Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
TheGiant80
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#241

Post by TheGiant80 »

JSumm wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 12:19 pm
You know, a wise man by the name of Patrick, I think he lived by the ocean, anyways he taught me that keeping your knife collection in your sock drawer to admire solves a lot of issues. Sometimes, I even forget I have a collection.
I got a good chuckle out of this. Cheers!

Alright so mine showed up today. After everything I’ve read, I was hesitant to even open the box…

Good gravy this thing rules!! Great action, perfect centering, laser sharpness, solid lockup, the scales feel like butter in my hand, etc etc. That chemical smell mentioned earlier in the thread is present, but it’s mild and easy to ignore.

I’ve been looking for a smaller folder that’s still up to hard-use tasks, and as a giant the Shaman qualifies as small for me. I’ve been playing with it for maybe twenty minutes now and I can’t stop smiling. I can’t wait to put the M4 to some real work in the next week.

Nice one Spyderco. I love it!
Holybotulism
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#242

Post by Holybotulism »

So I couldn't get the knife centered because my balls are not fully developed?... Thanks for sharing that with me, because I would've never figured that out. If you want to disassemble your knife and correct everything wrong that should've been done at the factory, that's your decision. Everyone that's saying everything about their knife is "perfect", should be the standard to which all others are judged. Centered knives are not the standard at Spyderco? When I can buy $50 Chinese knives that are impeccable, there's no reason why a $260 USA knife can't match the standards of a knife that cost 1/5th the price.
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JSumm
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#243

Post by JSumm »

TheGiant80 wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 pm
JSumm wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 12:19 pm
You know, a wise man by the name of Patrick, I think he lived by the ocean, anyways he taught me that keeping your knife collection in your sock drawer to admire solves a lot of issues. Sometimes, I even forget I have a collection.
I got a good chuckle out of this. Cheers!
Well good!

Sometimes I wonder where our Patrick is. Is he climbing another rock? A tree maybe. How many more knives has he lost? Does he still look back at our time in fondness? Did he order a MNOSD shirt?
- Jeff
May your feet be warm and dry and your throat warm with whiskey. A knife in hand or in the sock band.
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kennethsime
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#244

Post by kennethsime »

TkoK83Spy wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 11:37 am
You guys need to stop watching all the clowns on youtube that nit pick every little aspect of a knife.
Can we make this a sticky at the top of the forum please?

I often wonder how folks have so many problems with their knives. I’ve been using Spydercos since 2010 or so and have never handled a bad one. Sure, some are better than others, but none have been dysfunctional by any stretch of the imagination.
I'm happiest with Micarta and Tool Steel.

Top four in rotation: K390 + GCM PM2, ZCarta Shaman, Crucarta PM2, K390 + GCM Straight Spine Stretch.
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Evil D
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#245

Post by Evil D »

Holybotulism wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 2:38 pm
So I couldn't get the knife centered because my balls are not fully developed?... Thanks for sharing that with me, because I would've never figured that out. If you want to disassemble your knife and correct everything wrong that should've been done at the factory, that's your decision. Everyone that's saying everything about their knife is "perfect", should be the standard to which all others are judged. Centered knives are not the standard at Spyderco? When I can buy $50 Chinese knives that are impeccable, there's no reason why a $260 USA knife can't match the standards of a knife that cost 1/5th the price.



Think of it less like people are trying to dismiss away the issue, and more like people are just offering you very simple solutions to fix centering. If you don't like it return it, I'm absolutely certain someone else will be happy to buy it and fix it. I'm not saying you're wrong either, I agree that as price goes up things like this matter more to me, but I'm willing to turn a couple screws, it's not the end of the world. I would be far more upset over cracked micarta or severely uneven blade grinds or other things I can't easily tweak myself and fix. But, you do you, nobody can tell you what's acceptable and what isn't, but they can offer you their perspective and I think that's what you're getting here.
All SE all the time since 2017
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curlyhairedboy
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#246

Post by curlyhairedboy »

I would posit that QC is looking for defects - bad plunge grinds, obvious blade warps, cracks, etc. We know that items that make it to the seconds sale are safe to use while still not meeting QC standards. To me that indicates 3 buckets:

Bucket 1: QC pass, these go out to the retailers and SFO.
Bucket 2: QC fail but functional, these get saved for factory seconds sale
Bucket 3: QC fail and not safe, these are destroyed.

I would guess that Spyderco's pretty intensive QC process is trying to minimize the number of knives in buckets 2 and 3, rather than decrease the variance in acceptable knives within bucket 1.

I think we have to draw a distinction between fidget qualities that can be corrected in a minute by an end user (centering off due to differences in screw tightness across the pivot) and actual defects for which we'd actually return a knife.

