Pacific Salt talk

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vivi
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Pacific Salt talk

#1

Post by vivi »

Didn't want to derail the What's In Your Pocket thread, so I'm moving the discussion here.
vivi wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:04 pm
You ever like a knife so much you don't want to carry anything else?

That's how I feel about this one:

Image

I like my Chiefs and Yojumbo and Police folders and fixed blades and various iterations of the C95 / Manix XL.....but this is THE knife for me. Light, compact, rust proof, excellent edge holding / toughness / ease of sharpening, minimal maintenance required, grippy and neutral handle that works in just about any grip.

Normally this time of year I carry my carbon steel folders more often, my heavier knives like the Manix series, etc. But my go to work knife has also become my go to day off knife.

My next knife purchase is either going to be a Swick 5 or another yellow Pacific Salt in PE H1 to dye to make a duplicate of this one.

It's funny how I started out carrying these in PE, then became a SE convert for a few years, but now I'm firmly in the PE camp. I think a coarse, toothy PE is the best of both worlds - no snagging like SE can sometimes do, but a serious bite on any slicing cut like a SE knife. I don't like how polished PE, or SE with any grit finish, cut in comparison. This is better for my uses.

Wartstein wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:07 am

It is "funny" for me too to read this ;) - funny also, how knife preferences can change in general..

You actually were the main factor in pointing me towards the Pac Salt, and that in SE back then, cause you preferred the latter.
Your thread also taught me how easy SE is to sharpen.
Now while you came back to PE again, I am still in the SE camp, and even more so from the point on when I got my Endela SE... (though I have to admit: Your "toothy (PE) edge approach" works well for me too!) ;)

I can also recall when you preferred the "old Endura handle" of the Pac Salt 1 over the "new Endura (4) handle" (Pac Salt 2), cause the latter one did not fit your hand and offered no really good grip.
Now you came to call the Endura 4 style handle even ".. neutral handle that works in just about any grip" (something that for me also always was the case, but I thought primarily cause I grip Spydercos not with the thumb on the ramp, but more "hammer grip-ish" and with the thumb on the flat of the blade. This makes a real difference concerning how the first finger placement and the "point" behind it on the Endura 4 / Pac Salt 2 feels)
And while I do prefer the Endura 4 style handle ergo-wise, I am not not sure if I not still want the "old" style handle on the Pac Salt. Why? Somehow, when it comes to linerless FRN, the old style handle feels more robust, cause it is made of "full" FRN without that "webbing" on the inside of the handle.
How do you feel about this? Do you think the "old" Pac Salt handle feels stronger, less flexy (not that the new would flex too much too, but more) and less prone to side to side play of the blade?
Funny you mention the Pacific 1. I actually carried that PE H1 and a SE Pacific 1 together the other day and used them both during my shift to compare them back to back.

The Pacific Salt 1 has a more rigid feeling handle and seems less prone to side to side play. It feels very solid with its one piece handle design.

For a long time I did prefer the 1's handle, to the point I bought about 5 of them when they got discontinued because I was convinced I'd never like the 2.

One day I decided to try the 2 and it won me over. Comparing them side to side that day the 2's ergonomics are a better fit for me after getting used to it.
Paraguy wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 9:27 am

Do you prefer H1 over lc200n? What are your thoughts on the new Magnacut salt series?
Yes, I prefer H1. It seems a little tougher, not a big difference in edge retention with how I sharpen them (thin, coarse edges), and the heavier blade feels better when opening and closing the H1 Pacific.

That said I could carry an LC200N Pacific Salt for the rest of my life and have no issues, it's a great steel and a wonderful knife overall.

For me and my uses it didn't feel like the upgrade I expected it to I suppose. The full flat grind was something I wanted in a Pacific for years, but it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference in cutting ability. Which surprised me. The lighter weight is nice for certain situations like trail running, but the H1 version is already light enough it never feels like it weighs me down.

