Looking at Cold .45's, what are these weird brands that make them?

[tacticooledc]

I see brands like Citadel and Bersa that make the 1911, are these chinese made or something or in someway inferior to the Colt counterpart? :confused:

[SolidState]

Cold?

[J32A2]

Think you mean Colt.

[tacticooledc]

I failed

[SolidState]

I've been wondering the same thing for some time now. Basically, there are a few makers worldwide. Some of the better ones are in the Philippines. There is now a wide variety in quality, metal, and build based upon who is making them. You can find anything about 1911s on youtube/forums though. Plenty of people have opinions.

[chuck_roxas45]

Cold Steel .45... yeh outa be good.

[marlinspike]

A lot of the cheap ones are made in either the Phillipines or South America.

Personally, I like STI, made in TX. I've thought about getting a Les Baer, but I'd need a higher paying job lol.

[THE PUNISHER]

sti is good..

[marlinspike]

BTW, as far as likely less expensive (than STI) 1911s that are made in the USA, apparently Ruger will be releasing a 1911 soon.

[Dr. Snubnose]

Cold Steel .45... yeh outa be good.

LOL....Stick that Barrel right thru a car hood.... Doc :D

[defenestrate]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX0MB7pJtKs

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/lX0MB7pJtKs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Jordan]

Everyone makes a 1911 pattern pistol... almost everyone, anyway. They range from low quality chinese copies all the way to full out custom race guns. It is a testament to Browning's engineering prowess that a 100 year old design is so popular today that this is the case. Too answer your question directly, most of the non-Colt models are inferior to an actual Colt. On the other hand, many of them are markedly SUPERIOR to a Colt, and many of them are about the same at a markedly lower price. It can be confusing to a brand new gun owner or prospective gun owner. I've heard many a story about people getting turned off to the model altogether because of some bad first impressions. If you are considering one for your first pistol... you should know something about the hierarchy of 1911 price and quality.

I've found certain things to be true of foreign imports. Generally, avoid most Asian country of origins. The only exception I've found is those made in the Philippines. Which is good, because frankly... most of the affordable 1911's out there were made in the Philippines and imported by some American company. If you are interested in building your own, you could do worse than a Armscor 1911 for your base. I actually find this just a little ironic. If you believe the somewhat apocryphal origin story behind the .45 ACP cartridge and the pistol most widely associated with it, then it was invented to deal with Philippino fighters that shrugged off .38s like raindrops.

If you don't trust imports at all, there are quite a few American made models that you should look into... Springfield Armory is probably the best bang for your buck (just a little bit of pun intended :p ). I've heard good things about the Remington R1 as well. You also can't go wrong with Para ordinance, Kimber (basic models start under 1000$, so I see them as bridging the gap between production quality and custom quality 1911's), Colt, RRA, and others that I've no doubt forgotten to mention. I'd say you are looking at 600-1200$ for a pistol in this quality tier. Maybe a tad less if you find a used one or if you are friendly enough with your local gunshop to get a deal... maybe a tad higher for a few of those brands.

Les Baer, Ed Brown, Bill Wilson, SV, STI, Nighthawk, the higher end portions of the Kimber product line, Cylinder and Slide, and countless others round out the mix with full on custom builds. Some, like C&S, start with an off the shelf model, swap out and fit aftermarket parts, and refinish. IIRC, they use a Sprinfield Armory model as their base. Some, like Baer, Brown, and Wilson manufacture most of their parts (if not all of them) at their own facilities. SV (Strayer Voight sp?) and STI are really sort of specialty shops for competition guns. I think they both have limited lines of carry oriented guns too though. If you have two or three grand burning a hole in your bank account, any of these fine pistols can be yours :p . I kid... some are much, much more expensive than that.

I would also caution someone who is new to gun ownership against buying a 1911 with the intent of modifying it. Because... well... I did that. On the upside, I learned an awful lot about gunsmithing trying to figure out how to fit parts by hand into my first hogleg. On the downside... it was a rather expensive and hazardous crash course. My fondest (seeing as this is the internet, most of you won't be able to note that I say fondest in the most sarcastic possible sense of the word) memory is ruining a 200$ Wilson Combat barrel by failing to install the pin that keeps the barrel cam attached to the barrel properly. That wasn't the most exciting catastrophic malfunction I caused, as the sear/disconnector/trigger combo that I didn't file down to a proper fit made my pistol into a rather unwieldy 8 shot submachine gun at one point. Good times :D . I figure between the initial 300$ investment in the shot out Firearms International (well, Armscor 1911 imported by Firearms International anyway) pistol, parts, and then replacement parts for those that I messed up... I probably could have just saved my money and bought a Les Baer :p .

