Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

[Naperville]

https://youtu.be/Kb-Mao9UkZo

Jim

[+1]

Use that 3-Day Test for everything and save yourself from a world of hurt.

[James Y]

[+1]

Use that 3-Day Test for everything and save yourself from a world of hurt.

This video shows an example of a Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu black belt who did NOT use the 3-Day Test.

The second part of the vid shows another example where another BJJ guy was successful against a gunman. The narrator says the situations are similar, but they’re clearly not. The gunman in the first example was the defender and had been taken down.. The gunman in the second example was committing a holdup, and either he didn’t have a killer’s mindset, and/or his gun was fake, or wasn’t loaded, etc. More than likely, he had expected the victim to comply, and hadn’t really intended to shoot anyone.

https://youtu.be/1iNsYsZzphg

Jim

[James Y]

*Oops. Somehow double posted while editing my post.

Jim

[James Y]

“Dojo Storming” (Dojoyaburi, or Dojoarashi).

“Dojo Storming” is when one school, or a practitioner of one martial art, enters another school and makes a challenge to the instructor. Or sometimes to the students. It was a tradition in Japanese martial arts in the past. The same was common in Chinese martial arts as well, in which the practice was referred to as Ti Guan. Chinese martial arts schools are not called dojos, but for simplicity’s sake in this post, I’m just going to call the practice “dojo storming.”

In a very notorious incident from 1970, John Keehan, AKA “Count Dante,” took some of his Karate students to storm a Kung Fu school, and one of Keehan’s students, who was also a close friend, was killed during the invasion of the other school. Although not mentioned in recent sources, I recall reading decades ago that his friend had been killed with a sword. This happened in Chicago.

I remember as a kid, a few instances where challengers came in off the street to challenge my Kenpo instructor to spar or fight. In each and every time, he made them put on some gloves, and he outsparred them easily (and not gently). One guy he beat towards the doorway, then punched him so hard the guy fell outside onto the sidewalk. Then he told the guy, “Take the gloves off and leave ‘em.”

My Shito-ryu Karate Sensei from Japan once KO’d a Chinese guy who came in off the street to challenge, dressed in full stereotypical “Kung Fu” garb, complete with Chinese frog button jacket and Tai Chi slippers. Maybe he thought he was Bruce Lee storming the Japanese dojo in Fist of Fury, lol. The Chinese guy had skill, though; he actually beat one of sensei’s black belts first. Thinking back on it, I'm guessing he might have been a practitioner of Bak Siu Lum (Northern Shaolin). Then Sensei sauntered onto the mat with a smirk on his face. He foot-swept the guy off his feet, and punched the guy’s solar plexus area hard as he was in mid-air. The guy fell hard to the mat. It was over. Sensei kind of chuckled to himself, then told a couple of his black belts to drag the guy outside and leave him lying there, like taking out the trash. That calm, cold smirk never left Sensei’s face.

My second Mantis Teacher in Taiwan, Sifu Peng, got challenges here and there, because he was a young teacher who was just establishing himself. One time a nut case came by and made a direct challenge to him. The nut case fancied himself a ninja, and pulled out a sharpened piece of metal about 2.5 feet long that he’d been carrying in his rear waistband. Then he quickly backpedaled “movie ninja style” into an on guard position. Sifu Peng took a flexible, unsharpened dan dao (AKA darn dao, or broadsword/saber), and they had a “sword fight.” Sifu Peng struck the guy around the arms and shoulders. But the deranged guy was also quick and swung his homemade “sword,” taking a chunk of flesh off of Sifu Peng’s forearm, which left a good-sized scar afterwards. The challenge fight lasted only several seconds. The guy dropped his sword at one point, then weirdly bowed “Japanese style,” and left.

