Wharncliffe's

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prndltech
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby prndltech » Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:21 pm

kennethsime wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:45 pm
I think I'm going to have to try a wharncliffe now - got to make up my mind between the rock jumper and the dragonfly!
The answer here is yes.

I don’t have a wharncliffe dragonfly, but I have had a serrated rock jumper in my pocket for the last week or so.
- Shannon

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PeaceInOurTime
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby PeaceInOurTime » Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:45 pm

I hope Mr. Janich will share his opinions and experience with this grind. With confirmation that this isn't just a compound grind, but rather asymmetrical, I'm looking forward to getting more info. Chisel grinds/edges work fine for me, they're all I've used all of 2020.

I'm curious if this grind preference is still true today and if it's primarily beneficial for knife fighting (I'm ignorant of the technical term).
+ I'm currently participating in a serrated edge only challenge for 2020: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=85560
+ "Wouldn't it be tight if everyone was chill to each other?" -Gryzzl (Parks and Recreation)

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby Wartstein » Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:36 pm

Wartstein wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:03 pm
....
But, Sal, are you thinking of still having a V edge then or would this be a chisel grind? (So the full flat side would go all the way down to the apex without a secondary bevel, and just the hollow grind side would have one)
fixall wrote:
Image

Have to quote my own post from the beginning of this thread:

Cause looking at fixals pic I still do not see if this grind definitely is a chisel grind:
- Does (only) the hollow side of the grind get a secondary bevel?
- Or still both the ffg AND hollow side?
- Can´t be (like the pic would suggest) that BOTH sides (like a scandi grind) have NO secondary bevel...

Sal, maybe you could chime in on this?
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

fixall
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby fixall » Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:52 am

Wartstein wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:36 pm
Wartstein wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:03 pm
....
But, Sal, are you thinking of still having a V edge then or would this be a chisel grind? (So the full flat side would go all the way down to the apex without a secondary bevel, and just the hollow grind side would have one)
fixall wrote:
Image

Have to quote my own post from the beginning of this thread:

Cause looking at fixals pic I still do not see if this grind definitely is a chisel grind:
- Does (only) the hollow side of the grind get a secondary bevel?
- Or still both the ffg AND hollow side?
- Can´t be (like the pic would suggest) that BOTH sides (like a scandi grind) have NO secondary bevel...

Sal, maybe you could chime in on this?
I didn't bother adding it to the picture, but I would imagine both sides would have a secondary bevel. I'm not aware of any Spyderco folders that have featured a zero edge. I wonder if the edge stability would suffer much with the more acute angle a zero edge, flat ground side would provide.

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby Wartstein » Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:58 am

fixall wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:52 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:36 pm
Wartstein wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:03 pm
....
But, Sal, are you thinking of still having a V edge then or would this be a chisel grind? (So the full flat side would go all the way down to the apex without a secondary bevel, and just the hollow grind side would have one)
fixall wrote:

Have to quote my own post from the beginning of this thread:

Cause looking at fixals pic I still do not see if this grind definitely is a chisel grind:
- Does (only) the hollow side of the grind get a secondary bevel?
- Or still both the ffg AND hollow side?
- Can´t be (like the pic would suggest) that BOTH sides (like a scandi grind) have NO secondary bevel...

Sal, maybe you could chime in on this?
I didn't bother adding it to the picture, but I would imagine both sides would have a secondary bevel. I'm not aware of any Spyderco folders that have featured a zero edge. I wonder if the edge stability would suffer much with the more acute angle a zero edge, flat ground side would provide.

Thanks! But that´s exactly the interesting part for me!

There ARE a lot of Spyderos that practically do have a zero edge (in ffg, sabre and hollow sabre) - just on ONE side though: Most of the SE models!

I am 100% sure the grind you pictured would not have a zero grind on BOTH sides (like a scandi would) - but perhaps it is a true chisel grind (and not a V edge)? And by that just the hollow side gets a secondary bevel?
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby RadioactiveSpyder » Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:03 am

Wartstein wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:58 am
Thanks! But that´s exactly the interesting part for me!

There ARE a lot of Spyderos that practically do have a zero edge (in ffg, sabre and hollow sabre) - just on ONE side though: Most of the SE models!

