H-2 vs. H-1

[elena86]

This fluffer knows a thing or two about the performance of H1 in spyderedge and it’s more than “decent”. Let’s say it outcuts most of the so called “super steels”. I am a spyderedge fanatic so my SE H1 spydies are not going anyway. Lucky for me, I was smart enough and purchased 37 spydies in H1( 23 are in SE) so I am covered so to speak. I might purchase a few before this magic alloy becomes extinct.

[Netherend]

The whole end of H1 thing is really making me want to pick up an Aqua Salt while I still can

it's a very slept on model. I've been using one for 10+ years and it's a great do it all fixed blade. Aqua Salt + a folding saw is a really light backpacking combo I've used on numerous trips.

backpacking and camping is what I was thinking of using it for as well . It looks like a tough fixed blade and h1 seems like a great steel for a fixed blade.

[Manixguy@1994]

I have a confession…. I too am a fluffer . Look forward to Sal’s comments, it should be interesting. MG2

[sethwm]

Anyone have a link to vivis thread on h1 sharpening?

[vivi]

Anyone have a link to vivis thread on h1 sharpening?

viewtopic.php?t=90089 - pacific salt thread

viewtopic.php?t=85096 - low grit sharpening thread

tldr - 10dps 300 grit edge cuts at least 4x longer than a factory edge when slicing rope and cardboard.

[Airlsee]

Anyone have a link to vivis thread on h1 sharpening?

Vivi beat me to it...and I only had the Pac Salt EDC thread...haha!

[sethwm]

Anyone have a link to vivis thread on h1 sharpening?

viewtopic.php?t=90089 - pacific salt thread

viewtopic.php?t=85096 - low grit sharpening thread

tldr - 10dps 300 grit edge cuts at least 4x longer than a factory edge when slicing rope and cardboard.

My wife has a ladybug salt I wanna carry for a bit. Don't know if I can get something that small down to 10 dps, but definitely 300 grit.

How important is grit v angle here you think?

[R100]

Another enthusiastic fluffer here!

One thing about having way more knives than you need is imagining uses for them

In a long term survival situation you can literally sharpen H1 on a smooth rock. Doesn't work with S30V - I've tried it.

A true SHTF situation might never happen but field sharpening is a big consideration for me because I spend a couple of months every year on the road with minimal gear. I carry an DMT coarse diafold with 6" of old belt loaded with diamond paste and I am good to go. You can sharpen anything with this but nothing so easily as H1.

Anyway, can you think of any reasonable justification for having 50 or 60 pocket knives? May as well go for some diversity.

Dan

[metaphoricalsimile]

Anyone have a link to vivis thread on h1 sharpening?

viewtopic.php?t=90089 - pacific salt thread

viewtopic.php?t=85096 - low grit sharpening thread

tldr - 10dps 300 grit edge cuts at least 4x longer than a factory edge when slicing rope and cardboard.

My wife has a ladybug salt I wanna carry for a bit. Don't know if I can get something that small down to 10 dps, but definitely 300 grit.

How important is grit v angle here you think?

According to Larrin Thomas' research, 10 dps gives about 4x the edge life of 20 dps, which would indicate that the coarse edge doesn't play much part.

[ZrowsN1s]

Anyone have a link to vivis thread on h1 sharpening?

viewtopic.php?t=90089 - pacific salt thread

viewtopic.php?t=85096 - low grit sharpening thread

tldr - 10dps 300 grit edge cuts at least 4x longer than a factory edge when slicing rope and cardboard.

My wife has a ladybug salt I wanna carry for a bit. Don't know if I can get something that small down to 10 dps, but definitely 300 grit.

How important is grit v angle here you think?

According to Larrin Thomas' research, 10 dps gives about 4x the edge life of 20 dps, which would indicate that the coarse edge doesn't play much part.

Comparing one of my 10dps high polished edges to a 12dps coarse edge, I would say that the grit absolutely makes a difference in performance.

Which you perfer is personal preference but, the coarse edge has a longer 'working edge' and longer aggression. What it lacks is push cutting and butter smooth cuts.

[JRinFL]

The vivi edge is what made a steel I avoided into one I enjoy using. It shows why it is important to match the sharpening style to the steel as well as to the use.

[wrdwrght]

The vivi edge is what made a steel I avoided into one I enjoy using. It shows why it is important to match the sharpening style to the steel as well as to the use.

Me, too.

It made me a fluffer, whatever that is.

But no H1 panic-buying for me. I’m well-stocked (and with LC200N, too).

I am curious about H2, less as a substitute than an H1 refinement, and I will get some, preferably in some new model.

I have a soft spot for tough steels (but no blind spot for harder ones).

