Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
User avatar
Wartstein
Member
Posts: 15213
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:06 am
Location: Salzburg, Austria, Europe

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#121

Post by Wartstein »

zuludelta wrote:
Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:09 am
navin johnson wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:52 am
...
The safest way I've found for closing Spyderco backlocks using one hand is to put the very tip of my index finger in the Spydie hole while depressing the lockbar, and then using that index finger to close the knife (in a sort of controlled "reverse slow roll"). This way, I have complete control over the blade's closing arc. However, I think that this method may be difficult or may not work for people with very small or very large hands, or those with compromised or limited finger dexterity.

This is my preferred way of closing lockbacks, though, and I can do it just as fast, if not faster, than if I drop the blade's ricasso/kick on my index finger, which requires changing my grip to complete the closing process.
A good and one of several ways of closing a backlock one handed! :)
And actually, I use the method you describe (or better a variant of it) a lot with CBBL knives too (release the lock with the thumb, guide the blade with the index finger to the closed position).
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
vivi
Member
Posts: 13846
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:15 am

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#122

Post by vivi »

zuludelta wrote:
Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:09 am
navin johnson wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:52 am
The safest way to close any folder is with two hands.

With a LB dropping the ricasso on a finger is next most safe.

Any method that requires multiple movements and /or violent flicking/movement has the potential to loose control and is far more difficult to do under stress.
The safest way I've found for closing Spyderco backlocks using one hand is to put the very tip of my index finger in the Spydie hole while depressing the lockbar, and then using that index finger to close the knife (in a sort of controlled "reverse slow roll"). This way, I have complete control over the blade's closing arc. However, I think that this method may be difficult or may not work for people with very small or very large hands, or those with compromised or limited finger dexterity.

This is my preferred way of closing lockbacks, though, and I can do it just as fast, if not faster, than if I drop the blade's ricasso/kick on my index finger, which requires changing my grip to complete the closing process.
Same. Been using that method for over a decade without incident. I also keep my pivots tight enough to prevent the blade free swinging.

https://streamable.com/g3pc6r

No issues doing it in a hurry, in the dark, or with my left hand occupied with some other task. Sometimes I even flick my EDC open and swing it shut at red lights.
:unicorn
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#123

Post by Evil D »

vivi wrote:
Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:30 am

https://streamable.com/g3pc6r

No issues doing it in a hurry, in the dark, or with my left hand occupied with some other task. Sometimes I even flick my EDC open and swing it shut at red lights.


I do the same but minus the index finger, just a little wrist flick to drop the blade down to my index finger and then flip it around and fold it shut with my thumb. Sometimes the old school in me naturally comes out and I do all that by folding it against my hip like I grew up doing with Case slip joints.
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
grubetown
Member
Posts: 57
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:15 pm

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#124

Post by grubetown »

Apologies if I derailed this thread :cool:

Back to RockJumper - sent the clip from my PM2 in for Cerakote, so will be carrying the RJ exclusively this week!
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#125

Post by Evil D »

grubetown wrote:
Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:25 pm
Apologies if I derailed this thread :cool:


Not at all, I think discussing closing methods is spot on topic for this knife since there's a bit of unknown when it comes to the grip forward design. It's an important detail that I think needs to be made very very clear if this kind of design is to be successful.
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
User avatar
ladybug93
Member
Posts: 8014
Joined: Tue May 15, 2018 11:20 pm

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#126

Post by ladybug93 »

hot take... i know everyone's in love with ffg se blades right now with the rockjumper and lc200n seki salts, but i think my ideal rockjumper would be ticn coated hollow ground h1 in se. there, i said it.
keep your knife sharp and your focus sharper.
current collection:
C36MCW2, C258YL, C253GBBK, C258GFBL, C101GBBK2, C11GYW, C11FWNB20CV, C101GBN15V2, C101GODFDE2, C60GGY, C149G, C189, C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, C122GBBK, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1
spyderco steels:
H2, CPM 20CV, CPM 15V, CTS 204P, CPM CRUWEAR, CPM S30V, N690Co, M390, CPM MagnaCut, LC200N, CTS XHP, H1, 8Cr13MoV, GIN-1, CTS BD1, VG-10, VG-10/Damascus, 440C
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#127

Post by Evil D »

ladybug93 wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:48 pm
hot take... i know everyone's in love with ffg se blades right now with the rockjumper and lc200n seki salts, but i think my ideal rockjumper would be ticn coated hollow ground h1 in se. there, i said it.