I am 100% sure the grind you pictured would not have a zero grind on BOTH sides (like a scandi would) - but perhaps it is a true chisel grind (and not a V edge)? And by that just the hollow side gets a secondary bevel?
Absolutely, the SE models do indeed have exactly that - zero edge on one side (chisel ground)... As for a true zero ground model on both sides, that’s easy too - the Nilakka. ;)

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby fixall » Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:11 am

Wartstein wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:58 am
fixall wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:52 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:36 pm
Wartstein wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:03 pm
....
But, Sal, are you thinking of still having a V edge then or would this be a chisel grind? (So the full flat side would go all the way down to the apex without a secondary bevel, and just the hollow grind side would have one)
fixall wrote:

Have to quote my own post from the beginning of this thread:

Cause looking at fixals pic I still do not see if this grind definitely is a chisel grind:
- Does (only) the hollow side of the grind get a secondary bevel?
- Or still both the ffg AND hollow side?
- Can´t be (like the pic would suggest) that BOTH sides (like a scandi grind) have NO secondary bevel...

Sal, maybe you could chime in on this?
I didn't bother adding it to the picture, but I would imagine both sides would have a secondary bevel. I'm not aware of any Spyderco folders that have featured a zero edge. I wonder if the edge stability would suffer much with the more acute angle a zero edge, flat ground side would provide.

Thanks! But that´s exactly the interesting part for me!

There ARE a lot of Spyderos that practically do have a zero edge (in ffg, sabre and hollow sabre) - just on ONE side though: Most of the SE models!

I am 100% sure the grind you pictured would not have a zero grind on BOTH sides (like a scandi would) - but perhaps it is a true chisel grind (and not a V edge)? And by that just the hollow side gets a secondary bevel?
Good point about the SE folders, I wasn't taking those into account. The edge on my Salt Wharncliffe SE holds up just fine... And now that I think of it, the grooves in the SE salt are basically the same as a zero edge (on one side), full flat/hollow grind, so the precedence is there as far as durability goes.

Not to get off track, but are you aware of any zero edge, full flat ground plain edge Spyderco's (not including fixed blades like the Puukko)? I'd be interested in giving one of those a try.

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby RadioactiveSpyder » Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:24 am

fixall wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:11 am
Good point about the SE folders, I wasn't taking those into account. The edge on my Salt Wharncliffe SE holds up just fine... And now that I think of it, the grooves in the SE salt are basically the same as a zero edge (on one side), full flat/hollow grind, so the precedence is there as far as durability goes.

Not to get off track, but are you aware of any zero edge, full flat ground plain edge Spyderco's (not including fixed blades like the Puukko)? I'd be interested in giving one of those a try.
Seriously, did you not see my post above yours? :rolleyes: The NILAKKA.
Last edited by RadioactiveSpyder on Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Wartstein
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby Wartstein » Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:25 am

fixall wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:11 am
Wartstein wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:58 am
fixall wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:52 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:36 pm
Good point about the SE folders, I wasn't taking those into account. The edge on my Salt Wharncliffe SE holds up just fine... And now that I think of it, the grooves in the SE salt are basically the same as a zero edge (on one side), full flat/hollow grind, so the precedence is there as far as durability goes.

Not to get off track, but are you aware of any zero edge, full flat ground plain edge Spyderco's (not including fixed blades like the Puukko)? I'd be interested in giving one of those a try.

Actually the more or less long PE part towards the tip of SE models is a true PE chisel grind in ffg or sabre hollow or sabre grind (depending on the model) - so a zero edge on just one side in PE..

/ No, I am personally not aware of any zero edge ffg PE model over the whole length of the edge... but I am far from knowing all Spydies in detail... ;)
And RadioactiveSpyder mentioned the Nilakka...
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby fixall » Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:26 am

RadioactiveSpyder wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:24 am
fixall wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:11 am
Good point about the SE folders, I wasn't taking those into account. The edge on my Salt Wharncliffe SE holds up just fine... And now that I think of it, the grooves in the SE salt are basically the same as a zero edge (on one side), full flat/hollow grind, so the precedence is there as far as durability goes.

Not to get off track, but are you aware of any zero edge, full flat ground plain edge Spyderco's (not including fixed blades like the Puukko)? I'd be interested in giving one of those a try.
Seriously, did you not see my post above yours? :rolleyes: The NILAKKA.
Nah, we must have had the reply window up at the same time, lol. I'll check that out, thanks!

