Spyderco Siren Observations

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
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Wartstein
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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Wartstein » Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:08 am

nerdlock wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:59 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:37 am
nerdlock wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 7:49 am
Hi Nerdlock, just as a quick sidenote: Actually there is no real ""new wave of [Spyderco] choil-less backlock designs" (which is sad), "just" the Siren and the RockJumper: And the Rockjumper was specifically designed so that the edge goes almost all the way back to the handle, but one can still safely drop the (hidden) unsharpened blade part on the indexfinger (Sal calls that "handle forward design")

Anyway, alternative backlock closing methods are really quite easy to learn, and imho even quicker and more convinient than the "drop on your finger" method...
There's also the newly released Spyopera... :)

Right, I stand corrected! :)
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Abyss_Fish » Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:49 am

is this a linerless design? I might go for it if I can close that gap between the blade and grip area a bit.
I require more lc200n and thinner grinds

Current collection: Watu, Rhino, Native G10 salt, Waterway, K390 Ladybug, Caribbean, Spydiechef

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Wartstein » Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:05 am

Abyss_Fish wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:49 am
is this a linerless design? I might go for it if I can close that gap between the blade and grip area a bit.

Yes, no liners!
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby sal » Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:40 am

Thanx Vivi,

Nicely done and I'm also glad you're back.

sal

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby VooDooChild » Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:30 pm

Wartstein wrote: ...

1.) As you might know, I personally choke up comfortably on the Ricasso of Endura /Pac Salt (and sometimes even on the very edge) all the time, it is probably my most used grip.

Now I see you do so with the Siren too (while I think you rarely choke up on the Pac Salt Ricasso?) - so I assume this grip option is actually rather comfortable, safe and useful?
...
For me, that grip is comfortable, but its definitely not safe. Theres so much traction on the g10 that with your index finger wrapped around the finger gaurd it feels secure, but it would take very little for your finger to quickly end up on the edge. I personally avoid any grip that can let my finger slip onto the edge. I know some people like that grip, but I couldnt recommend it for agressive cutting.
sal wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:14 pm
... "The edge is a ghost"...

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Wartstein » Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:59 pm

VooDooChild wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:30 pm
Wartstein wrote: ...

1.) As you might know, I personally choke up comfortably on the Ricasso of Endura /Pac Salt (and sometimes even on the very edge) all the time, it is probably my most used grip.

Now I see you do so with the Siren too (while I think you rarely choke up on the Pac Salt Ricasso?) - so I assume this grip option is actually rather comfortable, safe and useful?
...
For me, that grip is comfortable, but its definitely not safe. Theres so much traction on the g10 that with your index finger wrapped around the finger gaurd it feels secure, but it would take very little for your finger to quickly end up on the edge. I personally avoid any grip that can let my finger slip onto the edge. I know some people like that grip, but I couldnt recommend it for agressive cutting.
Thanks!
I know I am in a minority, but as said I choke up on the Endura Ricasso all the time (and even right on the sharp edge) and in many tasks and never found that unsafe and never cut myself.
So I guess the forward grip on the Siren should be fine for me! :)
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby vivi » Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:40 am

Doc Dan wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:22 am
Thanks for a great review, Vivi. I especially appreciated your knife in hand pictures and comments. I’ve wondered how it would fit in my xxl hands.
I was worried the handle would feel a little too small, but its just big enough to feel like a full sized handle for my grip.
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:34 am
I will touch on some points later, just a remark on the closing thing right now: You are so right when saying (quote): "Being able to adapt to different closing methods for different designs may become a necessity as we see the cutting edge move closer to the handle on Spydercos lockbacks."
It would be a sad thing if people miss out on the Siren just cause with ONE single of several methods there might be a bit more risk of nicking the finger...

Another way of closing a backlock that keeps your fingers safe and might be usefull in case of the Siren is this one: https://streamable.com/bhhzs (shown one time really slow, two times regular speed)
May look a bit "fancy", but it actually works really quick and well. Additionall, when having finished the closing the knife in this way, it sits perfectly in your hand already to be put back in the pocket.
Thanks for the video, thats a slick closing method.

Assuming the rockjumper, siren and spyopera sell well and we see more lockbacks like these designs, I think people will need to use different closing methods than dropping the blade on your finger. It can be done safely on the Siren, but with how small the margin for error is I feel better using a different method.
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Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby vivi » Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:43 am

blueblur wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:59 am
Great write up. I came to many of the same conclusions.