It's a valid opinion to think that every knife in bucket 1 should be centered and dialed in for the smoothest action. It's possible for Spyderco to do, but there are valid arguments that Spyderco should prioritize other things first.

As for me, I appreciate that Spydercos are designed 'edge-first'.
EDC Rotation: PITS, Damasteel Urban, Shaman, Ikuchi, Amalgam, CruCarta Shaman, Sage 5 LW, Serrated Caribbean Sheepsfoot CQI, XHP Shaman, M4/Micarta Shaman, 15v Shaman
Fixed Blades: Proficient, Magnacut Mule
Special and Sentimental: Southard, Squarehead LW, Ouroboros, Calendar Para 3 LW, 40th Anniversary Native, Ti Native, Calendar Watu, Tanto PM2
Would like to own again: CQI Caribbean Sheepsfoot PE, Watu
Wishlist: Magnacut, Shaman Sprints!
WhiskeySandwich
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#247

Post by WhiskeySandwich »

TkoK83Spy wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 11:37 am
You guys need to stop watching all the clowns on youtube that nit pick every little aspect of a knife. The Shaman is such an easy knife to work with in terms of disassembly and maintenance. Grow a set and give it 5 minutes of your time, you'll be happy with the results. If it's not rubbing...it's not a problem. If it's gritty, rinse it out or hit it with some compressed air. If that doesn't help, tweak the pivot. If that doesn't work, remove a whopping 3 screws and clean it out and lube accordingly. It's really not rocket science. Sick of all the pissing and moaning about things that are so easy to fix on your own.

I don't even want to hear about "well if you buy a new car, you don't want it to have a scratch on it" or things of that nature. Guess what, you buy a new car...what's the first thing you do before driving it...adjust your seat, steering wheel and mirrors. Not much different than the little tweaks I mentioned above, when it comes to setting up YOUR knife to YOUR preferences. Just because your blade has a slight wiggle, or it's not "drop shutty" or something like that, doesn't mean it's not a safe knife to operate and no reason that it shouldn't pass QC for those reasons. THAT'S on you to adjust to YOUR liking...not Spyderco's liking.
This exactly.

If you can’t be bothered to put in the effort, why is it so important to you? If you care enough, you’ll make it yours. Not to mention, it’s M4, this is not a maintenance free knife, these things take work. Unless you’re the type to send it for warranty service every time you want it oiled…maybe save it for someone who will appreciate it. Bad enough half of these went to scalpers.

This is my favorite knife, I tore it apart day 1, gave it some love, and its excellent now. I’ll keep using the heck out of it and if it needs work, I’ll do it myself. Nobody I trust more with my favorite stuff than me.
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troutinCO
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#248

Post by troutinCO »

WhiskeySandwich wrote:
Sat May 21, 2022 8:55 pm
TkoK83Spy wrote:
Thu May 19, 2022 11:37 am
You guys need to stop watching all the clowns on youtube that nit pick every little aspect of a knife. The Shaman is such an easy knife to work with in terms of disassembly and maintenance. Grow a set and give it 5 minutes of your time, you'll be happy with the results. If it's not rubbing...it's not a problem. If it's gritty, rinse it out or hit it with some compressed air. If that doesn't help, tweak the pivot. If that doesn't work, remove a whopping 3 screws and clean it out and lube accordingly. It's really not rocket science. Sick of all the pissing and moaning about things that are so easy to fix on your own.

I don't even want to hear about "well if you buy a new car, you don't want it to have a scratch on it" or things of that nature. Guess what, you buy a new car...what's the first thing you do before driving it...adjust your seat, steering wheel and mirrors. Not much different than the little tweaks I mentioned above, when it comes to setting up YOUR knife to YOUR preferences. Just because your blade has a slight wiggle, or it's not "drop shutty" or something like that, doesn't mean it's not a safe knife to operate and no reason that it shouldn't pass QC for those reasons. THAT'S on you to adjust to YOUR liking...not Spyderco's liking.
This exactly.

If you can’t be bothered to put in the effort, why is it so important to you? If you care enough, you’ll make it yours. Not to mention, it’s M4, this is not a maintenance free knife, these things take work. Unless you’re the type to send it for warranty service every time you want it oiled…maybe save it for someone who will appreciate it. Bad enough half of these went to scalpers.

This is my favorite knife, I tore it apart day 1, gave it some love, and its excellent now. I’ll keep using the heck out of it and if it needs work, I’ll do it myself. Nobody I trust more with my favorite stuff than me.
All that. I needed to work on mine, but it took little effort to get it perfect. It is now one of my favorites after being unsure about the size. I'm really glad you guys talked me into giving this one a shot. I want more now....
CriticalMe
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#249

Post by CriticalMe »

I'm posting this in case anyone is having the same problem with their new Shaman.

Problem: When the lock is disengaged to close the blade the detent ball drags enough that two hands are required to close the knife. Loosening the pivot lessens this, but you then have side to side blade play.

