Goniometers

[vivi]

I'm looking for suggestions for a laser goniometer that can show me the angles of my edges.



I currently have one of these and it isn't ideal for measuring knife edges, as I've come to find out.

[sal]

Hi Vivi,

CATRA makes a number of them at different price ranges that are quite effective. I have a portable one at my home and we use a large one in the Factory. Many of my teachers, like Cliff Stamp, Wayne Goddard, Ed Schempp and others have taught me that edge geometry is really more important than just about anything else when it comes to cutting performance. So we've always paid special attention to the edge and a Goniometer is essential for measuring that consistency.

It's not something that most knife users are involved with, but for Edge Junky's, it's a valuable tool. I'm sure that others will also be able to offer useful information.

sal

[Bolster]

Funny this topic comes up; just yesterday I went on Amazon for a look. There is a $50 laser gonio under the name "Laser Knife Edge Reader" on Amazon with 4 ratings currently, and it's rating 3-1/2 stars.

[vivi]

Hi Vivi,

CATRA makes a number of them at different price ranges that are quite effective. I have a portable one at my home and we use a large one in the Factory. Many of my teachers, like Cliff Stamp, Wayne Goddard, Ed Schempp and others have taught me that edge geometry is really more important than just about anything else when it comes to cutting performance. So we've always paid special attention to the edge and a Goniometer is essential for measuring that consistency.

It's not something that most knife users are involved with, but for Edge Junky's, it's a valuable tool. I'm sure that others will also be able to offer useful information.

sal

Sal,

The focus Spyderco places on geometry and cutting ability is one of the reasons I've been such a loyal fan all these years. When using your knives, that attention to geometry shows.

[Cambertree]

I have the Gritomatic Laser Edge Lite 2.0 Goniometer.

It’s an inexpensive and useful tool.

Some larger knives don’t quite fit, but I’m talking about wide blades like the ESEE Junglas or kitchen cleavers.

Most knives should be fine in it.

It takes CR2032 batteries and mine came with a spare battery.

https://www.gritomatic.com/products/las ... goniometer

[JD Spydo]

When I was still working in machine tool shops I had two brands of tools I really loved. One of them was "STARRETT" and the other was SPI. I'm wondering if STARRETT makes an angle measuring tool like these? I've been out of it for so long that I'm kind of lost on what's new in the tool industry.

There were also a couple of Japanese made machine tool companies that had decent quality as well. But of all the tools in that sector I ever used I never found anything with better quality than that of STARRETT.

[Bolster]

A DIY gonio using a laser pointer, a clamp, and a printed scale...

http://bessex.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=338

[RustyIron]

It’s an inexpensive and useful tool.

Hey, Camber.
My name is Rob and I'm a Toolaholic... a card carrying gadget junkie. I've considered a goniometer, but I'm not sure that it wouldn't be one of those toys that sits on the shelf gathering dust. I need a rational excuse to buy one.

Most of my knives are done on a guided system. I know the angle of the guide, subtract for the angle of the blade, and I can be pretty sure to within half a degree what I'm doing. If I want a blade more acute, I make it more acute. If I want to go more obtuse, I go more obtuse. I'm not sure that knowing the precise angle will be beneficial.

How can the goniometer improve my edges?

Thanks!

[GarageBoy]

Gritomatic has two versions
One is more affordable than the other, both are sold out right now

Rustyiron, a goniometer shows you the edge angle (each side) at a glance. How important that is to you is your call

[TenGrainBread]

When I was still working in machine tool shops I had two brands of tools I really loved. One of them was "STARRETT" and the other was SPI. I'm wondering if STARRETT makes an angle measuring tool like these? I've been out of it for so long that I'm kind of lost on what's new in the tool industry.

There were also a couple of Japanese made machine tool companies that had decent quality as well. But of all the tools in that sector I ever used I never found anything with better quality than that of STARRETT.

Starrett is indeed an industry standard for professional machinists. They do not make a laser goniometer but they do make very precise vernier protractors that might work in a pinch.

[Deadboxhero]

"Hobbigoni" from Catra is the one to buy, order from CATRA in the UK. It will have a slight learning curve since light reflects differently due to edge finish, scratch pattern and convex vs flat vs hollow edges but It should be a rather eye opening tool. It's the only way to accurately measure the edge angle in degrees.

[Cambertree]

It’s an inexpensive and useful tool.

Hey, Camber.
My name is Rob and I'm a Toolaholic... a card carrying gadget junkie. I've considered a goniometer, but I'm not sure that it wouldn't be one of those toys that sits on the shelf gathering dust. I need a rational excuse to buy one.

Most of my knives are done on a guided system. I know the angle of the guide, subtract for the angle of the blade, and I can be pretty sure to within half a degree what I'm doing. If I want a blade more acute, I make it more acute. If I want to go more obtuse, I go more obtuse. I'm not sure that knowing the precise angle will be beneficial.

