How to throw a knife combat style

[Waco]

Anyone from 1 inch to 17 feet would be in some serious trouble.

Do you train with moving targets?

[Blerv]

This thread offers some interesting discourse. I still find it extremely off-topic and it's moving a bit further along the chest beating path. Let's stop and talk about some of the concepts presented without beating a dead horse, or in this case, throwing a knife into one. :p

History

Knife throwing for combat is a very limited art. In these situations there have been select warriors throughout history, particularly in places like India, Africa and parts of Asia such as Indonesia. Traditionally these are light armored, blade cultures. Missile and melee weapons, etc. The difference is many of these tribes have leaned towards throwing rings or multiple-tipped knives which appear more club-like in nature. I can see this being effective in situations for more than the standard 17 feet; lob it into the crowd of warriors and you're bound to stick someone.

The throwing knife was mostly popularized in the USA by circus and festivals. A few armed forces around the world have attempted to work it into their curriculum. The closest (IMHO) to come to a practical conclusion is the Russian Spetsnaz with the Ballistic Knife.

Pros

Obviously there is a range of methodology to the throwing knife. I would hope most have a short game and the throwing side down well. With multiple tools you don't always "give them your weapon".

More than the silent aspect (see Rambo) is the mass factor. I'm no physics major but momentum = mass x velocity. That means a successful hit is a sizable one with a large entry point delivered with a significant "thump".

Cons

The list (IMHO) far outweighs the pros. You essentially have a very limited amount of heavy ammunition, a VERY short effective range which isn't consistent from 1-17 feet. In reality due to the travel path it's probably what, 2/3'rds of that towards the end of the knife's travel? Most people would think an American Derringer is a HORRIBLE weapon let alone defense piece, still it offers an advantage in every way while being concealable and legal with a concealed carry permit.

In 17 feet (which is probably idealistic while being attacked) you don't even have enough time to chamber another throw before someone with ANY skill can close on you. Likely they are armed with a similar weapon and mid-swing. At close range the average throwing knife is a miserable knife, seriously, compare it to a Ronin, Rock Salt, CRK Hissatsu, etc.

Let's just pretend you are two lone soldiers in a 16th century battlefield (why not?). Even at the max range you listed, 17 feet, a successful hit means what? There are very few "kill shots" in the heat of adrenalin but plenty of stories of people dying afterwards from a knife wound IF struck in the right place multiple times. How many stories have you heard of a person delivering multiple chest shots while fighting off people for minutes?

So delivering one Battleship "hit" to someone closing on you only probably pissed them off. While the other person holding a tool with the intent of solely delivering multiple strikes per second not including the rush of their body weight against your stationary self.

Summary

I have no bladed combat experience. If I did I wouldn't be dumb enough to brag about it because it's illegal to stab people (thank God). I do know that in the fit of rage you rarely find people in the ER with one knife wound, it's in the dozens and far too gruesome to look at.

In the primitive missile weapon category the throwing knife is one of the interesting picks. It has a certain flair and intrigue to it, similar to the American Bullwhip. The problem is when it gets boiled down to the elements you run into the problem that it has rarely (if ever) been effectively used by countless people through history for the sole purpose of killing things. People have hunted varmints in Africa with throwing sticks and non-returning boomerangs but not deer. Even when compared to various eccentric Wushu weapons like the rope dart it falls flat on it's face in accuracy, distance, and repeatable use.

Sure in any situation a tool can become a weapon. A wood chisel becomes a dagger if you are attacked in the woodshop (:confused :) but there are more logical choices whether you are a knife throwing ring fighter or a normal Joe citizen.

I would certainly invite people to link articles and give their .02 cents on the topic. In all honesty I have a limited and biased stance on the topic as well as a juvenile education in physics.

[Shike]

I recall many years ago Skeeter Vaughn told the story in a knife magazine. I believe he was a Mocassin ranger during WWII. Here is all I could find.
http://users.rcn.com/comlogic/knife/his ... keeter.htm

If I recall correctly from Vaughn's interview the knife hit the sentry in the back somewhere between shoulders and neck, but I am an old geezer and my memory fails me :D He did go on to become a movie actor.

[extremethrower]

no but i move and throw

Check this tidbit > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNhYJgDdCu4

[extremethrower]

Does Spyderco sell throwers?

[Waco]

Does Spyderco sell throwers?

I think that would go against their marketing approach of selling practical knives that you carry regularly.

[Blerv]

I wish they did. Then this thread wouldn't belong in off-topic.

[Jordan]

Is anyone in the military taught to throw knives? It looks cool in the movies, but it sounds like a big gamble with a moving target. Unless you hit a vital organ, your enemy is still a threat and now he has your knife.

Nope, nor are we taught back-flip-hatchet-throws, ninja-smoke-escapes, or how to hang off the side of a building by our finger tips... all of which would be extremely useful in very specific situations (mostly when confronted by angry NCOs :p ). I am just a regular Army junior enlisted type, so I can't vouch for high speed special forces units... but I would venture to posit that nobody gets combat knife throwing training from the US military. On the other hand, I've never been to a field exercise where someone wasn't trying to plant a ka-bar into a post to kill time... so it is a skill that quite a few people develop for fun. I've even seen a few guys that could potentially be deadly with a thrown knife.

[wrdwrght]

Nope, nor are we taught back-flip-hatchet-throws, ninja-smoke-escapes, or how to hang off the side of a building by our finger tips...

The only steel I was taught to throw in my training for Vietnam was the artillery projectile. Other than that, it was all about throwing lead.

I do recall some guy asking our Ranger instructor about throwing knives. In response, the instructor asked him why he would want to give the enemy a weapon... I think that says it all.

[Jordan]

The only steel I was taught to throw in my training for Vietnam was the artillery projectile. Other than that, it was all about throwing lead.

I do recall some guy asking our Ranger instructor about throwing knives. In response, the instructor asked him why he would want to give the enemy a weapon... I think that says it all.

I had no idea you were a fellow redleg. :)

[wrdwrght]

I had no idea you were a fellow redleg. :)

Yup. 155mmSP, but half my time was spent as an FO with a Vietnamese Ranger battalion. At 6'4", I sorta stood out...

[Jordan]

Yup. 155mmSP, but half my time was spent as an FO with a Vietnamese Ranger battalion. At 6'4", I sorta stood out...

Heh, no doubt... you musta been the units human periscope :p . My unit rolled with the Paladin (also 155, also SP... maybe same type of gun you folks had, no idea when we started using it :p ) up until recently. We got changed from a heavy brigade combat team to a stryker brigade combat team, which meant no more tracks, which meant we had to train up on towed pieces. Hopefully we will get some M777s before the next deployment... cause right now we are using M198s that definitely look like they have seen better days (code for: held together with old grease, duct tape, and hope :p )