Have we "Jumped the shark"?

If your topic has nothing to do with Spyderco, you can post it here.
User avatar
Kev83
Member
Posts: 245
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Maryland

Have we "Jumped the shark"?

Postby Kev83 » Fri Apr 26, 2013 10:42 am

My question to my fellow knife enthusiasts is just that. Have we jumped the proverbial shark? Are we too wrapped up in high dollar, expensive, and to some point so expensive that we don't want to use the knife for what they're intended for products? The talk of super steels, alloys, carbon fiber, titanium and any other kind of jewel encrusted embellishment and/or finish that can be shoehorned into a knife package can be a little much at times for some people. Have we forgotten a bit of our father's generation or generations before his thoughts on products and their uses? Days when they used knives to out and out just survive and provide for their families. My thoughts are, years ago I would've never paid what I have paid now for some knives but I do it because I feel I as a hard working man earn the right to indulge and treat myself to these luxuries every once in a while. Yet somehow, in the back of my mind I can't help but hear my father's voice, who has passed away almost a year ago now, saying "You spent how much on a knife?!, you know how many other more important things you could have used that money for?!" Now if he were still with me today once he saw the piece, he'd have remarked at how nice it is and hint that he'd like to have one too. I love getting into detailed conversations and even heated discussions in depth about details of knives, makers and materials so for me I gotta say I'm somewhat ok with the topic.. At least for now that is. I may look back years from now and say what the Hell was I thinking but for now ill bask in the complete obliviousness that is my favorite hobby. So there it is fellow forum dwellers, what say you?

BAL
Member
Posts: 3463
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:58 am
Location: Middle Earth

Postby BAL » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:11 am

I think that it goes way beyond knives.

Look at your phone, how much did it cost, how much do people pay for phone services.

Look at television, once the ability to watch it was free. Now how much do people pay
a month to watch it.

It wasn' that long ago that you could buy a decent shoe for not too much. Now, I will
spend that much on the insert pads or socks alone.

Having said all of that, I do tend to agree on the knife question. I have asked myself
the same thing a number of times. Until I bought my first Spyderco, the most that I
ever spent on a knife was $15, wich was on sale for half price at Cabelas.

I recently bought a Tuff for a couple bills. Heck, I could have bought a decent pair of
shoes for that.

Great topic.

User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 22084
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Postby Evil D » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:15 am

I relate this topic to my other hobby, which is drag racing. I don't need 500hp, I don't need to drive a race car disguised as a street car. I can get by perfectly fine with a '88 Ford Fiesta as far as getting from A to B, but I don't HAVE to so why would I? People who fall into the category of "enthusiast" tend to spend good money on the things they're enthusiastic about.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

User avatar
Kev83
Member
Posts: 245
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Maryland

Postby Kev83 » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:54 am

Totally agree with you BAL! Every aspect of our life has some form or another of what is deemed as excess. Just thought I'd see how people thought that pertained to the knife community

User avatar
Kev83
Member
Posts: 245
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Maryland

Postby Kev83 » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:56 am

Evil D wrote:I relate this topic to my other hobby, which is drag racing. I don't need 500hp, I don't need to drive a race car disguised as a street car. I can get by perfectly fine with a '88 Ford Fiesta as far as getting from A to B, but I don't HAVE to so why would I? People who fall into the category of "enthusiast" tend to spend good money on the things they're enthusiastic about.
I'm with ya! If you ain't first, you're last! Lol

User avatar
kbuzbee
Member
Posts: 4762
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Mentor, OH

Postby kbuzbee » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:57 am

BAL wrote:I think that it goes way beyond knives.
And water used to come free from a fountain instead of $2 a bottle out of a vending machine. ;)

It's a great point and as mentioned, it's a thing we do because we enjoy it, beyond the purely functional aspects of a simple cutting tool.

Ken
玉鋼

User avatar
The Deacon
Member
Posts: 25353
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:33 am
Location: Upstate SC, USA
Contact:

Postby The Deacon » Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:06 pm

I think there has always been a demand for quality materials and superior workmanship, both for practical and esthetic reasons. I also think we are blessed with choices when it comes to knives, a range of options from SAKs and Opinels to high end customs and, as Spyderco buffs, from Byrds and the Tenacious family to the Military and other models in latest and greatest exotic steel surrounded by CF or titanium. As for me, I do have some expensive "shelf queens", but among the knives I carry and use are a prototype bolstered Stretch, a custom AT Barr left handed One-Eyed Jack in damascus and ivory, and a couple Kiwis with several hundred dollars worth of engraving.
Paul
My Personal Website ---- Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting ---- Spydiewiki
Deplorable :p
WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!

Rangodash
Member
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:00 am

Postby Rangodash » Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:13 pm

It doesn't really matter, does it? If that's what the knife hobby means to you and brings you happiness, then so be it.
(Libertarian)(.357)(CPM M4)

BAL
Member
Posts: 3463
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:58 am
Location: Middle Earth

Postby BAL » Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:09 pm

Kev83 wrote:Totally agree with you BAL! Every aspect of our life has some form or another of what is deemed as excess. Just thought I'd see how people thought that pertained to the knife community
Absolutely, I am totally on board with your comments. It's interesting to me.

