Most Underestimated Steel.

[TomAiello]

Ah, ok. I have a full set of the MBS-26 knives.

I found this article of Larrin's: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2019/03/04/all-about-aeb-l/

From the article it sounds like AEB/AEB-H is a precursor to AEB-L.

"Uddeholm did patent a stainless steel in 1928 [2], which was named AEB, and later AEB-H to differentiate it from AEB-L. "

That would seem to bear out my general feeling that I prefer AEB-L to MBS-26, and 14c28n to AEB-L.

[Nate]

I’ll put in a mention for B70P.

Looks to be a great “well-balanced” alloy for cutlery and the performance of my mules has been great. Very nice mix of fine grain size, toughness, wear resistance, and ease of grinding/sharpening, but I doubt we’ll see it used again due to the lack of interest it saw.

Admittedly, it is a crowded field, but I feel like it might do better now that there seems to be more appreciation for the likes of 52100, AEB—L, BD1N, etc than when the mule was released.

[Dan In MI]

I was able to reprofile my ZDP DF2 with much less effort than it required to recondition a mini-Gerber with whatever mystery steel they use.

"Mystery steel" is quite an accurate assessment. I don't want to get into bashing any manufacturer too much, but suffice it to say that I was rather displeased with the last Gerber product I purchased.

Both of the Spydies I put to work have VG-10 blades. For my purposes, it does well. I do not use my knives heavily or routinely perform demanding tasks with them. As time marches on (and hopefully my income grows exponentially), I will try other steels. But as long as my budget and mentality remain unchanged, today's exotic steels will have long shed that status by the time I put them to work.

[TomAiello]

I’ll put in a mention for B70P.

Looks to be a great “well-balanced” alloy for cutlery and the performance of my mules has been great. Very nice mix of fine grain size, toughness, wear resistance, and ease of grinding/sharpening, but I doubt we’ll see it used again due to the lack of interest it saw.

Nate, do you have a Spy-27 Mule?

I have and have used/tested both, and I can't really find a clear advantage for B70P over Spy-27. Maybe I need to do some more testing though. Shouldn't B70P have an edge holding advantage?

[Nate]

Nate, do you have a Spy-27 Mule?

I have and have used/tested both, and I can't really find a clear advantage for B70P over Spy-27. Maybe I need to do some more testing though. Shouldn't B70P have an edge holding advantage?

That’s a good question. I don’t have any experience with Spy-27 yet, but it kind of goes to what I was saying about the “crowded field” these days. Would need to look into them more, but I think Spy-27 should have slightly better edge-holding on paper, while B70P might have a small advantage on toughness, corrosion resistance, and ease of sharpening.

[Trav64]

Aeb L, 14c28n, really 14c28n sticks out in my mind the most.

[Spook410]

When a steel falls from favor because there is a readily available better choice now on the market, it's not underrated. It is overtaken.

You're implying that the consumer is not totally manipulated by the profit seeking motive of the market, which is of course false.

None of the new steels seeking to replace S30V will have a noticeable real world effect on performance.

IMHO, and for the most part, those that actually care about such things are not sheep being guided about by the manufacturers. It's a hobby. We read and keep track of what's going on. I can get a good, usable steel and decent design in a $40 knife on Amazon. When I move up to the Spyderco price range I'm looking not only for consistent quality but interesting applications of modern steels. Because it's interesting.

As for S30V, I don't think that's a steel that requires much advocacy. While S35V costs about the same and is an incrementally better knife steel, S30V is perfectly adequate. Still.. there was that time I cut up cardboard boxes from a cross country move. Huge stack. All sizes from appliance to shoe box. It took around 5 hours with several breaks. The knife was a Maxamet mule. Performance was absolutely amazing. Did it all without even a touch up. In another case I cleared a section of blackberry thicket using my Spyderco Province in 4V. A couple hours worth of hacking through tough woody vines. Just the sort of thing 4V is good for and it performed flawlessly. If I had been using S30V in either real world case, I would have seen a difference.

[chuck_roxas45]

I say VG10 and AUS8

[bearfacedkiller]

I don’t understand all the love for m390 when S90V does everything M390 does but does it better. Maybe S90V just got overshadowed by S110V which seems to intimidate many people. Anyway, S90V seldom gets any love. It is possibly the best highly wear resistant stainless available.

[RamZar]

Before powdered steels became available for knives the good steels I had were 154CM, N690, ATS-34 and VG-10. Even today these “old” steels are perfectly adequate.

I believe powdered CPM-S30V became available in late 2001 but I didn’t get any knives in CPM-S30V until 2005. It was the super-steel of its time.

[Gtscotty]

I don’t understand all the love for m390 when S90V does everything M390 does but does it better. Maybe S90V just got overshadowed by S110V which seems to intimidate many people. Anyway, S90V seldom gets any love. It is possibly the best highly wear resistant stainless available.

S90V is certainly well regarded amongst knife folks, but per the real data, it doesn't do everything better than M390/20CV. S90V has more wear resistance, but it has about the same toughness and it's a couple steps down on corrosion resistance as compared to M390/20CV. It probably is one of the best high wear stainless steels if high wear is all you're after, but S110V and M390/20CV provide slightly different balances that would obviously appeal to folks more concerned with corrosion than academic variances in wear resistance at the very top of the chart.

