Koch funded climate skeptics confirm global warming

[Sequimite]

Back in 2010, Richard Muller, a Berkeley physicist and self-proclaimed climate skeptic, decided to launch the Berkeley Earth Surface Temperature (BEST) project to review the temperature data that underpinned global-warming claims. Remember, this was not long after the Climategate affair had erupted, at a time when skeptics were griping that climatologists had based their claims on faulty temperature data.

Muller’s stated aims were simple. He and his team would scour and re-analyze the climate data, putting all their calculations and methods online. Skeptics cheered the effort. “I’m prepared to accept whatever result they produce, even if it proves my premise wrong,” wrote Anthony Watts, a blogger who has criticized the quality of the weather stations in the United Statse that provide temperature data. The Charles G. Koch Foundation even gave Muller’s project $150,000 — and the Koch brothers, recall, are hardly fans of mainstream climate science.

So what are the end results? Muller’s team appears to have confirmed the basic tenets of climate science. Back in March, Muller told the House Science and Technology Committee that, contrary to what he expected, the existing temperature data was “excellent.” He went on: “We see a global warming trend that is very similar to that previously reported by the other groups.” And, today, the BEST team has released a flurry of new papers that confirm that the planet is getting hotter. As the team’s two-page summary flatly concludes, “Global warming is real.”Here’s a chart comparing their findings with existing data: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezr ... _blog.html

[The Deacon]

So you're saying the effect, which was never really in doubt, has been confirmed while the attempt to blame it on human activities, rather than the same forces that have caused climate change for millions of years, remains as bogus as ever.

[Sequimite]

So you're saying the effect, which was never really in doubt, has been confirmed while the attempt to blame it on human activities, rather than the same forces that have caused climate change for millions of years, remains as bogus as ever.

You may not have doubted it but others have and do including the physicist that led this new study.

To you I suppose it's just a coincidence that global warming took off with the industrial revolution. You have stated that human over-population is causing a myriad of intractable problems but will not consider that rising temperatures may be one of them.

In fact though, I don't think it matters whether humans were the primary cause. The question is can humans do anything to reduce the future damage that is less expensive than doing nothing. I certainly don't know the answer.

[SolidState]

Highschool Chemistry teaches:

Hydrocarbon + Oxygen = CO2 + H2O

It's called combustion and is the primary source of energy for our society because we're dumb, lazy and scientifically illiterate as a society.

College chemistry teaches that chemical bonds are made of electrons, and that those bonds resonate at different energies depending on the nuclei (elements) involved in sharing those electrons. The same experiments allow us to characterize everything from medicines to plastics and nanoparticles. CO2 resonates and absorbs in the middle of infrared. H2O absorbs and resonates as heavily in the microwave region.

We use microwaves to heat food every day, and nobody claims they don't work, yet virtually the same response from CO2 is denied by jackass climatologists who are paid to ignore simple spectroscopy and basic chemistry. Then other people with the scientific literacy of a Chinese fifth grader go around and parrot the b.s. claims of the scientifically illiterate people that they follow like sheep without investigating science themselves.

News flash: Listening to politicians about science is almost as dumb as believing them about their stated intentions.

Go do some experiments to refute CO2's activities in conversion of sunlight to heat. Lets see what you find.

I know what I found while doing IR Spectroscopy for the Oil Research Corps from 2001-2006. Exxon, BP and Koch Industries know as well, and it's no surprise to them that science backs man's contributions to climate. It is first-year chemistry, and NO IT'S NOT UNDER DEBATE WITHIN THE SCIENTIFIC COMMUNITY. Any statements of that kind are b.s. propagandistic lies generated by industrial interests outside of the scientific community... MARKETING.

Many prove how effective flat-earth advertising is with the scientifically illiterate. We've had this talk before, and it was claimed that DuPont's data was a government conspiracy to raise taxes. Priceless!

If anything, this is a psychological study in denial and societal cognitive dissonance. Either that, or it is a brutally clear statement about the dismal state of the American intellect and scientific literacy.

