Police vs. Endura - Ergonomics

[Jason Paul]

Hi All,

I'm considering getting a Police 4 LW, possibly in K390. It might be too big, but I'm thinking about it; but have a couple of questions. I know that model has a good fan base.

I'm mainly asking about the ergonomics of the Police vs. the Endura. I have a Pacific Salt 2, which is basically the same as an Endura. I'm one whose fingers don't quite line up with the Endura, so the bumps make it less comfortable than other Spydercos. The first space is too large for one finger, but too small for two fingers, so the ergonomics are just meh.

Looking at the Police, it looks like the first space (not the choil) is actually smaller than the one on the Endura. So, maybe the Police will line up with my fingers better. I also think I've read from some who say they find the ergos of the Police better than the Endura.

So, who here has both the Police and Endura and can comment on the ergonomics between them? Maybe comparison photos if you have them? Anyone who doesn't fit the Endura, but finds that the Police works?

I was also considering the Native Chief, but I generally don't like pocket-shredding G-10, so would probably wait for the LW to come out. Of course, that's probably several months away at least.

Also just looking for general comments about the Police. I'm on the fence about it anyway, just because of the size alone. I kind of like the idea, but many reviewers say they hardly carry it because it's so big.

Thanks!

[bearfacedkiller]

I hate the Endura handle. The Police handle works well for me. They Chief is a little better. The Police is definitely large. The Chief is a little bit smaller. The Chief takes up less space in the pocket than the Police.

I don’t know if I could pick a favorite between the Police and Chief but I definitely like them both more than the Endura. I had a Super Blue Endura that I held on to for years trying to like it. I eventually traded it away. I had some apprehension about doing so because it is a sought after model but in retrospect I have no regrets. I still have the SB Stretch and Delica if I want to play with Super Blue.

[JRinFL]

If you don't mind some manual labor, G-10 can be lightly hand sanded to make it less aggressive. Use a good mask and/or sand under water to prevent breathing in the dust.

[ChrisinHove]

The Police seems significantly larger in hand than the Endura - it really is big! It’s handle is more immediately comfortable for my XL hands than the Endura, however, which can easily find a comfortable grip forward or back on the handle.

But that’s not the whole story … the Endura handle makes me place my grip differently, and when I do it’s equally comfortable in use.

The Native Chief is slightly better than either, though.

[VooDooChild]

I used to complain about the points on the endura but I forced myself to adjust my grip every time I used it. Then I got used to the handle. Now I like it.

With that said the police 4 lightweight is great though. Its big but I stopped caring about that sort of thing a long time ago.

[vivi]

Hi All,

I'm considering getting a Police 4 LW, possibly in K390. It might be too big, but I'm thinking about it; but have a couple of questions. I know that model has a good fan base.

I'm mainly asking about the ergonomics of the Police vs. the Endura. I have a Pacific Salt 2, which is basically the same as an Endura. I'm one whose fingers don't quite line up with the Endura, so the bumps make it less comfortable than other Spydercos. The first space is too large for one finger, but too small for two fingers, so the ergonomics are just meh.

Looking at the Police, it looks like the first space (not the choil) is actually smaller than the one on the Endura. So, maybe the Police will line up with my fingers better. I also think I've read from some who say they find the ergos of the Police better than the Endura.

So, who here has both the Police and Endura and can comment on the ergonomics between them? Maybe comparison photos if you have them? Anyone who doesn't fit the Endura, but finds that the Police works?

I was also considering the Native Chief, but I generally don't like pocket-shredding G-10, so would probably wait for the LW to come out. Of course, that's probably several months away at least.

Also just looking for general comments about the Police. I'm on the fence about it anyway, just because of the size alone. I kind of like the idea, but many reviewers say they hardly carry it because it's so big.

Thanks!

I have the exact same feelings about the Endura handle. First part of the grip is oversized for one finger but undersized for two.

The Police is a lot more comfortable for my hands. If they ever make a Police Salt I'd ditch the Pacific, despite howmuch I've carried them the past ~15 years.

[juggler]

I'm one whose fingers don't quite line up with the Endura, so the bumps make it less comfortable than other Spydercos

I had exactly the same problem with the Endura (or the Delica, for that matter) and I quickly sold it for that very reason: nice blade, great size but poor ergonomics (for me, at least).

While the Police is obviously bigger, it's surprisingly comfortable and easy to handle for a knife this size, probably because of its slim profile. And yes, the more neutral grip makes a huge difference. I was worried it would be a bit too big for me (I have medium to large hands) but it's now my most used folder.

[p_atrick]

P4LW is a great knife. I much prefer it to the Endura. Yes, it is big, but I was surprised at how "small" it felt in my hand and my pocket. I thought it would be unwieldy. It is a great design and one I'd recommend.