----------

Regarding the handle on the 1 vs the 2, here is a five minute video I made right after the 2 won me over: https://streamable.com/dpy4uh

viewtopic.php?t=87226 - This is my Pacific Salt 2 Observations thread

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=68426 - Thread I made in 2015 when I found myself transitioning away from carrying the Pacific as a special use knife and it had become a go to EDC for me.

viewtopic.php?t=90089 - Last August I challenged myself to carry H1 PE for a month. This is the thread where I got really serious about using coarser and coarser grits to see how much edge retention I could pull out of H1 PE. Turns out it will out cut most knives in my collection if it has a 200-400 grit edge and the higher edge retention steels have a more polished edge most folks tend to use. So if you like to touch up, say, an S30V Manix on the fine sharpmaker rods, I would bet my whole Spyderco collection my PE H1 Pacific will slice cardboard longer than the Manix. This is coming from someone that used to not ever consider carrying PE H1 as an EDC because I was unimpressed with the edge holding.

https://youtu.be/VbDHhIx-ZO4&feature=emb_title

Rope cutting demo I did with a factory edge Pacific Salt VS my coarse finish Pacific Salt. This video demonstrates what I've been talking about better than words can.

Since running that experiment I've become even more impressed with H1. It is no exaggeration to state I can easily go a month without sharpening my PE H1 Pacific Salt, the edge retention is that good.
:unicorn
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spoonrobot
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#2

Post by spoonrobot »

PE H1 has been my favorite steel for decades, I favor the long discontinued Atlantic but exclusively carry the Pacific for the past few years since the former is now impossible to replace. I'll add my own attestation here, you're doing great work championing the steel.
spoonrobot wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:03 pm
I think H1 is probably the most unfairly maligned steel wrt edge retention. I think most of the negative feedback is from people who are repeating what they've heard, not sharing personal experience. It's not the best but it certainly holds it's own compared mid-tier steels. I've posted this before, but a few years ago I had occasion to cut 200+ feet of dirty bike box cardboard with PE H1. The knife cut great and would still shave after.
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ladybug93
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#3

Post by ladybug93 »

vivi wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:02 pm
The full flat grind was something I wanted in a Pacific for years, but it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference in cutting ability. Which surprised me.
i found i prefer the hollow grind for a lot of edc tasks. it makes for a more robust blade, but my h1 pac salt also cuts cardboard down with greater ease than my ffg manix. it's not a huge difference, but you definitely notice it after breaking down a few boxes.

i've yet to try a pe h1 knife, but i'd be happy to if they ever come out with an all black df2 salt. maybe i'll grab a black salt 2 at some point.
keep your knife sharp and your focus sharper.
current collection:
C253GBBK, C258GFBL, C101GBBK2, C11GYW, C11FWNB20CV, C101GBN15V2, C101GODFDE2, C60GGY, C149G, C189, C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, C122GBBK, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1
spyderco steels:
CPM 20CV, CPM 15V, CTS 204P, CPM CRUWEAR, CPM S30V, N690Co, M390, CPM MagnaCut, LC200N, CTS XHP, H1, 8Cr13MoV, GIN-1, CTS BD1, VG-10, VG-10/Damascus, 440C
vivi
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#4

Post by vivi »

spoonrobot wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:29 pm
PE H1 has been my favorite steel for decades, I favor the long discontinued Atlantic but exclusively carry the Pacific for the past few years since the former is now impossible to replace. I'll add my own attestation here, you're doing great work championing the steel.
Have you considered the new LC200N Atlantic?
spoonrobot wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:03 pm
I think H1 is probably the most unfairly maligned steel wrt edge retention. I think most of the negative feedback is from people who are repeating what they've heard, not sharing personal experience. It's not the best but it certainly holds it's own compared mid-tier steels. I've posted this before, but a few years ago I had occasion to cut 200+ feet of dirty bike box cardboard with PE H1. The knife cut great and would still shave after.
Image
I believe it. Around 2015 I was using my Aqua Salt in the garage a lot to break down cardboard boxes for recycling. That was the PE H1 knife I originally experimented with different grit finishes on. Even when I sharpened it to as high of a polish as the medium sharpmaker rods, it would cut all the cardboard in one go easily. Never had to stop and sharpen, and there were days I filled up an empty recycling bin and still had leftovers. I'd stockpile boxes and let them add up so I could have longer test sessions. Sharpening it with my old worn DMT X coarse it showed even better edge retention, and another big jump when I bought a set of 180-400 grit diamond plates.

