K390 Stretch 2: Manix 2 LW killer?

[Senfkarte]

Got my K390 Stretch 2 today. Of course, it is way too early to come to any conclusion. So I only can share my very first impression.

The knife came with a little blade play. Tightening the pivot screw was a quick solution, with introduced a scraping sound while closing or opening. I was not able to find the exact source of the sound, so I took the knife apart and sanded the FRN and the steel liners down at the edges. I was very positive surprised, that there was a lot of oil between the steel liners und the FRN scales. I still don't know where the problem was, but it was gone after the sanding and now the edges of the FRN feel much better.


Now for the killer part. I have to be honest and say, that I disagree on this part. At least when comparing the Stretch to the Manix 2. In the pictures, the two look very similar but in my hand they are not this similar as one would think. The Manix fits my hands way better. Or I am so much more familiar with the Manix in comparison to the Stretch, that I expected something other. Furthermore, the blade shape of the Manix seems better for my uses. But that's hard to judge, since the Stretch is mine only for 12 hours.
But I have to say, the Stretch may be a PM2 killer. Very similar blade shape but better ergos. And I think the better lock. I want to be clear. I do not dislike the comp lock. But as a lefty, the regular comp lock is not the best lock in town to disengage on the same level of convenience as a right-handed person. On the plus side, the cutout for the comp lock is on the better side when the knife is used with the left hand. Of course the cutout for the back lock can be uncomfortable, too. But a good back lock still is over a comp lock for me personally. And if it is only because the back lock has a stronger tendency to keep the blade in the closed position.
So time will tell, but these are my very first impressions with the Stretch 2.

[Fireman]

https://youtu.be/yvRVWgy8uBo

[Wartstein]

.....

Now for the killer part. I have to be honest and say, that I disagree on this part. At least when comparing the Stretch to the Manix 2. In the pictures, the two look very similar but in my hand they are not this similar as one would think. The Manix fits my hands way better. Or I am so much more familiar with the Manix in comparison to the Stretch, that I expected something other. Furthermore, the blade shape of the Manix seems better for my uses. But that's hard to judge, since the Stretch is mine only for 12 hours.
.......

Manix vs Stretch ergos are an interesting thing, both very good, but different:

When talking about the Stretch 2, the Manix in comparison "hugs" the hand more due to the shorter grip area and "rear guard" (the Stretch 1 is/was way closer to the Manix in that regard) - this can be a good thing, bad thing or not matter at all, depending on personal preferences.

Now where I find the Stretch (1 and 2) definitely superior over the Manix is when cutting really, really tough materials, like certain very thick doubled walled, perhaps damp cardboard.
When I really have to grip the handle very hard, and the material offers a lot of resistance, the Manix starts to get uncomfortable, cause the corners of the handle cut into the flesh of the hand.
The Stretch, probably due to the chamfering of the FRN (the FRCP Manix LW does not really have this), is a lot better in such "extreme" tasks. But admittedly I have to do such cutting so very rarely with a folder, that the difference here between Manix and Stretch almost does not matter to me.

But perhaps you´d like to try one day for yourself how this is for you and if you also can feel a difference between Stretch and Manix ins such tasks. If so, I´d be interested in the results!

(Edited for spelling)

[ladybug93]

.....

Now for the killer part. I have to be honest and say, that I disagree on this part. At least when comparing the Stretch to the Manix 2. In the pictures, the two look very similar but in my hand they are not this similar as one would think. The Manix fits my hands way better. Or I am so much more familiar with the Manix in comparison to the Stretch, that I expected something other. Furthermore, the blade shape of the Manix seems better for my uses. But that's hard to judge, since the Stretch is mine only for 12 hours.
.......

Manix vs Stretch ergos are an interesting thing, both very good, but different:

When talking about the Stretch 2, the Manix in comparison "hugs" the hand more due to the shorter grip area and "rear guard" (the Stretch 1 is/was way closer to the Manix in that regard) - this can be a good thing, bad thing or not matter at all, depending on personal preferences.

