Page 2 of 3
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:05 am
by curlyhairedboy
Unfortunately in hammer grip I can get it to unlock....
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:21 am
by Sumdumguy
It was neat, but the Ikuchi crushed it. No competition.
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:33 am
by Sharp Guy
curlyhairedboy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:05 am
Unfortunately in hammer grip I can get it to unlock....
Hmmm...I tried it and I can't. Even if I hold it so my finger's right on the button I can't push the button in far enough to even come close to unlocking. Likely a difference in hand size I guess
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:19 pm
by sal
Hi Michael,
I guess I'm going to have to ask you the definition of the word "Dud"?
Some would day a knife is a dud if it doesn't sell well. That's certainly not the case with the Smock.
Some might say it's a dud if it doesn't perform as intended. It certainly opens. locks, closes and cuts.
Some might say it's a dud just because they don't like it? That would be too subjective, in my opinion, to use the word; "Dud".
sal
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:45 pm
by Surfingringo
It’s got some neat features. i like the button lock a lot and would like to see it used on some other folders. Maybe a Button lock siren. :rolleyes: :p
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 8:19 pm
by sal
Hi Lance,
It's not really a button lock. Different animal. We hope to make a button lock in the Sage in the future, but it's different. The Smock is a Compression lock with a button release. The button release was part of the Compression lock patent along with other methods of unlocking it.
We generally don't modify collaboration designs. We try to make them as the designer wanted them. Sorry on the Siren. Too Late. It's a back-lock. It would take all new tooling to remake it as a Compression lock. Or a button lock.
sal
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 9:10 pm
by PStone
Wrong thread :o
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, But A Disappointment To Me
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:49 pm
by MichaelScott
sal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:19 pm
Hi Michael,
I guess I'm going to have to ask you the definition of the word "Dud"?
Some would day a knife is a dud if it doesn't sell well. That's certainly not the case with the Smock.
Some might say it's a dud if it doesn't perform as intended. It certainly opens. locks, closes and cuts.
Some might say it's a dud just because they don't like it? That would be too subjective, in my opinion, to use the word; "Dud".
sal
Sal, the definition of dud is something that does not work or is unsatisfactory. Given that context I have to admit that my choice of the word dud was not entirely correct. Of course, all opinions are subjective and sometimes shared with others and sometimes not. I will think of a more descriptive term that encompasses what I think are unsatisfactory characteristics of the Smock.
The Smock is certainly a top seller and I know this because of how they flew off the shelves. As I said, I was interested in the design from the beginning. I was too slow in acquiring one so I basically just had to wait. I think it is one of my most anticipated Spyderco Knives. However, I found it unsatisfactory in the ways that I mentioned in my previous post. My standards these days are better expressed in designs that are perhaps more simple and mature such as the Para Military 2, Para 3, Sage, Delica and similar designs. They lack the technical innovations of the Smock but have evolved over iterations into subtle but sophisticated designs that enable a user to comfortably and securely accomplish a variety of cutting tasks. I am sure that most Smock owners are quite happy with their choice. I will be replacing mine with a Sage 5.
It boils down to my high expectations and then disappointment with the design as a frequent user knife and I tried to explain why. I will change the title (if I am able) to something more appropriate.
Regards,
Michael
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, But A Disappointment To Me
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:03 pm
by MichaelScott
MichaelScott wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:49 pm
sal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:19 pm
Hi Michael,
I guess I'm going to have to ask you the definition of the word "Dud"?
Some would day a knife is a dud if it doesn't sell well. That's certainly not the case with the Smock.
Some might say it's a dud if it doesn't perform as intended. It certainly opens. locks, closes and cuts.
Some might say it's a dud just because they don't like it? That would be too subjective, in my opinion, to use the word; "Dud".
sal
Sal, the definition of dud is something that does not work or is unsatisfactory. Given that context I have to admit that my choice of the word dud was not entirely correct. Of course, all opinions are subjective and sometimes shared with others and sometimes not. I will think of a more descriptive term that encompasses what I think are unsatisfactory characteristics of the Smock.
The Smock is certainly a top seller and I know this because of how they flew off the shelves. As I said, I was interested in the design from the beginning. I was too slow in acquiring one so I basically just had to wait. I think it is one of my most anticipated Spyderco Knives. However, I found it unsatisfactory in the ways that I mentioned in my previous post. My standards these days are better expressed in designs that are perhaps more simple and mature such as the Para Military 2, Para 3, Sage, Delica and similar designs. They lack the technical innovations of the Smock but have evolved over iterations into subtle but sophisticated designs that enable a user to comfortably and securely accomplish a variety of cutting tasks. I am sure that most Smock owners are quite happy with their choice.
