Towards my first SE Spyderco

[Matus]

The recent announcement of the Ayoob sprint (exclusive?) made me for some reason realize that this knife would be super cool with an SE edge (whether the steel would turn out to be Cruwear, VG-10 or something else is not the deciding factor for me). At the same time I am pretty sure that this is not going to be a cheap knife - in particular after German taxes and import fees. So it would make a lot of sense to get a more common Spyderco with SE to see whether it would be something for me.

And that brings me to a little 'inner conflict'.

On one hand - the general consensus appears to be, that a FFG SE Spydies like the recent salts in LC200N are the better cutters than the more 'classical' H1 SE knives that all appear to have a relatively narrow, hollow grind. This does not surprise me, but the thing is, that the Ayoob is most likely going to come with a hollow grind reminiscent of the H1 SE Sypdercos, rather than the LC200N models.

That leaves me wondering what of the two categories of the SE knives to get to on one hand get a knife with optimized performance, while on the other hand also to get as good of an idea as possible on what to expect with SE Ayoob ...

The knives I would be considering:
- FFG SE: UKPK Salt, Pacific Salt 2 LC200N, Salt 2 LC200N
- Hollow grind SE: Pacific Salt 2 H1, Salt 2 H1

Should I get the UKPK, than it would become my EDC to be carried mainly in city environment (as it is one of the few DE-legal knives from Spyderco), the rest would be mainly used around the house (carboard comes to my mind) and maybe when hiking.

I would really appreciate your opinions here. I would like to try NOT to overthink it ... again

Thank you

P.S. The word 'serrated' is apparently too common to be searched-for around here

[ladybug93]

are you not going to be allowed to legally carry the ayoob and/or any of the other knives you listed?

[Evil D]

Well....I'm gonna go ahead and say what nobody wants to hear (sorry JD) but in the world of SE slicers, the Ayoob isn't very hard to beat...so you can "match" just the slicing performance with almost any other model. There will be huge differences in how the knife performs overall that have more to do with ergonomics, but focusing just solely on the blade itself and the thickness and height of the blade grind, it isn't exactly the most slicy combination. For example a SE Dragonfly Salt will shame it, and a SE ARK will humiliate the Dfly. Slicing = thin, and the Ayoob isn't exactly ground thin. It's not a brick, but like I said...not hard to find other SE models that *slice* better. Again, overall performance is a broader discussion.

Think of this like discussing tire grip as a factor of two different car's performance, while keeping in mind that there's a whole other discussion about what the cars themselves are capable of.


If you just want something as inexpensive as you can get to play with, I think you'd like a SE Tenacious. It's kinda sorta a budget Caribbean in some ways, obviously not at all in being a Salt but they have a similar overall design as far as ergonomics go and both are FFG. The steel is also very forgiving and easy to sharpen and would be great for practice. The UKPK Salt is also a great option but will slice pretty differently than an Ayoob.


If you just want something that will perform closer to the Ayoob, get any of the H1 Salt models. This is also assuming that the new Ayoob comes with serrations that are the same as the old one that I have.

[Wartstein]

Just was about to link Davids thread about serrations, but now he he chimed in... well, gonna link it anyway: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84985

... I know I am one of those who emphasises my preference of ffg SE over hollow grind SE.
But I actually think that height/width... the ammount of "aggressivness" has a lot more impact on the performance of SE blades than the kind of grind.

For me so far (concerning what I've tried myself): The "mellower" the better. My ffg Endela SE performs even better than my ffg Salt 2 SE, since the latter has a bit more aggressive serrations.

And I think my hollow grind Pac Salt SE performs also just a tad better than the ffg Salt SE, since the Pac Salt has been sharpened a lot more and due to that less pointy and mellower serrations already.

[Jim Malone]

You can not carry the Ayoob in Germany. You can own it, but not carry it. The UKPK is legal to carry in Germany. Either one handed opening and non locking, or two handed locking. I've carried a Spyderco knife here in Belgium for 35 years now. Never been stopped, or asked if i carried a knife. Probably the same applies to Germany. But why tempt faith and not carry something legal in big city enviroments. If the O.P. does not have the appearance of a person of interest the chanced of beeing stopped by the police are small.

[Jim Malone]

As a side note i normally don't like SE that much. Most of my knives are PE or CE. But i did buy a Endela wharncliff FFG in SE as a shorts knife and it seems to cut very well. It's not really something that excells in thin slicing vegetables. It's more an agressive matter seperator.

[Matus]

Well....

Thank you for your reply (and for that fantastic pinned post on SE edges - I learned a lot from it!). I am starting to lean towards getting the an SE knife that I would enjoy most and later once Ayoob gets actually released then consider whether I am in for one or not.