[TomAiello]

I don’t understand all the love for m390 when S90V does everything M390 does but does it better. Maybe S90V just got overshadowed by S110V which seems to intimidate many people. Anyway, S90V seldom gets any love. It is possibly the best highly wear resistant stainless available.

I prefer M390 in smaller blades, because it seems to hold an edge slightly longer in my use, and because it's lower maintenance (more corrosion resistant).

I prefer s90v in larger and fixed blades, because it's more stable, and I can run the blade thinner.

M390 definitely has an advantage in corrosion resistance. S90v is great for edge holding and toughness, but it's the only stainless I've been able to accidentally stain to a noticeable degree. The staining difference between my Sprig (s90v) and the custom version of same (Elmax) was surprisingly (as in I totally didn't expect it) noticeable.

I agree that s90v is underrated though. I think that Spyderco picked it out as the 'best compromise super high end stainless' and then it got used a bunch and suffered from a 'boredom effect'.

I also think there is some silly 'higher number better' effect going on relative to s110v. I strongly prefer s90v to s110v because s110v has been noticeably chippier for me. I've chipped both s110v (Manix) and m390 (TRC K-O) in high end production knives, and ever only rolled s90v, even in a super thin re-grind (Southfork).

[TomAiello]

S90V has more wear resistance, but it has about the same toughness and it's a couple steps down on corrosion resistance as compared to M390/20CV. It probably is one of the best high wear stainless steels if high wear is all you're after, but S110V and M390/20CV provide slightly different balances that would obviously appeal to folks more concerned with corrosion than academic variances in wear resistance at the very top of the chart.

I guess I need to review the data more. My subjective uses give me a different impression--my s90v has just seemed tougher than the other two.

I think maybe heat treat and HRC explain some of the differences I've experienced, though. The m390 knife I chipped (TRC fixed blade) definitely holds an edge longer than my m390 PM2, but I was able to cut roofing shingles (the kind with tar and gravel mixed through them) with the PM2 without an edge damage. The s90v knife (thin regrind on a southfork) I ran (hard) into a metal grill plate (cutting meat on the grill--probably not a great idea) only rolled--no chipping.

If someone told me that I was only allowed to have one stainless for the rest of my life, and it was either s90v or m390, I'd be ok with that.

[JD Spydo]

I actually think VG-10 is great in a lot of applications. I'd love to have the kitchen utility knives in VG-10, for example, but I know the price bump would make them non-sellers.

I agree that it is suffering from a 'been there done that' effect among knife people that isn't very fair to it.

That's a great observation Tom because I do have a buddy who got a couple of the older Spyderco kitchen knives from back around 2011 which had VG-10 steel and he really bragged about them. It's been so many years I forgot the name of the models.

Also over the years I've used one set of my TEMPERANCE 1 fixed blade models mainly for kitchen use and the TEMP 1 is fabulous in the kitchen. Now I do hit it on the Sharpmaker after each use just to keep it razor sharp and it amazes me the wide range of food uses that the TEMP 1 is great for. The TEMP 1 is still my all time favorite Spyderco fixed blade in spite of all the great units they've come out with since.

OK I was just reminded it was the "Yin-Yang" models that had VG-10. And that's the ones my buddy had.

[S-3 ranch]

AEB-L , is very underestimated IMO

[Team Sick]

I dunno about ZDP being underrated. Aren't the Ultra-Expensive Rockstead knives in ZDP-189?

[GarageBoy]

I prefer M390 in smaller blades, because it seems to hold an edge slightly longer in my use, and because it's lower maintenance (more corrosion resistant).

I prefer s90v in larger and fixed blades, because it's more stable, and I can run the blade thinner.

What model do you think fits s90v the most?

[vivi]

I dunno about ZDP being underrated. Aren't the Ultra-Expensive Rockstead knives in ZDP-189?

People seem to forget about it, maybe due to how old it is in the knife market. It has edge holding that can hang with the big dogs and is easier to sharpen than most high edge retention steels too.

People also seem to have developed the opinion its a carbon steel over the past five years, because every time I see the steel mentioned its corrosion resistance is under estimated.

I'm notorious for being tough on knives when it comes to corrosion resistance and I never had any particular issues with ZDP. I rank it along side 8Cr in that department.

In fact I had both plain ZDP189 blades and ZDP189/420j laminate blades. On the latter both of the steels showed the same level of corrosion.

[JonLeBlanc]

I prefer M390 in smaller blades, because it seems to hold an edge slightly longer in my use, and because it's lower maintenance (more corrosion resistant).

I prefer s90v in larger and fixed blades, because it's more stable, and I can run the blade thinner.

What model do you think fits s90v the most?

I know your question was not directed to me, but my S90V Millie is an absolute sword for outdoor use.

[FRNFanboy]

Spy27 doesn’t get nearly the attention it deserves. VG10 gets close to S35vn territory at a fraction of the price. 14c28n performs at 90% of LC200n. So many people seem to think that edge retention is the sole redeeming quality of a steel, and with many of the steels on this post it’s just a case of familiarity breeding contempt.