Diagnosis: Upon disassembly I noticed a glob of metal on the back side of the lock bar (the side that faces the scale). This deposit of metal is along side the slot that is cut in the liner to create the lock bar. It is thick enough that it is preventing the lock from being fully depressed and allowing the detent ball to clear the blade.

Solution: I removed the glob of metal with a small metal file after taping the surrounding area to prevent scratching. After reassembling the knife I tightened the pivot so there is no blade play. Now it drops shut when lock is depressed.

This is my first post on any forum. I've been helped many times by other's posts explaining how to adjust, repair or replace things. I figured I'm over due to try to help. Hopefully this is useful and understandable.
Michael Janich
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#250

Post by Michael Janich »

Dear CriticalMe:

Welcome to the Spyderco Forum.

I'm sorry to hear about your issues with your Shaman. Did you happen to take any photos of the "glob" before you fixed it?

Stay safe,

Mike
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kennethsime
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#251

Post by kennethsime »

CriticalMe wrote:
Mon May 23, 2022 7:34 pm
This is my first post on any forum. I've been helped many times by other's posts explaining how to adjust, repair or replace things. I figured I'm over due to try to help. Hopefully this is useful and understandable.
Great first post. Very helpful!
I'm happiest with Micarta and Tool Steel.

Top four in rotation: K390 + GCM PM2, ZCarta Shaman, Crucarta PM2, K390 + GCM Straight Spine Stretch.
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Airlsee
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#252

Post by Airlsee »

CriticalMe wrote:
Mon May 23, 2022 7:34 pm

Welcome to the forum! Glad you were able handle the issue and get your Shaman performing correctly!
So it goes.
CriticalMe
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#253

Post by CriticalMe »

Thank you for the welcome Mr. Janich. This is my brother-in-laws Shaman. The action on mine is great. Thank you kennethime and Airisee for the kind words.

Two pics of glob (deposit) of metal on the back side of the lock bar.
Image
Image

Taped to protect surrounding area.
Image

After filing most of the deposit.
Image
Image
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JSumm
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#254

Post by JSumm »

That is a heck of first post CriticalMe! And extremely helpful for anyone with the same issue. Welcome to the forum!
- Jeff
May your feet be warm and dry and your throat warm with whiskey. A knife in hand or in the sock band.
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Crox
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#255

Post by Crox »

Yes, thank you for the post and great pictures. I assume these parts are punched out so must not have been cleaned up after.

It is an interesting contribution to the conversation regarding QC.

My opinion: Yes, we should be willing to turn some screws to get the action we like. But should this have made it through? It obviously didn't function well and took stronger intervention than tweaking some torx screws.
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Evil D
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#256

Post by Evil D »

Crox wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:19 pm
Yes, thank you for the post and great pictures. I assume these parts are punched out so must not have been cleaned up after.

It is an interesting contribution to the conversation regarding QC.

My opinion: Yes, we should be willing to turn some screws to get the action we like. But should this have made it through? It obviously didn't function well and took stronger intervention than tweaking some torx screws.


This is one that I'd absolutely document and share, if for no other reason than to let Spyderco know it happened, but sometimes with limited production you can't get a replacement so I'd more than likely try to fix it unless I talked with them on the phone and was guaranteed to get a replacement and not just a refund. For standard production stuff I would absolutely send this back to them for the feedback.
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troutinCO
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#257

Post by troutinCO »

I think the laser cutters need some tweaking.
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Crox
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#258

Post by Crox »

troutinCO wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:36 pm
I think the laser cutters need some tweaking.
It’s probably a press? Which would or could leave tags like that.

Edit - maybe a punch is proper term.
Superflex
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#259

Post by Superflex »

They may use water jets for cutting some pieces.
The glob of metal is unacceptable QA/QC, as is the scratch in my blade from the first grind that never got removed. If this was a general production knife, mine would be going back for a replacement.
My CruCarta PM2 came with 3 loose torx screws on the clip. As a AFI, it's an easy fix. For a first time buyer without the tools, it's a letdown.
Too many 420 breaks in Golden?
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Mushroom
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Re: Blade HQ M4/Micarta Shaman

#260

Post by Mushroom »

Crox wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:38 pm
troutinCO wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:36 pm
I think the laser cutters need some tweaking.
It’s probably a press? Which would or could leave tags like that.

Edit - maybe a punch is proper term.
The liners are not punched out with a press. That little bit of dross looks to be the result of extreme heat caused either by a laser cutter or wire edm.

It looks like a glob of molten metal that fused to the back side of the liner when it was cut. It was probably too large to get knocked off during the tumbling process and then went unnoticed during assembly. Unless it negatively effected the lockup or unlocking, that is something that would be difficult to catch during quality control.
-Nick :bug-red
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