Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

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Dr. Snubnose
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Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Dr. Snubnose » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:27 pm

Was never a really big believer in Ghosts (with the exception of Casper the Friendly Ghost), and of those who were posed to pass over to the "other side" but never made it...haunting away at peoples all over America. Well this is what we are watching on TV at work each day. People reporting strange occurrences happening in their homes or places of business...when the level of incidents reach intolerable levels, experts, priests, para-normal specialists etc)are called in to investigate and sometimes paid money to rid the evil spirits from the home with much success, so it seems. All this seems hookus pookus to me and my scam meter rings off the chart....But is there really something to these people's unbelievable stories? Like I said I'm not a real believer but I had one of those "UN-explainable" occurrences twice in my life. Back in the 1970's I went to a private "sleep away from home" Military High School. The school was located in Cold Spring Harbor NY, known by all the residents up close and from afar as "Oheka Castle" It was an actual castle brought over from overseas and erected as a home for billionaire Otto Kahn around the turn of the century on Long Island. A real castle it was indeed, 400 plus rooms,every room with a fireplace,7 sub-cellars beneath the earth housed it's own railroad station with locomotive and caboose, acres of English gardens, swimming pools and fountains, a ballroom with a salt water aquamarine for the dance floor.....pure opulence... for the time period. Before it was the Military School "Eastern Military Academy" the castle was home to the US Merchant Marine Academy....so there is a long history there....well to cut to the chase it was 1800 hours on the clock, all the cadets were in the mess hall having dinner. As a Cadet Captain and Company Commander twice weekly it was my responsibility to inspect all the barracks,cadet living quarters, bathrooms and hallways. These were white glove inspections, checking for dust on wall and foot lockers, checking for properly made hospital corners on the beds, dirt on the floors etc etc....Each Company commander would do this weekly and grade all the other companies in sort of a competition each week...well it really was used to determine the companies eating order in the mess hall....(First place=Hot food.....Last Place....wellllll ) Well to make this story short (lol) The company commander during the evening inspections was one of two persons at that time in the castle that were not in the mess hall. There was the Officer of the Day (guarding the main desk at the commandants office) then on this day there was me doing an evening inspection. As I walked down a long hallway to the rooms that housed myself and my company, to do the inspection, I saw something strange walking away and in front of me in the hallway. Mind you the hallways where quite wide, 10-12 feet wide. In front of me walking/gliding ...I don't know.. I saw no shoes...was a large dark figure wearing a very long and large black cloak with a hood. I never saw a face but this figure was large 6'5" or better, and the cloak took up half the hallway....Now we had all kinds of military dress uniforming and we wore the long coats and capes as worn by the cadets at West Point but this cloak looked nothing like that or anything else we had in the school. I walked behind this thing (30 feet behind) and when it reached the end of the hallway and should have made a left turn to go to the rooms instead it walked straight ahead through the wall and disappeared before my eyes, right before it walked through the wall I pointed at it and said hey!.....Never told anyone about it....for fear of being thought of as or being labeled crazy....but was I crazy...I saw what I saw...but what was it that I saw?

Second time this sort of thing happened to me was kinda bizarre. The wife and myself went with a real estate agent to view a house for sale that had many outbuildings and zoned for commercial use. We were thinking about acquiring the house and land and opening a wellness center/retreat. The home was very old, built in an exclusive area of long island back in the early 1800's. My wife and I entered the main house and we both got this very strange feeling....hard to describe....gloomy, depressed, like bad energy. Walked up the long staircase to the second level where there was a kitchen and several rooms. Again very strange feelings...like a floating in space kinda thing, like there was no substance to the floor boards of the floor beneath my feet and there was no existing downstairs level anymore....very very strange.....stranger when the wife and I walked in front of the doorway and glanced into the kitchen, saw a nicely tiled old stone cooking fireplace stove built in the wall and a tall porcelain dutch oven, and a large dinning table and chairs made of wood....problem was we saw about 8 people sitting around the table eating, they were foggy in appearance but clearly defined in dress of the 1800's and they all stopped eating and looked up at me and the wife all at the same time. My wife saw the same thing I did, but is a little more descriptive about what she saw....(things I don't remember or might have missed) but basically the same story....We literally ran from the house...when I glance back towards the kitchen it was totally empty of people at the table....Once again I got to say....What was that....I can't explain it...but there is no denying the experience.....so what says you Ghosts, Demons, and Para-Normal specialists out there.... hookus pookus...or is there anything to this.....have any UN-explainable experiences of your own ...you care to share.....Promise not to think you are crazy!!!! Doc:)

