Siren - strange lock movement

[craytab]

Giving this topic a bump over here. On bladeforums we've been getting a monthly update but nothing yet this month.

Hoping for a plan to fix knives for those customers who want the issue addressed on their knives!

[vivi]

I'll be interested to hear what they figure out.

[Matus]

Not long ago Sal commented that they found a possible solution and are testing it. So let't just wait and let them to get this done :)

[mb1]

I’ve found myself not carrying mine much lately due to the lock movement. Used it for the first time in a while yesterday cutting some paracord and got some lock movement on that task.

Hope a fix does happen. It’s otherwise a great knife that I miss carrying more.

[Fharing45]

OK I'll bump it. I have passed on this 3 different times because of the concerns here. Sal let us know when we can expect the new lock fixes. Please, I hate passing on models I really want.

[Abyss_Fish]

Wasn’t worried about this too much but was just cutting some paracord and my blade fully disengaged. Waiting patiently for updates, seems like a pretty easy fix.

[Matus]

I am just wondering whether this issue has been already fixed within the framework of the CQI. I am curios about the Siren, but would prefer to get one once the correction was implemented.

[Wartstein]

I am just wondering whether this issue has been already fixed within the framework of the CQI. I am curios about the Siren, but would prefer to get one once the correction was implemented.

Same here!

Though I still hope for FRN and/or SE versions... (From all I know I am pretty certain Lance himself would not be opposed to this too...)

[Wartstein]

... weird thing is, not all of them (or even just a small percentage) do have this issue, right?
also a GOOD thing though: One could just choose a dealer who does check for things like this and make sure a "good" one is sent...

[ChrisinHove]

... weird thing is, not all of them (or even just a small percentage) do have this issue, right?
also a GOOD thing though: One could just choose a dealer who does check for things like this and make sure a "good" one is sent...

If it’s a geometry issue, rather than manufacturing tolerances (unlikely), then I can’t see how that could be the case.

[Wartstein]

... weird thing is, not all of them (or even just a small percentage) do have this issue, right?
also a GOOD thing though: One could just choose a dealer who does check for things like this and make sure a "good" one is sent...

If it’s a geometry issue, rather than manufacturing tolerances (unlikely), then I can’t see how that could be the case.

I thought so too, but it seems like many/most DON'T have that issue...

[Xplorer]

... weird thing is, not all of them (or even just a small percentage) do have this issue, right?
also a GOOD thing though: One could just choose a dealer who does check for things like this and make sure a "good" one is sent...

If it’s a geometry issue, rather than manufacturing tolerances (unlikely), then I can’t see how that could be the case.

I thought so too, but it seems like many/most DON'T have that issue...

I've been trying to stay out of this conversation. The issue is lock geometry. Unless they had a large batch that was made "out of spec" for some reason, ALL Sirens are going to have the same issue until they change the geometry in the lockbar/blade intersection. I'm glad it's not a safety concern.

[JRinFL]

I've been trying to stay out of this conversation because I know exactly what the problem is and there is so much about this that I personally find this quite frustrating and disappointing. The issue is lock geometry. Unless they had a large batch that was made "out of spec" for some reason, ALL Sirens are going to have the same issue until they change the geometry in the lockbar/blade intersection. I'm glad it's not a safety concern, but....soooo disappointed

In your experience and with your knowledge, is this some thing can be fixed or improved on by a skilled end-user, or is it more likely going to require an all new lock bar and/or blade to solve? I'n not trying to put you on the spot here, so it's OK to side-step the question.

[Accutron]

Sal posted this to the equivalent thread on Bladeforums on 8/25...

We will surely offer a solution and you have my sincere apology for the length of time it's taking. We have been working steadily on it, and the "fixes" which we invested much time and funds on did not work.

The Factory manager thought he had a fix and cut thousands of blades and locks, which fixed the "Pop up", but he interface didn't work well and the the locks defeated. So back to the engineers. They found that they had to move the lock pivot to a few different locations and test to find the sweet spot. Remember a thousands of an inch makes a difference. Now we have found the sweet spot for the lock pivot and we're testing before running thousands of more blades and locks. One we've tested and approved of the new pivot location, they we'll begin building replacement models.