Why tho
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#128

Post by Evil D »

Ok so I've used it quite a bit now and I've got some feedback thoughts.



1. First up is the whole jimping thing. I can't speak for climbers (nor can I imagine what they would and wouldn't like) but it seems to me the only drawbacks from having jimping on the thumb ramp are 1) potentially damaging your thumb in some kind of extremely hard use. Michael Janich spoke of this about the Yojimbo 2 which was why it also doesn't have thumb jimping. 2) potentially snagging your clothing/pockets when trying to clip the knife back into your pocket. I've had this happen to me but in a casual situation it's not a big deal...maybe it IS big deal when you're hundreds of feet off the ground scaling a mountain...again, I wouldn't know. I think it's important to consider that (much like pretty much every self defense knife ever made) most of these knives will ultimately get used for other uses beyond what the intended design is for, so perhaps adding jimping to the thumb ramp needs to happen because you can pretty much guarantee more people will buy this knife for EDC than for actual rock climbing. I don't think I'd care either way but it will tie into my next concern...


2. I'd rather the scales behind the thumb ramp didn't have jimping at all and were smooth like other models. Example:
Image

That's the RJ, Stretch, and Spyderhawk. A while back in my Caribbean thread I was talking about hot spots when using a knife really hard for extended periods of time (carving/whitling) and I mentioned my interest in maybe making a switch to back locks because the area where the Compression Lock is located is a major hot spot on my palm, compared to the same area on a back lock that is smooth and solid and much easier on your hand. This little bit of jimping that's molded into the handle isn't the end of the world but it does start to wear on your hand after a while. I would rather it was smooth like the Stretch, and then if you add jimping to the thumb ramp you'll still have something that keeps your thumb from slipping forward while still keeping the handle smooth and comfortable.


3. This wee little bit of ricasso that's still sticking out...it's gotta go too. While it's a vast improvement over other back lock designs, it's still a potential snag point. This will depend on what you're cutting, and for a climber I doubt that a rope would make much of a snag there, but for me this design (and this particular knife) can't fully replace my Caribbean unless there is nothing between the handle and the edge that material can snag on. I make a lot of cuts with the heel of the blade, so this is a big deal for me.
Image
Image


4. This is maybe a little nitpicking, but I'd like that extra little bit of blade to be added to completely fill the handle. I know most will say that it's only 1/4 inch or so, but to me that could be another quarter inch of PE at the tip of the blade that could be that much more useful if/when I need PE. This is probably lowest priority of my concerns or wishes, but if we're open to feedback and looking to make changes, this is something I'd change.




Besides that, I'm finding the rest of the handle to be wonderful. It fits my hand perfectly as what would basically be the smallest you could make a handle that gives me a full grip without the need for a choil. Closing it hasn't been an issue at all, in fact if you look at the bottom of the handle there is a contoured area that I'm guessing is there more to smooth out the corner of the handle to give your thumb a straighter/smoother shot at the thumb ramp, but towards the rear of this area there's almost a bit of shoulder to the contouring, and if you feel this spot with your index finger, that's pretty much as far back as you want your finger to be positioned when dropping the blade closed onto your finger. Unless you have very small/thin fingers, that contouring works as an indexing spot and if you just don't move further back from there you shouldn't get cut.


So, how much can FRN molds be changed, and at what cost? Can the scales be extended out just a wee bit more to cover that last bit of ricasso, or can the blade itself be tweaked a bit to seat it further into the handle? I could probably live with the other issues, but that bit of ricasso is what's really standing between me and what could be a perfect design.

Also make a bigger version too. 3.5+ inches cutting edge.
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
User avatar
curlyhairedboy
Member
Posts: 2621
Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2016 11:01 am
Location: Southern New England

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#129

Post by curlyhairedboy »

if they make a bigger version it could be the BoulderJumper.
EDC Rotation: PITS, Damasteel Urban, Shaman, Ikuchi, Amalgam, CruCarta Shaman, Sage 5 LW, Serrated Caribbean Sheepsfoot CQI, XHP Shaman, M4/Micarta Shaman, 15v Shaman
Fixed Blades: Proficient, Magnacut Mule
Special and Sentimental: Southard, Squarehead LW, Ouroboros, Calendar Para 3 LW, 40th Anniversary Native, Ti Native, Calendar Watu, Tanto PM2
Would like to own again: CQI Caribbean Sheepsfoot PE, Watu
Wishlist: Magnacut, Shaman Sprints!
Michael Janich
Member
Posts: 3001
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:33 am
Location: Longmont, CO USA
Contact:

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#130

Post by Michael Janich »

Hey, All:

Great discussion. BTW, many of the questions and concerns in this thread are addressed in the article on the RockJumper in the last issue of the byte. Sal blessed that article personally, so it accurately represents his thoughts and insights.