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Doc Dan » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:49 pm

Well, as for #1 I certainly believe in demons because the Bible tells me they are real. A lot of the Muslims and Hindus and Buddhists and Taoists in the hospitals see a figure like that coming for them before they die and unless sedated they go out screaming. (but also see #2)

However, as for #2, I firmly believe that such incidents are most likely a window or hole, if you will, occurring in space/time. I believe such incidents as marching soldiers, your dinner party, and etc. are times when conditions cause a window in space/time and you can see what went on in the past, but not completely clearly as it has already happened and it is only a window, not a case of transporting you back.
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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Evil D » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:26 am

I'm not really a religious person so "spirituality" is a gray area for me. What I do believe is that science tells us that matter can't be created or destroyed, yet everyday people and animals are born with consciousness and everyday they die, and I believe that consciousness goes somewhere. I don't know if that means there's an afterlife, a heaven/hell kind of scenario, or what. Consciousness has to be more than just being alive or dead, it can leave a body despite that body still being alive (what they call "brain dead" yet the body and brain can still be kept alive for years while the consciousness that existed in it has seemingly left). I believe there is far more that we don't understand about this subject than we do understand, and not even the smartest minds of our time can comprehend it. We have things like science and faith that try in their own ways to explain and make sense of the things we don't understand, but I don't think we're even close to scratching the surface.
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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby SuckSqueezeBangBlow » Sat Sep 10, 2016 3:44 am

Doc Dan wrote:Well, as for #1 I certainly believe in demons because the Bible tells me they are real.
Same here. I also believe in angels too. Once I was told by my boss to climb back up the ladder when changing tennis court globes after changing the globe and ballast. I heard a voice telling me to stay put and walk away. My boss had already walked back to the shop to turn them back on and when he did the globe exploded. Had I gone up the ladder I would have copped a face full of glass.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby The Mastiff » Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:25 am

I fear no human so I don't fear human ghosts if there are ghosts as such. I do however fear demons and believe very strongly in them. I don't know what exactly they are but I believe they do exist. Angels as well. Anything that can shield themselves from my eyes or enter from other dimensions and go back are beings not to be treated lightly. There are real exorcists around and if you can get one to open up and talk you will hear about humans levitating, walking up walls backwards, causing rain going up from living room floors, stuff like that. I am talking about doctorate of psychology or psychiatry , or Medical doctor Jesuit priests and am not talking about guys who are living in someones basement and blogging about it. The Vatican runs an exorcist school training new batches a few times a year. Some priests go to their first exorcism and refuse to ever go again.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby SuckSqueezeBangBlow » Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:37 am

The Mastiff wrote:. Some priests go to their first exorcism and refuse to ever go again.
I bet!

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby MacLaren » Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:53 am

I believe there are demons. But I also believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and so do the demons - and they tremble at the mention of the Lords name. For they know the Lord will be victorius. Therefore, I don't worry myself with anything really. The Father is in total control.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby ChrisinHove » Sat Sep 10, 2016 10:19 am

Wow, Dr Snubnose, those incidents would have certainly unsettled me!

In my job, I've crawled round buildings dating back many, many, many hundreds of years, and lived and stayed in some of over half a millennia. Generations have lived - and died - in these places, some immediate family, and I've never had even a slight spooking.

I've known people who have, or think they have, however. I'm happy to accept they thought they saw what they say they did, but have to defer belief until I see it for myself.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Liquid Cobra » Sat Sep 10, 2016 10:34 am

I don't believe in ghosts, goblins or demons. I guess I used to because that's what I was taught as I was raised as a catholic. However, I've bee a pretty big atheist for the last 20 years give or take so belief in such things have gone by the wayside.