Soft spot, get it?

Soft = Fluffer?

[Airlsee]

I feel like a soft touch is a necessity for all fluffers...

[vivi]

fluffers with a light touch get the best edges :)

[metaphoricalsimile]

Comparing one of my 10dps high polished edges to a 12dps coarse edge, I would say that the grit absolutely makes a difference in performance.

Which you perfer is personal preference but, the coarse edge has a longer 'working edge' and longer aggression. What it lacks is push cutting and butter smooth cuts.

I don't disagree that coarse edges vs polished edges both perform different tasks better, so what kind of edge a person prefers should probably be driven by their routine cutting tasks, I'm just pointing out that Vivi claims that a 10 dps coarse edge lasts 4x longer than the factory edge, and I'm using data from a good source to point out that it *probably* has more to do with the 10 dps than it does the coarse edge.

I also like coarse edges for my usual daily cutting tasks, but I do feel like a lot of people on this forum claim that coarse edges are *always better*, without providing good supporting evidence for that.

Here's a great example of the opposite being true for this youtuber:

https://youtu.be/FwHvWm4drlg

He gets about 25% more cuts in a test push-cutting against rope with a polished edge vs. a toothy edge on LC200N. Now I'm not claiming that this test "proves" that polished edges are better than toothy edges, but I *am* claiming that it *disproves* that toothy edges are *always* better.

[ZrowsN1s]

You are correct they are not *always* better. You probably wont find a bigger polished edge fan than me.

As for the geometery, thats why I was using my experience between my 10dps polished edge vs my 12dps coarse edge. I wouldn't compare it to a factory edge because yes geometry does matter a lot.

Polished edge will always win in a push cutting test vs coarse edge. That's true right off the sharpening stones. I've seen that with my BESS tester. But coarse edge wins the endurance race when it comes to slicing.

Taking factory edge out of the statement and instead saying a coarse edge will out last a polished edge 4x longer in slicing is closer to the truth.

Here is some bad drawing and a gross generalization of what I would say the performance curves look like. Not very accurate but I think it conveys what Im trying to say.

[Josh Crutchley]

According to Larrin Thomas' research, 10 dps gives about 4x the edge life of 20 dps, which would indicate that the coarse edge doesn't play much part.

Larrin has another chart that shows some interesting results in Catra with varying grit edges.

[vivi]

You are correct they are not *always* better. You probably wont find a bigger polished edge fan than me.

As for the geometery, thats why I was using my experience between my 10dps polished edge vs my 12dps coarse edge. I wouldn't compare it to a factory edge because yes geometry does matter a lot.

Polished edge will always win in a push cutting test vs coarse edge. That's true right off the sharpening stones. I've seen that with my BESS tester. But coarse edge wins the endurance race when it comes to slicing.

Taking factory edge out of the statement and instead saying a coarse edge will out last a polished edge 4x longer in slicing is closer to the truth.

Here is some bad drawing and a gross generalization of what I would say the performance curves look like. Not very accurate but I think it conveys what Im trying to say.

Yep, well said.

Geometry and edge finish both play a role in edge retention.

I think I find the performance drop off of polished edges a little more dramatic. Once they stop having any shaving ability I find they cut most things very poorly. While a coarse edge that won't shave still has weeks, if not months of cutting ability.

I've experimented with different finishes a lot. Especially at work, where for a while I carried a 200 grit 10" chef knife and a 2000 grit 10" chef knife.

I compared them both on the things I typically cut. Slicing tomatos, cleaning branzino, cutting peppers and onions for salsa, breaking down beef tenderloin etc.

I found in nearly every situation I preferred the coarser edge.

I found the polished edge was indeed better at certain things, like mincing garlic.

But the performance difference between the two when it came to mincing garlic was small, meanwhile the performance difference slicing ripe tomato when not at peak sharpness was massive.

These days both my chef knives are coarsely sharpened. Their edges last up to a week, while the polished edges always needed touched up daily.

There is a time and place for both edge types. For a dedicated whittler a coarse edge wouldn't make any sense. If you're cutting a ton of rope with a PE knife I can't see any reason to go high polish.

For my uses though, there's a lot more situations I prefer the coarse. So that's what my EDC's get.

[ladybug93]

i was like, what does poland have to do with this? i think i need to step away from the computer for a bit.

[vivi]

According to Larrin Thomas' research, 10 dps gives about 4x the edge life of 20 dps, which would indicate that the coarse edge doesn't play much part.

Larrin has another chart that shows some interesting results in Catra with varying grit edges.

Aren't catra machines testing edges with solely push cuts? if so that would definitely skew results in favor of polished edges. Or am I mistaken and they can do slices too?