In fact I have a brand new black blade PE H1 Pacific Salt I've been keeping unused so I can do a comparison video with its cutting performance VS my reprofiled green PE H1 Pacific. Would you guys like a cardboard cut test this time, or do you have another idea?

Speaking of cardboard, I forgot to show this video where I ran out of cardboard to cut:



Here's another showing me touching up the knife. Takes about 90 seconds.

:unicorn
vivi
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#5

Post by vivi »

ladybug93 wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:46 pm
vivi wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:02 pm
The full flat grind was something I wanted in a Pacific for years, but it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference in cutting ability. Which surprised me.
i found i prefer the hollow grind for a lot of edc tasks. it makes for a more robust blade, but my h1 pac salt also cuts cardboard down with greater ease than my ffg manix. it's not a huge difference, but you definitely notice it after breaking down a few boxes.

i've yet to try a pe h1 knife, but i'd be happy to if they ever come out with an all black df2 salt. maybe i'll grab a black salt 2 at some point.
The all black salts look really slick. I love my green one but I'm excited to get the all black into the rotation once I use it for testing.

I was firmly in the FFG camp for a long time. Was a little let down feeling when the Yojimbo 2 went to hollow grind instead of the FFG first version.

Using the Ronin 2 a bunch for utility stuff like breaking down cardboard and even camping tasks, it changed my view. Thinking back to when I carried Buck 110's I never had any issues with their geometry either. Hollow grinds can cut very well when done right, and they're done well on the Pacific Salt and Aqua Salt.
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ladybug93
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#6

Post by ladybug93 »

vivi wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:12 pm
ladybug93 wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:46 pm
vivi wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:02 pm
The full flat grind was something I wanted in a Pacific for years, but it doesn't seem to make that much of a difference in cutting ability. Which surprised me.
i found i prefer the hollow grind for a lot of edc tasks. it makes for a more robust blade, but my h1 pac salt also cuts cardboard down with greater ease than my ffg manix. it's not a huge difference, but you definitely notice it after breaking down a few boxes.

i've yet to try a pe h1 knife, but i'd be happy to if they ever come out with an all black df2 salt. maybe i'll grab a black salt 2 at some point.
The all black salts look really slick. I love my green one but I'm excited to get the all black into the rotation once I use it for testing.

I was firmly in the FFG camp for a long time. Was a little let down feeling when the Yojimbo 2 went to hollow grind instead of the FFG first version.

Using the Ronin 2 a bunch for utility stuff like breaking down cardboard and even camping tasks, it changed my view. Thinking back to when I carried Buck 110's I never had any issues with their geometry either. Hollow grinds can cut very well when done right, and they're done well on the Pacific Salt and Aqua Salt.
i really like the hollow grind on the yo2. for such a thick blade, i can't believe how thin it is behind the edge. that thing is a beast. and i agree completely that the hollow grind is well done on the pac salt also. you're making me really want to try a pe h1 pac salt. i still wish you could buy coated blades with yellow handles too.
keep your knife sharp and your focus sharper.
current collection:
C253GBBK, C258GFBL, C101GBBK2, C11GYW, C11FWNB20CV, C101GBN15V2, C101GODFDE2, C60GGY, C149G, C189, C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, C122GBBK, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1
spyderco steels:
CPM 20CV, CPM 15V, CTS 204P, CPM CRUWEAR, CPM S30V, N690Co, M390, CPM MagnaCut, LC200N, CTS XHP, H1, 8Cr13MoV, GIN-1, CTS BD1, VG-10, VG-10/Damascus, 440C
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JSumm
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#7

Post by JSumm »

So the Pacific Salt 2 is on my short list. I was going back and forth between H-1 and LC200N. Just from reading, I had settled on LC200N and Rit Dyeing the scales black. I like that it is FFG.