Even if I ever did witness something like described above I would be more likely to believe it was something related to an optical illusion or some sort of temporary loss of blood to my head. The brain is a funny thing, it's very good at playing tricks on us.
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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby tvenuto » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:27 am

Evil D wrote:I'm not really a religious person so "spirituality" is a gray area for me. What I do believe is that science tells us that matter can't be created or destroyed, yet everyday people and animals are born with consciousness and everyday they die, and I believe that consciousness goes somewhere. I don't know if that means there's an afterlife, a heaven/hell kind of scenario, or what. Consciousness has to be more than just being alive or dead, it can leave a body despite that body still being alive (what they call "brain dead" yet the body and brain can still be kept alive for years while the consciousness that existed in it has seemingly left). I believe there is far more that we don't understand about this subject than we do understand, and not even the smartest minds of our time can comprehend it. We have things like science and faith that try in their own ways to explain and make sense of the things we don't understand, but I don't think we're even close to scratching the surface.
Agreed here. Also not religious at all, but will fully admit that we don't even know what we don't know when it comes to the things you mention. That said I do not believe in demons or angels or some otherworldly being that is permanently associated with our world and has some sort of emotional investment into what is going on here. I'll allow for alternate dimensions (or in the parlance of string theory: other multi-dimensional branes on which other beings live, wholly separate from our familiar 3 spacial dimensions).

My wife claims to have seen a ghost when she was a child. She saw it with her friend, and years later they spoke about it and her friend said "I doubted that memory until you brought it up, that's exactly how I remember it." Apparently he had a blue face and a beard, like unnaturally blue, not blue like someone suffocating. He was looking through a window and he smiled at them. She said she wasn't afraid of him at all and he seemed like a very nice person. They went to the window or outside to look and see where he went, but they couldn't find him (it's a rural area with not many places to hide).

One of her uncles has one of those game cameras up in the woods, and one day it took a picture of a woman in a night gown walking a dog (small one like a yorkie). The pictures during the night and day look different due to the night vision setting, and so it was absolutely pitch black when this picture was taken. She wasn't holding a flashlight, certainly not one that is on, and this was quite deep in the woods. Very strange photo, and she has her back to the camera preventing identification.

So, I'm willing to believe that people truly think they saw something. Now, whether or not they see it with their eyes is a question. Did the blue man's "visit" actually involve visual communication? Meaning: did photons from the sun bounce off his face, which absorbed all wavelengths except for blue, and then reflect towards the eye's of my future wife, imprinting a memory upon her brain that she will call up many years in the future? If so, his visit changed the physical distribution of energy in the universe. For example, the grass behind him didn't get those photons and didn't turn it into more grass. The blue wavelength was less energetic than the one produced by the sun. Although minor, these ghastly visits would constitute a loss in fidelity in the First Law of Thermodynamics. What happened to the energy in the absorbed wavelengths of light? Did he take it with him or did he give it back in some way? Also, even if he somehow only interacted with their brains, and caused them to have a memory, what provided the energy to drive those electro-chemical processes?

Related to this, many people think that the "ghosts" they see interact with objects. If they knock something over, did their feet have friction upon the ground? If not where was the "reaction force?" Where did it go? Since a falling object has the potential to perform work, did they just add energy to the universe? There is also the potential that the ghost does something that decreases entropy. For instance, let's say an OCD ghost decides to stack books in alphabetical order. This would constitute a violation of the second law of thermodynamics. Again for example, if you arranged those books you would have burned stored food energy, and the overall entropy would have increased even if the entropy of the books decreased.

