Damasteel UK Penknife UKPK - DAMASTEEL PATTERN

[The Meat man]

I'll echo the preferences for lighter etching. Keep it subtle. I don't want it black and white.

Also, I really hope that we can get the Vanax Damasteel (DC18N). This is easily worth a $50 premium over standard Damasteel, and honestly I'd probably pay $75 over for it.
However, if it drives the cost of the knife up to $200+ then I'm probably out. But I'd gladly pay $175.

[SG89]

I’d rather keep the blade thin; it’s a slipit after all so particularly suited for slicing.

Agreed

[fixall]

I’d rather keep the blade thin; it’s a slipit after all so particularly suited for slicing.

Agree 100%. The thin, slicey blade on the UKPK is one of my favorite things about it.

[TomAiello]

I'd prefer a thinner, slicey blade as well. But for people using it as their primary EDC (in the UK, for example) that preference might be different.

[sal]

the original request was for "Damascus". I moved the discussion to "Damasteel", because it was readily available, atainless and easier to work with. The request was for the "look".

Vanax is about 4 times more expensive than S90V and we seem to be having a problem getting a sample to test, besides the high price.

If the DC18N is the only acceptable material, we may have a new problem? What is the only pattern available for the DC18 material?

sal

[TomAiello]

What is the only pattern available for the DC18 material?

"DC18N is available in Odins Eye™, Grosserosen™, Hakkapella™, Thor™, Hugin™ and Rose™."

https://damasteel.se/damacore-dc18n/

[Cambertree]

I feel the DS93X is perfectly acceptable steel for a knife that would be used. If it's not to be used and merely a collectors piece safe queen, then does it really matter what Damasteel grade it's made out of?

I'd definitely like to try Vanax, but the actual edge retention in Larrin's recent '48 knife steel' tests was about the same as Cruwear, Elmax and S30V, and not a great deal more than CPM154. Where Vanax pulls ahead is obviously in extreme corrosion resistance, and possibly in edge quality and sharpening response. Is higher corrosion resistance that much of a desirable trait in a knife like this? Not really to me.

Having said that I'd like to test Vanax out for sure, but it sounds like a whole new round of R&D testing would also need to be done for the DC18N steel, whereas it's already been done for the DS93X steel.

If DC18N was not a great deal more in price, I'd say go for it, but I feel it might be quite a bit more expensive.

Regarding the blade thickness, I'm strongly opposed to going thicker than 2.5mm bladestock. The thin bladestock is what makes the UKPK a great cutter, and fundamentally I would like a knife that performs well underneath all the cosmetic flourishes.

I've seen some 'designed by committee' knives on other forums, where the knife ended up with a whole bunch of blingy features, but ended up in my knife drawer never to be used, because people neglected to insist on some of the most fundamental qualities that make a knife a good cutter - thin bladestock, and thinly ground blade geometry.

[bbturbodad]

I feel the DS93X is perfectly acceptable steel for a knife that would be used. If it's not to be used and merely a collectors piece safe queen, then does it really matter what Damasteel grade it's made out of?

I'd definitely like to try Vanax, but the actual edge retention in Larrin's recent '48 knife steel' tests was about the same as Cruwear, Elmax and S30V, and not a great deal more than CPM154. Where Vanax pulls ahead is obviously in extreme corrosion resistance, and possibly in edge quality and sharpening response. Is higher corrosion resistance that much of a desirable trait in a knife like this? Not really to me.

Having said that I'd like to test Vanax out for sure, but it sounds like a whole new round of R&D testing would also need to be done for the DC18N steel, whereas it's already been done for the DS93X steel.


If DC18N was not a great deal more in price, I'd say go for it, but I feel it might be quite a bit more expensive.

Regarding the blade thickness, I'm strongly opposed to going thicker than 2.5mm bladestock. The thin bladestock is what makes the UKPK a great cutter, and fundamentally I would like a knife that performs well underneath all the cosmetic flourishes.

