Rockjumper discussion

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crazywednesday
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Rockjumper discussion

Postby crazywednesday » Tue May 05, 2020 7:54 pm

What mold did they use for the handle? Looks like a new design. They must be fairly confident in this model.
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Mushroom
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Mushroom » Tue May 05, 2020 8:04 pm

Yep, it's a completely new design, so new molds were made for this model. I recall Sal first making mention of it over a year ago at least, so it has been in the works for quite some time now.
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby VooDooChild » Tue May 05, 2020 9:46 pm

Its funny. I dont like the delica. But one look at the rockjumper handle and I know I will like it. Im already wondering if we can get a leafshape or drop point blade for it in the future.
sal wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:14 pm
... "The edge is a ghost"...

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kennethsime
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby kennethsime » Tue May 05, 2020 9:58 pm

VooDooChild wrote:
Tue May 05, 2020 9:46 pm
Its funny. I dont like the delica. But one look at the rockjumper handle and I know I will like it. Im already wondering if we can get a leafshape or drop point blade for it in the future.
I'm in for a leaf or drop point and brightly-colored FRN. Or Ivory FRN so we can dye it to our liking.

RockLeaf? RockDrop? Let's keep this going.
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby cabfrank » Tue May 05, 2020 10:00 pm

What is that stuff they put on snowy roads again? Oh yeah, rock salt.

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Enactive » Tue May 05, 2020 10:38 pm

I had the same thought about the handle. It brought out some Stretch fans. :cool: :spyder:

I will likely get a serrated one and would like a brown handle drop point with Rock Jumper handle.

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Mushroom » Tue May 05, 2020 10:57 pm

Might just be me but the Rockjumper reminds me of a Polestar, except as an FRN backlock wharncliffe. :D The Polestar might be a good alternative for those wanting to see the Rockjumper in a leaf shape blade.
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Wartstein
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Wartstein » Tue May 05, 2020 10:57 pm

crazywednesday wrote:
Tue May 05, 2020 7:54 pm
What mold did they use for the handle? Looks like a new design. They must be fairly confident in this model.

See here viewtopic.php?f=2&t=85940#p1398627 for the background of the Rock Jumper (and a broad discussion in the thread, though at that time we did not know what the model would finally look like).
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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sal
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby sal » Tue May 05, 2020 11:02 pm

In reality, It's a test piece The beauty of the mid back-lock is:

1. The kick hits the lock bar at the pivot which prevents the edge from hitting the back spring.
2. The knife can be easily and safely closed with one hand.
3. The spring offers a strong self close detent.
4. The design concept can be a very strong lock.

Some have complained about the presence of the "kick" which offers nothing and doesn't look good. The first solution was to create the finger choil, which permitted one to get the finger very close to the edge and turned the kick int a useful part of the knife. We make quite a few of our models with finger choils.

Then there were those that complained that they really didn't like finger choils and would like to see the edge come right up to the handle without a finger choil (like the Lil'Temperance) and still employ the mid back-lock. Sometimes requests can be a PITA, bur sometimes they can also spur the creation of solutions.

Enter the Rock Jumper. A relatively simple solution that offers much.

We've found that making G-10 knives in Seki ends up with such a high cost that it doesn't really let us know the true value and demand of a design. We decided to "bite the bullet" and go straight into an FRN model. Tooling is considerably higher, but the per piece cost is much less. It also give us the opportunity for colors, sprints and steel adjustments.

The main feature we're testing and studying is the ability to have the edge close to the handle on a mid back-loco and still retain the "normal" muscle memory of closing a mid lock-back quickly with one hand without cutting yourself. This in addition to the other advantages of the mid back-lock. And do this without an exposed kick or finger choil.

We do have a "Leaf jumper" in-the-works as well.

I believe that there will be certain part of the market that will appreciate the features I listed above on one model. I have enjoyed carrying and using the early models. It's a good size. Legal in many areas, will take a large hand, comfortable to carry, ergonomic for most hands. The result of many many hours of thought on top of a fair amount of experience. I hope you like it. :o

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Wartstein
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Wartstein » Tue May 05, 2020 11:27 pm

sal wrote:
Tue May 05, 2020 11:02 pm
In reality, It's a test piece The beauty of the mid back-lock is:

1. The kick hits the lock bar at the pivot which prevents the edge from hitting the back spring.
2. The knife can be easily and safely closed with one hand.
3. The spring offers a strong self close detent.
4. The design concept can be a very strong lock.