Sometimes Sifu Peng’s advanced students took challenges on his behalf. I accepted a few of them. A couple backed down and left. One guy had been a senior classmate of Sifu Peng, and was himself a highly-certified teacher, who had brought along several of his own students to watch. This guy was certified by a famous grand master (whom I won’t name) to teach multiple styles (Baji, Bagua, Chen-style Tai Chi, Mantis) in university Kung Fu clubs, and he also taught hand to hand at the police academy. We sparred and I handled him easily. At one point I had him bent over with his arm twisted, and was kicking him in his torso. Sifu Peng broke it up and said it was a draw. Later, I heard from others that Sifu Peng privately told them that I had easily beaten his senior classmate, but he had tried to allow his senior classmate to save face in front of his students by declaring it a draw.

I fought another guy, who was a member of the Taiwan full-contact Leitai (the same as Sanda) team, because he came by and hurt one of my classmates. He kicked my leg, so I punched him once, hard (bare-fisted) between the eyes. Not the most effective place to hit him, but he stumbled around a bit and fell flat on his face. When he got up, he gave up.

Am I mentioning these incidents to say how great I am? ABSOLUTELY NOT. I honestly believe I handled those particular guys easily because, one, maybe they weren’t as good as they or others thought they were. And also remember the saying, “styles make fights.” Meaning personal styles, not systems. Sometimes certain individuals are “cryptonite” to certain other individuals, irrespective of “style,” or sometimes even regardless of skill level. I know I’ve had certain individuals I was never able to consistently get the better of in sparring.

Below are a couple related videos:

https://youtu.be/zsDNtkPkS08

The following video has been making the rounds, and was mentioned in the previous vid. Not great, but it shows an example of a disrespectful visitor to a backyard school challenging the methods of the instructor, in this case a Wing Chun teacher. The “challenger” claims to do Jeet Kune Do. But it’s obvious the visitor is just a disrespectful schmuck with zero social skills, nor any ability to read verbal or physical cues. It turns into more of a common brawl than a “style vs style” fight. I think it definitely could have been handled better before it escalated, but stuff happens, and hindsight is 20/20.

Warning: This video contains some strong language.

https://youtu.be/7Mosz2Pj0WA

Jim

[Naperville]

I was at a school cookout and a black belt in Taekwondo and at least 1+ years of escrima who I had easily defeated in sparring 5 to 6 months earlier wanted to "spar" with me....this goof was shaking and almost foaming at the mouth. I was like, "Whoa whoa whoa...this does not look good, do you understand?" He just looked at me.

Some of these people hold grudges for in school sparring! I could not believe it.

NO. I did not spar with him. If I would have, it would have been an out and out full on brawl, and I saw this guy in class 3 to 4 days a week! I felt sorry for him in a way.

[James Y]

Naperville,

You did the right thing by not sparring him again. It sounds like he was mentally unstable. Nothing good would have come of it.

One thing I noticed over the decades is that, while I’ve met many great people in martial arts, I’ve also encountered many weird people in martial arts. Both here in the States and in Taiwan. There’s something about martial arts that seems to attract people who are weirdos, or at least unstable. Most people I’ve met in martial arts have been normal; many were arrogant; but when the people were weird, oftentimes they were friggin’ wacko. And it’s been both males and females. Maybe it’s the “exoticism”, or the idea of gaining some kind of power over others to overcome their deep-seated insecurities. It’s not limited to so-called “traditional” martial arts, either. The first martial arts weirdos I ever encountered were in the Kenpo school I trained at (my first stand-up fighting/striking art), and that school was very non-traditional. I’m sure that MMA, Krav Maga, modern combatives, etc., get their share of wackos, too. Although I have noticed that the more militaristic the schools were (such as in the Japanese Karate dojo I trained in), there were far fewer weirdos who joined, or they dropped out pretty quickly.

Jim

[James Y]

It’s been 48 years…

This past July 20th was the 48th anniversary of Bruce Lee’s passing. He died in 1973 at the young age of 32. Think about that. How many people have made such a powerful and lasting impact, and positively inspired more people in their lives by the age of 32, that they are still inspiring people and being discussed to such a level nearly 50 years after their passing? Not to discount anybody’s life, but I bring this up because in recent years, it has been the popular trend to bash Bruce Lee. Everybody knows about Quentin Tarantino’s bashing of Bruce’s character in QT’s last movie. But this has been going on for years. Especially in martial arts and MMA forums. More and more, it’s not only about Bruce Lee’s supposed “lack of real fighting skill,” but now it’s progressed to outright character assassination. Bruce Lee receives more criticism and character assassination than Charles Manson, John Wayne Gacy, and Ted Buddy combined. Hmmm. Why is that? It’s because Bruce Lee’s name and success trigger those with deep-seated inferiority complexes.

