Siren

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
Cscottsss
Member
Posts: 350
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 6:33 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Re: Siren

Postby Cscottsss » Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:25 am

I'd love to see a "mini" Siren.

I mainly kayak fish in small creeks/rivers and lakes and prefer smaller Salt knives to carry in the summer. Either my Dfly Salt or Native 5 Salt.

User avatar
Wartstein
Member
Posts: 6943
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:06 am
Location: Salzburg, Austria, Europe

Re: Siren

Postby Wartstein » Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:43 am

Surfingringo wrote:
Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:18 am
I want to leave some feedback here after using my Siren everyday for months. I have noticed that one thing that has been a bit polarizing about the design is the heavier g10 texture. ......

I don´t have a Siren (yet!!) but I think the more grippy G10 is only a plus!
- If one really uses the knife and likes the texture and the better grip it provides: Perfect.
- If one really uses the knife and does NOT like the heavier texture: No problem at all too sand it down and smooth it by yourself I guess (and by doing so the handle will get to a point of smoothness just sooner than it would have gotten later anyway).
- If one is more of a collector and does NOT really carry and use the knife: Does not really matter what kind of texture the handle has anyway...
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

soulspy
Member
Posts: 119
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:48 am
Location: NorCal

Re: Siren

Postby soulspy » Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:40 am

Surfingringo wrote:
Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:18 am
I want to leave some feedback here after using my Siren everyday for months. I have noticed that one thing that has been a bit polarizing about the design is the heavier g10 texture. Some folks love it and others are scared it will be a “pocket shredder”. The texture was indeed chosen to provide better grip in wet, bloody, sweaty or slippery conditions. The slightly higher points and lower recesses of this g10 offers more overall surface area and more space to drain fluid along with higher points to maintain contact with the hand. It does indeed work much better than standard g10 at providing grip in wet conditions.

What I can tell you after several months of use and carry though is that the texture calms down a LOT very quickly. I haven’t done any type of sanding or smoothing to mine but it is now MUCH smoother than it was when new. Kind of the same way that regular g10 smooths out with use. The difference is, even though this g10 smooths out you are still left with those much larger recesses that still make the handle much grippier in wet conditions. I have been carrying the Siren exclusively for months now and have not had any issues with pocket or waistband wear. I honestly don’t feel like this is ANY more abrasive to clothing than regular g10. Based on my experience with it at this point I would actually like to see Spyderco use it on more designs.

Note: I know that this is my design so my objectivity might be clouded when discussing it. For that reason I try to refrain from leaving the kinds of Performance opinions and observations that I have left over the years on other designs like the Pacific Salt. I feel obliged to mention this though because it is a completely objective observation on the material itself. Can anyone else who has carried and used their Siren regularly offer their observations on this?
I have carried the Siren for a few months as well. The texture of the G10 has lost the sharpness that seemed excessive initially. I agree that it should be the default texture for G10 in more models. On a well worn PM2, the G10 is almost slick after 6 years. People should really give it try and give a month or so to "break in."

blueblur
Member
Posts: 335
Joined: Wed May 10, 2017 3:09 pm
Location: The Keystone State

Re: Siren

Postby blueblur » Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:55 am

soulspy wrote:
Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:40 am
Surfingringo wrote:
Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:18 am
I want to leave some feedback here after using my Siren everyday for months. I have noticed that one thing that has been a bit polarizing about the design is the heavier g10 texture. Some folks love it and others are scared it will be a “pocket shredder”. The texture was indeed chosen to provide better grip in wet, bloody, sweaty or slippery conditions. The slightly higher points and lower recesses of this g10 offers more overall surface area and more space to drain fluid along with higher points to maintain contact with the hand. It does indeed work much better than standard g10 at providing grip in wet conditions.

What I can tell you after several months of use and carry though is that the texture calms down a LOT very quickly. I haven’t done any type of sanding or smoothing to mine but it is now MUCH smoother than it was when new. Kind of the same way that regular g10 smooths out with use. The difference is, even though this g10 smooths out you are still left with those much larger recesses that still make the handle much grippier in wet conditions. I have been carrying the Siren exclusively for months now and have not had any issues with pocket or waistband wear. I honestly don’t feel like this is ANY more abrasive to clothing than regular g10. Based on my experience with it at this point I would actually like to see Spyderco use it on more designs.

