butcher two pigs every year. I always shot them half way between the eye and the ear hole with a .22 Magnum. It only took one.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#49

Post by OldHoosier62 »

I've killed a lot of hogs, both wild and domesticated.

In the wild, I carry a 4in 44 magnum with 240gr hard cast solids because you never know what shot the hog will give you and these WILL penetrate with a head on skull shot.

In the barn lot its usually a 4in 22LR Ruger Single-Six full of CCI Blaser 40gr solids. As Michael said above, halfway between the eye and ear does the trick. As does a behind the ear shot if the hog won't cooperate. Same with cattle, sheep and whatever else wanders into the farm.

As I keep telling people...it's all about where you hit, not what you hit with. With that being said, I carry the 10mm (the real 40 caliber), 44spl and magnum or 45ACP about 85% of the time. I don't anticipate any protracted gunfights so a high capacity 9mm is not in my carry lineup. I carry what I do because I'm infinitely comfortable with them and confident in their abilities to protect me from anything I may encounter....2 legged or 4 legged.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#50

Post by Doc Dan »

In the slaughter house back home they used a .22 to put down hogs and cows, but they were close and penned up.

BTW, no one should doubt that a .380 with the right ammunition can be a good choice. It has proven itself to me and to millions. Fairbairn told of someone being shot with a .380 and the bullet going completely through the body (FMJ likely) and of a man being shot 7 times with a .45 ACP and having to be beaten with the empty gun to finally be stopped. Sometimes, even with good shot placement, people are not immediately stopped. (And do not listen to that Philippines stuff. True the 38 Colts were very weak (not Special) but the stories you hear about the "45" in the Philippines have the cartridge doing things even a 30-06 could not do. No doubt it is a good and proven caliber, but handguns are weak. We always see on TV where the person gets shot in the vest and knocked out, broken bones, etc. from a handgun. Hogwash! Never happened. One Vest maker shoots himself with a .44 Mag with no ill effects. Many people have been shot and did not realize it.)
I Pray Heaven to Bestow The Best of Blessing on THIS HOUSE, and on ALL that shall hereafter Inhabit it. May none but Honest and Wise Men ever rule under This Roof! (John Adams regarding the White House)

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Live pure, speak true, right wrong, follow the King--
Else, wherefore born?" (Tennyson)



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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#51

Post by Crux »

I used to carry a .380 +P+ Buffalo Bore rounds and I think it's a decent defense round but I couldn't find one with a trigger that I liked. I finally ended up moving back to 9mm with the SA XDs 3.3 9mm and even with that I upgraded the trigger. I need a trigger that won't drive me crazy.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#52

Post by OldHoosier62 »

Doc Dan wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:22 pm
In the slaughter house back home they used a .22 to put down hogs and cows, but they were close and penned up.

BTW, no one should doubt that a .380 with the right ammunition can be a good choice. It has proven itself to me and to millions. Fairbairn told of someone being shot with a .380 and the bullet going completely through the body (FMJ likely) and of a man being shot 7 times with a .45 ACP and having to be beaten with the empty gun to finally be stopped. Sometimes, even with good shot placement, people are not immediately stopped. (And do not listen to that Philippines stuff. True the 38 Colts were very weak (not Special) but the stories you hear about the "45" in the Philippines have the cartridge doing things even a 30-06 could not do. No doubt it is a good and proven caliber, but handguns are weak. We always see on TV where the person gets shot in the vest and knocked out, broken bones, etc. from a handgun. Hogwash! Never happened. One Vest maker shoots himself with a .44 Mag with no ill effects. Many people have been shot and did not realize it.)
As I said...It's where you put the bullet, not the size of the hole. Anecdotal evidence aside, current loads of the major calibers has significantly closed the "power gap" for social encounters. Even just 10 years ago this was not the case with the 125gr Remington 357 magnum load being the king of the hill for at least 10 years to my recollection followed closely by the Federal 45ACP 230gr Hydra-Shock load....both rated on the high 80% one-shot-stop data from the FBI stats. Today several different loads available from several manufacturers ranging 9mm thru 45acp all rate in the 80+% range. And they do it through bullet construction combined with optimal velocities for the given task...be it hunting or defense. A good defensive load is very easy to find these days in almost any caliber. The old stories from yesteryear still linger but a little research shows that they are irrelevant in today's world.

