Pocket Pistols

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Dr. Snubnose
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby Dr. Snubnose » Wed Jul 15, 2015 5:38 am

As a person who totes around multiple firearms on my person daily..... access in the car to a/my pocket pistol becomes much more difficult while seated behind the wheel, I can access a knife quicker from that position than I can a pocket pistol....I don't like the idea of removing my firearms from my body outside of the car with everyone and their grandmother watching....it seems to UN-nerve certain folks even though It might take a second to do. I never liked the idea of a center console gun...mostly because It's only within reach of my one hand. To solve the problem I glued heavy duty velcro ( Male-rough side) to the inside of my side map pocket in the door. I glued Velcro (smooth Female side)all around the outside to a cheap nylon holster (open top) that fits my pocket pistol. I remove the gun inside the car and slip it into its Door Pocket Holster set up. Now I have access to my pocket pistol with either hand while sitting behind the wheel....The nice thing about the set up is I can cant the pistol in any direction for easier access and the velcro match up between holster and door map pocket keeps everything in place. Easy to exit the car palming your firearm and placing it back into the pocket....The action looks like anyone who gets out of their car and puts their wallet in their pocket..Many people just hate to sit on their wallets when driving. The action does not raise suspicion with bystanders as it looks very normal...been using this method for over twenty years...the set up is not expensive to do and is quite effective.....Doc:)

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby DansGunBlog » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:36 pm

Hey Paul - excellent point, totally agree.

And also agreed in particular on comfort, a topic so often ignored by the "who cares if it's comfortable" crowd... because we know **** well, most folks are gonna leave it at home if it's not comfortable, and that doesn't do anyone any favors. :-)

Here in Dallas it's 0F in February, and 105F in August... just like wardrobe, ideal carry options change with the climate, no way around it.

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby enduraguy » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:13 pm

I find I'm carrying my Ruger LCR .22 magnum more lately. Loaded with Gold Dots. Comfortable in its Thies brand holster, 100% reliable after 500 rounds so far, lightweight, and I can empty it in around 3 seconds into a 5" group from 10 feet away.

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby Dr. Snubnose » Fri Jul 17, 2015 2:01 am

My God Wilmer that is some of the best writing I often ever seen!!!! I'm so glad you service is cheap, bet Udaguys that write fortunes in those cookies....I'm right aren't am.....Doc;)

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby MichaelScott » Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:27 am

Car, seated, belted: pistol in appendix position in holster, shirt pulled out from under the seat belt. Right handed. Easy to draw. Can draw with left if necessary. Gun stays in place in car, out of car, on the street, sitting in a restaurant, etc. I usually carry AIWB for all those reasons, and I don't worry about people "bumping" me accidentally, or on purpose, and asking "What's that?" I used to tell them it was my insulin pump, but having given up on lying, I just say it's my weapon and deal with what comes next. Seldom happens though.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby DansGunBlog » Fri Jul 17, 2015 10:37 am

@Michael i've yet to find the right combination to actually be comfortable for appendix carry... what firearm / holster combo have you found to work, and in what position? any other tips to make it work? likely losing those few extra inches from the otherwise perfect appendix carry zone will help lol, hence the reason i took up a little running in addition to the muscle/core focused workouts.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby MichaelScott » Fri Jul 17, 2015 11:34 am

For me (I am 6' 3" and 200 pounds), and it is a personal decision, I most often carry a S&W M&P Shield in one of these: G-Code Eclipse, Blade-Tech Revolution or Cook's adjustable clip kydex. When I carry my LCP AIWB, I have been using a Kusiak straight drop with mag pouch. I think this is the best combo for the LCP when carrying AIWB or Cross Draw. I suspect it might also be a great AIWB holster, with the mag pouch attached, for the Shield, but I haven't gotten one to review.

Weather and circumstance permitting, I may also carry my Ruger SR9c with the 17 round magazine, but it's not as easy to conceal, hence the need for somewhat heavier clothing or perhaps a jacket. It is of course heavier, but that's not always bad.

Generally, I think the best self defense carry pistol is one that has the basic form factor, especially width, and weight of the Shield. I like 9 mm since the ammo is not exotic and usually available, it is a very effective SD round with modern, factory hollow point loads, and the recoil is manageable for accurate follow up shots if necessary.