The news becoming more prevalent now surrounding his use of marijuana and other stuff (most likely for relief from a back injury he suffered in 1969 that almost ended Bruce’s ability to train in martial arts). His supposedly having had a mistress(es), etc. If we put a microscope on the lives of his critics, we would find many skeletons in their closets, and probably far more of them.

For those who say that Bruce Lee wasn’t really a good martial artist, and pick apart every bit of footage to confirm their views, the implication is, ”I’m better than Bruce Lee was, and I could have beaten him. That makes me better than the so-called greatest martial artist that ever lived. See how great I am!”

That’s the reason, plain and simple. While the rest jump on the bandwagon, because…the internet. In reality, what have any of these negative people accomplished in their lives to inspire countless others around the world? Other than some maybe having a YouTube channel. But WHO HAVE THEY INSPIRED IN A POSITIVE WAY??

One of the biggest criticisms is that “Bruce Lee was only an actor.” What they fail to realize is that Bruce Lee was an anomaly. Yes, he originally came from an acting background; his father, Lee Hoi-Chuen, had been a Cantonese Opera singer and film actor, which no doubt resulted in Bruce being a child actor in several films, starting years before he ever studied martial arts. This doesn’t mean that Bruce Lee was not an elite martial artist. Ask countless tough and respectful martial artists who either trained with or worked with him: Taky Kimura, Dan Inosanto, Jesse Glover, James DeMile, Robert Baker, Richard Bustillo, Jim Kelly, Louis Delgado (the last Karate fighter to defeat Chuck Norris in competition when Chuck was still at his peak), Wally Jay, Leo Fong, Skipper Mullins, Gene LeBell, and many more, have all attested to Bruce’s phenomenal abilities, far beyond his movie persona. Even the late Joe Lewis, who had trained with Bruce but later had a falling-out with him, gave Bruce his due respect, even if he also had some criticisms. The late Karate fighter Louis Delgado, mentioned above, had actually free-sparred with Bruce Lee and was in awe, and had stated that he had never faced anybody on Bruce Lee’s level. I repeat: Louis Delgado had fought Chuck Norris in competition, and had even defeated Chuck.

As for Chuck Norris, he has passive-aggressively trash-talked Bruce Lee over the years. Chuck should be grateful to Bruce Lee; without him, Chuck would have remained an unknown (to the general public) Karate teacher and former Karate fighter. He literally owes all of his success as Chuck Norris the celebrity to Bruce Lee, and he shows his gratitude by putting him down and lying about how he taught Bruce Lee how to high kick. Bruce met Chuck in either 1967 or 1968; there is footage of Bruce showing off world-class high kicks as early as 1964 and 1965. They may have done some technique exchanging, but to claim he taught Bruce how to high kick is a lie.

Chuck also lied about having been a professional fighter. I remember watching a talk show in the early ‘80s where the host asked Chuck if he ever fought full-contact. Without hesitation, Chuck said, “No, I never did. Full contact came along after I was already retired from competition.” Fast-forward to just several years ago…Chuck stated that he had been an undefeated world champion professional fighter, and the host asked him, “Was that in full-contact kickboxing?” And Chuck grinned and said, “Yes, it was.”

So which was it, Chuck? Fortunately, I have a good memory and caught him in a lie. Maybe he thought nobody would remember, or never thought there’d come a day when anybody could just look up the information. Chuck has also smirkingly implied that he would have beaten Bruce Lee because “I was a professional fighter.” It depends on how you define a professional fighter. Chuck only ever competed in point Karate matches, and the time he was paid was when he was part of a Karate tournament ‘dream team,’ in which the team had received some pay. Which means that technically he had been a ‘professional fighter.’ He’s said some other stuff that puts Bruce down in a passive-aggressive manner, when he should be GRATEFUL that he even has the platform that he has, in large part because of Bruce Lee.