I need to play around with the edge angle and edge finish more but I’ve found this steel to not hold an edge for long at all. It certainly hasn’t lived up to the hype I’ve heard anyway. Everything else about the knife is a huge win for me though.
What sharpening method have you been trying? Which grit is your finishing stone?
Pancake wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:10 am
Nice review Vivi!

I like the Siren, but the wire clip....is ok, but nothing spectacular. Maybe sometime in the future I will get it, just to have both Waterway and Siren.
I still thought that Siren is smaller, but the edge is comparable to Endura, interesting.
It's got a bit more cutting edge in fact.
benben wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:27 am
SOLD! Great write up vivi, covered all the bases! When I got to check out your Siren the other day, it took about 30 seconds to realize it would be my next purchase! Extremely light, extremely balanced, and the fit & finish were Golden perfect!
That's how I felt when I handled it. Looking at pictures for some reason I didn't get super excited for it, had a feeling I might end up preferring to stick with the old Pacific Salts. Handling it a bit showed me how well its designed.
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Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby vivi » Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:01 am

bearfacedkiller wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 7:19 am
Thanks for taking the time to put that together and I am sure I speak for many of us when I say that it is nice to have you back around.
Thank you. This community is amazing. I'm happy to contribute to it.
zuludelta wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:12 am
Oh, just one question: Outside of the obvious tasks where SE outperforms PE (i e., cutting rope & other similar materials), is there any situation where you would prefer using the serrated Pac Salt 2 over the Siren?
Hmm, good question. I'd be more comfortable with the Pacific as a work knife....bit cheaper to replace, easier to clean, and less to think about when opening and closing it multiple times a day. The Siren I still catch myself reverting to different closing methods sometimes.

To me it'd be tough to choose one model over the other forever...they both do certain things a little better than the other. I'm glad I don't have to make that choice. Some days I want to carry the Siren, some days the Pacific, and the Police LW is starting to work back into rotation too. They all have their pros and cons.
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:46 am
1.) As you might know, I personally choke up comfortably on the Ricasso of Endura /Pac Salt (and sometimes even on the very edge) all the time, it is probably my most used grip.

Now I see you do so with the Siren too (while I think you rarely choke up on the Pac Salt Ricasso?) - so I assume this grip option is actually rather comfortable, safe and useful?

2.) When holding the knife with all fingers on the actual handle, your pinky obviously sits in the area where the back end of the handle starts to bend upwards again (and not in the space behind the front guard that seems to be dedicated for the fingers to go) - does this cause any issues, discomfort, less control? (Though I don´t think so, cause if you would have mentioned it)
I use that grip (I call it a side grip) primarily when I'm cutting things on a cutting board, and thumb on spine or wrapped around the handle otherwise. Rarely I'll do a cut towards my body (I know) and I'll use that side grip then too. While I find it comfortable, I find those other two grips better for general purpose cutting away from my body.

My pinky looks like its hanging off the edge of that main grip area but my pinky bone manages to stay forward of that spot. Just barely. Even if I scoot my grip back and my pinky does go to that curved area in the back, I find that plenty ergonomic.

I have a fixed blade, an LT Wright Frontier Valley, that had a similar handle shape but a smaller sized handle, and I grip it with my pinky on that rear section. It works fine.
ladybug93 wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:03 am
great write-up as always, vivi. i'll also echo the sentiment of being glad you're back again. i always find your reviews quite useful.

how do you feel about the large finger guard? do you fin it gets in your way at all? that's my primary concern with this design, even though it's not something i'm really all that worried about.
Thank you.

I like the large guard. I don't have any issues with it. It gives me a comfortable spot for my thumb in side grip.
sal wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:40 am
Thanx Vivi,

Nicely done and I'm also glad you're back.

sal
Thank you Sal. It was a comment by you that made me decide to come back. Looks like you're stuck with me for a little while longer :D
Current carry rotation:

Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Wartstein » Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:16 am

vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:40 am
Doc Dan wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:22 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:34 am
I ......
Another way of closing a backlock that keeps your fingers safe and might be usefull in case of the Siren is this one: https://streamable.com/bhhzs (shown one time really slow, two times regular speed)
May look a bit "fancy", but it actually works really quick and well. Additionall, when having finished the closing the knife in this way, it sits perfectly in your hand already to be put back in the pocket.
Thanks for the video, thats a slick closing method.