Some have complained about the presence of the "kick" which offers nothing and doesn't look good. The first solution was to create the finger choil, which permitted one to get the finger very close to the edge and turned the kick int a useful part of the knife. We make quite a few of our models with finger choils.

Then there were those that complained that they really didn't like finger choils and would like to see the edge come right up to the handle without a finger choil (like the Lil'Temperance) and still employ the mid back-lock. Sometimes requests can be a PITA, bur sometimes they can also spur the creation of solutions.

Enter the Rock Jumper. A relatively simple solution that offers much.

We've found that making G-10 knives in Seki ends up with such a high cost that it doesn't really let us know the true value and demand of a design. We decided to "bite the bullet" and go straight into an FRN model. Tooling is considerably higher, but the per piece cost is much less. It also give us the opportunity for colors, sprints and steel adjustments.

The main feature we're testing and studying is the ability to have the edge close to the handle on a mid back-loco and still retain the "normal" muscle memory of closing a mid lock-back quickly with one hand without cutting yourself. This in addition to the other advantages of the mid back-lock. And do this without an exposed kick or finger choil.

We do have a "Leaf jumper" in-the-works as well.

I believe that there will be certain part of the market that will appreciate the features I listed above on one model. I have enjoyed carrying and using the early models. It's a good size. Legal in many areas, will take a large hand, comfortable to carry, ergonomic for most hands. The result of many many hours of thought on top of a fair amount of experience. I hope you like it. :o

sal


Sal, as both one of those who was asking for a backlock model with edge all the way to the handle and being a climber:
Thanks for that great design!
Looks just perfect. Compact, a lot of ffg cutting edge; comes in SE either; tall, rather thin blade; comfy looking, neutral handle; rather deep carry but still well accessible from the pocket - perfect! :)

For me the beauty of the Rock Jumper in Spydercos lineup is primarily, that now we "backlock-lovers" have all the options:

- Ricasso (I personally DO like Ricassos and even choke up on those all the time)
- Choil (also great, especially on the Stretch)
- And now: Also edge almost all the way to the handle (like Linerlock and Comp. lock did already offer).

Just options for everyone and every situation - and that´s one of the main things Spyderco is to me...
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Wartstein
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Wartstein » Tue May 05, 2020 11:46 pm

I also hope, that this unique model will maybe bring some people to try backlock knives who were reluctant to do so.

As Sal says above about "the beauty oft he mid back-lock" (quote):

"1. The kick hits the lock bar at the pivot which prevents the edge from hitting the back spring.
2. The knife can be easily and safely closed with one hand.
3. The spring offers a strong self close detent.
4. The design concept can be a very strong lock."


Let me add: For me Spydercos backlock also is the most versatile and safest to use lock - but that and all "the beauty of the backlock" can only be experienced if one really uses or at least handles their knife rather frequently. It has to be discovered and one has to practice a bit, and that is something I personally like (the "beauty of the comp. lock" for example would be, that one can play with and easily operate it right from the beginning, even if new to folders - which is also great in another way).

There are so many ways to operate a backlock (and if one practices a bit, also so many ways to fidget with it, for those who like that):

- With all fingers always out of the blade path (just like with a comp lock or CBBL)
- Or having the knife always in a safe, "fingers wrapped around the handle" grip, while still being much less at risk of being hit by the edge like it is with other locks in that grip
- totally ambidextrous operation
- works great with gloves and cold, wet fingers..

Now, long story short: That´s why I am so glad that now with the Rock Jumper, the backlock models also offer an ffg "edge all the way to the handle" option. This lock deserves it! :)
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Wartstein » Wed May 06, 2020 12:08 am

sal wrote:
Tue May 05, 2020 11:02 pm

We do have a "Leaf jumper" in-the-works as well.

.....

Sal, any words on that "Leaf Jumper"?

