The fillet knife I wish Spyderco had made!

[skeeg11]

Gotcha, looks like that'd open up redfish and sheepheads quite nicely like a zipper, without dulling your main blade. Again, cool idea, may have to give that a spin next time I'm near the grinder.

I thought about blunting the tip on a serrated Hawk Bill but haven't had the heart to do so.

[Chris_P_Bacon]

Always a pleasure to see a Phil Wilson post.

Respect! For so many reasons too. The man cares about every thing knife. Pushes heat treats, tests edges, discovers the limits that you can push a steel. So much thought goes into design and use. Not to mention the way he sort of took Shawn (Big Brown Bear) under his wing and taught him. That goes along way in my book, and he seems genuinely like a good person. I love how they both push the boundaries of what's possible with different steels.

I'm sure I'm not the only one down on his knees begging, "Puh-leeeeeze, take pity on us and work something out with Sal." I'm getting long in the tooth and would like to see this happen in what little time I have left to enjoy it.

Sounds like you and I might be in the same boat Hurry Phil

[Chris_P_Bacon]

I thought about blunting the tip on a serrated Hawk Bill but haven't had the heart to do so.

I feel you on that one. Perhaps I'll get a dextreme and modify that old rusty carpet knife and compare the two one day, ya know for science.

[Zipper]

I would cut myself in no time!

LoL I was thinking the same thing, especially after seven or fifteen beers and a nip or two. Forget the back edge is serrated and dive into the initial skinning cut and saw through the ends of three fingers. It would require some getting used too and attention to detail. But if you get bit, I'll bet you remember the next time... (maybe).

Exactly where I was coming from!
I appreciate everyone is different though. I probably should have elaborated. My concern is the serrated portion intended for ‘harder use’, is on the spine of the last couple of inches of a thin tipped flexible blade with a very sharp edge facing the user.
How he is using that knife, I would prefer 2 dedicated knives. The flexible filleting knife for the bulk of the job and a dedicated short stiffer blade (like the Waterway), for the hard stuff. That system works perfectly for me. I also think a serrated blade (hawksbill, leaf or wharncliffe) would also be fine. Maybe better. At least on our big scaled fish like Barramundi.
Again, just my opinion. Based mainly around spending an hour or so filleting everything caught over the couple of days. Usually in the evening, whilst yarning (talking) to mates and staying hydrated.

[aicolainen]

Thanks Darby, I'm right there on every point. You're expressing exactly my frustration when I go fillet knife shopping online. Too much cheap crap that will indeed work, somewhat, but it's frustrating to say the least.

Like I implied in my first reply, my fishing endeavors does not require a lot as far as knives go, but as a knife enthusiast that doesn't stop me from looking for- and trying to justify overkill solutions to almost non-existing problems.

One such knife, that I almost ordered a couple of times, is the Quit Carry Pilot:
https://quietcarry.com/collections/the- ... t-knife-or
I have no idea if it's any good, but it does tick a few boxes for me.

[JD Spydo]

This is a big reason that I dearly miss the older AUS-8 Spyderco Catcherman. Because the older AUS-8 Catcherman was available in full Spyderedge which gave it a lot of versatility depending on the type of cutting job you have. You could take on really tough fillet jobs like on that Queen Snapper.

I've kept my full SE, AUS-8 Catcherman for all these years ( slightly over 20 years) and I watch it like a hawk because I'm doubtful that Spyderco will ever give us another full SE Catcherman. And AUS-8 isn't bad blade steel for a fillet knife either.

I looked up the type of steel that this Dexter "Dextreme" model is made from. and Google said it was "high carbon, high allow steel">> what ever that is. Although I will say that Cold Steel's older fillet knives with the Carbon V which I'm sure is comparable wasn't a bad fillet knife at all.

[standy99]

This is a big reason that I dearly miss the older AUS-8 Spyderco Catcherman. Because the older AUS-8 Catcherman was available in full Spyderedge which gave it a lot of versatility depending on the type of cutting job you have. You could take on really tough fillet jobs like on that Queen Snapper.

I've kept my full SE, AUS-8 Catcherman for all these years ( slightly over 20 years) and I watch it like a hawk because I'm doubtful that Spyderco will ever give us another full SE Catcherman. And AUS-8 isn't bad blade steel for a fillet knife either.

I looked up the type of steel that this Dexter "Dextreme" model is made from. and Google said it was "high carbon, high allow steel">> what ever that is. Although I will say that Cold Steel's older fillet knives with the Carbon V which I'm sure is comparable wasn't a bad fillet knife at all.

