A rant about Tax- A long read...

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demoncase
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A rant about Tax- A long read...

#1

Post by demoncase »

So then:

For those not familiar with UK tax law, it goes like this:
You don't pay income tax on the first £10,000 you earn.
You pay 20% on everything from £10,001 to £31,655.
Everything you earn after £31,655 to £100k you pay tax on at 40%.
You also get additionally taxed on any benefits (like a company car) or capital gains (over a fixed value- like big share payouts)
To make this quite complicated maths easier, Her Majesty's Revenue & Customs (HMRC aka 'The taxman) give you letter once a year in April with a 'tax-code'- a 3 digit code which tells you how much you get after tax....Easy right.

However: I received a letter this week in a HMRC envelope, saying my tax code had been changed to D0- "Emergency Tax" which is what you get when you owe them money and they want it back....D0 I found out meant instead of the above sliding scale I was on a flat 40% tax for every penny I earned :mad:

The other shoe dropped a day later when a P800 'Tax Calculation' appeared on my mat, showing that I owed the taxman £1484... :(

As anyone not self employed has the tax automatically paid by their employer, what in the name of Satan's fiery hooves had occurred here?!

A number of folks will know I've got one of those jobs with a multi-national aerospace company that comes with 'Global' in the title, means at least 16 long-haul international flights a year and a company car....And, typically, the company car gets taxed by HMRC as an additional benefit.
Which is listed on the P800.

I check the amount on the company car benefit statement and it's less- in fact it's exactly double according to the HMRC. To the penny.

I call HMRC and- being a government agency and clearly meant to be all about making my life as a tax-paying voter easier- sit on hold for 35 minutes- on a premium rate number I might add, so I did it from my desk phone.
I get through, point out the error and get put on hold for another 5 minutes while he 'checked his handbook on what he's allowed to do over the phone'
He came back and said "Yep- all sorted"
Then I ask about my tax code- same caper, this time I have to tell him my salary..But all sorted.

I now don't owe them a penny and my tax code is right again. :p

....Basically, they decided there was one Jon Lopez working for Moog Inc.
That Jon Lopez was- for reasons best known to the 'deep thinkers' at HMRC was being paid twice.
Two exact same salaries- to the penny. But they could only find records for me paying tax on one of them...
And not only that, but this Jon Lopez two identical Volvo S60 company cars of the precise same spec with the precis same value that- I assume- they thought I put on each foot like roller skates. And they could only find records for me paying tax on one of these too....

So instead of doing some elementary basic logical thought, they went "Meh. Let's rip the backside out of this guy's pay-cheque". :confused:
What if I hadn't actually bothered to challenge it?
How many folks every year end up chunking a load of their hard earned to HMRC because HMRC can't add up?

I joked at work that it's a bloody good job we don't make plane components with same level of mathematics:
"Yeah, we know it was supposed to have 4 engines but we've given it 8 instead.....Sorry" :D

I wouldn't mind, but 10 years ago I received a not-dissimilar tax-bill 3 days before I was getting married, this time because I changed jobs twice in 12 months, HMRC lost most of my records and 'extrapolated what we thought you earned that year'- which turned out to be £6k more than I earned.
After much losing of my letters, that all got sorted- in fact they owed ME £117, which I got a cheque for. :eek:
Warhammer 40000 is- basically- Lord Of The Rings on a cocktail of every drug known to man and genuine lunar dust, stuck in a blender with Alien, Mechwarrior, Dune, Starship Troopers, Fahrenheit 451 and Star Wars, bathed in blood, turned up to eleventy billion, set on fire, and catapulted off into space screaming "WAAAGH!" and waving a chainsaw sword- without the happy ending.

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awa54
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#2

Post by awa54 »

HMRC got nuthin' on the IRS! In the good 'ol USofA it would have been your job to figure out what you owed (or pay someone who's job it is to understand our byzantine tax laws).

That whole sequence still reminds me of Brazil though ;)
-David

still more knives than sharpening stones...
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demoncase
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#3

Post by demoncase »

awa54 wrote:HMRC got nuthin' on the IRS! In the good 'ol USofA it would have been your job to figure out what you owed (or pay someone who's job it is to understand our byzantine tax laws).