On the flip side. For no good reason, I love the look of a hollow grind. Gayle Bradley (also Centofante) has my favorite looking blade Spyderco offers just not the knife for me. I have an old Endura 4 with Saber Grind VG-10. There was a time I wanted something with a stronger tip for outdoor work and home renovation. I have since found that I prefer FFG from the the saber grind experiment. And that FFG is plenty strong for me.

After reading this, I am starting to be convinced I should try the H-1 route. If the hollow grind can cut through boxes well. I actually find my SG Endura can go through boxes just fine and just as good as my Manix. I do understand the TBE of the hollow grind can help with some material. :thinking
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skeeg11
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#8

Post by skeeg11 »

Sometimes there can be quite a difference between HHG and Low Hollow or Sabre grind. I like the way my serrated LC200N Pac Salt slices.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#9

Post by spoonrobot »

vivi wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:55 pm
spoonrobot wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:29 pm
PE H1 has been my favorite steel for decades, I favor the long discontinued Atlantic but exclusively carry the Pacific for the past few years since the former is now impossible to replace. I'll add my own attestation here, you're doing great work championing the steel.
Have you considered the new LC200N Atlantic?
I tried both the Pacific and Atlantic in their LC200N versions, while very impressed with their cutting performance I much prefer the additional saber hollow grind and heft of the H1 models. The LC200N Pacific has a svelte blade stock and cuts like a laser but I found myself hesitant to use the knife to it's fullest potential due to the decreased durability - although that may be perceived and not actual.

The picture somewhat minimizes the taper, in combo with the FFG it's a superb cutting instrument but just didn't fill my hand the same. I also found the actual sharpening to be less enjoyable and not as easy as H1. Good knives, just outside my preferences now.
Image
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tangent
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#10

Post by tangent »

I often carry a Salt 2 or Native 5 because of my job (math prof). However, if you told me I could only have one type of folder for the rest of my life to serve all purposes, I would select a Pac Salt without any hesitation.

I recently got the LC200N FFG Pac Salt and although I like it, it’s not quite the same. I couldn’t pinpoint what it was until reading this thread. It’s the heft of the H1 variant (whether actual or perceived)…that is the difference.

Dang it, Vivi, now I gotta rebuy a plane edge Pac Salt in H1 and put that wicked thin and very coarse bevel on it. Makes perfect sense!

Thanks for all the stuff you post. I’m a fan. 😎🤓
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#11

Post by VooDooChild »

tangent wrote: I often carry a Salt 2 or Native 5 because of my job (math prof)...
I dont really understand why a math professor would need to carry a salt series... And I even have a degree in mathematics as well.
Must be a phd thing. :cheap-sunglasses

But its all good, carry what you like.

This guy has been in my pocket the last few days.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#12

Post by tangent »

VooDooChild wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 11:33 pm
tangent wrote: I often carry a Salt 2 or Native 5 because of my job (math prof)...
I dont really understand why a math professor would need to carry a salt series... And I even have a degree in mathematics as well.
Must be a phd thing. :cheap-sunglasses

But its all good, carry what you like.

This guy has been in my pocket the last few days.
Well, I’m not always teaching math. I like it for IWB carry when exercising…and that is why I have the salts. For corrosion resistance…but also for the extreme light weight. I like having one knife for most things…simpler that way. Plus, for my EDC tasks, LC200N has enough edge retention for me. (No PhD here…just a masters degree) ;)
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#13

Post by Evil D »

snip
Last edited by Evil D on Wed Dec 15, 2021 6:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#14

Post by Freediver »

The Pacific Salt 1 & 2 are my absolute favorite and most carried Spydercos. I’ve been carrying one form of it for the last 10+ years. I’ve also gifted more Pacific Salt 1s than I can remember. If we get a Pacific Salt in Magnacut my knife buying/addiction may end because it will be my grail knife.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#15

Post by spoonrobot »