Lost a few catcherman in the day off the back of the boat. Would roll off the mounted bait board if not put away when moving spots. Doh……

Using Dexter Russel for probably 15 years of 20 years butchering in the day.(and still use them in the kitchen and filleting) They have always been just High Carbon steel….never found out what steel.
Way better in my book than Victonox and F-dick knives as a softer steel that is super easy to sharpen and keeps an edge for a long time with a steel. Downside is they wear out twice as quick. But at the price point have never worried.

[Cl1ff]

Yeah, I commented on my impression of BD1N because I think it would more than count as an “enthusiast” option in regards to performance when compared with whatever is on the “common” filet knife.

The only way I think you’re going to experience another horizon of significantly better performance in edge retention with equivalent or better corrosion resistance to BD1N is going with MagnaCut, M390, or maybe s110v/M398 (there are more to consider of course).
That’s what I think anyway.

At that point, I think we’re looking at two or three separate enthusiast grades rather than “BD1N is the base and MagnaCut (etc.) is for enthusiasts”.
Which I think is fine. Just want to ground our perspective in reality a bit. BD1N would already be a significant upgrade.

The Murray Carter’s that use BD1N are themselves divided into two series. One keeps the g10 handles and the other uses polypropylene. Both keep the same cutting geometry as the most expensive Super Blue and Burl G10s. They’re just for different kinds of enthusiasts than the Super Blue burl g10s.
One that is looking for less maintenance (better corrosion resistance and no compromise in edge retention as BD1N is actually more wear resistant) and others who aren’t concerned with a fancy handle that pushes the price up.

Spyderco evidently thinks BD1N is good enough to offer on the production Manix and Para 3 lightweights, which I think most would realistically agree are still enthusiast models even when you can get more performance in some ways from the Spy27 versions.

Again, I’m all for different tiers of an “enthusiast” filet knife similar to the Murray Carter series or Manix2/Para3 LWs. I only think our perception of what is for enthusiasts seems a little skewed here.

Or maybe, it’s my perspective that is skewed?
Do you think a BD1N Spyderco is an enthusiast’s knife?

[JRinFL]

Spyderco could just make a bigger Z-cut in the shape of a filet knife and it’d probably be similarly inexpensive.

The Z-cuts are fantastic. BD1N has been holding up well in edge performance and excellently with corrosion resistance too!

I wouldn’t hesitate a second to buy a Phil Wilson (just to bring up an already suggested example) filet knife made like the Golden,CO Z-cuts.

Just give the handle more grip and that’s all.

My Z-cut snapped with very little flex and pressure. They replaced it under warranty with a stern note claiming I had abused it and it was a one-time replacement. I put that model on my "never ever again" list. A longer model would be a disaster.

[JRinFL]

This is a big reason that I dearly miss the older AUS-8 Spyderco Catcherman. Because the older AUS-8 Catcherman was available in full Spyderedge which gave it a lot of versatility depending on the type of cutting job you have. You could take on really tough fillet jobs like on that Queen Snapper.

I've kept my full SE, AUS-8 Catcherman for all these years ( slightly over 20 years) and I watch it like a hawk because I'm doubtful that Spyderco will ever give us another full SE Catcherman. And AUS-8 isn't bad blade steel for a fillet knife either.

I looked up the type of steel that this Dexter "Dextreme" model is made from. and Google said it was "high carbon, high allow steel">> what ever that is. Although I will say that Cold Steel's older fillet knives with the Carbon V which I'm sure is comparable wasn't a bad fillet knife at all.

Probably a simple typo. I'm sure they meant "high alloy steel."

[Cl1ff]

Spyderco could just make a bigger Z-cut in the shape of a filet knife and it’d probably be similarly inexpensive.

The Z-cuts are fantastic. BD1N has been holding up well in edge performance and excellently with corrosion resistance too!

I wouldn’t hesitate a second to buy a Phil Wilson (just to bring up an already suggested example) filet knife made like the Golden,CO Z-cuts.

Just give the handle more grip and that’s all.

My Z-cut snapped with very little flex and pressure. They replaced it under warranty with a stern note claiming I had abused it and it was a one-time replacement. I put that model on my "never ever again" list. A longer model would be a disaster.

Upon reading this I strolled on into my kitchen, took out my Z-cuts, and pressed the flat of the blades down onto my cutting board at various pressures and angles with very little care.
All four came out just fine.

I’m not going to claim you abused yours, but if you broke mine I’d claim it was abuse.