Will it be like the Rock Jumper, but with a leaf shaped blade?
Or maybe a bit larger, so essentially a "backlock Carribean"?! (That would be great!)

[EDIT:] Forgot about the cost of FRN molds (thanks, Lance, for reminding me) - so certainly not a larger version, but the current size is perfect for an all around climbing / outdoors knife anyway]
Last edited by Wartstein on Wed May 06, 2020 4:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby tangent » Wed May 06, 2020 12:27 am

I like this knife. Would love a salt version!

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JustinB
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby JustinB » Wed May 06, 2020 3:20 am

Super excited for the RockJumper! A leaf shape blade in the future would be cool too, and more colour options will be awesome.

I'm definitely going to be at least getting two of both PE and a SE :D
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Pancake » Wed May 06, 2020 3:41 am

Leaf shape blade, +30% bigger and I am in :D
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Wartstein » Wed May 06, 2020 3:45 am

Pancake wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:41 am
Leaf shape blade, +30% bigger and I am in :D

30 % bigger ?! :eek:
That would be huge... a lot bigger than a Caribbean...
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Surfingringo » Wed May 06, 2020 3:50 am

Wartstein wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 12:08 am

Sal, any words on that "Leaf Jumper"?

Will it be like the Rock Jumper, but with a leaf shaped blade?
Or maybe a bit larger, so essentially a "backlock Carribean"?! (That would be great!)

Pancake wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:41 am
Leaf shape blade, +30% bigger and I am in :D
Given that this is a brand new model that required a new frn mold I would think it HIGHLY unlikely that a leaf shaped variant would come in a larger size...at least initially. My guess is that they would try to use the mold that they just invested in to create various models. If I’m right then I’m sure that a larger one would be possible depending on sales but it’s just hard to imagine them creating an entirely new mold right out of the gates just for a leaf shaped variant. Who knows, just my speculation.
Last edited by Surfingringo on Wed May 06, 2020 4:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby JustinB » Wed May 06, 2020 4:00 am

Surfingringo wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:50 am

Given that this is a brand new model that required a new frn mold I would think it HIGHLY unlikely that a leaf shaped variant would come in a larger size...at least initially. My guess is that they would try to use the mold that they just invested in to create various models. If I’m right then I’m sure that a larger one would be possible depending on sales but it’s just hard to imagine them creating an entirely new mold right out of the gates just for a leaf shaped variant. Who knows, just my speculation.

That is a good point about the molds. The LeafJumper will most likely be the same size and use the same mold as the RockJumper, and I would prefer it be the same size as well. I'm sure if it is super successful (which I think it will be :D) then we may end up seeing different size options in the future of both the Rock and Leaf jumper
Justin :spyder:

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Wartstein
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Wartstein » Wed May 06, 2020 4:27 am

Surfingringo wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:50 am
Wartstein wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 12:08 am
Pancake wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:41 am
Leaf shape blade, +30% bigger and I am in :D
Given that this is a brand new model that required a new frn mold I would think it HIGHLY unlikely that a leaf shaped variant would come in a larger size...at least initially. My guess is that they would try to use the mold that they just invested in to create various models. If I’m right then I’m sure that a larger one would be possible depending on sales but it’s just hard to imagine them creating an entirely new mold right out of the gates just for a leaf shaped variant. Who knows, just my speculation.

Lance, you're 100 % right on this. Forgot about rhe costs of FRN molds for a moment.
Anyway, I'd be happy with a leaf shaped, rock Jumper sized folder too! I'd probably get both (leaf and wharnie), and both in SE.

Actually for a climbing knife the current size is just PERFECT.
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Pancake
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Re: Rockjumper discussion

Postby Pancake » Wed May 06, 2020 4:44 am

Wartstein wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:45 am
Pancake wrote:
Wed May 06, 2020 3:41 am
Leaf shape blade, +30% bigger and I am in :D

30 % bigger ?! :eek:
That would be huge... a lot bigger than a Caribbean...
Bigger is better, everybody know it :D

But Lance is correct, I did not take into consideration that a new mold would be needed, so the leaf shaped blade is going to be in the same size as a wharncliffe.
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45


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