That whole sequence still reminds me of Brazil though ;)
Ah yes- I did have to do the working out myself, but thankfully there's a fairly clear set of worked sums on the HMRC website that let you work it out.

The real 'warning flag' was when my 'Car Benefit' in their calculations started with a 7 when on the P11D Car Benefit form (also provided by HMRC at a different point in the year) it started with a 3. ;)
Warhammer 40000 is- basically- Lord Of The Rings on a cocktail of every drug known to man and genuine lunar dust, stuck in a blender with Alien, Mechwarrior, Dune, Starship Troopers, Fahrenheit 451 and Star Wars, bathed in blood, turned up to eleventy billion, set on fire, and catapulted off into space screaming "WAAAGH!" and waving a chainsaw sword- without the happy ending.

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awa54
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#4

Post by awa54 »

sure that P11D wasn't actually a 27B/6 ?
-David

still more knives than sharpening stones...
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demoncase
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#5

Post by demoncase »

awa54 wrote:sure that P11D wasn't actually a 27B/6 ?
:D
Warhammer 40000 is- basically- Lord Of The Rings on a cocktail of every drug known to man and genuine lunar dust, stuck in a blender with Alien, Mechwarrior, Dune, Starship Troopers, Fahrenheit 451 and Star Wars, bathed in blood, turned up to eleventy billion, set on fire, and catapulted off into space screaming "WAAAGH!" and waving a chainsaw sword- without the happy ending.

https://www.instagram.com/commissarcainscoffeecup/
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The Mastiff
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#6

Post by The Mastiff »

About two years ago I got a letter from my state retirement about my not filing a form reporting about income I had back in 97-99. Because of that, they claimed I owed them 16K and they were going to take it out of my check at over $300 per month until I paid it off. There was no way I would have skipped the notification back then or the state would have cut my pay off back then. I couldn't find a copy of the form from 97 though and so I had to pay. They just stopped giving me the money. :) I had no say in the matter. That's a lot of money to a guy on retirement with lots of medical expenses.

They did the same to hundreds of other retirees when they had a budget shortfall and needed a quick way to lower expenses and us retirees had to carry the load.

That's what governments do in my experience. Even if we class action lawsuit to get our money back IF we win it will be years to decades later and the government rmployees in charge will have solved their temporary budget shortfall. I'm sure the people who thought that one up got a raise. :)

Joe
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awa54
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#7

Post by awa54 »

The Mastiff wrote:About two years ago I got a letter from my state retirement about my not filing a form reporting about income I had back in 97-99. Because of that, they claimed I owed them 16K and they were going to take it out of my check at over $300 per month until I paid it off. There was no way I would have skipped the notification back then or the state would have cut my pay off back then. I couldn't find a copy of the form from 97 though and so I had to pay. They just stopped giving me the money. :) I had no say in the matter. That's a lot of money to a guy on retirement with lots of medical expenses.

They did the same to hundreds of other retirees when they had a budget shortfall and needed a quick way to lower expenses and us retirees had to carry the load.

That's what governments do in my experience. Even if we class action lawsuit to get our money back IF we win it will be years to decades later and the government rmployees in charge will have solved their temporary budget shortfall. I'm sure the people who thought that one up got a raise. :)

Joe
Grrr! this sort of thing is where my liberal and conservative brains both short circuit... first off it's just not right to f... people out of what they have paid in for throughout their working lives and second, how does anyone get off viewing an *obligation* like pensions as a revenue stream for any other expense??

I still believe that *good* governments can exist, although the US may be too big and too diverse (and still have a bit too much residual cowboy mentality) for this to be true in any of our lifetimes. But I'll keep on voting and keep hoping for good to come of it.
-David

still more knives than sharpening stones...
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noseoil
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#8

Post by noseoil »

Since the US government is now about $18 trillion in debt, please explain to me why I need to pay ANY taxes to them. They print the money they need, so paying taxes isn't necessary any more.
Last edited by noseoil on Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
TomAiello
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Re: A rant about Tax- A long read...

#9

Post by TomAiello »

Don't worry. They're here to help.
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