A longer one would be be just fine.
However, if you want to optimize a longer Z-cut for filleting fish, I’d increase the stock thickness, the height of the blade slightly, as well as the handle size. I’d also prefer more grip like their Japanese kitchen knives (which I also just tested alongside my Z-cuts).

With the increase in stock thickness should also come a stronger taper. I think this allows flexion at the anterior part of the blade with cutting performance similar to the current Z-cuts while keeping the blade’s heel firm for more powerful cuts and to minimize risk of breaks or bends near the handle.

Spyderco’s 6.5in Utilty kitchen knife has some flex and would probably work for filleting, but it’s also not optimized for that task, being more generalized.

[JRinFL]

I was surprised when it snapped and more surprised at the accusation. I suspect a heat treat issue, but I guess claiming I abused it was easier than investigating. FTR, I have several of the Japanese line and they have served close to 20 years (a couple at least) doing the same job, no issues to report. I have the one Z-cut they sent to replace the broken one and that will be my last. IMO, the Japanese line is worth the extra money.

[Cl1ff]

I do really like my Santoku and Utility.
Maybe that style is the way to go for a Spyderco filet knife?
I initially suggested z-cuts because of their low price, USA origin, and good performance. Even if mine snapped I’d still think they’re excellent cutters and the edge performance and corrosion resistance are good.

I think the Japanese culinary knives also offer great performance for a good price. I don’t have too much experience with the steel used in them yet, but I’ve heard good things and they’ve been performing really well for me.

I just cut some Cantaloupe and Oranges with them earlier.

[Mushroom]

Spyderco could just make a bigger Z-cut in the shape of a filet knife and it’d probably be similarly inexpensive.

The Z-cuts are fantastic. BD1N has been holding up well in edge performance and excellently with corrosion resistance too!

I wouldn’t hesitate a second to buy a Phil Wilson (just to bring up an already suggested example) filet knife made like the Golden,CO Z-cuts.

Just give the handle more grip and that’s all.

My Z-cut snapped with very little flex and pressure. They replaced it under warranty with a stern note claiming I had abused it and it was a one-time replacement. I put that model on my "never ever again" list. A longer model would be a disaster.

I had a Spyderthrower replaced because it snapped in half while throwing it and I received the exact same note. Telling me I abused a throwing knife by using it as a throwing knife was confusing.

———

I’d love to see a new Spyderco filet knife. Either an enthusiast option or a more economic option would be fine with me. Re-introducing the K06 Filet Knife back into the Polypropylene MBS-26 culinary lineup could be a good economic way of brining a filet knife back to market.

[Bemo]

Yeah, I commented on my impression of BD1N because I think it would more than count as an “enthusiast” option in regards to performance when compared with whatever is on the “common” filet knife.

The only way I think you’re going to experience another horizon of significantly better performance in edge retention with equivalent or better corrosion resistance to BD1N is going with MagnaCut, M390, or maybe s110v/M398 (there are more to consider of course).
That’s what I think anyway.

At that point, I think we’re looking at two or three separate enthusiast grades rather than “BD1N is the base and MagnaCut (etc.) is for enthusiasts”.
Which I think is fine. Just want to ground our perspective in reality a bit. BD1N would already be a significant upgrade.

The Murray Carter’s that use BD1N are themselves divided into two series. One keeps the g10 handles and the other uses polypropylene. Both keep the same cutting geometry as the most expensive Super Blue and Burl G10s. They’re just for different kinds of enthusiasts than the Super Blue burl g10s.
One that is looking for less maintenance (better corrosion resistance and no compromise in edge retention as BD1N is actually more wear resistant) and others who aren’t concerned with a fancy handle that pushes the price up.

Spyderco evidently thinks BD1N is good enough to offer on the production Manix and Para 3 lightweights, which I think most would realistically agree are still enthusiast models even when you can get more performance in some ways from the Spy27 versions.

Again, I’m all for different tiers of an “enthusiast” filet knife similar to the Murray Carter series or Manix2/Para3 LWs. I only think our perception of what is for enthusiasts seems a little skewed here.

Or maybe, it’s my perspective that is skewed?
Do you think a BD1N Spyderco is an enthusiast’s knife?

At one time I might have said yes. But now my answer is no. BD1N is virtually identical to our old good friend 440B with about .11 to .15% Nitrogen. I heard this the first time on one of Shawn and Larrin's Steel Talk podcasts and it blew my mind. In that discussion Larrin stated that it is an open question how much that 0.11% nitrogen truly increases the hardness of the steel. I had been a vocal advocate for BD1N, when in reality it was a change of nomenclature. Would any of us be that enthused with a label that had read "440B New and Improved!"? I truly thank Dr. Thomas for sharing his knowledge and one of these days maybe with repeated listenings/readings more of it will sink in. I hope this doesn't derail this thread.