And I am not a Bruce Lee cult worshipper. But before people criticize, or buy into all the posthumous criticism and character assassination of Bruce Lee, they should actually listen to people who either knew him or had worked with him, and had nothing to gain for themselves by either putting him on a pedestal, or putting him down.

In the videos below, the late former Karate fighter Jim Kelly (who also co-starred in Enter the Dragon) shares some thoughts on Bruce Lee:

https://youtu.be/2CYHzi7jDG8

https://youtu.be/a9x9TP5eGqQ

Jim

[James Y]

More on Bruce Lee: Three Videos.

The late Richard Bustillo on Bruce Lee:

https://youtu.be/enRw_exx4AA

Bruce Lee demonstration at the 1964 Long Beach International Karate Championships. Assisting Bruce was his student Taky Kimura. Much of this film footage is just Bruce Lee standing around talking (there is no sound). The best part of this video clip is from about 4:23 to about 4:32; Bruce Lee showing his amazing kicking speed. You can clearly see that the film was not sped up. The Master Zhang in Taiwan I mentioned several posts ago had similar sudden, explosive kicking speed:

https://youtu.be/gU5OwNzZjxM

Bruce Lee’s 1-inch punch and 6-inch punch. TBH, his “6-inch punch” looks more like a 12-inch to 18-inch punch. IIRC, this footage was shot at the 1967 Long Beach International Karate Championships, and I also read somewhere that the footage was shot by Jay Sebring, the hairstylist to the stars, who had first met Bruce Lee at the 1964 Internationals, and had been instrumental in bringing him to the attention of Hollywood. This was the same Jay Sebring who, along with Sharon Tate, Abigail Folger, and Wojciech (AKA Voytek) Frykowski, became a murder victim at 10500 Cielo Drive in 1969, by members of the Manson Family.

https://youtu.be/TVmraXBRzek

Jim

[Naperville]

My knowledge is rather limited so forgive me for the people that I omit...

These people, Bruce Lee(JKD), Kano Jigoro Shihan(Judo), GM Cabales(Cabales Serrada Escrima), Funakoshi Gichin (Shotokan Karate), Mas Oyama(Kyokushin Karate), GM Giron(Bahala Na), Jigoro Kano(Jiu-Jitsu), GM Taboada(Balintawak), Helio Gracie(BJJ), and maybe 10 to 15 others are/were unbelievable. Obviously, as I said, I do not know of all the excellent and once great creators of martial arts systems over the last 150 years. They were the CREATORS of art systems, not just practitioners.

They only come along once every 200 years. They need to be treasured. We would not have martial arts without them.

[James Y]

My knowledge is rather limited so forgive me for the people that I omit...

These people, Bruce Lee(JKD), Kano Jigoro Shihan(Judo), GM Cabales(Cabales Serrada Escrima), Funakoshi Gichin (Shotokan Karate), Mas Oyama(Kyokushin Karate), GM Giron(Bahala Na), Jigoro Kano(Jiu-Jitsu), GM Taboada(Balintawak), Helio Gracie(BJJ), and maybe 10 to 15 others are/were unbelievable. Obviously, as I said, I do not know of all the excellent and once great creators of martial arts systems over the last 150 years. They were the CREATORS of art systems, not just practitioners.

They only come along once every 200 years. They need to be treasured. We would not have martial arts without them.

Thanks, and agreed.

Another name I would add to the list is less well-known to many…Okinawan Karate master Motobu Choki. The style he founded in 1922, which is very rare, is Motobu-ryu.

The Karate videos by Jesse Enkamp are quite good:

https://youtu.be/BfXWu4AteXg

Jim

[James Y]

Not martial arts-related, but a good reminder to never underestimate anybody. Especially an angry person armed with a knife:

https://youtu.be/Un9w8AZWWYs

Jim

[James Y]

After posting one of my favorite songs by the late Lou Reed in the “What are you listening to?” thread, I remembered that in his later years, Lou Reed was an avid proponent of Chen style Taiji Quan (Tai Chi), under Master Ren Guangyi:

https://youtu.be/rZrKK3GMRPA

Jim

[James Y]

1-Inch Punch (and two demo videos below).