Assuming the rockjumper, siren and spyopera sell well and we see more lockbacks like these designs, I think people will need to use different closing methods than dropping the blade on your finger. It can be done safely on the Siren, but with how small the margin for error is I feel better using a different method.
You mentioned that your preferred backlock closing method (guiding the blade almost to close with the index finger always in the opening hole) does not work too well with the Siren, cause the guard gets in the way.
So I thought you like the method I show above (this one: https://streamable.com/bhhzs ) - I know, it looks a bit like "showing off", but it actually perhaps is the quickest method to close a backlock one handed.
Plus, with this method when the knife is fully closed, you have it in hand with index finger and thumb on the opening hole, can then quickly rotate the knife back so the "spine" of the handle rests on your palm and it is in the perfect position to be put back in the pocket.

Another method, of which I know you´re aware of anyway, where the guard won´t come in the way is this one:
https://streamable.com/myzlt
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby aicolainen » Tue Sep 01, 2020 5:08 am

Thank you for making such a thorough review. Tabletops are OK to get a general idea how a knife could fit a certain role, but I increasingly enjoy watching/reading reviews from people who actually use their knives in similar ways to what I do.

The Siren wasn't really on my radar before, but it is certainly more so after reading this. Your review of the Waterway that you linked to on the other hand. It instantly pushed me down off the fence.

When I'm out camping, fishing and such, I usually like to have a small folder for quick cutting task or detail work like cutting fishing lines, as well as a more fit for purpose fixed blade e.g. for bushcraft/camp work, processing fish or field dressing animals.
I just find that a small capable folder quicker, more convenient and usually safer for those small cutting jobs. With experience I've developed a strong bias toward back locks with spydie hole for such use. So easy and safe to operate in almost any conditions.

This weekend I was tenting out in the backcountry. The trip was heavily focused on fishing and camp life, but a mountain ascent or two was not out of the question either. Having to be quite weight/space conscious when carrying all my gear so far in such a short time frame, I settled on the SpydieChef for quick access pocket knife and in-camp food prep, and a Fällkniven F1 in my backpack for everything else.
The SpydieChef was a compromise as it is a little larger and heavier thn I prefer for this kind of pocket carry, but mainly I find the RIL mechanism to be too cumbersome to operate with cold fingers with the reduced dexterity that follows. It's also not as safe. Closing the knife takes more effort and focus to do safely and the knife has opened in my pocket a few times - as it also did once this weekend. Still no injuries to come from that, but a bit too close for comfort.
The F1 is a beast, and I never needed that kind of ruggedness throughout my trip, and that beefiness is quite counterproductive when processing fish.

The Waterway, or something similar, would have been the perfect fixed blade for this kind of outing. It's seems quite capable of everything from food prep to light wood processing, and probably far superior at processing fish.
That kind of flexibility would allow me to carry one of the usual suspects in my pocket, typically a DF2, Salt 2 or Native Salt.
Thanks again!

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby blueblur » Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:30 am

vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:43 am
blueblur wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:59 am
Great write up. I came to many of the same conclusions.

I need to play around with the edge angle and edge finish more but I’ve found this steel to not hold an edge for long at all. It certainly hasn’t lived up to the hype I’ve heard anyway. Everything else about the knife is a huge win for me though.
What sharpening method have you been trying? Which grit is your finishing stone?
Pancake wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:10 am
Nice review Vivi!

I like the Siren, but the wire clip....is ok, but nothing spectacular. Maybe sometime in the future I will get it, just to have both Waterway and Siren.
I still thought that Siren is smaller, but the edge is comparable to Endura, interesting.
It's got a bit more cutting edge in fact.
benben wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:27 am
SOLD! Great write up vivi, covered all the bases! When I got to check out your Siren the other day, it took about 30 seconds to realize it would be my next purchase! Extremely light, extremely balanced, and the fit & finish were Golden perfect!
That's how I felt when I handled it. Looking at pictures for some reason I didn't get super excited for it, had a feeling I might end up preferring to stick with the old Pacific Salts. Handling it a bit showed me how well its designed.