Perhaps there is a "Ministry of Ghastly Thermodynamic Balance" where these ghosts come from, and ghosts are only allowed to perform work, decrease entropy, or absorb energy in strict balance with what other ghosts are doing or have done. They have to submit paperwork describing their intended actions, the ministry calculates the thermodynamic consequences of such actions, and grants approvals based on balancing the consequences with those of others. That might explain why interactions are so short, as calculating the thermodynamic consequences becomes more and more difficult for longer and more complicated visits. It might also describe why so many sightings are at night, limiting the photon exposure I mention earlier. I can actually imagine such a questionnaire:

"do you plan on appearing opaque or translucent? How many people will see you and at what time of day?"
"list your preferred skin and clothing color and two back-up shades, do not forget to include shoes, if applicable"
"will you be moving objects? if so list object types and approximate weights"
"Do you plan on changing the temperature of any rooms? If so list approximate room size, type of construction, etc"

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Evil D » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:35 am

The connection I keep making is that our brains and nervous system generates a considerable amount of energy, and when we die and/or go brain dead, and lose our consciousness, that energy (well, most of it at least brain waves) leaves the body. That energy has to go somewhere, because energy can only be converted from one form to another, it can't be destroyed. But, when we die, all of that energy is released. Some of it goes in the form of cellular decomposition and/or to other lifeforms that break down our bodies, but what about consciousness or "spirit"?
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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby tvenuto » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:44 am

MacLaren wrote:I believe there are demons. But I also believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and so do the demons - and they tremble at the mention of the Lords name. For they know the Lord will be victorius. Therefore, I don't worry myself with anything really. The Father is in total control.
Out of curiosity, and perhaps this deserves its own thread:

If everything was created by god (the Father), he must have created the demons, correct? (You do not mention this above, but it is a standard interpretation). Even if he didn't create them directly, would he not have, at minimum, set up conditions such that their creation was possible, even inevitable?

If the Father is in total control, why do the demons resist his wishes? If they are not resisting, then is he orchestrating said battle? What is the purpose of this temporary battle, if it is to be won at some point in the future?

If the Lord Jesus Christ will be victorious at some point in the future, what would be the outcome of the lack of battle (between the demons and the lord), and if no worldly outcome, what is the meaning of such a battle?

Given that good and evil are opposites, if evil were to cease (my interpretation of the victory mentioned above), then does good have any meaning? Is my interpretation of the victory incorrect?

I apologize if your post was mainly allegorical, but I am interpreting it as literal since that was the question presented in this thread. I'm also open to discussing over PM, or in another thread. I have done my best to avoid the "loaded question" and "begging the question" logical fallacies.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby tvenuto » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:59 am

Evil D wrote:The connection I keep making is that our brains and nervous system generates a considerable amount of energy, and when we die and/or go brain dead, and lose our consciousness, that energy (well, most of it at least brain waves) leaves the body. That energy has to go somewhere, because energy can only be converted from one form to another, it can't be destroyed. But, when we die, all of that energy is released. Some of it goes in the form of cellular decomposition and/or to other lifeforms that break down our bodies, but what about consciousness or "spirit"?
"Generating energy" in this sense is a bit misleading. Like a car engine, your brain uses energy, turns some of it into work, but the rest into heat, which are all forms of energy. The total "energy" including mass is preserved, but the total entropy (all things considered) increases. Food energy (glucose) that you consumed powers those processes you mention. When you die, what was earmarked for your brain ceases to be needed, and will be broken down, to a point, by microorganism like you said.

Your final moments, my opinion? A tiny puff of heat. Air molecules are agitated slightly more and the overall entropy of the universe increases by the most infinitesimal fraction. As far as the remaining energy you locked up in all of your cells, I actually feel it's far more natural to be buried in such a way that this energy actually returns to the environment (not how we do it now).

It may be sad, but that's the story of you. So you better do some awesome sh*t while you're here.

To be clear, I will allow that consciousness, as you describe, might be some other thing that we can't currently account for. My point is that as far as physical thermodynamic processes go, were we to fully account for all inputs and outputs, we would find no discrepancies between your death and turning off your car engine. Of course, that's just my feeling, and it's entirely possible that I'm wrong about that.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby tvenuto » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:28 pm

Also, is anyone here watching "Stranger Things" on Netflix? It kind of dovetails with this discussion.

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Dr. Snubnose » Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:52 pm

Enlighten me....(not going religious here) Are not Demons some type of Angel fallen from the graces of God?