Skepticism is not equivalent to science. Science requires that you test things, and all the tests show that infrared radiation is converted into molecular motion by CO2.

[SimpleIsGood229]

Peanut butter and banana is vastly superior to straight-up PB&J. I have much personally-gathered anecdotal evidence with which to prove this. The texture of the banana nicely compliments that of the peanut butter, as opposed to the more liquid consistency of most jellies. In addition to that, the toned-down sweetness of the banana --as opposed to the often excessive sweetness of jelly-- allows the various earthy complexities of the peanut butter to come through. In all, the PB&N is superior in most applications to the PB&J

:D

[Sequimite]

Bananas are a staple among bicyclists. On the morning of a big ride I'll have a peanut butter and banana sandwich or a chocolate brownie CLIF bar covered in peanut butter with a banana on the side.

[SimpleIsGood229]

I don't mean to de-rail the thread :D , but the Cool Mint Chocolate is my favorite Clif Bar so far.

You know, I'm thinking Nutella and banana would be pretty awesome. Perhaps peanut butter on one side, bananas in the middle, and Nutella on the other side...yes, that would be really nice. Geeze, I'm making meself hungry here.

[Dr. Snubnose]

Call me a skeptic...but I think there is more Global Whining then Global Warming....and I don't give a rat's a$$ if PP&J is not as good as PP&N....but it is a proven scientific fact (NOT DISPUTED BY THE SCIENTIFIC COMMUNITY) That Rats who text on their cell phones have a higher cancer rate than rats who don't!....... :p Doc :p

[Monocrom]

Last Winter was one of the coldest in NYC history.

Although common sense is dead, and has been for many years, it's alive and well in some of us.

[The Mastiff]

Someone here got me started on PB, bananas, and honey. Great stuff!

Joe

[Sequimite]

Last Winter was one of the coldest in NYC history.

Although common sense is dead, and has been for many years, it's alive and well in some of us.

Elevating a single datapoint as definitive and ignoring tens of thousands from around the world is common sense?

Like the old joke about the lottery being a tax on people who are poor at math this shows a lack of understanding of statistics. A moving average is composed of individual data points that are scattered. Particular points may be higher or lower than the average.

[Pinetreebbs]

I am awaiting the next large volcano eruption and the ensuing climate impact shenanigans. There was once an advertisement campaign, Don't fool with Mother Nature.

Above 60 degrees F, give a Wild Berry PowerBar® while I am waiting. If it is colder a PBJ made with strawberry jam will do, the PowerBar® is a little tough to eat when cold.

I hope I managed to cover the original topic and the sub topic. :)

[Pinetreebbs]

What is important about Koch funding? The DOE (US Taxpayer) is the largest contributor at $188,000.

From the Berkeley Earth web site:

"Funded through Novim, a 501(c)(3) corporation, the Berkeley Earth Surface Temperature study has received a total of $623,087 in financial support."

Donors

The Lee and Juliet Folger Fund ($20,000)
William K. Bowes, Jr. Foundation ($100,000)
Fund for Innovative Climate and Energy Research (created by Bill Gates) ($100,000)
Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation ($150,000)
The Ann & Gordon Getty Foundation ($50,000)

We have also received funding from a number of private individuals, totaling $14,500 as of June 2011.

Other Financial Support

This work was supported in part by the Director, Office of Science, of the U.S. Department of Energy under Contract No. DE-AC02-05CH11231 ($188,587)

[JNewell]

C'mon, you think truth matters if you have money on your side? :rolleyes: Really, now... :o

[Blerv]

I'm a firm believer that people will continue to exist and evolve unless completely wiped from the planet. If the second happens it's very likely nothing could be done to prevent it.

Worrying about things that cannot be controlled only accomplishes by increasing your stress. It's likely my fate will be sealed by hear disease, a car accident, or a coconut falling from a tree compared to slow-cooking in our ozone layer.