I reset the bevel to just under 15 dps and took it up to 1000 grit with my EPA stones. I would then do touch ups on the sharpmaker with the brown rods at the 30 deg setting following by a few passes on a strop, then later on at the 40 deg setting followed by the strop. I reset the bevel again and put it away for the last month. I’m going to FL next week and plan for it to be my main edc so I’ll get more testing in on it then.

What have you done with the edge that you’ve found to work well?

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby vivi » Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:16 pm

aicolainen wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 5:08 am
Thank you for making such a thorough review. Tabletops are OK to get a general idea how a knife could fit a certain role, but I increasingly enjoy watching/reading reviews from people who actually use their knives in similar ways to what I do.

The Siren wasn't really on my radar before, but it is certainly more so after reading this. Your review of the Waterway that you linked to on the other hand. It instantly pushed me down off the fence.

When I'm out camping, fishing and such, I usually like to have a small folder for quick cutting task or detail work like cutting fishing lines, as well as a more fit for purpose fixed blade e.g. for bushcraft/camp work, processing fish or field dressing animals.
I just find that a small capable folder quicker, more convenient and usually safer for those small cutting jobs. With experience I've developed a strong bias toward back locks with spydie hole for such use. So easy and safe to operate in almost any conditions.

This weekend I was tenting out in the backcountry. The trip was heavily focused on fishing and camp life, but a mountain ascent or two was not out of the question either. Having to be quite weight/space conscious when carrying all my gear so far in such a short time frame, I settled on the SpydieChef for quick access pocket knife and in-camp food prep, and a Fällkniven F1 in my backpack for everything else.
The SpydieChef was a compromise as it is a little larger and heavier thn I prefer for this kind of pocket carry, but mainly I find the RIL mechanism to be too cumbersome to operate with cold fingers with the reduced dexterity that follows. It's also not as safe. Closing the knife takes more effort and focus to do safely and the knife has opened in my pocket a few times - as it also did once this weekend. Still no injuries to come from that, but a bit too close for comfort.
The F1 is a beast, and I never needed that kind of ruggedness throughout my trip, and that beefiness is quite counterproductive when processing fish.

The Waterway, or something similar, would have been the perfect fixed blade for this kind of outing. It's seems quite capable of everything from food prep to light wood processing, and probably far superior at processing fish.
That kind of flexibility would allow me to carry one of the usual suspects in my pocket, typically a DF2, Salt 2 or Native Salt.
Thanks again!
The Waterway or Aqua Salt would be really good for that sort of thing. Both are very light. I have a lot of the thicker, more overbuilt style knives like an ESEE 6HM, Scrapyard Dogfather, ESEE 4 (Sold it last year) and some others like that.

The thinner, light fixed blades I own like the Street Bowie, Aqua Salt and Waterway for me fulfill all the same uses those do, for the most part. The longer knives like the ESEE 6 and Dogfather chop better, but not even close to how well my $25 fiskars X7 hatchet chops. I've concluded I'm better off with a lightweight 4-5" fixed blade, adding a hatchet, machete and / or multitool depending on what the trip will bring.

Whrn I'm backpacking big knives are dead weight. I'm not going to be chopping things down, I'm going to cover miles then string up a tarp and hammock in less time it'd take someone with a chain saw to frame a shelter.
Current carry rotation:

Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby vivi » Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:50 pm

blueblur wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:30 am
I reset the bevel to just under 15 dps and took it up to 1000 grit with my EPA stones. I would then do touch ups on the sharpmaker with the brown rods at the 30 deg setting following by a few passes on a strop, then later on at the 40 deg setting followed by the strop. I reset the bevel again and put it away for the last month. I’m going to FL next week and plan for it to be my main edc so I’ll get more testing in on it then.

What have you done with the edge that you’ve found to work well?
Strange, our processes sound more similar than not. Interesting our results have varied so much.

I reset the edge on a 200 grit diamond plate, brought up a burr on each side, then used feather light strokes to deburr on the same stone. Estimated angle of 10-12 degrees per side. From there I did a roughly 15 degrees per side microbevel with a spyderco medium stone, trying to get it hair popping sharp in few enough strokes I don't completely grind off the microserrations from the 200 grit plate.