No where I find the Stretch (1 and 2) definitely superior over the Manix is when cutting really, really tough materials, like certain very thick doubled walled, perhaps damp cardboard.
When I really have to grip the handle very hard, and the material offers a lot of resistance, the Manix starts to get uncomfortable, cause the corners of the handle cut into the flesh of the hand.
The Stretch, probably due to the chamfering of the FRN (the FRCP Manix LW does not really have this), is a lot better in such "extreme" tasks. But admittedly I have to do such cutting so very rarely with a folder, that the difference here between Manix and Stretch almost does not matter to me.

But perhaps you´d like to try one day for yourself how this is for you and if you also can feel a difference between Stretch and Manix ins such tasks. If so, I´d be interested in the results!

jobs like this are why i started edc'ing a small utility knife in my bag. usually, if you have to really grip your knife and push hard through material, it's because you're using the wrong tool. i understand wanting a pocket knife that can do everything, but i would never pry open a paint can with my manix, so why would i try to push it into other work it isn't best suited for? a gerber prybrid can be a real hand saver against cardboard. it's way less ergonomic than a manix, but it cuts cardboard so much easier that it more than makes up for it. and you can get serrated utility blades too.

[Senfkarte]

...
But perhaps you´d like to try one day for yourself how this is for you and if you also can feel a difference between Stretch and Manix ins such tasks. If so, I´d be interested in the results!
...

I find that gripping a knife very hard gives you a good idea if there are any hotspots. Of course this is not exact but for a first impression it is better than nothing. And I have to say, when gripping the Manix 2 and the Stretch 2 very hard, the Stretch 2 seems to have fewer hotspots. In a not so hard grip the Manix 2 still feels better, more locked.

[Craiger12]

First impression - I. Love. This. Knife.

I was hesitant to pull the trigger bc I already have the K390 PM2 but I'm happy I did. The thinner blade stock is also thinner BTE and slices like crazy. There is zero blade play in any direction and the action is very smooth and solid. Blade centering and lock bar/blade alignment are both perfect. This knife is going to see a ton of pocket time through the fall and winter until it's time to break out the Salts again for warmer weather. Just need to pick up a deep carry clip.

[NCC-2893]

First impression - I. Love. This. Knife.

I was hesitant to pull the trigger bc I already have the K390 PM2 but I'm happy I did. The thinner blade stock is also thinner BTE and slices like crazy. There is zero blade play in any direction and the action is very smooth and solid. Blade centering and lock bar/blade alignment are both perfect. This knife is going to see a ton of pocket time through the fall and winter until it's time to break out the Salts again for warmer weather. Just need to pick up a deep carry clip.

I totally agree. It doesn’t suffer from the grip issues that the PM2 has. My pinky with the PM2 always rests on that tip near the butt when not choked up. Much more of an issue when bearing down. Stretch does not have that issue. A knife with the same feel without the choil would be the Rock Jumper. Grips designed for hard work. Like many have mentioned, the appreciation of the handle design of the Stretch and Rock Jumper are more noticeable when using a strong grip over a prolonged time. I’m very excited to see how the upcoming Leaf Jumper blade shape will function, look, and feel.

[Wartstein]

First impression - I. Love. This. Knife.

I was hesitant to pull the trigger bc I already have the K390 PM2 but I'm happy I did. The thinner blade stock is also thinner BTE and slices like crazy. There is zero blade play in any direction and the action is very smooth and solid. Blade centering and lock bar/blade alignment are both perfect. This knife is going to see a ton of pocket time through the fall and winter until it's time to break out the Salts again for warmer weather. Just need to pick up a deep carry clip.

I totally agree. It doesn’t suffer from the grip issues that the PM2 has. My pinky with the PM2 always rests on that tip near the butt when not choked up. Much more of an issue when bearing down. Stretch does not have that issue. A knife with the same feel without the choil would be the Rock Jumper. Grips designed for hard work. Like many have mentioned, the appreciation of the handle design of the Stretch and Rock Jumper are more noticeable when using a strong grip over a prolonged time. I’m very excited to see how the upcoming Leaf Jumper blade shape will function, look, and feel.

I have several Stretch 1, but also quite extensive experience with the Stretch 2, "regular" and straight spine (the VG10 ivory sprint) and the PM2.

