ZDP-189 - Overrated or Super Steel?

[Larrin]

New research on ZDP-189 analyzing its toughness, edge retention, and corrosion resistance. How does it achieve such high hardness? Is it really stainless? Does it have any toughness at such high hardness? https://knifesteelnerds.com/2019/12/30/ ... overrated/

[JD Spydo]

Interesting question as if ZDP-189 is a true "stainless steel"? I'm one to take issue with that because I've had a couple of really negative experiences with ZDP-189. One time about 10 years ago I was gathering some fresh home grown tomatoes that I grew that year. I cut up some tomatoes to snack on using my Burgundy Caly Jr. with ZDP-189 blade steel. It was stupid on my part because I did forget to rinse the blade off with fresh water. The next morning it looked as though I had soaked the blade in an industrial strength acid or extremely caustic chemical.

It was so bad that I sent it back to Spyderco to have the edge re-surfaced. When I got it back I still had to polish it profusely to get it looking decent again. I"ve used VG-10 along with some other steels to cut up food items with and forget to clean them but none of them corroded like that ZDP-189 did.

This is coming from a guy who is a fan of ZDP-189. And I plan on keeping my Spyders that have that steel. But I truly wonder if ZDP-189 is a true stainless steel by the conventional definition???

[jdw]

I really don't know but I can sharpen it. It holds a fine edge as long as I could possibly want. I don't have a blade of it that has truly rusted on me but I am also pretty sure that it isn't really stainless. I dang sure appreciate all of your work!!

[Naperville]

Excellent article! I have one knife in ZDP-189, a Zero Tolerance "Factory Custom" 0450FCZDP and I paid dearly for it. I don't feel cheated by how much I paid, but it was above $350US and that was steep for the lil pocket knife that it is.

In any case, I did not know that Cowry-X was that close to ZDP-189. Thanks for letting us in on that lil tidbit. I had not attempted to find a neighbor to Cowry-X and ZDP-189 is pretty close.

Fallkniven has several Cowry-X fixed blades, and they charge quite a bit for that steel too. I see:
- Fallkniven Northern Light NL5 Idun Cowry X 4" Damascus Blade, Stacked Leather Handle, Leather Sheath - NL5cxL for $1,500, list is over $2,300!
- Fallkniven HK9cx Hunting Knife 9 Cowry X Steel for $1,700, list is over $2,700!

I'd like to see these knife steels used more often. Maybe that would bring the prices down.

[ABX2011]

I agree, overrated!

[cbrstar]

After reading this I'm kinda surprised that ZDP-189 was sold as stainless. My ZDP Dragonfly was one of the first Spyderco's I bought. And when researching them. I saw a lot of threads saying how you had to really take care of it to stop it corroding. In fact when I bought mine it had a thin coating of oil on it.
Personally I really like ZDP-189, but I could be biased because I really like my Dragonfly. I actually used my Dragonfly more then any other knife for a long time. When using the knife daily I found it never corroded. It wasn't until I left it in my winter jacket all this summer only to re-discover it this winter, that I found it had stained. But the stain polished out super easy!

IMHO If any steel is overrated it's S110V. The better edge retention isn't worth the sweat and tears to sharpen it, and it also has very poor toughness. ZDP-189 is a much more pleasant sharpening experience.

[gull wing]

After reading this I'm kinda surprised that ZDP-189 was sold as stainless. My ZDP Dragonfly was one of the first Spyderco's I bought. And when researching them. I saw a lot of threads saying how you had to really take care of it to stop it corroding. In fact when I bought mine it had a thin coating of oil on it.
Personally I really like ZDP-189, but I could be biased because I really like my Dragonfly. I actually used my Dragonfly more then any other knife for a long time. When using the knife daily I found it never corroded. It wasn't until I left it in my winter jacket all this summer only to re-discover it this winter, that I found it had stained. But the stain polished out super easy!

IMHO If any steel is overrated it's S110V. The better edge retention isn't worth the sweat and tears to sharpen it, and it also has very poor toughness. ZDP-189 is a much more pleasant sharpening experience.

Oh yes, my S110V Para 3 sits in it's box today because of that.

[ABX2011]

Are you using diamonds on that S110V? Doesn't give me any trouble.

[ZrowsN1s]

Ive seen zdp rust. But after you get a little 'patina' on it, it holds up great as a stainless.

[Ankerson]

S110V is NOT hard to sharpen at all, really no more difficult than most other steels. Doesn't take any longer to sharpen either that I have noticed.

It's all the same basic principle.

I sharpen all the steels the same way using the same stones from simple carbon steels all the way to MAXAMET and never had any issues with any of them.

The real trick to S110V is not to overthink it, just sharpen it.

Doesn't matter what steel it is, just sharpen the knife the same way as all the other ones.

[prndltech]

s90v is “easier” and I prefer it over s110v and zdp honestly.

I’ll take s30v or s90v any day over those and I’m not a huge fan of them. But I’ll use em, carry em and sharpen em all the same.

I think they’re all overrated though. s30v does just fine, as does vg10. If the heat treats right I don’t care.

[dan31]

I believe ZDP-189 was targeted to the Japanese market using Aluminum oxide stones as stated in Larkin’s article. This makes perfect sense given the steels chemistry. It is an excellent steel for its intended market/user. If you want harder carbide steels they are available as are the new stones that make easy work of them. Now that we have the bonded diamond/cbn stones the harder carbide steels can be considered by more of the average users like me who are not great at sharpening, yet.

I do like ZDP-189 and will be purchasing more knives like a ZDP-189 Endela.

[GiftedMisfit]

....

I think they’re all overrated though. s30v does just fine, as does vg10. If the heat treats right I don’t care.

This.

[JMM]

FWIW, a friend of mine has a Rockstead knife w/ZDP-189 running at 67.9 I believe, and the edge on that knife, that truly scary sharp edge, can withstand more abuse than any knife I've ever seen/held/used in person -- and the ability to strop it back to factory sharp ridiculously easy is simply amazing... but, I suppose, given the cost of the knife, it should be nearly magical ;-b

That said, I have a Stretch2 and an Endura that while they are most certainly not stainless in any way, I rather like the edge holding ability... Meh, but that's just me! ;-)

[Bill1170]

I have both a Delica and a Stretch in ZDP. Both of them I mirror polished by hand. I haven’t subjected either to harsh corrosive conditions, but they remain shiny and unblemished in regular carry and use. ZDP is a steel that really excels with low angles and a high polish. I suspect that the polish helps prevent rust.

[ChrisinHove]

Interesting article. I suspect the marketplace has also concluded the same.

[Jazz]

I find ZDP just patinas lightly, and looks fantastic. I like the steel, and hope for a ZDP Delica wharnie, and K390, while we're at it. Not being a steel snob, I also like VG10 just fine. Just ask my work knife that cuts tons of cardboard if there's anything wrong with VG10.

[GarageBoy]

ZDP has a reputation for holding a fine edge better than vanadium carbide centric steels - have other steels caught up in this regard? If you take, say s90v to a high polish with abrasives that can cut the vanadium carbide properly, can you regain some fine edge holding?

[vivi]

I did not have corrosion issues with ZDP and I found it to sharpen much easier than other stainless steels with similar levels of edge holding. I can't recall a steel I've sharpened that's produced such minimal burring.

[Ankerson]

I haven't had any sort of problems with ZDP corrosion wise, but then I know it's not stainless so I treat it as such.