Were you able to get it as sharp as you expected with your process? Or did it not get as sharp as you were going for?
Current carry rotation:

Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Wartstein » Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:50 am

vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:01 am
bearfacedkiller wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 7:19 am
zuludelta wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:12 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:46 am
.....
My pinky looks like its hanging off the edge of that main grip area but my pinky bone manages to stay forward of that spot. Just barely. Even if I scoot my grip back and my pinky does go to that curved area in the back, I find that plenty ergonomic.
.....
ladybug93 wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:03 am
sal wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:40 am

Thanks, Vivi! That´s good news! If the grip area is long enough for your very large hands, it will certainly work for guys like me with "just" L to XL sized hands. :)
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby blueblur » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:42 am

vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:50 pm
blueblur wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:30 am
I reset the bevel to just under 15 dps and took it up to 1000 grit with my EPA stones. I would then do touch ups on the sharpmaker with the brown rods at the 30 deg setting following by a few passes on a strop, then later on at the 40 deg setting followed by the strop. I reset the bevel again and put it away for the last month. I’m going to FL next week and plan for it to be my main edc so I’ll get more testing in on it then.

What have you done with the edge that you’ve found to work well?
Strange, our processes sound more similar than not. Interesting our results have varied so much.

I reset the edge on a 200 grit diamond plate, brought up a burr on each side, then used feather light strokes to deburr on the same stone. Estimated angle of 10-12 degrees per side. From there I did a roughly 15 degrees per side microbevel with a spyderco medium stone, trying to get it hair popping sharp in few enough strokes I don't completely grind off the microserrations from the 200 grit plate.

Were you able to get it as sharp as you expected with your process? Or did it not get as sharp as you were going for?
I can get it extremely sharp but the edge drops off fairly quickly.

The next time I reset the bevel I’ll try a diamond plate and I won’t go through as much of a progression. Maybe my edge is just too polished for what I’m looking for. I’ll try that and report back. Thanks for the assistance.

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby aicolainen » Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:22 am

vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:16 pm
The Waterway or Aqua Salt would be really good for that sort of thing. Both are very light. I have a lot of the thicker, more overbuilt style knives like an ESEE 6HM, Scrapyard Dogfather, ESEE 4 (Sold it last year) and some others like that.

The thinner, light fixed blades I own like the Street Bowie, Aqua Salt and Waterway for me fulfill all the same uses those do, for the most part. The longer knives like the ESEE 6 and Dogfather chop better, but not even close to how well my $25 fiskars X7 hatchet chops. I've concluded I'm better off with a lightweight 4-5" fixed blade, adding a hatchet, machete and / or multitool depending on what the trip will bring.

Whrn I'm backpacking big knives are dead weight. I'm not going to be chopping things down, I'm going to cover miles then string up a tarp and hammock in less time it'd take someone with a chain saw to frame a shelter.
Thanks! I actually considered buying the Aqua Salt just recently, but that was for a different use case that didn't really materialize.
Between the Waterway and Aqua Salt, which one would you have preferred for this type of use?
Hmm.. just looked, and the Aqua Salt seem to only be available with SE and coated blade now. Even though I'm convinced I need to try out the spyder edge after reading some threads on the topic, I'm not sure this is the best use case. Neither am I convinced that coatings and food go together very well... Besides that I like the hollow grind and that the handle doesn't seem to obstruct the cutting path to any considerable degree.

Sorry to bother you with silly noob questions. It's neither trivial nor particularly cheap to get hold of Spyderco's in this part of the world, so trying my best to make as few bad decisions as possible. There will be enough of that anyways :-)

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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Surfingringo » Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:48 pm

aicolainen wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:22 am
vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:16 pm
The Waterway or Aqua Salt would be really good for that sort of thing. Both are very light. I have a lot of the thicker, more overbuilt style knives like an ESEE 6HM, Scrapyard Dogfather, ESEE 4 (Sold it last year) and some others like that.

The thinner, light fixed blades I own like the Street Bowie, Aqua Salt and Waterway for me fulfill all the same uses those do, for the most part. The longer knives like the ESEE 6 and Dogfather chop better, but not even close to how well my $25 fiskars X7 hatchet chops. I've concluded I'm better off with a lightweight 4-5" fixed blade, adding a hatchet, machete and / or multitool depending on what the trip will bring.