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby Dazen » Mon Oct 19, 2020 6:29 am

sal wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:53 pm

Mike's preferred grind is a high hollow on the front side and a full flat on the back side which makes for a really thin edge making a great slicer. I didn't want to do that back then (couple of decades) because I didn't think the market was ready for it. Mike and I agreed to full flat. (Though now, I don't think I would be opposed to a special run of Mike's grind.

sal
I understand why this would make an excellent slicer in something for the kitchen, depending on if your right or left handed. But, in self defense how would this grind be better than the high hollow currently on the Yojimbo 2? Wouldn’t a traditional high hollow be thinner BTE than a high hollow on the front side and a full flat on the back side? Also, will we finally see a SE Yojimbo/Yojumbo with this grind?

Dane

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby dj moonbat » Mon Oct 19, 2020 7:51 am

benben wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:24 pm
CBA2E41F-2D78-4FD3-AF3C-BF73496EFC75.jpeg
My meager wharncliffe stable.
No collection including the orange Urban could ever be “meager.” What a great little knife.

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby curlyhairedboy » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:07 am

color me intrigued - the wharnie grind knives i've owned (yojimbo, rock jumper, swayback) have consistently great performance.

The asymmetrical grind sounds interesting. almost like a chef's knife with a concave on one side to help food release.
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby prog_knife » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:31 am

curlyhairedboy wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:07 am
The asymmetrical grind sounds interesting. almost like a chef's knife with a concave on one side to help food release.
I think Chris Reeve did something similar on their Sikayo kitchen knives. I know one side is hollow-ground about half way up. Not sure if the other is ground at all, or if it's more of a chisel grind.

Had to show this thread to my wife, who owing to her artistic training is a partisan for straight edges--think X-Acto knives, et cetera. She likes my Q-Ball, and we just ordered her a Delica Wharncliffe.
Maybe there's an untapped market in the arts and crafts world for friendly little Wharnies like Manbug or Dragonfly. I reckon Spyderco would have more appeal in those communities than knife companies with a more traditionally knife-y style.
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby carrot » Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:26 am

In my experience, the HHG as on knives like the CRK folders and the GB2 really make them cutting demons.

I don't really like how CRK treats their steel (too soft for my taste) but the geometry is excellent.

I think if Spyderco did some wharncliffe in HHG, it would cut even better. I don't think high hollow grind is ugly at all. In fact, I think the Dragonfly 2 Salt is the best looking blade of the bunch. I am definitely a part of the crew with an appetite for wharncliffe.

I eagerly await the RockJumper K390 in PE and SE (which hasn't been confirmed, but I feel it in my bones that it is coming).

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby Wartstein » Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:16 am

Dazen wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 6:29 am
sal wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:53 pm

I understand why this would make an excellent slicer in something for the kitchen, depending on if your right or left handed. But, in self defense how would this grind be better than the high hollow currently on the Yojimbo 2? Wouldn’t a traditional high hollow be thinner BTE than a high hollow on the front side and a full flat on the back side? Also, will we finally see a SE Yojimbo/Yojumbo with this grind?

Dane

Probably a traditional high hollow would be thinner behind the edge, but if this new grind would be made a chisel grind (so a secondary bevel just on the hollow grind side, but a zero grind on the ffg side) at least the edge angle would be more acute there.
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby Ez556 » Mon Oct 19, 2020 7:42 pm

This asymmetrical grind sounds really interesting. What about a Rock Jumper with this flat+hollow grind and an Emerson wave? It could be called the Rock Fighter.
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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby MacLaren » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:13 pm

I say 100% go for it!!

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby SpyderGrill » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:26 pm

I like Warncliffes for the ease of sharpening. I have never been good at free hand sharpening any blade. I carried a Delica SE for the last month or so and now a RockJumper PE for the last couple of weeks.

I have a KME I really havent mastered yet, but sharpening the RockJumper was easy.

I need to get a Sharpmaker for my SE blades and light touch ups.

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Re: Wharncliffe's

Postby sal » Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:03 pm

Actually, it's a discussion on Wharncliffe's. I brought in Mike, because I believe he's the reason there is so much discussion on the Wharnciffe blade shape and performance. Mike's outa' town, but I'm sure he'll join in when he returns.

Is there interest for a serrated Yo2?

sal


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