Er... to summarize, the reason there are so many on the market is that imitation is the highest form of flattery. And they range from very bad to much better than the original. As usual, apologies for being a bit long winded, your experience may differ, et cetera et cetera.

[tacticooledc]

Everyone makes a 1911 pattern pistol... almost everyone, anyway. They range from low quality chinese copies all the way to full out custom race guns. It is a testament to Browning's engineering prowess that a 100 year old design is so popular today that this is the case. Too answer your question directly, most of the non-Colt models are inferior to an actual Colt. On the other hand, many of them are markedly SUPERIOR to a Colt, and many of them are about the same at a markedly lower price. It can be confusing to a brand new gun owner or prospective gun owner. I've heard many a story about people getting turned off to the model altogether because of some bad first impressions. If you are considering one for your first pistol... you should know something about the hierarchy of 1911 price and quality.

I've found certain things to be true of foreign imports. Generally, avoid most Asian country of origins. The only exception I've found is those made in the Philippines. Which is good, because frankly... most of the affordable 1911's out there were made in the Philippines and imported by some American company. If you are interested in building your own, you could do worse than a Armscor 1911 for your base. I actually find this just a little ironic. If you believe the somewhat apocryphal origin story behind the .45 ACP cartridge and the pistol most widely associated with it, then it was invented to deal with Philippino fighters that shrugged off .38s like raindrops.

If you don't trust imports at all, there are quite a few American made models that you should look into... Springfield Armory is probably the best bang for your buck (just a little bit of pun intended :p ). I've heard good things about the Remington R1 as well. You also can't go wrong with Para ordinance, Kimber (basic models start under 1000$, so I see them as bridging the gap between production quality and custom quality 1911's), Colt, RRA, and others that I've no doubt forgotten to mention. I'd say you are looking at 600-1200$ for a pistol in this quality tier. Maybe a tad less if you find a used one or if you are friendly enough with your local gunshop to get a deal... maybe a tad higher for a few of those brands.

Les Baer, Ed Brown, Bill Wilson, SV, STI, Nighthawk, the higher end portions of the Kimber product line, Cylinder and Slide, and countless others round out the mix with full on custom builds. Some, like C&S, start with an off the shelf model, swap out and fit aftermarket parts, and refinish. IIRC, they use a Sprinfield Armory model as their base. Some, like Baer, Brown, and Wilson manufacture most of their parts (if not all of them) at their own facilities. SV (Strayer Voight sp?) and STI are really sort of specialty shops for competition guns. I think they both have limited lines of carry oriented guns too though. If you have two or three grand burning a hole in your bank account, any of these fine pistols can be yours :p . I kid... some are much, much more expensive than that.

I would also caution someone who is new to gun ownership against buying a 1911 with the intent of modifying it. Because... well... I did that. On the upside, I learned an awful lot about gunsmithing trying to figure out how to fit parts by hand into my first hogleg. On the downside... it was a rather expensive and hazardous crash course. My fondest (seeing as this is the internet, most of you won't be able to note that I say fondest in the most sarcastic possible sense of the word) memory is ruining a 200$ Wilson Combat barrel by failing to install the pin that keeps the barrel cam attached to the barrel properly. That wasn't the most exciting catastrophic malfunction I caused, as the sear/disconnector/trigger combo that I didn't file down to a proper fit made my pistol into a rather unwieldy 8 shot submachine gun at one point. Good times :D . I figure between the initial 300$ investment in the shot out Firearms International (well, Armscor 1911 imported by Firearms International anyway) pistol, parts, and then replacement parts for those that I messed up... I probably could have just saved my money and bought a Les Baer :p .

Er... to summarize, the reason there are so many on the market is that imitation is the highest form of flattery. And they range from very bad to much better than the original. As usual, apologies for being a bit long winded, your experience may differ, et cetera et cetera.

Not at all, you've been most helpful- thanks.

[gac]

BTW, as far as likely less expensive (than STI) 1911s that are made in the USA, apparently Ruger will be releasing a 1911 soon.

Yes, the news came out today.
http://rugerforum.net/ruger-pistols/343 ... r1911.html

http://www.ruger.com/products/sr1911/models.html