Whrn I'm backpacking big knives are dead weight. I'm not going to be chopping things down, I'm going to cover miles then string up a tarp and hammock in less time it'd take someone with a chain saw to frame a shelter.
Thanks! I actually considered buying the Aqua Salt just recently, but that was for a different use case that didn't really materialize.
Between the Waterway and Aqua Salt, which one would you have preferred for this type of use?
Hmm.. just looked, and the Aqua Salt seem to only be available with SE and coated blade now. Even though I'm convinced I need to try out the spyder edge after reading some threads on the topic, I'm not sure this is the best use case. Neither am I convinced that coatings and food go together very well... Besides that I like the hollow grind and that the handle doesn't seem to obstruct the cutting path to any considerable degree.

Sorry to bother you with silly noob questions. It's neither trivial nor particularly cheap to get hold of Spyderco's in this part of the world, so trying my best to make as few bad decisions as possible. There will be enough of that anyways :-)
Hi aicolainen, I’ll throw my 2 cents in and offer a little insight into the Waterway design. One of the goals I had when designing that knife was to create a knife that I could throw in a dry bag and head down the coast on a multi day kayak trip. I wanted a “do everything” knife that could handle fishing, fish processing, and general camping and survival tasks. I wanted a single knife that could do everything necessary in the wilderness and could perform in the harshest of environments.

I actually did just that kind of trip two weeks ago and though I brought a Siren and a couple of other knives to play with, there was nothing that I did on that trip that the Waterway couldn’t handle. It performed fish cleaning, rope cutting, wood processing, food prep...it did it all, just like it was intended to by design. I think the Aqua Salt is a superb design and would be quite capable too. I don’t have an opinion on which one would be better for you but I can tell you that that what you are describing is VERY close to the usage for which the Waterway was designed.

vivi
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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby vivi » Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:20 pm

aicolainen wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:22 am
vivi wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:16 pm
The Waterway or Aqua Salt would be really good for that sort of thing. Both are very light. I have a lot of the thicker, more overbuilt style knives like an ESEE 6HM, Scrapyard Dogfather, ESEE 4 (Sold it last year) and some others like that.

The thinner, light fixed blades I own like the Street Bowie, Aqua Salt and Waterway for me fulfill all the same uses those do, for the most part. The longer knives like the ESEE 6 and Dogfather chop better, but not even close to how well my $25 fiskars X7 hatchet chops. I've concluded I'm better off with a lightweight 4-5" fixed blade, adding a hatchet, machete and / or multitool depending on what the trip will bring.

Whrn I'm backpacking big knives are dead weight. I'm not going to be chopping things down, I'm going to cover miles then string up a tarp and hammock in less time it'd take someone with a chain saw to frame a shelter.
Thanks! I actually considered buying the Aqua Salt just recently, but that was for a different use case that didn't really materialize.
Between the Waterway and Aqua Salt, which one would you have preferred for this type of use?
Hmm.. just looked, and the Aqua Salt seem to only be available with SE and coated blade now. Even though I'm convinced I need to try out the spyder edge after reading some threads on the topic, I'm not sure this is the best use case. Neither am I convinced that coatings and food go together very well... Besides that I like the hollow grind and that the handle doesn't seem to obstruct the cutting path to any considerable degree.

Sorry to bother you with silly noob questions. It's neither trivial nor particularly cheap to get hold of Spyderco's in this part of the world, so trying my best to make as few bad decisions as possible. There will be enough of that anyways :-)
There are still PE Aqua Salts for $135 shipped for US residents if you browse ebay. Probably some left at knife shops too if you poke around.

For me the advantages of each design is as follows:


Waterway

+ smaller sheath footprint
+ more comfortable for my thumb to rest on the spine due to no thumb ramp
+ more acute tip
+ lighter
+ better grind (ffg vs hollow sabre)
+ better edge retention vs PE H1


Aqua Salt

+ the handle is wider and fills my palm better
+ the handle texture is less abrasive while still being perfectly secure.
+ cheaper
+ more cutting edge
+ Available in SE or PE


Basically I like the Waterway blade better for the full flat grind, pointy tip, no thumb ramp and better edge retention in PE. I like the Aqua Salt handle better, I like the extra blade length and the option for SE is nice.

I could be happy with either one for this role.
Current carry rotation:

Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

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Bloke
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Re: Spyderco Siren Observations

Postby Bloke » Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:26 am

Great write up, Vivi! :cool:

Thanks heaps for your time and effort. :)
A day without laughter is a day wasted. ~ Charlie Chaplin


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