[soc_monki]

I think the Police, Endura, and Chief all have their place and I enjoy using them all. They are all comfortable for me, with the chief being #1, Police #2, and Endura #3, but all really close. If I had to choose one, I'd probably go with my S90V/CF Chief though. Such a classy knife! But I do love that big honkin' K390 Police blade!

[vivi]

I'd agree on the Chief. Police hasn't seen hardly any pocket time since I picked up some Chiefs.

[FourStringFiend]

I agree with what others have said. The Endura is great (my main carry for years). Police 4 is more comfortable but much larger (I carry a Chaparral LW when I do). Chief hits a sweet spot between the two (it has almost replaced the Endura for me).

[DOUBLE D]

I don’t have the police so I can’t comment on that. But I do have the same issue on the endura which is my favorite model. I sanded down that first hump so it was even with the rest of the handle. I left the back hump. It’s amazingly comfortable now. 20 minutes of work and it’s the greatest ergos ever now. I have a post with some pictures around here somewhere. I don’t know how to link it and it’s been so long since I’ve posted pics I’m not sure how to do it anymore. If your interested I’d be happy to figure out how to post new pics.

[nerdlock]

I don't have the Endura but I have the Police 4 G-10. Despite it's large size, it's one of the most extremely comfortable handles of all my Spydercos. I love the chamfering on the G-10 and I often wonder why that chamfering isn't used on Golden models like the Native Chief.

[Wartstein]

.... I’m not sure how to do it anymore. .....

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=83968

[James Y]

My Police 4 LWT is definitely more comfortable in hand than the E4. But the E4’s handle bumps have never been a problem for me. The P4 LWT is simply one of Spyderco’s most comfortable handles, period.

Lately, I’ve been mostly carrying Golden models; but if I were to carry either the P4 LWT or the E4 more again, it would still be the E4 most often, simply due to its size. Not because of my hand size (it feels great), but blade size. I simply don’t need an over-4” blade for the vast majority of my own daily pocketknife tasks.

Jim

[prndltech]

My Police 4 LWT is definitely more comfortable in hand than the E4. But the E4’s handle bumps have never been a problem for me. The P4 LWT is simply one of Spyderco’s most comfortable handles, period.

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

x2

[yablanowitz]

Possibly too late to add value, but I did finally get a few pictures uploaded.

[Jason Paul]

Thanks for all of the replies so far.

@yablanowitz - not too late at all, and very helpful - thanks!

The photos make it pretty clear that the first section of the Police handle is a better fit for one finger vs. being too big for one but too small for two like the Endura. I can practically tell just by looking that the Police has better ergonomics (for me).

Still debating if the Police is just too big in general. It seems like it should carry about like my Pacific Salt 2; probably just slightly longer in the pocket. One odd thing is how much handle is still coming out from the back of your hand.

I'd just hate to spend $160+ on a knife only to find out it's just too big to carry. That said, it certainly does have a strong fan base.

[vivi]

Thanks for all of the replies so far.

@yablanowitz - not too late at all, and very helpful - thanks!

The photos make it pretty clear that the first section of the Police handle is a better fit for one finger vs. being too big for one but too small for two like the Endura. I can practically tell just by looking that the Police has better ergonomics (for me).

Still debating if the Police is just too big in general. It seems like it should carry about like my Pacific Salt 2; probably just slightly longer in the pocket. One odd thing is how much handle is still coming out from the back of your hand.

I'd just hate to spend $160+ on a knife only to find out it's just too big to carry. That said, it certainly does have a strong fan base.

Part of that is due to how he grips it.

With the Police 3 I developed the habit of gripping the handle so my index finger was further back in that first contour. otherwise my middle finger would land on a point on the handle.




While the Police 4 has a more rounded handle, it still feels better gripped this way too.

That said I find extra long handles ergonomically superior to ones that end in my palm like a delica.

[R100]

I like both the P4 and Endura handles but I do find the Endura better balanced and "livelier" in the hand. I prefer it as a work knife. Of late though I find myself carrying my Native Chief most frequently. It is a great knife and actually much less pocket shredding than the P4 lw. The smooth portion of the P4 where the clip lands is long but not quite long enough and I find it really grabs the pocket and creates wear. I switched to tip up but still have the same issue. I found the Native Chief better than the P4 in this regard when new but much better now that it is worn in.

With respect to the Endura 4 handle, I didn't even realise there was an issue until I read about it on this forum. Now I can't "unfeel" it and have sanded the handle on my K390 version! If you think the E4 handle isn't perfectly ergonomic it's probably because you are too spoiled by Spyderco. Grab a knife from another manufacturer and you'll see what I mean!

Dan