Evil D wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 8:43 am
spoonrobot wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 8:45 pm
vivi wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:55 pm
spoonrobot wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 1:29 pm
PE H1 has been my favorite steel for decades, I favor the long discontinued Atlantic but exclusively carry the Pacific for the past few years since the former is now impossible to replace. I'll add my own attestation here, you're doing great work championing the steel.
Have you considered the new LC200N Atlantic?
I tried both the Pacific and Atlantic in their LC200N versions, while very impressed with their cutting performance I much prefer the additional saber hollow grind and heft of the H1 models. The LC200N Pacific has a svelte blade stock and cuts like a laser but I found myself hesitant to use the knife to it's fullest potential due to the decreased durability - although that may be perceived and not actual.

The picture somewhat minimizes the taper, in combo with the FFG it's a superb cutting instrument but just didn't fill my hand the same. I also found the actual sharpening to be less enjoyable and not as easy as H1. Good knives, just outside my preferences now.
Image
Image



I don't think that blade has any actual distal taper at all. I think what you're seeing is the blade spine appears to be getting thinner only because it slopes down into the full flat grind of the blade. When the spine is moving down at a straight angle it's getting thinner as the blade grind also gets thinner. I think if you measured the blade thickness a quarter inch above the edge at different places on the blade you'll see it's the same thickness front to back. Distal taper would mean the blade has a thinner cross section at the tip.
The LC200N Pacific does have a distal taper, I owned one for a few months. The spine is 3mm at the spyderhole but thins to 2mm and less gradually moving towards the tip. The H1 models maintain the full 3mm thickness until the hollowgrind section meets the spine near the tip.

Although I did have a first production LC200N Pacific, has this been changed on more recent runs?

Here are some better pictures I was able to find:
Image
Image
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#16

Post by JSumm »

I think what David was speaking to is the thickness parallel to the tip. Draw a parallel line from the tip to the back of the blade and measure. It will probably be close to the edge. Thickness should be the same at the same parallel point across the blade.
Last edited by JSumm on Tue Dec 14, 2021 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#17

Post by Evil D »

snippity
Last edited by Evil D on Wed Dec 15, 2021 6:10 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#18

Post by wrdwrght »

After some enthusiasm for the announced PacSalt2, I didn’t actually go “meh”, but I couldn’t see how it improved on my original SE and PE. When the original’s disco was announced, I even got an SE backup.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#19

Post by Monty »

I think the Salt series gets too often dismissed as only a knife for water activities. I take some of mine out on the water, sure, but living on the southern coast you could never step on the beach and you'll still be dealing with humidity three seasons a year. I have many old knives with pitting to testify to this. Even ones o carried in the 90's before switching to Spyderco have a few spots, oiling a knife every day just isn't realistic for me. Espionage the Ladybug on my keychain, the fixed blades on my kayak, in the truck, etc. Those will go months without any attention.
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Re: Pacific Salt talk

#20

Post by vivi »

Monty wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 12:40 pm
I think the Salt series gets too often dismissed as only a knife for water activities. I take some of mine out on the water, sure, but living on the southern coast you could never step on the beach and you'll still be dealing with humidity three seasons a year. I have many old knives with pitting to testify to this. Even ones o carried in the 90's before switching to Spyderco have a few spots, oiling a knife every day just isn't realistic for me. Espionage the Ladybug on my keychain, the fixed blades on my kayak, in the truck, etc. Those will go months without any attention.
Yeha the salt series is great for peace of mind. One less thing to worry about. I don't think twice about leaving my Pacific clipped IWB on a run. Don't think twice about carrying it on a kayak or carrying it at work where I spend most my time in a 110 degree area.

To me a 100% corrosion proof folder is a much bigger deal than the difference in edge retention between K390 & 440C. Sharpening a little more often is much less trouble than breaking down a knife, sanding out rust, putting it back together and coating it in oil.

The H1 fixed blades are nice too, the toughness really gets to shine there. I don't think my Aqua Salt has ever gone on a fishing trip, but I've batoned plenty of firewood for the camp site over the years.

They're very well rounded.
:unicorn
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