I've seen some 'designed by committee' knives on other forums, where the knife ended up with a whole bunch of blingy features, but ended up in my knife drawer never to be used, because people neglected to insist on some of the most fundamental qualities that make a knife a good cutter - thin bladestock, and thinly ground blade geometry.

x2

[fixall]

I feel the DS93X is perfectly acceptable steel for a knife that would be used. If it's not to be used and merely a collectors piece safe queen, then does it really matter what Damasteel grade it's made out of?

I'd definitely like to try Vanax, but the actual edge retention in Larrin's recent '48 knife steel' tests was about the same as Cruwear, Elmax and S30V, and not a great deal more than CPM154. Where Vanax pulls ahead is obviously in extreme corrosion resistance, and possibly in edge quality and sharpening response. Is higher corrosion resistance that much of a desirable trait in a knife like this? Not really to me.

Having said that I'd like to test Vanax out for sure, but it sounds like a whole new round of R&D testing would also need to be done for the DC18N steel, whereas it's already been done for the DS93X steel.

If DC18N was not a great deal more in price, I'd say go for it, but I feel it might be quite a bit more expensive.

Regarding the blade thickness, I'm strongly opposed to going thicker than 2.5mm bladestock. The thin bladestock is what makes the UKPK a great cutter, and fundamentally I would like a knife that performs well underneath all the cosmetic flourishes.

I've seen some 'designed by committee' knives on other forums, where the knife ended up with a whole bunch of blingy features, but ended up in my knife drawer never to be used, because people neglected to insist on some of the most fundamental qualities that make a knife a good cutter - thin bladestock, and thinly ground blade geometry.

You’ve echoed my thoughts exactly sir.

I’d only add that I’m also concerned about the actual availability of Damacore in a timely manner for the amount needed for this project. It seems pretty hard to get a hold of and I’d rather not be waiting a couple of years for this run if it can be avoided.

[Cambertree]

x2

You’ve echoed my thoughts exactly sir.

I’d only add that I’m also concerned about the actual availability of Damacore in a timely manner for the amount needed for this project. It seems pretty hard to get a hold of and I’d rather not be waiting a couple of years for this run if it can be avoided.

Thanks fellas, and that’s another good point, Fixall.

[TomAiello]

Is the DC18N in short supply? Or is it just that it's expensive?

For what it's worth, I found small pieces for sale to check price. When buying a single piece that is 38 x 100mm (1.5 x 4") the price is in the $150-$200 range (https://www.brisa.fi/supplies/knife-ste ... core-dc18n). It looks like a 1 foot long piece (1.5 inches wide) is $325 (https://www.rwwilsonknives.com/store/p9 ... s_Eye.html). So if you were restricted to buying 12" pieces, and making 4 blades per piece, cost of materials for the blades would be about $75 (about half of the price if you bought just one piece of the right size to make one blade). Presumably, the price in larger quantities would continue to decline.

[Superfool]

the original request was for "Damascus". I moved the discussion to "Damasteel", because it was readily available, atainless and easier to work with. The request was for the "look".

I said damascus originally in error. I now know damasteel is the correct term.

Vanax is about 4 times more expensive than S90V and we seem to be having a problem getting a sample to test, besides the high price.

So this cancels Vanax out as an option for this knife then, correct? I think we need it spelled out for us. Everyone here has areas of the knife that they hold specific interest in and value above others, but no-one here gets it all, with the real world cost implications, and the resultant overview like you Sal. I wanted you to choose the blade, because I thought if we put too many options on here, this project is going to get away from us.

If the DC18N is the only acceptable material, we may have a new problem? What is the only pattern available for the DC18 material?

The DC18N is NOT the only acceptable material. As far as I am aware, it is one person who said that, and I don't believe it is the majority concensus.