Note: I know that this is my design so my objectivity might be clouded when discussing it. For that reason I try to refrain from leaving the kinds of Performance opinions and observations that I have left over the years on other designs like the Pacific Salt. I feel obliged to mention this though because it is a completely objective observation on the material itself. Can anyone else who has carried and used their Siren regularly offer their observations on this?
I have carried the Siren for a few months as well. The texture of the G10 has lost the sharpness that seemed excessive initially. I agree that it should be the default texture for G10 in more models. On a well worn PM2, the G10 is almost slick after 6 years. People should really give it try and give a month or so to "break in."
I agree with both of you completely. I have carried mine exclusively since I received it in mid April and love the additional traction and general feel of this coarser G10. Spyderco should definitely look into expanding this texture into other models, if not making it the standard G10 texture. I have noticed it has worn down and lost some of that “bite” it initially had but is still grippy with a little pressure. I haven’t noticed any additional pocket wear compared to other knives I’ve carried in the past, including smooth cf and pakkawood.

In short, I really don’t see a reason NOT to use this texture on G10 models moving forward.

wrdwrght
Member
Posts: 3396
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:35 am

Re: Siren

Postby wrdwrght » Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:00 am

Surfingringo wrote:
Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:18 am
Based on my experience with it at this point I would actually like to see Spyderco use it on more designs.
I have your Waterway and now your Siren (impressions and gratitude above) and am inclined to agree.

What I have found is that new G10, regardless of its surface treatment, loses some degree of its grippiness over time. It does so in two ways. It abrades and it collects.

In the first week of my Siren, I’ve had it in my raccoon-hands most of my waking hours (this fondling, not fidgeting, is a thinking-aid in my writing process). My handle is now not as grippy as it was on Day 1 and slips into my pocket way more easily than on Day 1.

Still, your G10 is grippier than Spyderco’s typical G10 at the same stage of my wearing down its high points and depositing my sebum in its low ones.

Same has been true with my Waterway, though, of course, pocketing is not an issue.

For anyone concerned with pocket-shredding, don’t be put off by your (or other people’s) first impression.

User avatar
gundamaniac
Member
Posts: 292
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:15 pm
Location: California Bay Area

Re: Siren

Postby gundamaniac » Tue Jul 28, 2020 3:02 pm

Although I just got my Siren, I observe the same behavior with regular G10. It tends to smooth out to the point that the texture is there but it doesn't particularly bite anymore. I can certainly believe that the sharp highs on the Siren G10 will smooth out, and am looking forward to seeing whether the deeper recesses continue to offer grip without the aggressiveness when this happens.
Last edited by gundamaniac on Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Woodpuppy
Member
Posts: 2229
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2018 6:38 pm
Location: Florida

Re: Siren

Postby Woodpuppy » Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:41 pm

Alright already, I’m convinced :p
Just need some disposable income...
:spyder: My other blade is a Kelly Perfect :spyder:

User avatar
Holland
Member
Posts: 7111
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 10:37 pm
Location: Alberta

Re: Siren

Postby Holland » Tue Jul 28, 2020 10:43 pm

PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Fri Jul 24, 2020 4:06 pm
Kodiak PA wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:22 pm
I love virtually everything about the Siren except one thing: When gripped hard the back lock easily disengages and though this really doesn't affect function it is irritating since there is some blade movement. Does anyone else experience this? Theoretically if you stab into something with a hard grip and the knife does disengage from the lock it could close on you. With downward pressure there is no risk.

I love the look, steel, design and I have lots of respect for designer. I experienced this with an Endura in the past but was wondering as a knife snob I'm making a too big of deal about this.

Thanks,
I think I remember hearing a few reports of people's grip disengaging back locks. I am curious because I've been unable to repeat that problem. Would you be able to describe or post a picture of the grip you are using?
I have the same issue of my hand disengaging the lock bar when using hammer grip or doing higher force cuts. I first noticed this when cutting up yams haha.

I've tried to not let it bother me, but I think I am going to let my Siren go and try an FRN N5. Other than that, the knife was great!
-Spencer

Rotation:
Junction | Gayle Bradley 1 & 2 | Mantra 1 | Chaparral 1 | Delica 4 | Dragonfly 2

User avatar
Wartstein
Member
Posts: 6943
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:06 am
Location: Salzburg, Austria, Europe

Re: Siren

Postby Wartstein » Tue Jul 28, 2020 10:48 pm

I´d so wish the Siren would come in SE! Not only because I´d want the majority of my Spydies in spyderedge generally and anyway, but I also think SE would fit this (Salt) model particularly well and reading through Davids Caribbean SE hard use thread it is pretty obvious that LC 200 N must be a great steel for SE

/ Another small detail I like about this design: It actually has a loop-over clip, but mounted so that it is luckily NOT deep carry! I strongly dislike deep carry anyway, but especially in an outdoor model like the Siren I think a bit of handle sticking out of the pocket to grab on is a very good thing. Also, that not TOO much of that rather long handle is inside the pocket.
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

wrdwrght
Member
Posts: 3396
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:35 am

Re: Siren

Postby wrdwrght » Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:17 am

With some effort, I have found the grip that loosens (but does not release) the Siren’s lock, thus giving the blade some vertical play.