What is also funny is how you tend to increase what you consider your top limits.
The Manix2 was the first "new" Spydie that I bought and it was $80 or so. I about
made myself crazy trying to decide "which one" to get.

I no sooner had it in hand that I was ordering another. It took a while and I finally
went over $100. I recently bought the Tuff for over 200. That actually doesn’t make
sense if you think about it, but many have spent way more than that.

To one person though a Kimber at $1300 is double what they would spend on a 45
or a 1911. Others opt for Les Baer, Wilson Combat, Ed Brown etc.

At least you can get a top of the line knife for a more reasonable price than a
comparable gun. It is kind of funny how much enjoyment you can get over a new
knife or even the thought of a new knife.

User avatar
phillipsted
Member
Posts: 3674
Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:30 am
Location: North Virginia

Postby phillipsted » Sat Apr 27, 2013 7:16 am

The minute I start salivating over gold and diamond encrusted art knives, I want you guys to slap some sense into me, OK? :)

TedP

User avatar
phillipsted
Member
Posts: 3674
Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:30 am
Location: North Virginia

Postby phillipsted » Sat Apr 27, 2013 7:26 am

Actually - that reminds me of a story. A couple of years ago, I took the family to Europe for a summer vacation. During the trip, we visited Solingen, Germany - home of the German steel and cutlery industry. We saw the Boker factory/shop, the Henkels/Zwilling shop, and several others. We also visited their fascinating "Klingenmuseum" or Cutlery Museum.

Long story short: The museum had what was supposedly "the world's most expensive/valuable folding knife" on display. I was anticipating a little bling, but also a well-crafted knife. I got there and it was a little different that I anticipated... It was a very tacky large folder that was completely encrusted in diamonds and other rare gems and every metal surface was polished to within an inch of its life... The blade steel wasn't marked, but it could have been any run-of-the-mill alloy and it wouldn't have mattered... Quite ugly and perfectly impractical at $1.3M... (wish I could find a pic on the interwebs...sorry!)

TedP

O,just,O
Member
Posts: 944
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:35 pm
Location: Qld. Australia.

Postby O,just,O » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:48 am

I like well designed good quality tools. I work as a carpenter on construction & repairs of homes.
My sliding compound mitre saw is the top shelf European model, $2,ooo worth of saw to cut big bits of wood into little bits of wood. My planes are either antique Millers Falls or Veritas. Chisels are Pfiel, Eskil Tuna, & Japanese Oire Nomi. Power tools are all name brand like Makita, Millwaulke or Panasonic.
My knives are the same. Quality tools with good ergonomics & the best steels.
I don't like nor do I buy cheapo's. They not only become more expensive in the end due to down time but are a blunt club in your hand. Too thick & short with no balance or finnese. Designed for economy in manufacture & not to use deftly each day & be a pleasure to use.
O.

User avatar
Pinetreebbs
Member
Posts: 1830
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 6:55 am
Location: SC

Postby Pinetreebbs » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:57 am

To each his own.

With this caveat: You are paying cash after paying all your bills, have savings and you setting money aside for retirement.
Have you joined Knife Rights yet?
Go to: http://www.KnifeRights.org
Protecting your Right to own and carry the knives YOU choose.

User avatar
The Deacon
Member
Posts: 25353
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:33 am
Location: Upstate SC, USA
Contact:

Postby The Deacon » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:59 am

phillipsted wrote:The minute I start salivating over gold and diamond encrusted art knives, I want you guys to slap some sense into me, OK? :)

TedP
Well Ted, I'd agree where diamonds are concerned, and that there is a point where quiet elegance ends and gaudy begins, but if Spyderco ever offered a clipless Kopa, real (Moki) Kiwi, or a bolstered Stretch or Chaparral tricked out like this Wm Henry Monarch I'd own and carry at least one. :o :)
Paul
My Personal Website ---- Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting ---- Spydiewiki
Deplorable :p
WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!

User avatar
Blerv
Member
Posts: 11695
Joined: Mon May 04, 2009 11:24 am

Postby Blerv » Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:47 am

Another thing to consider is depreciation. Collectibles such as baseball cards have no inherent usability, they are purchased by enthusiasts and *should* appreciate in value. That's the whole point. Other assets though are a bit of a dice toss.

Quality folding knives, if demand exceeds supply, should also appreciate in value. They serve a secondary purpose of actually being tools. The cost of steel, other materials, and labor is steadily increasing as well. Years back people could buy a Native C41 at Walmart for around $40 (I hear), you certainly can't buy one for that now. A used but not abused C41 with a box is probably worth about $30, maybe more.

Consider this: Most people aren't car enthusiasts yet buy new cars. Some buy very nice cars on the basis of "I deserve it" and many of these people own the car for far less than 10 years, like 2-3 years. Then they buy a similar replacement and repeat the cycle. Besides the cost of financing $35,000 (like a loaded Honda Accord or any decent SUV) you are also out depreciation. Do this a couple dozen times over your lifespan and you have thrown away hundreds of thousands that could have been plunked away at a IRA or 401(k). The most rational path for most Americans is a bus pass and perhaps an older car in the driveway. The car should be driven until it falls apart and major components are likely more cheap to replace the car itself.