“Everybody” knows about Bruce Lee’s 1-inch punch (of course, there are also 2-inch, 3-inch, etc., punches). Exact same concept, just varying distances. Bruce Lee did NOT invent the 1-inch punch. He was just the first to openly demonstrate it to American audiences. There are also 1-inch palm, elbow, shoulder, etc., strikes. These are found in various Chinese martial arts systems. There is nothing magical or superhuman about it; it is rooted in mental intent, technique, and full-body mechanics.

In Taiwan, Sifu Peng taught me his 1-inch punch, and also a “no-inch punch.” The latter method begins with the closed fist already in contact with the body (without measuring with the fingertips, which is only for demonstrations), and the power generated is like a sudden spasm, or ‘pulse,’ similar to a sudden sneeze. This will not send a person flying back; the sudden jolt, if done with full intent into the solar plexes area, will knock the wind out of you (at least), and the tendency is for the recipient to either fold up and drop on the spot, or momentarily freeze, then stumble away, and bend over, and maybe go to their knees. I felt Sifu Peng’s “no-inch punch,” done with only enough power so I could feel it, and it knocked the wind out of me. I could only imagine if it had been done full-force.

Such techniques were not intended to be used in isolation, but were designed to be used in close quarters with an opponent, if/when your hand (or elbow, shoulder, etc.) is already in contact with the opponent’s body, and you have no time or room to deliver a full blow. Sometimes multiple, rapid-fire short strikes with the same hand can be applied to create some other opening. At the very least, it may create some distance, cause some distraction, and hopefully discomfort. The power begins from the feet, spirals through the legs, the hips, the back, the shoulder, and through the wrist and into the target. That sounds like a lot, but all of these things occur in a split-second. The entire body is working as a single unit.

In reality, when a human body stumbles or flies backwards through the air from a 1-or 3-inch punch (which is more dramatic-looking in demonstrations), it means that the force has been dissipated in some way, either by the protective padding on the recipient, or in the delivery. Or because a bony surface like the sternum has been struck. If the full force of an inch strike penetrates into the soft tissues of an unpadded, unprotected body, the effect will NOT be visually dramatic, and the recipient’s body will move little upon contact. But the effect on the recipient can be devastating.

As far as hand conditioning goes, it’s a real thing. The LEO/former bodyguard friend I mentioned a couple pages back can punch a cement sidewalk or a cement curb bare-fisted, with full power, without any pain or injury to his hand.

Check out the neat water-touching jump at the end of the first vid:

https://youtu.be/KVP_k42hKwE

https://youtu.be/bjxpcPPxiB4

Jim

[James Y]

San Diego, CA; 1988

This pic was taken during a short visit home from Taiwan. I’m demonstrating a roundhouse kick to the head of my friend Marc. I had originally met Marc while training in Lung Ying (Dragon Shape) style prior to going to Taiwan. He also trained in Choy Lee Fut. Five years later, when I returned home for good, he introduced me to study Choy Lee Fut with Sifu Primicias. Marc had taken up the study of acupuncture, and in the mid-‘90s he moved to northern CA, where he runs a highly successful acupuncture practice, and teaches Choy Lee Fut.



Jim

[James Y]

Video: “Proof That Karate Works!”

https://youtu.be/xeX47-F8D70

Jim

[James Y]

Tim Larkin interviews Geoff Thompson (Part 1):

https://youtu.be/a_0Jgdkb7cc

Jim

[James Y]

Tim Larkin interviews Geoff Thompson, Part 2.

I really like when Geoff Thompson discusses the more ‘esoteric’ aspects. In my own life, starting sometime in the mid-1990s and continuing up to today, I’ve come to parallel conclusions through my own studies and self-practices; that we do indeed create our own realities and experiences that are a reflection of ourselves. Whether on a conscious or a subconscious level.

https://youtu.be/O9aIakHnrvE

Jim

[James Y]

Iron Palm (Tie Sha Zhang), and Iron Fist (Tie Quan).