Stay safe,

Mike
prndltech
Member
Posts: 3132
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:53 am
Location: 512

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#131

Post by prndltech »

Evil D wrote:
Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:48 am
Ok so I've used it quite a bit now and I've got some feedback thoughts.



1. First up is the whole jimping thing. I can't speak for climbers (nor can I imagine what they would and wouldn't like) but it seems to me the only drawbacks from having jimping on the thumb ramp are 1) potentially damaging your thumb in some kind of extremely hard use. Michael Janich spoke of this about the Yojimbo 2 which was why it also doesn't have thumb jimping. 2) potentially snagging your clothing/pockets when trying to clip the knife back into your pocket. I've had this happen to me but in a casual situation it's not a big deal...
Exactly. I’d rather NOT have jimping for reason number one. It does not matter for occasional use, but for extended cutting... it’ll tear yo hand/fingers/thumb up! And this is coming from a career master mechanic, and a lifelong Bass/guitar player. My hands and fingers have basically turned into gloves. I’ve never had a knife without jimping slip out of my booger hooks.

Edit* are chef knives jimped? Nope.
- Shannon

MNOSD 0006
User avatar
dj moonbat
Member
Posts: 1488
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:58 am
Location: Sunny SoCal

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#132

Post by dj moonbat »

I can live without a jimped thumb ramp, but think it would be nice.

I think getting rid of the jimping on the back side of the grip would be a mistake. A lot of rope cutting involves holding a loop of rope in one’s non-dominant hand, inserting a knife with the blade toward one’s chest, and cutting on the pull stroke. That jimping is exactly what I’d want for this method.

And I think extending the scales to cover the ricasso completely is a no-brainer. Exposed ricasso buys us nothing.
User avatar
elena86
Member
Posts: 3768
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:59 am
Location: Somewhere in Europe

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#133

Post by elena86 »

tangent wrote:
Fri Oct 02, 2020 6:47 pm
sal wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 8:21 pm
Hi Tangent,

Eric's long term plan is to make a Salt version of most popular models.

sal

Just saw this...that's awesome. Looking forward to it...each time I think "Spyderco can't improve on this..." and then Spyderco improves on it. The Rock Jumper feels great in the hand and is smooth as butter. I'm looking forward to the Salts. And I would guess that maybe we won't have to wait as long since LC200N is now in Japan. :D

I hope my beloved SE wharnie Delica is one of those “most popular models” Sal :spyder:
Marius

" A mind all logic is like a knife all blade. It makes the hand bleed that uses it "
( Rabindranath Tagore )

Proud member of the old school spyderedge nation :bug-white-red
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#134

Post by Evil D »

elena86 wrote:
Thu Oct 08, 2020 10:03 am
tangent wrote:
Fri Oct 02, 2020 6:47 pm
sal wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 8:21 pm
Hi Tangent,

Eric's long term plan is to make a Salt version of most popular models.

sal

Just saw this...that's awesome. Looking forward to it...each time I think "Spyderco can't improve on this..." and then Spyderco improves on it. The Rock Jumper feels great in the hand and is smooth as butter. I'm looking forward to the Salts. And I would guess that maybe we won't have to wait as long since LC200N is now in Japan. :D

I hope my beloved SE wharnie Delica is one of those “most popular models” Sal :spyder:


I can imagine it would be a bit of a logistical nightmare to make everything in a Salt variant, and who knows if the rest of the casual knife using world will even care, but I've said it before I will likely buy a SE Salt version of all my favorite models especially if they're done in FFG/LC200N.
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
User avatar
elena86
Member
Posts: 3768
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:59 am
Location: Somewhere in Europe

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#135

Post by elena86 »