It boils down to my high expectations and then disappointment with the design as a frequent user knife and I tried to explain why. I will change the title (if I am able) to something more appropriate.
Regards,
Michael
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 5:00 am
by Surfingringo
sal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 8:19 pm
Hi Lance,
It's not really a button lock. Different animal. We hope to make a button lock in the Sage in the future, but it's different. The Smock is a Compression lock with a button release. The button release was part of the Compression lock patent along with other methods of unlocking it.
We generally don't modify collaboration designs. We try to make them as the designer wanted them. Sorry on the Siren. Too Late. It's a back-lock. It would take all new tooling to remake it as a Compression lock. Or a button lock.
sal
Hey Sal, that remark was meant as a joke...probably a poor one. There were a number of very specific reasons for using a backlock in the Siren design.
I DO like the lock on the Smock though and I DO hope that it gets used on some more designs in the future! :spyder:
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:04 am
by ChrisinHove
Bad luck, Michael! It’s disappointing when an eagerly awaited item arrives and turns out to be a ... err, less pleasing than anticipated!
I had the same last week with a Rex45 Para3, which I picked up new for a great price. Didn’t fit my hand at all well. Rather than return it to the distributor, where the price had gone up 40% in the meanwhile, I sold it at cost to a fellow Spyderco fan. I’m not out of pocket, I no longer gaze wantingly at P3’s, and someone else got the good deal - so not all bad news.
I put the money towards a LNIB EuroEdge. Now I know already that this is a show knife, and a showpiece of manufacturing, but sometimes the “show” versus “go” of some (mainly collab) models seems indistinct until you get them in hand.
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:45 am
by Sumdumguy
I understand what Michael was getting at. I feel the same way.
This knife was designed with the lights on max, sunburn level.
It functions alright as a knife, but as a Spyderco, it feels compromised. Looks were put far ahead of function/performance.
Compared to most other knives Spyderco has made, this one is at the bottom of the barrel(IMO). Now, monetarily it is obviously a hit. However, so was that Kardashian show and I hope we can all agree about that being swill. Popularity means naught.
The average consumer is an idiot**, so judging somethings quality by sales is not going to be accurate(unless you're an accountant :p).
I'll take the ugly, unpopular Caribbean, any day of the week and have a FAR superior knife because of it.
If you want novelty over substance, this is your knife. If you want an uncompromising tool, look elsewhere.*
*: This is the opinion of Sumdumguy, take it for what it's worth.
**: Not opinion, complete fact.
The Euroedge, while pretty and heavy, is a far better tool than this one. It's also way more comfortable in hand.(same goes for the Sub-Hilt)
I've been looking for another one, ever since I sold mine to a buddy. Just gotta find the right deal!
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, But A Disappointment To Me
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:57 am
by MichaelScott
MichaelScott wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:03 pm
MichaelScott wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:49 pm
sal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:19 pm
Hi Michael,
I guess I'm going to have to ask you the definition of the word "Dud"?
Some would day a knife is a dud if it doesn't sell well. That's certainly not the case with the Smock.
Some might say it's a dud if it doesn't perform as intended. It certainly opens. locks, closes and cuts.
Some might say it's a dud just because they don't like it? That would be too subjective, in my opinion, to use the word; "Dud".
sal
Sal, the definition of dud is something that does not woqk or is unsatisfactory. Given that context I have to admit that my choice of the word dud was not entirely correct. Of course, all opinions are subjective and sometimes shared with others and sometimes not. I will think of a more descriptive term that encompasses what I think are unsatisfactory characteristics of the Smock.
The Smock is certainly a top seller and I know this because of how they flew off the shelves. As I said, I was interested in the design from the beginning. I was too slow in acquiring one so I basically just had to wait. I think it is one of my most anticipated Spyderco Knives. However, I found it unsatisfactory in the ways that I mentioned in my previous post. My standards these days are better expressed in designs that are perhaps more simple and mature such as the Para Military 2, Para 3, Sage, Delica and similar designs. They lack the technical innovations of the Smock but have evolved over iterations into subtle but sophisticated designs that enable a user to comfortably and securely accomplish a variety of cutting tasks. I am sure that most Smock owners are quite happy with their choice.