[Cl1ff]

Do you think a BD1N Spyderco is an enthusiast’s knife?

At one time I might have said yes. But now my answer is no. BD1N is virtually identical to our old good friend 440B with about .11 to .15% Nitrogen. I heard this the first time on one of Shawn and Larrin's Steel Talk podcasts and it blew my mind. In that discussion Larrin stated that it is an open question how much that 0.11% nitrogen truly increases the hardness of the steel. I had been a vocal advocate for BD1N, when in reality it was a change of nomenclature. Would any of us be that enthused with a label that had read "440B New and Improved!"? I truly thank Dr. Thomas for sharing his knowledge and one of these days maybe with repeated listenings/readings more of it will sink in. I hope this doesn't derail this thread.

I think that’s a fair assessment of the steel, although I see no reason to change an opinion on the performance of a steel because it’s not new or got a different name.
It still performs well and BD1N could be called a modern refinement and resurgence in recognition of a quality, old school, composition.

Maybe my comment was overpopulated by talk about steel specifically, but I was really trying to make a point about performance, which involves much more about the knife than steel, and how we make the distinction between what is a “common” knife or an “enthusiast’s” knife.

I’d call a BD1N Manix 2 LW or Para 3 LW or Murray Carter an “enthusiast’s” knife.

I don’t mean to derail the thread so much, though!

[Chris_P_Bacon]

Do you think a BD1N Spyderco is an enthusiast’s knife?

Like I hinted to in a previous reply; If a fillet is introduced, and if they could make two lines (since handle moulds aren't cheap) if it helped them recover some of the tooling costs back, I'm not opposed to them making two lines. Am I interested in BD1N (No), Do I think it's a good Steel (Yes) Would that steel be fine for the budget line (Yes). Do I also think MBS-26 is a good steel (Yes) I already own K06 Discontinued MBS-26 Fillet. Have many fillet knives in fact, and still just bought two more, and will invariably buy more as time goes on. Lot's of different size fish, so I use lots of different lengths with different stiffness levels. Could I get by with just one (Yes), would that make me as happy (No).

I'm looking for a blade that will showcase what a can be done with a more modern steel performance wise. I'd like to see people chicken eyeing it, smiling, thinking to themselves "Wow. now this is a next level fillet knife. If it has the wow factor, that will help it sell itself. Some people would be shocked to know how much money some people are willing to spend on the sports they love. Outdoorsy folks come in a ton of different income levels. There's tons of stamped steel options for the budget minded. But there's also gaping hole in the high end fillet knife offerings, especially on the collab/production side of things.

I also think if there is any company out there that could make this happen, it's definitely Spyderco.

The higher end (of the two) wouldn't be as cheap, and that's part of the point. If one desires a truly high end custom, you're generally going to have to turn to a custom maker. But if one wants a very useful, and yet somewhat lower price, then a custom collab is not a bad idea. I feel it's the perfect solution. I also think Phil Wilson is the perfect gent to do this collab with.

[Chris_P_Bacon]

Thanks Darby, I'm right there on every point. You're expressing exactly my frustration when I go fillet knife shopping online. Too much cheap crap that will indeed work, somewhat, but it's frustrating to say the least.

Like I implied in my first reply, my fishing endeavors does not require a lot as far as knives go, but as a knife enthusiast that doesn't stop me from looking for- and trying to justify overkill solutions to almost non-existing problems.

One such knife, that I almost ordered a couple of times, is the Quit Carry Pilot:
https://quietcarry.com/collections/the- ... t-knife-or
I have no idea if it's any good, but it does tick a few boxes for me.

Got one in bound thanks to you sharing that link, thank you!

[aicolainen]

Got one in bound thanks to you sharing that link, thank you!

Wow, that’s probably my most efficient enabling ever. Hope you like it!

PS! If you do like it, feel free to write about your impressions and enable me back

[skeeg11]

I thought about blunting the tip on a serrated Hawk Bill but haven't had the heart to do so.

I feel you on that one. Perhaps I'll get a dextreme and modify that old rusty carpet knife and compare the two one day, ya know for science.

Hmmmmmmmmm. Not much available in the way of filletable fish here in the dead of winter, but come Spring, perhaps I can add a blob of epoxy to the tip of a serrated Hawk bill for temporary testing purposes. I suspect a serrated Hawk Bill with a blunt tip might actually perform even a bit better than a blunted PE carpet knife for outline cut purposes. We'll see come spring.