Having a nice knife or multiples is not needed. It's a fun hobby that if done well isn't a horrible outlet for your money. It's more efficient half the other socially acceptable hobbies. I don't play golf but don't need a calculator to know Spyderco is a safer bet. :)
:spyder: Blake :spyder:

User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 22084
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Postby Evil D » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:32 pm

My experience with collectables is that, things that were never meant to be collector's items and that were typically used hard and destroyed/thrown away worn out, are the things that are most sought after by collectors. I used to collect some '80s toys, and the ones that were super rare were the toys that were really popular but nobody ever thought would be collectable so nobody ever saved them in unopened/NIB condition. You won't find original He-Man figures in their original packages...they practically don't exist, same for GIJOE and a lot of other iconic '80s toys. Things that are marketed as collector's items are typically things that nobody but enthusiasts care about.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

User avatar
noseoil
Member
Posts: 506
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:28 pm

Postby noseoil » Sun Apr 28, 2013 9:04 pm

I admit I have a fondness for highly functional and well made things (the two elements of design, form & function). I'm including knives now as this newly acquired "hobby" of mine. Admittedly, one pocket knife is plenty, why have more than one? A friend at work asked me what is the best steel for a pocket knife a while ago, and it started me on this path. Who would have thought that an innocent question about steel would end up in this forum and in this thread? I guess I was just ready to look at things. I found the ZDP-189 online, started reading and I'm still enjoying the stuff I read about and the Delica I first bought. I don't "need" the HK's I have, any similar thing would do just fine, but I like having a proven platform which works exactly as it was designed and will function in any environment. The knives are simply an extension of this mind-set; superbly designed, simple, functional and aesthetically pleasing. No, I think the need to create order out of chaos remains a strong component of the human emotional makeup, and doing it just a bit better is one part of the mix.

Pneumothorax
Member
Posts: 1635
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 2:21 pm
Location: SoCal, behind the Orange Curtain

Postby Pneumothorax » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:11 am

Interesting topic. I will give my two cents based on my current job situation - which is - I dont have one. I used to make good money (and hope to again) and bought what I wanted (not overly so) and when I wanted it. Now, Im not overly materialistic, but I have over 50 Spydies. I promised myself when I got laid off that I would not buy another Spydie until I got my next job. For someone who averaged about 1 Spydie a month for 4 years, that is some tough task. But now that I have cut out almost all discretionary spending, Im discovering that what I NEED vs. what I WANT are two very different things. Even though I use all my Spydies, I look at them even more practically now - and the ones that really dont serve a real need for me, I am going to sell. I think we do get caught up in buying the best this or that and it is fine if there is money for it that really isnt needed for anything else - but I do have 1 kid in college and another going in 2 years and I do want to retire as soon as is feasible, so I m changing my ways. I will not get a Spydie unless I really love it (it has to speak to me...like most of them do). I won't buy stuff that I dont really need and focus more on other value investments like upgrading my house both for comfort and for resale value and putting more money into college and retirement funding. That being said, I do have a list of Spydies that on "on backorder in my mind".
___________________________________________
2011: G10 Dragonfly ^ Breeden Rescue ^ Bug ^ Honeybee ^ Centofante 3 ^ Woodcraft Mule ^SFO Visit Buys = Frn Stretch & Native 4 CF!! ^ Salt 1 ^ Burgundy Calypso ZDP-189 ^ Walker Blue Almite ^ Native 5 ^ Squeak ^ Chaparral ^ Urban Olive Green ^ STREET BEAT!!...
2012: Caly Jr (vintage/NIB!), SS Navigator-fave LBK of all time, Jester, Orange Dodo, CS Orange PM2,Techno, Bradley! AIR!!

User avatar
defenestrate
Member
Posts: 2395
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:33 am
Location: RTP NC area
Contact:

Postby defenestrate » Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:57 am

That knife is beautiful, Paul. i have some citrine here so I might try to adapt a spydie to use it (obviously with a hole rather than a stud opener, it will take some time and effort to do right). Will let you know if I get a project of this sort completed.
I drink, and I cut things.
-er, me, by way of Tyrion Lannister

jeep45238
Member
Posts: 223
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:46 pm

Postby jeep45238 » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:27 am

In my opinion, sometimes, but it's also all relative. To apply that same concept to almost every other aspect of our lives and you would have hardly anything - and then compare what remains to what many third world country citizens have, and we've still got it good. I have three knives, with three distinct purposes. I've got a fully serrated Native4 for my daily carry. I have a Military 2 for deployments. I have a Benchmade Morpho for kicks/collection. Personally I'm content, and think that with an ESSE 4 and a Kiwi I'll be pretty much set on knives for a very long time.


This country is unique and amazing, and I believe that we owe it to two simple things.

1) This country was founded upon greed, not need. Whatever you desire and are willing to work for is yours to EARN, and nobody else's to take away.
2) This country was founded upon a creed, not a religion, ethnicity, language, or currency. That in and of itself backs up number one.


Return to “Off-Topic”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 12 guests