You might be interested in more on this on my self defense carry blog: http://sdcarry.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; I will be publishing a review article on various "synthetic" (non-leather) AIWB holsters for the Shield soon. I've been using about five different models since last year and am about ready to write up my findings and preferences.

I would note that there is no "perfect" holster. Depends on the individual's preferences and circumstances. My ideal holster is one that carries the weapon safely and securely in a place on the body that is readily accessible in most circumstances and conceals reasonably. For me, I have migrated to synthetic holsters because I think they best represent those factors, and I like the option to re-holster with one hand if the other isn't available.

Hope that helps, but remember, it is only my opinion. You can read all the blogs and reviews out there, but you will have to get a few holsters and try them out for a while. I'd recommend starting with used holsters, if they are in good shape, since you will probably go through a number of them before you end up keeping two or three as your favorites.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby TomAiello » Fri Jul 17, 2015 1:10 pm

Michael, do you carry those at the same time?

I have almost never carried two handguns, but if I did, I'd opt for two that shared magazines (like Glock 19 and 26, for example).

What led you to the combination you chose?

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby MichaelScott » Fri Jul 17, 2015 2:49 pm

I have had the SR9c for quite some time. I like the option of 17 round and 10 round magazines. But, for most situations, especially in the warmer months, I carry the Smith. When I'm home, I swap the Smith for the LCP. I don't care to carry either the Smith or SR9c ALL of the time, so at home here in our little village of 800 souls (in the winter, more like 2000 in the summer) I feel OK with only the LCP. When I go out I will carry the SR9c or Smith. Do I carry both at the same time? Sometimes, yes. As Massad Ayoob said, if you are going to carry a gun, why not carry two? The advantages are obvious. But, I'm not a pedant about it.

That said, the LCP is a perfect second or "back up" gun. Unless you've had one and shot one you can't believe how small and light, but loud and powerful it is.

When I was a moderator on a gun forum a few years back, there were always the threads claiming that .380s were "mouse guns", "girly guns", not adequate to stop a threat. I've never known of people with these hard-core opinions offer to be shot with one to see how pathetic the .380s are.

No, the LCP won't "drive nails" in the hands of your ordinary shooter. No, it won't stop a full grown man in his tracks. (That would take a shotgun or heavy rifle, and even those don't always work on certain people.) No, it doesn't "feel" as expensive as an expensive .380 because it is affordable. I think it works for its intended purpose and works very well indeed.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby Mad Mac » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:02 pm

Some of these pictures were posted by me on another thread but seem appropriate to repeat here.

Kel-Tec P3AT 380 with clip. After this picture
I tried carrying it in the righthand pocket and that works too.

Image

Image

Seecamp is smaller but heavier stainless steel and more expensive.
This is the .32. It's also available in .380 only .10 inches larger in grip.
It is very expensive.

Image

Here Seecamp is shown in convertible holster.
Panel on for right hip pocket carry. Remove panel for right front pocket carry.

Image
1990: Endura SE, Delica PE, Mariner, Police. 2014: ClipiTool Bottle Opener. 2015: Kitchen Knife PE, Tenacious CE, Stretch PE, Moran Drop Point, Kiwi, two Byrd Cara Caras, Schempp Bowie, Native 5 Forum Knife, Sharpmaker, Police SE, Small SpyderPac, Ultra-Fine Stones, Tenacious SE, 4" Paring Knife, 2" Paring Knife, Starmate. 2016: The Spyderco Story, The Tactical Folding Knife, USN Ladybug H-1 Hawkbill SE, Black BaliYo, Yellow H-1 Salt Dragonfly 2 SE, Ulize, Pink Native 5 PE, Renegade C23PS and C23P, Gayle Bradley 2, Double Bevel, Gayle Bradley Air, Cricket Blue Nishjin, Centofante Memory, K2, two Large Lum Pink G10, Rubicon. 2017: Battlestation, Orange Positron, Gray Baliyo, Native 5 CE, Tenacious CE. 2018: EuroEdge, ClipiTool Standard, 2019 Calendar Contest Rhino CF PLN.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby TomAiello » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:11 pm

MichaelScott wrote:That said, the LCP is a perfect second or "back up" gun. Unless you've had one and shot one you can't believe how small and light, but loud and powerful it is.
I don't own one, but I've owned a P3AT, and I own and (sometimes) carry a Kahr P380, which are both about the same size.