There is no secret that I love and carry my beloved SE wharnie Delica quite alot. One question for those who own both the SE wharnie Delica and the SE RJ and not only. What has the RJ to offer me over the Delica ? Longer handle ? Longer blade ? Hidden ricasso and edge all the way to the handle ? Do I really need those ? I have medium hands and I am mostly a city boy. I like the spine shape of the Delica blade slightly more...that RJ nose is kinda droopy. Yes,you guessed ... I need you guys to push me over the edge with the RJ. I shall purchase one anyway, just because is a Sal Glesser design and I am a sucker for spyderedges, but I need help to silence that voice into my head who keep tormenting me : “you don’t need another wharnie blade in spyderedge” :eek:
Marius

" A mind all logic is like a knife all blade. It makes the hand bleed that uses it "
( Rabindranath Tagore )

Proud member of the old school spyderedge nation :bug-white-red
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#136

Post by Evil D »

elena86 wrote:
Thu Oct 08, 2020 10:37 am
There is no secret that I love and carry my beloved SE wharnie Delica quite alot. One question for those who own both the SE wharnie Delica and the SE RJ and not only. What has the RJ to offer me over the Delica ? Longer handle ? Longer blade ? Hidden ricasso and edge all the way to the handle ? Do I really need those ? I have medium hands and I am mostly a city boy. I like the spine shape of the Delica blade slightly more...that RJ nose is kinda droopy. Yes,you guessed ... I need you guys to push me over the edge with the RJ. I shall purchase one anyway, just because is a Sal Glesser design and I am a sucker for spyderedges, but I need help to silence that voice into my head who keep tormenting me : “you don’t need another wharnie blade in spyderedge” :eek:


Well I'm gonna break your first rule because I don't have the wharnie Delica so maybe my opinion here is less valuable, but I do seem like one of the people who are more critical of the ricasso issue and I've owned a couple Delicas so I'll give ya my two cents anyway.

You have to decide if what I see as "gains" are worth it to you. If the handle of the Delica fits your fingers (the grooves), and if having your index finger that far from the edge doesn't bother you, then the only other gains are maybe more edge length. It depends on your preferences, I see those things as absolute improvements but that's not to say the Delica is flawed or a bad design. I've said it before though, for my preferences this knife makes the Delica (and Native 5, Para 3, maybe more) obsolete. There's really no scenario where I'd buy a Delica over this knife.
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
prndltech
Member
Posts: 3132
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:53 am
Location: 512

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#137

Post by prndltech »

elena86 wrote:
Thu Oct 08, 2020 10:37 am
There is no secret that I love and carry my beloved SE wharnie Delica quite alot. One question for those who own both the SE wharnie Delica and the SE RJ and not only. What has the RJ to offer me over the Delica ? Longer handle ? Longer blade ? Hidden ricasso and edge all the way to the handle ? Do I really need those ? I have medium hands and I am mostly a city boy. I like the spine shape of the Delica blade slightly more...that RJ nose is kinda droopy. Yes,you guessed ... I need you guys to push me over the edge with the RJ. I shall purchase one anyway, just because is a Sal Glesser design and I am a sucker for spyderedges, but I need help to silence that voice into my head who keep tormenting me : “you don’t need another wharnie blade in spyderedge” :eek:
I have a delica, a salt 2 wharncliffe and an SE endela. I have a rock jumper on the way.... If you can’t wait a while then youll have to find out for yourself :D
- Shannon

MNOSD 0006
User avatar
Pancake
Member
Posts: 1146
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:52 am

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#138

Post by Pancake »

Hey EvilD, are you going to grind that riccaso area down? It could be done with belt sander, or a dremel. i guess you dont have to grind all the way to the spine, just thinned it down around the snag area.
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45
User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 27147
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#139

Post by Evil D »

Pancake wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:00 am
Hey EvilD, are you going to grind that riccaso area down? It could be done with belt sander, or a dremel. i guess you dont have to grind all the way to the spine, just thinned it down around the snag area.
I don't think you can because it's also the kick that stops the blade when closed.
All SE all the time since 2017
~David
User avatar
Pancake
Member
Posts: 1146
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:52 am

Re: Rock Jumper comparison thread + general info

#140

Post by Pancake »

Evil D wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:54 am
[
Oh, yeah, make sense, didn't think about it this way.
Try superglue piece of plastic on the handle, so that way you will not have any riccaso left 😂😂
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45
Post Reply