In this video, Hung Kuen (AKA Hung Gar Kung Fu) master Mark Houghton demonstrates with his daughter, Charlene Houghton.

Mark Houghton’s Iron Palm/Iron Fist development is extreme. As you can see, he only practices this extreme conditioning using his right hand; thus it’s much bigger than his left hand. In times past, it was common for a right-handed practitioner to train Iron Palm/Fist with the left hand only, supposedly so that he would be less likely to use it by accident; and also to maintain full dexterity in the dominant hand. I don’t know which is Mark Houghton’s dominant hand. His level of hand conditioning is more extreme than many other methods. I’ve seen a few other masters with hands conditioned like that. With any type of “Iron” skill development (“Iron Shirt”/“Iron Cloth,” “Iron Arm,” “Iron Palm/Fist,” “Iron Leg,” “Iron Head,” etc.), or any Kung Fu (also spelled “Gongfu”) body hardening/toughening, development must be done correctly and gradually, and proper Dit Da Jow herbal linament must be used. Otherwise, you risk injuring or disfiguring yourself. Iron Shirt also includes Qigong (Chi Kung) practices. These conditioning methods are very real, but relatively few practice them. The most common and most easily developed is Iron Arm (forearm). In times past, when Kung Fu was used primarily for combat, these types of conditioning methods, especially Iron Arm and Iron Palm/Fist, were considered a part of basic development in many systems.

I myself still practice Iron Arm, and practice some Iron Palm, but nowhere near as extreme as Mark Houghton’s method. My Iron Palm practice includes slapping and striking an Iron Palm bag and the wooden “Iron Arm Hammer.” And I train both hands. The Iron Palm method I use is much gentler, and while the hands are thickened *very* slightly over what they would be naturally, mine are completely normal-looking, and not deformed. And I cannot strike hard objects with the flat bones on the backs of my hands like Mr. Houghton can. Even his right hand knuckles have become purposely flattened through his training, enabling him to punch cement slabs without pain or injury. But ANY method must be learned properly and practiced carefully and mindfully.

Mark Houghton is a legit master of Hung Kuen (Hung Gar). He was born in England, but moved to Asia (first Malaysia, then Hong Kong) by himself in his late teens. He still lives in either Hong Kong or Guangdong, in China. He’s a bit older than I am, so his mastery of the Cantonese dialect and his mannerisms are NOT a put-on. He’s not “pretending to be Chinese.” His life story is quite remarkable. He’s highly respected in Chinese martial arts circles, and has had legitimate street experience.

https://youtu.be/kIwG8H3fZb4

Jim

[James Y]

Iron Shirt/Golden Bell Cover (Okinawan style, demonstrated by Ryan Parker).

In Chinese martial arts, there are methods of training the body to be able to be able to withstand heavy blows, even to many vital areas. These are referred to as Jin Zhong Zhao (Golden Bell Cover) or Tie Bu Shan (Iron Shirt, or Iron Cloth), and are a type of ‘protective’ Kung Fu. These are descriptive names for training methods that include both internal (Qigong) and external hardening and toughening aspects. The Japanese translation of “Qigong” is “Kiko.” Ryan Parker, the Karate teacher in the video, has claimed that the process took him 3 years, and that he started experimenting with taking blows after 1 year. Meaning that the method, like any “Iron” body training (including Iron Arm, Palm/Fist, Shin, Head, etc.), must be done very gradually and with care. Improper training can result in severe internal and external damage. In other words, do not try this at home!

This is the real-life version of an ability that was portrayed in numerous Kung Fu movies, an ability usually possessed by villains. Movies such as:
Executioners From Shaolin
The Invincible Armour
Shaolin vs Lama
Shaolin Martial Arts
Born Invincible
The Crane Fighter
…and many other movies, many of which can be found in my “Favorite Movie Fight Scenes” thread.