It boils down to my high expectations and then disappointment with the design as a frequent user knife and I tried to explain why. I will change the title (if I am able) to something more appropriate.
Regards,
Michael
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:59 am
by Wartstein
As said in my previous post: I am not really entitled to weigh in on the Smock cause I never even held one.
But it would be interesting to know how well it would be received if it had let´s say "just" a basic linerlock instead of the (fascinating, no doubt!) button comp. lock and be more judged by its ergos, "choil", cutting edge...
Maybe many people would still like it as they do the current model, maybe not so much. I don´t know.
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, But A Disappointment To Me
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:01 am
by MichaelScott
MichaelScott wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:49 pm
sal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:19 pm
Hi Michael,
I guess I'm going to have to ask you the definition of the word "Dud"?
Some would day a knife is a dud if it doesn't sell well. That's certainly not the case with the Smock.
Some might say it's a dud if it doesn't perform as intended. It certainly opens. locks, closes and cuts.
Some might say it's a dud just because they don't like it? That would be too subjective, in my opinion, to use the word; "Dud".
sal
Sal, the definition of dud is something that does not work or is unsatisfactory. Given that context I have to admit that my choice of the word dud was not entirely correct. Of course, all opinions are subjective and sometimes shared with others and sometimes not. I will think of a more descriptive term that encompasses what I think are unsatisfactory characteristics of the Smock.
The Smock is certainly a top seller and I know this because of how they flew off the shelves. As I said, I was interested in the design from the beginning. I was too slow in acquiring one so I basically just had to wait. I think it is one of my most anticipated Spyderco Knives. However, I found it unsatisfactory in the ways that I mentioned in my previous post. My standards these days are better expressed in designs that are perhaps more simple and mature such as the Para Military 2, Para 3, Sage, Delica and similar designs. They lack the technical innovations of the Smock but have evolved over iterations into subtle but sophisticated designs that enable a user to comfortably and securely accomplish a variety of cutting tasks. I am sure that most Smock owners are quite happy with their choice.
It boils down to my high expectations and then disappointment with the design as a frequent user knife and I tried to explain why. I will change the title (if I am able) to something more appropriate.
Regards,
Michael
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, But A Disappointment To Me
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:03 am
by MichaelScott
Duplicate
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:09 am
by MichaelScott
ChrisinHove wrote: ↑Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:04 am
Bad luck, Michael! It’s disappointing when an eagerly awaited item arrives and turns out to be a ... err, less pleasing than anticipated!
I had the same last week with a Rex45 Para3, which I picked up new for a great price. Didn’t fit my hand at all well. Rather than return it to the distributor, where the price had gone up 40% in the meanwhile, I sold it at cost to a fellow Spyderco fan. I’m not out of pocket, I no longer gaze wantingly at P3’s, and someone else got the good deal - so not all bad news.
I put the money towards a LNIB EuroEdge. Now I know already that this is a show knife, and a showpiece of manufacturing, but sometimes the “show” versus “go” of some (mainly collab) models seems indistinct until you get them in hand.
Exactly. I loved the Smock until I had one in hand. I wanted a companion to my beloved Para 3. It is fortunate for us that Spyderco’s extensive array of different designs and their CQI philosophy offers us so many choices.
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:21 am
by TkoK83Spy
Did you try that grip I posted in the photo? For me, using it feels quite natural when holding this knife that way.
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:00 am
by Maximumsmoochy
My experience with the Smock is similar to Michael's - once I had one in hand, it just didn't jive for me as a tool. It is technically amazing, gorgeous to behold and does indeed open, cut, and close really well. Fun as **** too. I really was drawn to it, so much so I bought and sold it twice!
After all that though, the Smock just wasn't a knife I could keep, use and enjoy long term. That doesn't make it a dud, it just makes it another option of multitudes that didn't work for me. As an aside, I have also owned and sold the PM2 twice as well, not for any apparent design flaw, but just 'cause I like others better.
Re: Spyderco Smock:Technical Showcase, Dud Knife
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:11 am
by Pancake
Hmm, well, Smock is more of a design and fidget knife then just boring EDC knife. With the button comp lock there has to be some sacrifices made in order to properly work. You can see it was designed from someone else and not Sal and co. I have not handled it or have any plans to buy it, but the handle is kinda weird, cutout for the first finger is a bit too far back and the back is...hm, don't know. Maybe I am completely wrong and this model could work with my hand, who knows.
But I guess it can't be selling that bad, when there is exclusive of this knife.