Having reproduced the problem, I discovered I can do the same on my Native Chief, which has the nearly-same handle-length.

I cannot reproduce the problem on my Pacific Salt, which has the nearly-same handle length. Have I discovered an actual purpose for the Boye dent, I wonder.

So, It would seem the problem is not the Siren but something to do with the absence of a Boye dent in combination with the mid-point lock-position that Spyderco favors.

FWIW, I can induce the same vertical play on my non-Boye Lil’ Native, but, because the handle is so short, only with a grip I would never use.

Is this problem fatal? Hardly. The lock is not released. All we get is a little vertical play, about the same as you can force in any Seki-City midlock. The only difference is the “rattling” on the Siren and Chief, which might rattle one’s aesthetic preferences.

User avatar
PeaceInOurTime
Member
Posts: 843
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 7:37 am

Re: Siren

Postby PeaceInOurTime » Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:16 pm

wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:17 am
With some effort, I have found the grip that loosens (but does not release) the Siren’s lock, thus giving the blade some vertical play.

Having reproduced the problem, I discovered I can do the same on my Native Chief, which has the nearly-same handle-length.

I cannot reproduce the problem on my Pacific Salt, which has the nearly-same handle length. Have I discovered an actual purpose for the Boye dent, I wonder.

So, It would seem the problem is not the Siren but something to do with the absence of a Boye dent in combination with the mid-point lock-position that Spyderco favors.

FWIW, I can induce the same vertical play on my non-Boye Lil’ Native, but, because the handle is so short, only with a grip I would never use.

Is this problem fatal? Hardly. The lock is not released. All we get is a little vertical play, about the same as you can force in any Seki-City midlock. The only difference is the “rattling” on the Siren and Chief, which might rattle one’s aesthetic preferences.

Would you be able to describe or post a picture of the grip you are using when your hand presses the lock bar?

wrdwrght
Member
Posts: 3396
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:35 am

Re: Siren

Postby wrdwrght » Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:47 pm

PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:16 pm
wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:17 am
With some effort, I have found the grip that loosens (but does not release) the Siren’s lock, thus giving the blade some vertical play.

Having reproduced the problem, I discovered I can do the same on my Native Chief, which has the nearly-same handle-length.

I cannot reproduce the problem on my Pacific Salt, which has the nearly-same handle length. Have I discovered an actual purpose for the Boye dent, I wonder.

So, It would seem the problem is not the Siren but something to do with the absence of a Boye dent in combination with the mid-point lock-position that Spyderco favors.

FWIW, I can induce the same vertical play on my non-Boye Lil’ Native, but, because the handle is so short, only with a grip I would never use.

Is this problem fatal? Hardly. The lock is not released. All we get is a little vertical play, about the same as you can force in any Seki-City midlock. The only difference is the “rattling” on the Siren and Chief, which might rattle one’s aesthetic preferences.

Would you be able to describe or post a picture of the grip you are using when your hand presses the lock bar?
Start with the basic hammer grip.

Image

Then find some fat in the web of your thumb and index finger and press it hard into the lock area.

Sumdumguy
Member
Posts: 3184
Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2017 3:51 pm

Re: Siren

Postby Sumdumguy » Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:26 pm

wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:47 pm
PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:16 pm
wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:17 am
With some effort, I have found the grip that loosens (but does not release) the Siren’s lock, thus giving the blade some vertical play.

Having reproduced the problem, I discovered I can do the same on my Native Chief, which has the nearly-same handle-length.

I cannot reproduce the problem on my Pacific Salt, which has the nearly-same handle length. Have I discovered an actual purpose for the Boye dent, I wonder.

So, It would seem the problem is not the Siren but something to do with the absence of a Boye dent in combination with the mid-point lock-position that Spyderco favors.

FWIW, I can induce the same vertical play on my non-Boye Lil’ Native, but, because the handle is so short, only with a grip I would never use.

Is this problem fatal? Hardly. The lock is not released. All we get is a little vertical play, about the same as you can force in any Seki-City midlock. The only difference is the “rattling” on the Siren and Chief, which might rattle one’s aesthetic preferences.

Would you be able to describe or post a picture of the grip you are using when your hand presses the lock bar?
Start with the basic hammer grip.

Image

Then find some fat in the web of your thumb and index finger and press it hard into the lock area.
Get a dremel and grind in a Boye dent. That will fix the problem.

Edit: Haha, yes you did figure out why the Boye dent exists.

User avatar
VooDooChild
Member
Posts: 1135
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:29 am

Re: Siren

Postby VooDooChild » Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:37 pm

For me it seemed like theres no way a hard grip can jam enough of the meat of your hand into the cutout to get it to close.

A minor disengagement of the lockbar is it. It will still operate safely.
sal wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:14 pm
... "The edge is a ghost"...