So I didn't really want to poll for these options, because I thought this would probably happen. Someone starts up about new (and expensive) options with no tangible cost implication, and other people all suddenly want unobtanium, and I am back to trying to stop a project tanking again. It happened on the handle threads and it's happening here.

I am not trying to be a fascist here, but if we get carried away, this project is going to get tanked, and no-one wants that.

Please stop overspeccing this knife. Lets keep it simple. Its a UKPK. People are putting Lamborghini wheels on a honda.

This is a preliminary thread for a poll on damasteel pattern. Can we please get back to that topic ONLY, and put other discussion on the main UKPK thread?

[Superfool]

Is the DC18N in short supply? Or is it just that it's expensive?

For what it's worth, I found small pieces for sale to check price. When buying a single piece that is 38 x 100mm (1.5 x 4") the price is in the $150-$200 range (https://www.brisa.fi/supplies/knife-ste ... core-dc18n). It looks like a 1 foot long piece (1.5 inches wide) is $325 (https://www.rwwilsonknives.com/store/p9 ... s_Eye.html). So if you were restricted to buying 12" pieces, and making 4 blades per piece, cost of materials for the blades would be about $75 (about half of the price if you bought just one piece of the right size to make one blade). Presumably, the price in larger quantities would continue to decline.

$75 is half the projected cost of the knife for a raw material. Even if you could find enough for 2000 knives, and negotiate half that price, tooling costs will presumably also take a hit.
I don't think anyone needs to get a calculator out to see that is not going to happen on a knife with a (hoped for) budget of $150.

[Superfool]

So here is my pre-poll roundup so far.

By my maths, Vinland, Hakapella and Hugin are the three frontrunners.

The final handle poll is up, IVORY G10 or shredded CF.
3 days.

Can we sort out the rest of the blade discussion, so we all agree and I can get his poll up tonight please?

Kind regards, David

[fixall]

I dig the Vinland the most out of those three choices, but overall I think the forum chose some great patterns and I would be happy to own a UKPK featuring any of the frontrunners.

*edit
I just noticed you weighted our choices. Nice touch. :)

[Abyss_Fish]

1st: Bifrost
2nd: thor

Not a fan: Dense twist, rose, I really just don't like the spindly or geometric ones.

[Sumdumguy]

So here is my pre-poll roundup so far.

By my maths, Vinland, Hakapella and Hugin are the three frontrunners.

dAMA POLL.png

The final handle poll is up, IVORY G10 or shredded CF.
3 days.

Can we sort out the rest of the blade discussion, so we all agree and I can get his poll up tonight please?

Kind regards, David

I think your chart is a bit flawed. I saw Ægir as first or second on several posts(including my own(and yours)

I'm still out, as I'm not interested in the handle choice. But, I don't want to see poorly compiled data, regardless.

[archangel]

If Vanax is that expensive, it's an easy choice. Pretty sure I'm gonna enjoy DS93X more than enough.

[Superfool]

So here is my pre-poll roundup so far.

By my maths, Vinland, Hakapella and Hugin are the three frontrunners.

dAMA POLL.png

The final handle poll is up, IVORY G10 or shredded CF.
3 days.

Can we sort out the rest of the blade discussion, so we all agree and I can get his poll up tonight please?

Kind regards, David

I think your chart is a bit flawed. I saw Ægir as first or second on several posts(including my own(and yours)

I'm still out, as I'm not interested in the handle choice. But, I don't want to see poorly compiled data, regardless.

While you are correct in that you put it as first, you put nothing in as second or third. Also you made it clear you were not buying the knife. I didn't include your choice for both of those reasons.

I did not put Aegir as my first choice but my second, so apart from you, only one person did. Hence there is only one vote for it as first.

I will, however, recheck the data prior to creating the poll, as I too dislike poor data compilation, and I would not want anyone suggesting I had tried to unfairly influence this project.

[The Meat man]

If we're counting dislikes too, put in a hate point for me on Vinland. It looks way too much like the damascus used in the Endura and Delica.