Most of the time my clothing allows me to carry my PM9, though, so the P380 is mostly only for "nice dress" occasions.

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby DansGunBlog » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:22 pm

TomAiello wrote:
MichaelScott wrote:That said, the LCP is a perfect second or "back up" gun. Unless you've had one and shot one you can't believe how small and light, but loud and powerful it is.
I don't own one, but I've owned a P3AT, and I own and (sometimes) carry a Kahr P380, which are both about the same size.

Most of the time my clothing allows me to carry my PM9, though, so the P380 is mostly only for "nice dress" occasions.
Tom, how do you carry the PM9? Pocket? lol mine is the same physical size as my Glock 42, tho a little heavier, and even the G42 is a tight fit in the pocket. even very loose cargo shorts.

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby TomAiello » Fri Jul 17, 2015 11:37 pm

DansGunBlog wrote:Tom, how do you carry the PM9? Pocket?
Yep.

I've got a kydex pocket holster from Alabama holster and a Remora holster I use for pocket carry. The kydex is thinner, but the Remora breaks up the outline more.

I almost always wear cargo shorts or cargo pants from Duluth Trading Company, and have no issues with pocket carry.

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby Doc Dan » Sat Jul 18, 2015 11:47 am

MichaelScott wrote:I have had the SR9c for quite some time. I like the option of 17 round and 10 round magazines. But, for most situations, especially in the warmer months, I carry the Smith. When I'm home, I swap the Smith for the LCP. I don't care to carry either the Smith or SR9c ALL of the time, so at home here in our little village of 800 souls (in the winter, more like 2000 in the summer) I feel OK with only the LCP. When I go out I will carry the SR9c or Smith. Do I carry both at the same time? Sometimes, yes. As Massad Ayoob said, if you are going to carry a gun, why not carry two? The advantages are obvious. But, I'm not a pedant about it.

That said, the LCP is a perfect second or "back up" gun. Unless you've had one and shot one you can't believe how small and light, but loud and powerful it is.

When I was a moderator on a gun forum a few years back, there were always the threads claiming that .380s were "mouse guns", "girly guns", not adequate to stop a threat. I've never known of people with these hard-core opinions offer to be shot with one to see how pathetic the .380s are.

No, the LCP won't "drive nails" in the hands of your ordinary shooter. No, it won't stop a full grown man in his tracks. (That would take a shotgun or heavy rifle, and even those don't always work on certain people.) No, it doesn't "feel" as expensive as an expensive .380 because it is affordable. I think it works for its intended purpose and works very well indeed.
Have you ever read what Fairbairn had to say about the .380 acp? It was a lethal round. I also found it interesting that the bad guys were not afraid of the .45acp. One criminal was shot with the full magazine of rounds and had to be clubbed with the gun to subdue him. The round the bad guys were most afraid of was one that spit a 86 grain bullet at 1400 fps. When Fairbairn had his men stand behind metal shields and fire various types of pistols at each other so they could get used to being fired upon, they found the faster rounds to hit the shield much harder than the slow rounds like the .45 and the .380.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby AH2525 » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:28 am

I've gone through my share from the NAA minis to a couple of keltecs and even a Kahr pocket 45 (!). Finally settled in on a Beretta 21a in 22 LR. It was the comfort of the grip that made the difference.

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby Mad Mac » Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:49 pm

In pocket pistols, I had a rimfire NAA .22 Mag single action revolver, then upgraded to a double action semi-auto Beretta 21A Bobcat in rimfire .22 Long Rifle, then upgraded to a center fire Beretta 950 Jetfire in .25 ACP, then upgraded to a Kel-Tec .32 ACP, then upgraded to a Kel-Tec .380 ACP, then went backwards to a Seecamp .32 because the Seecamp .380 price is out of my league. Basically, I always wanted a Seecamp. It just took me a long tortuous path to get there.
1990: Endura SE, Delica PE, Mariner, Police. 2014: ClipiTool Bottle Opener. 2015: Kitchen Knife PE, Tenacious CE, Stretch PE, Moran Drop Point, Kiwi, two Byrd Cara Caras, Schempp Bowie, Native 5 Forum Knife, Sharpmaker, Police SE, Small SpyderPac, Ultra-Fine Stones, Tenacious SE, 4" Paring Knife, 2" Paring Knife, Starmate. 2016: The Spyderco Story, The Tactical Folding Knife, USN Ladybug H-1 Hawkbill SE, Black BaliYo, Yellow H-1 Salt Dragonfly 2 SE, Ulize, Pink Native 5 PE, Renegade C23PS and C23P, Gayle Bradley 2, Double Bevel, Gayle Bradley Air, Cricket Blue Nishjin, Centofante Memory, K2, two Large Lum Pink G10, Rubicon. 2017: Battlestation, Orange Positron, Gray Baliyo, Native 5 CE, Tenacious CE. 2018: EuroEdge, ClipiTool Standard, 2019 Calendar Contest Rhino CF PLN.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby RanCoWeAla » Mon Oct 12, 2015 4:14 pm