How can the goniometer improve my edges?

Thanks!

Hey Rusty,

Good question, my friend. At the moment, I’m enjoying being able to check the exact angle of stock factory edges, in the same way I check the BTE measurements.

How useful that is, I guess only you can say.

I use benchstones and the Sharpmaker for most of my sharpening, so it’s probably more handy for that type of approach than it would be with a guided system.

As Shawn said, the laser reflects light differently, depending on the crispness or convexity of the shoulder bevel. You can check for asymmetry of angles.

If you sharpen a lot of knives for other people, it can be handy to know where the edge angle is at, before you start.

Also, if you teach others how to sharpen, they can find it useful and interesting to be able to instantly check their edge angle.

I’m sure there are better goniometers out there, but at $65 IIRC, I feel it was worth it.

[Baron Mind]

Hi Vivi,

CATRA makes a number of them at different price ranges that are quite effective. I have a portable one at my home and we use a large one in the Factory. Many of my teachers, like Cliff Stamp, Wayne Goddard, Ed Schempp and others have taught me that edge geometry is really more important than just about anything else when it comes to cutting performance. So we've always paid special attention to the edge and a Goniometer is essential for measuring that consistency.

It's not something that most knife users are involved with, but for Edge Junky's, it's a valuable tool. I'm sure that others will also be able to offer useful information.

sal

Sal,

The focus Spyderco places on geometry and cutting ability is one of the reasons I've been such a loyal fan all these years. When using your knives, that attention to geometry shows.

I concur. That being said, I think it could be even better. I propose rule no. 15. Target edge angle should be 15 degrees per side, with a target behind the edge thickness of 15 thousandths of an inch. Rule no. 15 would allow for a tolerance of +- 5, so 10-20 dps and 10-20 thousandths behind the edge. I don't mean to sound ungrateful, but rule no. 15 would make me an even bigger Spyderco fan, and working it into the advertising/literature/edge-u-cation could produce an even greater # of devout, well educated Spydie heads. :)

[GarageBoy]

Ehh, I totally understand if Spyderco has to keep edges thicker on certain models to maintain strength on weaker steels for the average user

[toxophilus]

I have the Gritomatic Laser Edge Lite 2.0 Goniometer.

It’s an inexpensive and useful tool.

Some larger knives don’t quite fit, but I’m talking about wide blades like the ESEE Junglas or kitchen cleavers.

Most knives should be fine in it.

It takes CR2032 batteries and mine came with a spare battery.

https://www.gritomatic.com/products/las ... goniometer

+1 on the Gritomatic

Below is an image of a stock factory edge Stretch carbon fiber ZDP-189 next to a Cruwear Shaman that I sharpened on my Wicked Edge.

I used it in this instance to ensure that the formula that I use to both center the blade vertically in the clamping system as well as getting as close as I can to my target °dps is accurate.

Centering the blade for me + math = even bevels (my target was 18°dps on the Shaman using the WE) :spyder:



Below is an image of the latest Endura K390 that I bought recently, it's almost spot on at 15°dps and when I finally had to resharpen it I set it up for 15°dps...



Vivi I will add that if you're interested in trying this one out I can/will ship it to you so you can try it out, just PM/DM me directly...

[nerdlock]

I have the Gritomatic Laser Edge Lite 2.0 Goniometer.

It’s an inexpensive and useful tool.

Some larger knives don’t quite fit, but I’m talking about wide blades like the ESEE Junglas or kitchen cleavers.

Most knives should be fine in it.

It takes CR2032 batteries and mine came with a spare battery.

https://www.gritomatic.com/products/las ... goniometer

Ooof, sold out!

[GarageBoy]

I used it in this instance to ensure that the formula that I use to both center the blade vertically in the clamping system as well as getting as close as I can to my target °dps is accurate.

Centering the blade for me + math = even bevels (my target was 18°dps on the Shaman using the WE) :spyder:

What's your method and formula for doing that?

[toxophilus]

I used it in this instance to ensure that the formula that I use to both center the blade vertically in the clamping system as well as getting as close as I can to my target °dps is accurate.

Centering the blade for me + math = even bevels (my target was 18°dps on the Shaman using the WE) :spyder:

What's your method and formula for doing that?

Oh my, rather than cluttering up this thread (it's long) I sent you a PM with the information :spyder:

[msimcoe]

Would you mind sending me a copy of your formulas and method as well. I would really appreciate it. Thank you.

[toxophilus]

Would you mind sending me a copy of your formulas and method as well. I would really appreciate it. Thank you.

Here is the link to the topic where I describe it.viewtopic.php?f=2&t=91388&p=1584384#p1584384