[Xplorer]

In your experience and with your knowledge, is this some thing can be fixed or improved on by a skilled end-user, or is it more likely going to require an all new lock bar and/or blade to solve? I'n not trying to put you on the spot here, so it's OK to side-step the question.

One would have to build a new lock bar and possibly a new blade to do it. And trust me...the geometry looks 100 times more simple than it really is. Sal's right when he says .001" makes a difference. Also, nearly every adjustment to geometry here affects more than one thing at the same time. To get this design to lock-up securely, not slide up, and function easily is a high wire act to say the least.

Fortunately the lock, as it exists, functions just fine and doesn't present a safety concern. It's just not perfect, and that's not what we're used to seeing from the company that consistently produces the best production folders in the industry and brought us the best functioning back-lock ever (the Native).

[phaust]

In your experience and with your knowledge, is this some thing can be fixed or improved on by a skilled end-user, or is it more likely going to require an all new lock bar and/or blade to solve? I'n not trying to put you on the spot here, so it's OK to side-step the question.

One would have to build a new lock bar and possibly a new blade to do it. And trust me...the geometry looks 100 times more simple than it really is. Sal's right when he says .001" makes a difference. Also, nearly every adjustment to geometry here affects more than one thing at the same time. To get this design to lock-up securely, not slide up, and function easily is a high wire act to say the least.

Fortunately the lock, as it exists, functions just fine and doesn't present a safety concern. It's just not perfect, and that's not what we're used to seeing from the company that consistently produces the best production folders in the industry and brought us the best functioning back-lock ever (the Native).

There's at least one report of a full unlock (https://bladeforums.com/threads/spyderc ... t-20573929), so it is a safety issue, though that doesn't mean it's common.

[Xplorer]

In your experience and with your knowledge, is this some thing can be fixed or improved on by a skilled end-user, or is it more likely going to require an all new lock bar and/or blade to solve? I'n not trying to put you on the spot here, so it's OK to side-step the question.

One would have to build a new lock bar and possibly a new blade to do it. And trust me...the geometry looks 100 times more simple than it really is. Sal's right when he says .001" makes a difference. Also, nearly every adjustment to geometry here affects more than one thing at the same time. To get this design to lock-up securely, not slide up, and function easily is a high wire act to say the least.

Fortunately the lock, as it exists, functions just fine and doesn't present a safety concern. It's just not perfect, and that's not what we're used to seeing from the company that consistently produces the best production folders in the industry and brought us the best functioning back-lock ever (the Native).

There's at least one report of a full unlock (https://bladeforums.com/threads/spyderc ... t-20573929), so it is a safety issue, though that doesn't mean it's common.

I am certainly on the look-out for any failures that would change my view about the safety of this lock as it is. That "report" being the only one AND the person says he looked down and it was just dangling but didn't know how that happened...and then couldn't repeat it makes me think it just isn't credible.

The issue of the lock sliding upward with pressure on the blade is the opposite of the blade coming unlocked. For the lock to unlock as described one would have to apply downward pressure on the spine/tip not upward. That lock as it is won't break loose with downward pressure on the spine/tip. My best guess is he simply pressed the button and didn't realize it, which is why he can't replicate it. I've done way too much real, hard and controlled testing on this knife to conclude anything other than that was a false report.

I confidently stand by my statement that there is no safety issue here.

[VooDooChild]

It could still potentially be a safety issue. If somehow the lockbar got stuck in the up position during use after lock slip occured.
Like maybe under hard use the lockbar slips up and then the meat of your hands or gloves kind of fill the lockbar well and the the lockbar doesnt reslip back into the locked position but stays unlocked. I feel like you would almost have to try to make this happen but the lock certainly isnt supposed to be slipping to begin with.

[Matus]

Ok, so based on the quote it seems that the whole lock needs a gentle redesign. I am going to sit back and wait.

[Manixguy@1994]

Huge bummer for me, I have been considering this knife for sometime. Really like how the blade sits in the closed position and the steel . I will wait for updates . Thanks MG2