There are certainly reasons to love the PM2, but performance-wise for me it is not really a match for the Stretch. Both in slicing performance and in ergos, especially, as you said, in prolongued use.

[Doc Dan]

First impression - I. Love. This. Knife.

I was hesitant to pull the trigger bc I already have the K390 PM2 but I'm happy I did. The thinner blade stock is also thinner BTE and slices like crazy. There is zero blade play in any direction and the action is very smooth and solid. Blade centering and lock bar/blade alignment are both perfect. This knife is going to see a ton of pocket time through the fall and winter until it's time to break out the Salts again for warmer weather. Just need to pick up a deep carry clip.

I totally agree. It doesn’t suffer from the grip issues that the PM2 has. My pinky with the PM2 always rests on that tip near the butt when not choked up. Much more of an issue when bearing down. Stretch does not have that issue. A knife with the same feel without the choil would be the Rock Jumper. Grips designed for hard work. Like many have mentioned, the appreciation of the handle design of the Stretch and Rock Jumper are more noticeable when using a strong grip over a prolonged time. I’m very excited to see how the upcoming Leaf Jumper blade shape will function, look, and feel.

I have several Stretch 1, but also quite extensive experience with the Stretch 2, "regular" and straight spine (the VG10 ivory sprint) and the PM2.

There are certainly reasons to love the PM2, but performance-wise for me it is not really a match for the Stretch. Both in slicing performance and in ergos, especially, as you said, in prolongued use.

Performance wise and comfort wise the SSS is far better than the PM2. There is no contest as far as I am concerned. Weight wise the M2LW is great, but the SSS is overall more comfortable and has a more useful blade shape. It bothers me to say this because I really do love the M2LW and own several. No more. As soon as new SSS models are released, I'm going for those, instead.

[Ramonade]

Since I can't find the s90v Native5 LW or Para 3 LW, I'm interested in trying K390, and the Stretch 2 LW straigth spine looks to be really really good for that job.

Has anyone noticed a bit of vertical blade play on this model? My Endura 4 ZDP-189 has some (other owners told me they do not, so just bad luck). I'd like to know if any experienced vertical blade play on the SSS2 LW.

[Wartstein]

Since I can't find the s90v Native5 LW or Para 3 LW, I'm interested in trying K390, and the Stretch 2 LW straigth spine looks to be really really good for that job.

Has anyone noticed a bit of vertical blade play on this model? My Endura 4 ZDP-189 has some (other owners told me they do not, so just bad luck). I'd like to know if any experienced vertical blade play on the SSS2 LW.

We´ve talked about the blade play in your Endura in that other thread: As far as I can recall it has quite some (unusual amount of) vertical blade play, right?

In think if you ask about "a bit of vertical blade play" on a(ny) Seki model, many if not most here will tell you that they notice a very slight amount of it (more like a bit of lock rock) when really trying to provoke it.

As said, I have to press the blades of all my Seki backlocks very hard on something like a cutting board to feel the blade move upward the slightest bit, but this will occur on probably almost any Seki backlock and will to be expected on the K390 Stretch too I guess. For me not an issue by any means though.

I´d say go for the Stretch, it is an amazing model, and perhaps ask the dealer to check for blade play before sending it out.
Should it still not satisfy you then, I think you are certainly entitled to return the knife (but I am almost 100% certain this won´t be necessary)

[Wartstein]

......

I totally agree. It doesn’t suffer from the grip issues that the PM2 has. My pinky with the PM2 always rests on that tip near the butt when not choked up. Much more of an issue when bearing down. Stretch does not have that issue. A knife with the same feel without the choil would be the Rock Jumper. Grips designed for hard work. Like many have mentioned, the appreciation of the handle design of the Stretch and Rock Jumper are more noticeable when using a strong grip over a prolonged time. I’m very excited to see how the upcoming Leaf Jumper blade shape will function, look, and feel.

I have several Stretch 1, but also quite extensive experience with the Stretch 2, "regular" and straight spine (the VG10 ivory sprint) and the PM2.