The best thing to do is order you a 511 Tactical shirt that has the hidden vertical document pockets with Velcro closures in every color if you're like me and wear jeans all the time. These shirts are very stylish, durable and the more you wash them the better they look. I call this the worlds most perfect shirt. You have two outside pockets that break the profile of anything inside and you can just about live out of these shirts. I carry a Glock 43 on the left side and a spare magazine on the right side. When I go to the Flea Market I may have cell phone, knives a magazine iPad Karambit or no telling what in there and no one would ever know I had anything. I just drop the Glock 43 in there loose no holster and you can access it from any position sitting standing or whatever . Empty chamber of course with trigger pulled that way you can tell just by feel that its perfectly safesafe

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby Mad Mac » Tue Oct 13, 2015 12:20 pm

Safety first, but allow me to pose a hypothetical. What if a person has been injured or is holding off an attacker with one hand, how is the person going to rack the slide to chamber a round?

Here is a recent article on the topic from the NRA American Rifleman.
1990: Endura SE, Delica PE, Mariner, Police. 2014: ClipiTool Bottle Opener. 2015: Kitchen Knife PE, Tenacious CE, Stretch PE, Moran Drop Point, Kiwi, two Byrd Cara Caras, Schempp Bowie, Native 5 Forum Knife, Sharpmaker, Police SE, Small SpyderPac, Ultra-Fine Stones, Tenacious SE, 4" Paring Knife, 2" Paring Knife, Starmate. 2016: The Spyderco Story, The Tactical Folding Knife, USN Ladybug H-1 Hawkbill SE, Black BaliYo, Yellow H-1 Salt Dragonfly 2 SE, Ulize, Pink Native 5 PE, Renegade C23PS and C23P, Gayle Bradley 2, Double Bevel, Gayle Bradley Air, Cricket Blue Nishjin, Centofante Memory, K2, two Large Lum Pink G10, Rubicon. 2017: Battlestation, Orange Positron, Gray Baliyo, Native 5 CE, Tenacious CE. 2018: EuroEdge, ClipiTool Standard, 2019 Calendar Contest Rhino CF PLN.
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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby RanCoWeAla » Tue Oct 13, 2015 4:16 pm

Trust me you'll find a way. I personally know of two who have either shot themselves or someone else carrying a live round in the chamber. If you could see the scar on one Guys leg four inches in diameter after numerous surgeries and skin grafts I think you would agree that any civilian who carries a live chambered round is asking for trouble. I would rather ere on the side of caution than have a 9mm go off in my shirt
pocket and kill me or someone else in a crowded area.
Then there's the Lady who dropped her purse and the .38 inside went off striking a bystander in the arm

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Re: Pocket Pistols

Postby RanCoWeAla » Wed Oct 14, 2015 9:22 am

Its like this. I would rather carry my Glock 43 loose in the document pocket of my 511 Tactical shirt with empty chamber and trigger down where I know beyond any doubt that its totally safe. Then, spend that first one to two seconds chambering a round rather than trying to draw from some pocket holster that may be inheritantly dangerous by design and taking a chance on shooting myself before I even have a chance to get off a shot.
I like the pocket holster shown with the See camp because it covers the entire trigger and trigger guard area. Never buy a holster that doesn't cover the entire trigger guard area. Your trigger finger will be instinctively drawn to the trigger and the last thing you want to do is use the trigger for leverage when drawing. You want a holster that forces you to keep your trigger finger as I say alongside and not inside. Your trigger finger should never touch the trigger until the decision to fire has been made based on the situation at hand.


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