The Cable show we watch every day is called Haunting something I think, I'll have to pay attention this week at work for the name of the show. The show has story after story of people from all walks of life having trouble with lets call them ghosts demons for now. Some of these people report not only seeing strange things, like objects that move about the room, broken dinner ware, things that fly at them from out of no where....pets food bowl being moved in the home everyday to a different step on the stairs....then there is the documented bruises and scratches reported by some with no evidence of hurting themselves, and then there are those who are shoved out of the way and pushed down to the ground by a ghost demon without explanation......or visual contact. There is more going on than what meets the eye......no puns intended....Doc:)

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby Water Bug » Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:30 am

Years ago, my family owned a border collie. He was still around when I left home for the Air Force, and the dog was always there when I came home on leave. One year while I was away from home on duty, the dog died... and, when I came home on leave afterwards and would sit there watching the TV, I would occasionally notice movement over towards the hallway near the living room and would see the black and white hind quarters and tail of a dog scampering through the hallway and into the next room. I saw similar things on a couple of other occasions during that leave to include glancing over towards the kitchen and seeing the dog sitting there looking at me... of course, when I'd looked back towards the kitchen, he'd be gone...

...So, one day during that leave, as I was chatting with my parents in the living room, I finally mentioned that I could've sworn that I'd seen that dog running around the house... my father chuckled and said, "Yeah, we see him, too, sometimes." Well, at least it wasn't just me seeing the ghost of this dog. Then my sister moved back in with my parents and somewhere along the lines acquired a dog... soon after she brought this dog into my parent's house, the ghost of the border collie disappeared.
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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby The Mastiff » Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:47 am

Enlighten me....(not going religious here) Are not Demons some type of Angel fallen from the graces of God?
Supposedly according to Hebrew and most Christian traditions. According to others there are also different races and types of intelligent life such as Djinn, nature spirits, elemental s, and many more. Some good, some bad just like humans. One common test of the "entity" is "knowing the unknowable" that priests will use to rule out fakery. There are other tricks as well. If an entity knows your past sins ( that you never told anyone) that is also an indicator of what you are dealing with.

For sure I don't know. I will say that people will call 911 when they are confronted by this stuff and there are also cops, Firemen, paramedics, detectives and chiefs of police and hospital staff that have all witnessed this kind of strange stuff and typically won't talk much about it. Some are open to these ideas and some are less than willing to even entertain the possibility. They hold on to their views about this existence and immediately resort to derision and attacks on character to guard against having their hold on reality challenged. People can react very strongly to the idea that there is a god, angels or demons or any other beings even while able to entertain the idea of life on other planets in our galaxy. .

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby shunsui » Fri Sep 16, 2016 2:26 am

The ghost of Stevie Ray is in the thread. :eek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL9eO4-aDMs

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby shunsui » Fri Sep 16, 2016 2:33 am

Ok, equal time for another view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tV1wAUulVec

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Re: Supernatural, Ghosts, Demons Thread

Postby O,just,O » Fri Sep 16, 2016 7:08 am

The victory was won at the cross by Jesus. We believers live in the victory NOW. Nothing to fear.
Lucifer was an angel of light, the most beautiful angel & a cherub of the throne room of God & rebelled because he saw how God loved us humans & put us higher than the angels. Through Jesus His Son He made us Sons & heirs. Lucifer could never be a son. Hebrews 1. And, yes, God did create evil. Isaiah 45:7.
One third of the host of Heavenly Angels sided with lucifer & were thrown down to earth where they appear as all the genies, djinn, grey aliens, venusians , trolls, leprechauns, faeries, demons, & any other manner of spirit that gives you the heeby jeebies.
Lucifers name was changed to satan & the angels became dark angels & they all can appear as anything they like, from beauty to ugly, animal to angel & have deceived many.
If you don't believe me, then try this.
Whenever you see them just claim the blood of Jesus over your self & them & then watch what happens next.
If they go off like a Catherine wheel on acid then that is good because they were a bad one.
If it is a Good God Angel then he or she will just love on ya.
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