There are certainly reasons to love the PM2, but performance-wise for me it is not really a match for the Stretch. Both in slicing performance and in ergos, especially, as you said, in prolongued use.

Performance wise and comfort wise the SSS is far better than the PM2. There is no contest as far as I am concerned. Weight wise the M2LW is great, but the SSS is overall more comfortable and has a more useful blade shape. It bothers me to say this because I really do love the M2LW and own several. No more. As soon as new SSS models are released, I'm going for those, instead.

True.
For me the only reasons for PM2 over Stretch could be if one prefers the comp.lock over the backlock or G10 over FRN.
Since for me it is exactly the other way round, and in ergos and cutting the Stretch outperforms the PM2 easily (I mean one can actually SEE this has to be the case when looking at the blades (tapering, thickness...)): Easy choice...

[Fireman]

I bet I would like K390 in a DLC chef knife.

[Ramonade]

[...]

[...]

In think if you ask about "a bit of vertical blade play" on a(ny) Seki model, many if not most here will tell you that they notice a very slight amount of it (more like a bit of lock rock) when really trying to provoke it.

[...]

I´d say go for the Stretch, it is an amazing model, and perhaps ask the dealer to check for blade play before sending it out.
Should it still not satisfy you then, I think you are certainly entitled to return the knife (but I am almost 100% certain this won´t be necessary)

Vertical blade play is felt in hand as soon as the cut requires more push than a simple paper cut. I'm working on the vid ! It's hard to show something that is mostly felt, and quite hard to see.


I'll make a short list of the knives I want to try/have. The quest for s90v led me to the para 3 LW, wich is a model i would now love to try .
I used to DJ years ago, and have some professionnal equipment gathering dust, it might soon turn into my first high end (CRK, Peña ?) knife or the N5 Fluted CF s90v + the famous SE Endela + that Stretch ! (Considering how infatuated I am with Spyderco, this isn't much of a choice)

[Wartstein]

Vertical blade play is felt in hand as soon as the cut requires more push than a simple paper cut. I'm working on the vid ! It's hard to show something that is mostly felt, and quite hard to see.


I'll make a short list of the knives I want to try/have. The quest for s90v led me to the para 3 LW, wich is a model i would now love to try .
I used to DJ years ago, and have some professionnal equipment gathering dust, it might soon turn into my first high end (CRK, Peña ?) knife or the N5 Fluted CF s90v + the famous SE Endela + that Stretch ! (Considering how infatuated I am with Spyderco, this isn't much of a choice)

That kind if vertical play is certainly not normal at all, not even on a Seki backlock (non of mine has/had even just nearly the amount you´re describing)

/ Good list!

- SE Endela imho is a must in the SE realm anyway, and the Stretch one of the best Spydercos ever.
- The Native one of the coolest looking Spydies for me, though a bit unstable in my particular hand (and only in harder use) - most though seem to love the ergos!
- I am afraid though that there is not Para 3 LW in S90V? (Just a carbon fibre sprint as far as I am aware of?)
Anyway, though really not my favorite Spyderco (by its specs/concept and in real use): The Para 3 LW is a Spydie one has to try imho! You might end up really liking it since very, very many do so! I had an SE version for a month and found it at least not bad. Just could (again) not really warm up to the comp.lock.

[Senfkarte]

...
But perhaps you´d like to try one day for yourself how this is for you and if you also can feel a difference between Stretch and Manix ins such tasks. If so, I´d be interested in the results!
...

I carried the Stretch 2 now for the past two weeks and did a bit of everything with it. Of course two weeks are still not a lot of time but I cut some thin cardboard, some thick cardboard, did some yard work and all other things, that needed to be cut. Most of it was not hard use but the yard work definitely required a good amount of force from time to time.
In those cases the Stretch 2 is superior to the Manix 2. The rounded handle really is better, my first impression was wrong. But in the other tasks the Manix 2 still feels better in my hand. Hard to say, which one is better overall on ergos. A rounded Manix 2 would be ideal....maybe some sandpaper

...
Has anyone noticed a bit of vertical blade play on this model? My Endura 4 ZDP-189 has some (other owners told me they do not, so just bad luck). I'd like to know if any experienced vertical blade play on the SSS2 LW.