User avatar
PeaceInOurTime
Member
Posts: 843
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 7:37 am

Re: Siren

Postby PeaceInOurTime » Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:57 pm

wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:47 pm
PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:16 pm
wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:17 am
With some effort, I have found the grip that loosens (but does not release) the Siren’s lock, thus giving the blade some vertical play.

Having reproduced the problem, I discovered I can do the same on my Native Chief, which has the nearly-same handle-length.

I cannot reproduce the problem on my Pacific Salt, which has the nearly-same handle length. Have I discovered an actual purpose for the Boye dent, I wonder.

So, It would seem the problem is not the Siren but something to do with the absence of a Boye dent in combination with the mid-point lock-position that Spyderco favors.

FWIW, I can induce the same vertical play on my non-Boye Lil’ Native, but, because the handle is so short, only with a grip I would never use.

Is this problem fatal? Hardly. The lock is not released. All we get is a little vertical play, about the same as you can force in any Seki-City midlock. The only difference is the “rattling” on the Siren and Chief, which might rattle one’s aesthetic preferences.

Would you be able to describe or post a picture of the grip you are using when your hand presses the lock bar?
Start with the basic hammer grip.

Image

Then find some fat in the web of your thumb and index finger and press it hard into the lock area.

Thanks! I tried that grip on my Endura but couldn't replicate the issue. The Endura's handle may be less hand-filling than the Siren -- my hand isn't able to wrap around the handle tight enough to even budge the lock bar. Everyone's hands and how they grip are different.

User avatar
Wartstein
Member
Posts: 6943
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:06 am
Location: Salzburg, Austria, Europe

Re: Siren

Postby Wartstein » Thu Jul 30, 2020 1:42 pm

wrdwrght wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:17 am
With some effort, I have found the grip that loosens (but does not release) the Siren’s lock, thus giving the blade some vertical play.

Having reproduced the problem, I discovered I can do the same on my Native Chief, which has the nearly-same handle-length.

I cannot reproduce the problem on my Pacific Salt, which has the nearly-same handle length. Have I discovered an actual purpose for the Boye dent, I wonder.

So, It would seem the problem is not the Siren but something to do with the absence of a Boye dent in combination with the mid-point lock-position that Spyderco favors.

FWIW, I can induce the same vertical play on my non-Boye Lil’ Native, but, because the handle is so short, only with a grip I would never use.

Is this problem fatal? Hardly. The lock is not released. All we get is a little vertical play, about the same as you can force in any Seki-City midlock. The only difference is the “rattling” on the Siren and Chief, which might rattle one’s aesthetic preferences.

It might also play a role how far back or forward on the handle the lockbar sits exactly relative to the hand position on a certain handle.
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

wrdwrght
Member
Posts: 3396
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:35 am

Re: Siren

Postby wrdwrght » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:15 pm

PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:57 pm
Thanks! I tried that grip on my Endura but couldn't replicate the issue. The Endura's handle may be less hand-filling than the Siren -- my hand isn't able to wrap around the handle tight enough to even budge the lock bar. Everyone's hands and how they grip are different.
Your Endura has a Boye dent, right?

User avatar
Wartstein
Member
Posts: 6943
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:06 am
Location: Salzburg, Austria, Europe

Re: Siren

Postby Wartstein » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:20 pm

wrdwrght wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:15 pm
PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:57 pm
....
Your Endura has a Boye dent, right?

Are there any without one?
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

vivi
Member
Posts: 7471
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:15 am

Re: Siren

Postby vivi » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:24 pm

Wartstein wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:20 pm
wrdwrght wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:15 pm
PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:57 pm
....
Your Endura has a Boye dent, right?

Are there any without one?
Endura 1-3. As far as I know all 4's and Pacific Salt 1's have them, and maybe some of the later runs of 3's.
Current carry rotation:

Pacific Salt 2 LC200N | Manix XL M4 DLC | Aqua Salt

User avatar
Wartstein
Member
Posts: 6943
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:06 am
Location: Salzburg, Austria, Europe

Re: Siren

Postby Wartstein » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:29 pm

vivi wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:24 pm
Wartstein wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:20 pm
wrdwrght wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:15 pm
PeaceInOurTime wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:57 pm
....
Your Endura has a Boye dent, right?

Are there any without one?
Endura 1-3. As far as I know all 4's and Pacific Salt 1's have them, and maybe some of the later runs of 3's.

Thanks, Vivi!

While I did not know either what you explained (so it´s valuable info for me), I was rather trying to ask if any variant of the Endura 4 ever came without a boye dent
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40


Return to “Spyderco General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bbturbodad, Bing [Bot], Cali HogHead, dano, FullFlatMind, Majestic-12 [Bot], Mushroom, rcwill98, Rp5, termite, vivi, zuludelta and 59 guests