FYI, We've got the heat treat of the MagnaCut blade down, thanx to Shawn and Larrin. the holdup is finding the best lock material to work with the blade. we've already nixed 2 different materials and we're now testing the 3rd.
sal
How often do you run into problems with blade and lock steels not working together, and in what ways do they not work? This is probably a detail that many of us have never considered (I certainly haven't). I'm assuming this is an issue with all locks? Is it more of an issue with some locks than others? Very interesting topic.
Ditto to all that!
Also, is the Heat Treat now geared more towards Toughness, Edge Retention or Corrosion Resistance? Will the Native5 with MagnaCut still be considered part of the Salt series?
I welcome dialog, as long as it remains cordial, constructive and is conducted in a civilized manner. - Titanic: Blood & Steel
You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time. - Abraham Lincoln
How often do you run into problems with blade and lock steels not working together, and in what ways do they not work? This is probably a detail that many of us have never considered (I certainly haven't). I'm assuming this is an issue with all locks? Is it more of an issue with some locks than others? Very interesting topic.
Great questions. I'm also naïvely wondering why the lock still can't (always ?) be made of the same steel as the blade.
Total guess here but I would think either the blade or the lock would need to be slightly softer. It would allow for some slight give with repeated lockup. Two equally hard materials could maybe due damage to each other. Again a total guess.
My guess would be the potential (or rather, potential difference) for galvanic corrosion. It's already challenging enough to refine a heat treatment for a new metal. Adding to that the extreme corrosion-resistance requirement in the salt models would like take some time to iron out. Just a guess though.
FYI, We've got the heat treat of the MagnaCut blade down, thanx to Shawn and Larrin. the holdup is finding the best lock material to work with the blade. we've already nixed 2 different materials and we're now testing the 3rd.
sal
How often do you run into problems with blade and lock steels not working together, and in what ways do they not work? This is probably a detail that many of us have never considered (I certainly haven't). I'm assuming this is an issue with all locks? Is it more of an issue with some locks than others? Very interesting topic.
Hi David,
It's a bigger problem than we thought. We first noticed it when making the original UK pen Knife. We used a spring that we felt would work, then we cycle tested it (open & close). The Vanadium carbines in the S30V cut a clean trough in the lock head leaving only a .003 sliver on each side where the washers were.
It's more of a problem with Salts. As mentioned, due to corrosion at the interface. However to test a material, we have to build the parts, build the knife and then go through the testing cycles. a real PITA.
As to the leaning in the heat treat, you'll have to ask Larrin and shawn.
sal
Thank You.
Hope they chime in.
I welcome dialog, as long as it remains cordial, constructive and is conducted in a civilized manner. - Titanic: Blood & Steel
You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time. - Abraham Lincoln
Thanks for the insider look Sal! It’s crazy hearing how much bringing a high quality knife to the market entails.
If cost wasn’t in the equation, would using the same material for the lock and blade be ideal, or are there hidden issues with that?
From my experience with firearms, specifically semi automatics,using the same type of material might or might not be a problem. Metals all have different properties. It can be difficult finding two metals that will slide against each other without either of them wearing unnecessarially, galling which we would call lock stick in knives and cause failures in firearms, and at the same time not cause corrosion which is important in this knife. While the blade is finalized, the spring would need to be suitable in strength and elasticity as well as fulfilling the other requirements. As Sal stated, the only way to be sure, especially with a new steel, is to make one and test it. Once they have it nailed down, the mext knife will be easier and quicker because they will already know which metals won't work and why. No worries, Once again this is the reason Spyderco knives are my most purchased knives. Thanks Sal and Company!
As Grizz mentioned, That's not always a good solution. Test, try, test, try...
I remember when Detonics came out with the first all stainless semi auto. I watched closely as "galling" was discovered in similar steels rubbing against each other.
Much of what we have learned at Spyderco has come from testing. Either from my teachers or our own testing. You become the beneficiary of that edge-u-cation.
This is really neat....feel like I'm in the Inner Sanctum. Been waiting for close to a year, so this is good news. So thankful for a knife maker that doesn't rush it. I (and I'm sure We) admire perfection.
My big takeaway from this is that instead of compulsively opening and closing my folder as I watched a movie at home, I could have been getting paid doing it for Spyderco
Seriously though, thanks to the company for doing their best to ensure the production of a reliable, high performance product.
I remember when Detonics came out with the first all stainless semi auto. I watched closely as "galling" was discovered in similar steels rubbing against each other.
That is actually the example I was remembering, although I had forgotten the model. I was quite into amateur gunsmithing and working on the actions of semi-auto guns once upon a time, and I am old enough to remember when stainless steel was first being used in firearms in a regular basis and the problems that occurred. I also learned very quickly the importance of going slow; It is extremely easy to remove too much metal, which cannot be replaced. Thanks for the insights into your business!
FYI, We've got the heat treat of the MagnaCut blade down, thanx to Shawn and Larrin. the holdup is finding the best lock material to work with the blade. we've already nixed 2 different materials and we're now testing the 3rd.
sal
Thanks for the update. I was wondering why there was a delay on the release of this knife.
This discussion about the lock material not playing nice with MagnaCut makes me wonder what other companies are doing right or wrong in regards to this. I keep seeing other brands crank out MagnaCut knives and I wonder what they're doing with the heat treat and the lock steel relationship. It does give the impression that they're just pushing out the steel for the sake of sales and in the long run I wonder if this could potentially hurt MagnaCut's reputation if these knives are making it out into the world with less than great heat treat and such.