Yes, mine has it too. It clicks under a little load, not a lot of force is required. But the movement is very, very small. You can feel it but to see it, you need to look very close and near the handle, to have a reference point. But I have to say, the first thing I have done to this knife, was to take it apart. So the fault may be on mine side and not on the side of Spyderco, although I am pretty sure I reassembled it correctly. But I have not checked for blade play, before disassembling it, so I give Spyderco the benefit of a doubt.

[Ramonade]

[...]

...
Has anyone noticed a bit of vertical blade play on this model? My Endura 4 ZDP-189 has some (other owners told me they do not, so just bad luck). I'd like to know if any experienced vertical blade play on the SSS2 LW.

Yes, mine has it too. It clicks under a little load, not a lot of force is required. But the movement is very, very small. You can feel it but to see it, you need to look very close and near the handle, to have a reference point. But I have to say, the first thing I have done to this knife, was to take it apart. So the fault may be on mine side and not on the side of Spyderco, although I am pretty sure I reassembled it correctly. But I have not checked for blade play, before disassembling it, so I give Spyderco the benefit of a doubt.

Mine was doing it upon receival, I made the exact same observations. However, I felt it to be really high of a vertical play. After disassembly, i found out that one of the FRN point supposed to be into the liner was squished and out of it. Managed to fix that and now I'm back to the same vertical play you described. People often say you can feel it while cutting with a lot of force, but for me it's more like any kind of cutting that isn't simple paper.

[Senfkarte]

Forgot to mention another big plus for the Stretch 2, it's the closed back. A closed back just feels like the edge is better protected. Usually there is only the knife in my knife pocket, but that's not always the case.

[Wartstein]

Forgot to mention another big plus for the Stretch 2, it's the closed back. A closed back just feels like the edge is better protected. Usually there is only the knife in my knife pocket, but that's not always the case.

This!

The pros of a closed back get underestimated sometimes imho.
It is one of the advantages a backlock normally offers (and also knives like the Manix 2 LW)

Not only cause it protects the blade - actually a closed back makes for better ergos too.
I always see it like this: If one was to create a really comfortable knife (fixed blade) handle: They would certainly NOT start ba giving such a handle a gap on the spine/ back of the handle, like most comp. and linerlock knives have...

[Wartstein]

...
But perhaps you´d like to try one day for yourself how this is for you and if you also can feel a difference between Stretch and Manix ins such tasks. If so, I´d be interested in the results!
...

I carried the Stretch 2 now for the past two weeks and did a bit of everything with it. Of course two weeks are still not a lot of time but I cut some thin cardboard, some thick cardboard, did some yard work and all other things, that needed to be cut. Most of it was not hard use but the yard work definitely required a good amount of force from time to time.
In those cases the Stretch 2 is superior to the Manix 2. The rounded handle really is better, my first impression was wrong. But in the other tasks the Manix 2 still feels better in my hand. Hard to say, which one is better overall on ergos. A rounded Manix 2 would be ideal....maybe some sandpaper

...
Has anyone noticed a bit of vertical blade play on this model? My Endura 4 ZDP-189 has some (other owners told me they do not, so just bad luck). I'd like to know if any experienced vertical blade play on the SSS2 LW.

Yes, mine has it too. It clicks under a little load, not a lot of force is required. But the movement is very, very small. You can feel it but to see it, you need to look very close and near the handle, to have a reference point. But I have to say, the first thing I have done to this knife, was to take it apart. So the fault may be on mine side and not on the side of Spyderco, although I am pretty sure I reassembled it correctly. But I have not checked for blade play, before disassembling it, so I give Spyderco the benefit of a doubt.

Thanks for reporting back, Senfkarte!!

As said, this is my experience too: In real "hard" use, when gripping the handle very tight, the Stretch ("1" in my case) is clearly more comfortable than the Manix 2 (LW in my case).
Not a big issue though, cause I rarely use my folders in that manner

/ On the blade play: This does no sound normal imho.
I don´t think any of my quite many Seki backlocks has/had that. Just some very slight lock rock on some under real hard pressure on a cutting board...