For me so far (concerning what I've tried myself): The "mellower" the better. My ffg Endela SE performs even better than my ffg Salt 2 SE, since the latter has a bit more aggressive serrations.

Thank you for mentioning this. I have completely forgot that there is Endela (and Endura) in SE (apparently also in k390). I am going to have a closer look - it would appear that each different model has slightly different grind when it comes to the serrations.

As a side note i normally don't like SE that much. Most of my knives are PE or CE. But i did buy a Endela wharncliff FFG in SE as a shorts knife and it seems to cut very well. It's not really something that excells in thin slicing vegetables. It's more an agressive matter seperator.

Aggressive matter separator is pretty much what I am expecting. So it sounds like I might be on the right track :)

[dsvirsky]

Since no one else has said it yet, get the UKPK Salt. It is a very good slicer.

[ladybug93]

i know i already told you this in the other thread, but my vote is for se h1. i can't imagine anyone regretting owning a pacific salt in se h1. at very least, it's a great knife to put in your waistband during a workout or a swim.


edited to add: and when you get your se ayoob, the pacific salt will still be useful in ways the ayoob isn't.

[JRinFL]

Since no one else has said it yet, get the UKPK Salt. It is a very good slicer.

Agreed. I was going to post the same thing.

[Jim Malone]

The UKPK Salt in SE is a great knife imho. But due to the fact that it is BRIGHT YELLOW this is not a discreet knife. This is one of the reasons i have not bought the UKPK Salt. In a non knife permissive environment ( like in Europe) a bright yellow pocket knife that draws attention to you wearing something in your pocket is sometimes not a good idea, even if legal. I would be the first to buy a UKPK Salt if it came in a subdued colour with a deep carry wireclip. Untill that ever happens i carry my S90V dark blue UKPK ( had to buy this one because a standard one wasn't available) when i'm in Germany.

[JRinFL]

The yellow is pretty easily and inexpensively dyed according to many here who have done it. Black and green are the easiest to achieve, but other colors should be possible.

RIT dye is what is used here in the States, but I do not know if it is sold in Europe or what the European alternative might be.

[JRinFL]

Good reference here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=80112

[Matus]

The color of the salty UKPK is not issue for me, I am not trying to pretend that I don't have a knife. I actually think that funky color like bright yellow, green or even pink make the knife look less serious and thus possibly less intimidating. If I want to go completely unobtrusive, then SAK it is (not that I would enjoy the knife-tool on SAK particularly much). And should the yellow now work for me, I would not be afraid to dye them (did the in the past).

@ladybug93 I hear you. Maybe it may sound weird, but I would eventually like to try H1 and I think Se would be the way to go. So it is not off the table (even if it might not be my first SE).

Since Endela was mentioned and went to check it out and realized that also k390 is going to come out with an SE edge (as the rest of the lineup). After initial excitement I realized that sharpening it with a Sharpmaker would not be particularly enjoyable or effective, so I guess I am going to put that idea on ice for now.

I really like the UKPK salt, but since it does not cost much less around here than as the Pacific Salt 2 LC200N, I am going to give it a few more days to consider. But I really like the knife.

[ladybug93]

lc200n and h1 are both easy to touch up on the sharpmaker. you really can't go wrong either way. h1 will give you a closer experience to the ayoob, as you pointed out, but either will be a great knife.

[Jim Malone]

I bought my fiancée (who is Bavarian) a pink squeek for her to carry in Germany. Now she has 3 pink Spyderco 's....a squeek, a dragonfly and a Delica.

[benben]

i know i already told you this in the other thread, but my vote is for se h1. i can't imagine anyone regretting owning a pacific salt in se h1. at very least, it's a great knife to put in your waistband during a workout or a swim.


edited to add: and when you get your se ayoob, the pacific salt will still be useful in ways the ayoob isn't.

This post right here!! Every Spyderco fan, user, and collector should own a SE Pacific Salt, I wish I would have listened years earlier!

[Bloke]

Baby steps ... buy a SE HB Ladybug.

[ladybug93]

Baby steps ... buy a SE HB Ladybug.

i was going to suggest this one too, but the hb is unlike anything else and won't really give you the experience you're looking for before buying a large se knife.

you know i do agree that everyone should have a ladyhawk as well though. i don't use mine often, but it's nice to know is always there in my wallet. it even typically makes it into theme parks and museums when i have to leave my regular edc in the car. and, as i've said before, it's a little monster that cuts way above its size and weight.

[cabfrank]

ladybug said he can't imagine anyone regretting owning a Pac Salt SE H1. I can't either, at all.