Today's task is putting together a carry package that is.....in no particular order..... A. Controllable, B. Reliable, C. Accurate, D. Concealable

And I agree about HollyWeird....the created some of the worst firearms myths and do everything they can to continue pushing these lies as fact. I believe it is to assist their gun grabbing political friends.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#53

Post by Doc Dan »

Here is a good indication of energy levels:

Image

(22 cal bullet)
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#54

Post by Crux »

OldHoosier62 wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:06 pm
As I said...It's where you put the bullet, not the size of the hole.
Isn't that the crux of it all? Which caliber best allows more chances to put that bullet where you want it at 10-20 feet?

A .22? Hardly. Assassins love this caliber but usually the shot is taken from less than an inch away. You can also be killed with a wooden toothpick at that same distance. Guns and their calibers are tools, find the right one for the purpose you need it for and stop hammering nails with a pipe wrench. :rolleyes:
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#55

Post by OldHoosier62 »

Crux wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:55 pm
OldHoosier62 wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:06 pm
As I said...It's where you put the bullet, not the size of the hole.
Isn't that the crux of it all? Which caliber best allows more chances to put that bullet where you want it at 10-20 feet?

A .22? Hardly. Assassins love this caliber but usually the shot is taken from less than an inch away. You can also be killed with a wooden toothpick at that same distance. Guns and their calibers are tools, find the right one for the purpose you need it for and stop hammering nails with a pipe wrench. :rolleyes:
Pretty sure I mentioned Major caliber in the first line. Nobody is talking about a .22 for SD. My low end caliber recommendation for a SD caliber has always been 380acp but with the proliferation of ultra compact 9mm pistols these days I wouldn't bother with it anymore. The gist of the post you quoted was that all the major calibers are within a very few percentage points of each other in the stopping power ratings these days due to advancements in bullet design paired with velocities for optimum expansion/damage in the target. Jacket thickness at critical points designed to expand consistently, weight and density of the lead alloy formulated to give the best upset upon impact but stay together as a single mass when driven at the correct velocity....it's all about the technology these days.

Have a wonderful Easter.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#56

Post by shunsui »

No carry permits here. Who's worried about overpenetration ?

https://youtu.be/7HuVkXLreWE

Now for a little overkill. Who thinks 9 slugs would move you back on your heels ?

https://youtu.be/KGkADFor0ec
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#57

Post by OldHoosier62 »

[https://youtu.be/T6kUvi72s0Y]

One of the best explanations of handgun, and long gun, ballistics I have found. Straight from the people who build your ammo.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#58

Post by Knife1 »

Crux wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:53 pm
I should say again that the Luger 9mm in respect to the .45 acp has these distinct and undisputed advantages. Longer range, more accurate, more carry rounds, smaller lighter handgun, less cost and most importantly relatively similar takedown results in the realistic actual shoot range of 15'-20', despite the .45 acp causing considerably more damage.
I'm curious, how was takedown similar if the 45 acp caused considerably more damage? And in what way did the 45 acp cause considerably more damage?
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#59

Post by RustyIron »

Alec Baldwin prefers .45 Long Colt.
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Re: 9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

#60

Post by MacLaren »

I carry .45 auto and .357 magnum
Seems like people really like to argue for 9mm
That's okay. You can carry a lot of those.
But, an Atlanta PD Swat Team member with over 30 years of experience in law enforcement ( and can't remember the exact article - not gonna try and di it up either ) but he said he has seen people shot with 9mm, .357 magnum etc - can't even remember what he said about. 45 auto but, he did say that and, it's true that a lot of people hyped up on drugs will keep coming when shot with 9mm. But, he said that every time people shot with a .357 magnum, they went out like a candle.
That .357 magnum like .45 auto has that "Shock " factor, that kinetic bone busting energy.
So, unless I feel extremely confident in getting off a head shot every time with a 9mm there's that chance I'll get killed. So, I trust my life to .45 auto and .357 magnum.
Another round I would use is .357 sig.
According to VA animal control, when they used 9mm it would usually take more than 1 shot to put the animal down. But, with .357 sig it was always one.
Again, Shock and kinetic energy.
I realize that this post will be torn to shreads about using the right 9mm ammo and just how incredibly effective it is. And , all the stats about just how effective they really are compared to 45 auto and 357 magnum. That's fine. Choose whatever you like.
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