Not every Kung Fu system incorporates Golden Bell Cover or Iron Shirt training. In times past, this type of training was often a part of Tong Zi Gong (AKA, Children’s Kung Fu), because children’s life force, or their Qi (Chi), is at its purest, and their bodies are the most pliable and malleable.

Oddly enough, although these methods originated in Chinese martial arts, the best demonstrations of Golden Bell Cover/Iron Shirt I’ve ever seen have been by some of the more hardcore traditional Okinawan-style Karate men. The demos I’ve seen by Chinese martial artists, either live or on video, have been sketchy, gimmicky, or not overly impressive. Ryan Parker demonstrates that he has clearly developed this ability for real. Notice that he DOESN’T need to “hype himself up,” hyperventilate, or overly tense up before getting struck. Although he’s a solidly-built guy, that is NOT the reason why he can take these blows, including to the neck, throat, groin, kidneys, and knees/shins.

Golden Bell Cover and Iron Shirt are often mentioned together, or interchangeably. Some say that Golden Bell Cover is superior to Iron Shirt, because it “trains from the inside out” (meaning, emphasizes internal energy development/Qigong first, and progresses to external training); whereas Iron Shirt “starts from the outside in” (meaning emphasizes external toughening first, then progresses to internal Qigong training). This supposedly makes Golden Bell Cover more comprehensive, and “better.” I honestly don’t know about that. I read a book on Iron Shirt that mostly emphasizes “internal” Qigong training, so obviously, different versions of each have varied approaches. My opinion (and I very well could be wrong) is that Jin Zhong Zhao (“Golden Bell Cover”) and Tie Bu Shan (“Iron Shirt”/“Iron Cloth”) are different names for essentially the same thing.

I myself have never practiced Golden Bell Cover or Iron Shirt.

https://youtu.be/9nD-zZwKM1M

https://youtu.be/b1gj1GShMo0

Jim

[James Y]

5 Iron Palm Methods (old footage)

This is pretty much the method I use, except that I do not include the fifth method, “dotting,” which emphasizes striking with the fingertips. If one is not very careful, constantly striking solid objects with the fingertips can cause blindness. I have personally seen one guy who incorrectly practiced his own version of “Iron Palm” by himself by striking an unpadded wooden stool 500 times a day, including the “dotting” method, and his eyesight started becoming messed up. I might have mentioned this somewhere earlier in this thread. I also heard of another individual from South Africa who trained Iron Palm, specifically his fingertips for piercing, and who went blind. If this all sounds like BS, this fingertips-eyesight connection was also confirmed by my friend who is an experienced acupuncturist. Of course, there are people who have trained their fingertips to strike who haven’t gone blind, but to me it’s not worth taking the chance.

Note that in the film, the practitioner is sinking his weight a little into each strike. A beginner should NOT do that. A beginner should only stand in the horse stance and raise the arm to just above head height, and allow the relaxed arm to drop by its own weight. Only after that has become easy, should there be any sinking into the strike. Even then, the arm always remains relaxed (never tenses up). Depending on the level of the practitioner, the Iron Palm bag may be filled with beans (preferably mung beans), smooth gravel, specially selected steel shot, etc.

This type of training is NOT the same as punching a heavy bag like a boxer, and the effects of the two types of training are very different, although I do occasionally punch and strike a heavy bag, too, but I do it bare-handed (unwrapped and ungloved).

As with any “Iron Body” type of training, slow but steady progress is important, and it is vital to use a proper formula of Dit Da Jow herbal liniment on the areas being trained both before AND after training, which must not be washed off for anywhere from 1.5 to 3 hours. And if there is a cut or abrasion to the skin of the area being trained, you must stop the practice until it heals/is no longer an open wound, because you DO NOT want any Dit Da Jow getting into an open cut. As you can see, one must be very meticulous and diligent in practicing these types of conditioning methods to maintain safety, and to ensure proper development.

1) Slapping (entire palm)
2) Throwing (back of hand)
3) Cutting (edge of palm)
4) Stamping (base/heel of palm)
5) Dotting (fingertips)

https://youtu.be/TpxtT6skl_0

Jim