I'm just hoping future generations adapt in a badass way like those Sand People from Star Wars. "Ruh ruh ruhhh! *swings club*"

[jabba359]

Global warming has been around for at least 12,500 years (which marked the end of the most recent glacial period). Since then, the planet has been warming and the glaciers retreating. Scientists are still not sure if we are completely out of the most recent ice age. So I believe that global warming is partially independent of human influence. If humans did not exist, the planet would still be warming.

Don't get me wrong, however, as I do believe that humans have made a contribution to the rapidity with which temperatures have risen the last century. But to say global warming is man-made is a half-truth at best. While I have no idea to what degree humans have influenced the warming, I believe that we should do our best to develop technologies that keep our planet as clean and natural as possible. I recycle as much as I can, walk to the grocery store rather than drive, and try to be energy conscientious by turning off unused lights, driving with a soft touch, only using grocery bags when I have to, etc. While we may or may not be able to affect climate change, I feel we still have a responsibility to be guardians of our planet and protect it for ourselves and future generations.

[The Deacon]

Guess the biggest problem for me is all the other cause and effect relationship science has established, only to reverse itself a decade or three later.

Given all the possible sources of CO2 and the fact that climate is gone through changes before, I will continue to take the claims that human activity is the primary culprit with a very large grain of salt. Which is not to say I feel human presence on this earth is benign. Far from it, I think we're well on our way to breeding ourselves into a worldwide famine. I also suspect that many of the proposed remedies, if implemented, like replacing gasoline engines with batteries will be discovered to do more damage than good. It's happened fairly often in the past.

Maybe there's a touch of selfishness involved as well. While I don't think I go out of my way to waste energy, I'd be very unwilling to told I had to sacrifice even a little bit my comfort in a feeble and futile attempt to postpone the day of reckoning. Drastic problems call for drastic solutions, overpopulation is the real problem and it won't cure itself, at least not in a pleasant way.

[EarthDog]

...Maybe there's a touch of selfishness involved as well. While I don't think I go out of my way to waste energy, I'd be very unwilling to told I had to sacrifice even a little bit my comfort in a feeble and futile attempt to postpone the day of reckoning. Drastic problems call for drastic solutions, ...

I'd say that frames the real question quite well. What can we do about it? What are we willing to do about it?

The consensus among climatologists is that global warming is both real and caused primarily by human generation of green house gases. Sure, science has self-corrected before, but the scientific consensus is the best we have at this time. We will not get a better analysis by K-Street lobbyists, oil rich billionaires, politicians, or even meteorolgists (who study weather, not climate).

If we do nothing but continue on the present course, we may not like the outcome. Human civilization arose under conditions that favor agriculture. A hotter earth may not be so kind to us.

As to what we can do about it, I believe we are way behind on addressing it.

[dbcad]

Climate change is happening. There's no other way to explain the global ice caps and glaciers melting at such a rapid rate. We will all see the change in our lifetime. You can't call it "global warming" rather it will be a form of climate change.

Because of the huge artic melt off ocean currents will change bringing different patterns of weather. Folks need to acknowledge that this change is coming and will be here no matter what we do now. This is a very serious subject. I have been trained in science and have heard and read the evidence. Weather patterns will and are changing. All we can do now is see what the ride will be like :)

Have to add... The Koch brothers are pieces of dung. Using their wealth to destroy the environment and influence politics for their own selfish gain. They are behind the push for a 2 tier society, the haves and have nots. I would hope their influence is curtailed in the future. I detest their type of selfish big money..............

[JNewell]

I'm a firm believer that people will continue to exist and evolve unless completely wiped from the planet. If the second happens it's very likely nothing could be done to prevent it.

Worrying about things that cannot be controlled only accomplishes by increasing your stress. It's likely my fate will be sealed by hear disease, a car accident, or a coconut falling from a tree compared to slow-cooking in our ozone layer.

I'm just hoping future generations adapt in a badass way like those Sand People from Star Wars. "Ruh ruh ruhhh! *swings club*"

But in all seriousness, good faith, good fellowship and good will, how do you know what can be controlled unless you try? Per ardua ad astra?