9mm vs 40 S&W vs 45 ACP

[Cowboyfromhell]

I remember reading about first hand accounts of er doctors and survivors of gunshot wounds and they all said that the .45 was the most devastating to the body. Big holes don't close back up and loss of extreme amounts of blood. Just saying...

[JRinFL]

I’ve read the opposite, that doctors and medical examiners have trouble telling the calibers apart based on wounds alone. Rimfire and shotgun excluded, of course.

[Doc Dan]

Yes. The differences in calibers are mostly in people's minds based upon myth and legend. The difference between a 9mm/357 and a .45 is .10. That's it. A minuscule amount. What does the damage is energy and speed and penetration. Pure physics.

When it comes to 9mm, .38 Special, .357 mag, and .45 ACP round nosed ball ammunition, they all poke holes nearly the same size. The .357 might do extra damage due to the energy. But that is it. The old myths of the .45 solving the Moro issue in the Philippines is silly. The myth has the .45 doing what even a .30-06 could not do. Silly.

[soc_monki]

I like my 9. And my 556. They're all I need.

[TomAiello]

Not a hunter, soc_monki?

I agree that for SD or HD, the caliber debate is pretty unnecessary. Any common caliber with decent ammunition will get the job done.

[Doc Dan]

W.E. Fairbairn related that both his officers, and the criminals alike, feared the 7.62x25 more than any other cartridge. Speed kills. At 1540 to 1800 fps, this is a serious cartridge. This little round was so devastating a hit to an arm or leg would often mean the loss of that limb. They did not fear the .45acp so much.

When he had his men practice getting shot at, he had them cover behind a steel shield. He reported that the hardest hits were not the big and slow, but the smaller and much faster rounds.

[soc_monki]

Not a hunter, soc_monki?

I agree that for SD or HD, the caliber debate is pretty unnecessary. Any common caliber with decent ammunition will get the job done.

Nope, unless you count squirrels and other small vermin. Pests. For those I have a 177 pellet gun since I live in the city limits 2 blocks away from the police station. I don't think they'd be very happy if I popped off a pistol or rifle for squirrels! Still have to be careful if I use the pellet rifle. It's surprisingly powerful and I would not want to fire it at a house or in anyone's general direction.

If I did decide to hunt I could take my 556...Mississippi doesn't prohibit using a 223/556 cartridge last I checked. I'd have to be sure when taking the shot though, because I'm sure if I missed the head or vitals the deer would suffer. Wouldn't even try on a hog...

Still need to get myself a shotgun.

[Snacktime]

W.E. Fairbairn related that both his officers, and the criminals alike, feared the 7.62x25 more than any other cartridge. Speed kills. At 1540 to 1800 fps, this is a serious cartridge. This little round was so devastating a hit to an arm or leg would often mean the loss of that limb. They did not fear the .45acp so much.

When he had his men practice getting shot at, he had them cover behind a steel shield. He reported that the hardest hits were not the big and slow, but the smaller and much faster rounds.

That's the steel core tokarev! Supper fun to shoot others steel targets with! Not really a round that has seen modern bullets design. Definitely king of the Saturday Night Specials.

[Doc Dan]

W.E. Fairbairn related that both his officers, and the criminals alike, feared the 7.62x25 more than any other cartridge. Speed kills. At 1540 to 1800 fps, this is a serious cartridge. This little round was so devastating a hit to an arm or leg would often mean the loss of that limb. They did not fear the .45acp so much.

When he had his men practice getting shot at, he had them cover behind a steel shield. He reported that the hardest hits were not the big and slow, but the smaller and much faster rounds.

That's the steel core tokarev! Supper fun to shoot others steel targets with! Not really a round that has seen modern bullets design. Definitely king of the Saturday Night Specials.

n
Not steel core in the USA, though. They are illegal. They are lead core with mild steel jackets with copper wash. It is a powerful round. I have no idea why the 7.62x25 hasn't gotten more attention from bullet makers and why it is not more popular. With the right bullet, it is a real penetrator, maybe over penetrator. With a modern hollow point it would be devastating. No need for a .357 sig.

[Co Pilot]

I just signed up and admit I haven't read the whole thread, so sorry if this has already been said. Massad Ayoob wrote something years ago about traveling the US and the world. About how only certain ammo for certain calibers was available in certain places. A point he made back then was that the preffered 9mm rounds were 115 grain +p+ jhps, and weren't available everywhere. Yes it was awhile ago, 90s probably. I thing this is very relavent still, even before the ammo shortage but certainly after. The 9mm is highly round dependant, todays most effective being 124 grain +p jhp or 147 gr jhp or both depending on who you ask, lol. And certain rounds, especially in 147gr, are more effective than others in the same weight and pressure.
Does 9mm suck? No 9mm doesnt suck but almost any .45acp 230gr jhp from an American manufacturer will do pretty well, even the generic ones, the "premium" rounds usually doing much better. Same with the .40, almost any 180 or 155 or 165gr jhp will do as well as the best 9mm rounds. The Border Patrol did just fine in MANY shootings with standard 155gr jhp, either Remington, Winchester or Federal depending on who won the contract.
What does that mean? I think 9mm is fine, much more so with "perfect" ammo, but .45 and .40 will do much better when you have "non premium" jhps. In todays world of shortages or if your budget doesn't allow for premium jhps pretty important.